The Enemy Inside Discussion Thread

[?]

At some point will there just be one sanctioned thread for all things new album...i.e. songs, videos, ordering info, etc?

https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=37913.0

However, I'm glad there are a few separate threads, because that one would turn into a huge mess (you could argue it is one already!) if all the discussion was there.

[Aythesryche]

As far as the carnival/circus sounding patches JR likes to revisit, thy don't seem as bad as what they could be. It's tolerable for me since its not completely in my face and apparent. The rest of the song around his clown parts makes it listenable for me. Still a bit odd considering all the billions of patches one can pick from and he chooses those. But I can certainly respect his choices at the same time. If that's what the dude likes then more power to him! It's certainly not as bad as some of Hakens stuff.

[dparrott]

The snare sounds great, nothing wrong with it whatsoever.

I like the single — much, much better than previous singles (with the exception of On The Back Of Angels). It feels a lot more cohesive and well-written than the usual pot luck of ideas.

The only thing "wrong" with it is the (incessant) re-appearance of circus and carnival music (usually from Jordan). It has, very unfortunately, become a recurring motif in a lot of Dream Theater songs. There's got to be other things they can play to musically signify any kind of emotional distress. Much like the overused and tired-sounding string patches of prog music, the clown music has to stop.

String patches and "carnival" patches are what make DT special for me.  So Shush.

  That and the little timing changes out of nowhere in the solos.  I'm grooving along to the tempo, then it's "wait...what was that?"

[Bone_Daddy]

No balls. No chunk.

John Petrucci is a great guitar player. No dispute. But he makes for an awful producer.

The chorus is very watered down - no emotion - no umph from LaBrie. Not impressed with the overall sound nor with the arrangement. This particular music feels like it should belong in a video game running in time lapse.

I do like the drumming, however, it's very scripted (very mathematical). And that's not a bad thing. It just sometimes comes off as forced.

I hope to hear better material from the rest of the new album. Thus far, there is nothing ground-breaking because there is nothing really new with this song. It's very average and severely under-produced.

[aprilethereal]

I don't get the hate for Jordan's goofy sections and patches. The little keyboard interlude in Endless Sacrifice (I'm sure you know what I mean ) is one of my favourite DT moments ever.

[TheGreatPretender]

I don't get the hate for Jordan's goofy sections and patches. The little keyboard interlude in Endless Sacrifice (I'm sure you know what I mean ) is one of my favourite DT moments ever.

Absolutely. And quite frankly, the ragtime keyboard solo he played on A Change of Seasons in LSFNY and the Instrumedley, was way better and more interesting than the original.

Yes, music can be dark, and minor and serious, but splicing a little light heartedness into it, like in TDEN, can give it an extra dimension. It doesn't make a joke out of the song, or take away from the tension. Heck, personally, I felt like in TDEN and TDOE, the ragtime solos actually added a bit of a sinister edge to the songs.

[LTE3]

No balls. No chunk.

John Petrucci is a great guitar player. No dispute. But he makes for an awful producer.

The chorus is very watered down - no emotion - no umph from LaBrie. Not impressed with the overall sound nor with the arrangement. This particular music feels like it should belong in a video game running in time lapse.

I do like the drumming, however, it's very scripted (very mathematical). And that's not a bad thing. It just sometimes comes off as forced.

I hope to hear better material from the rest of the new album. Thus far, there is nothing ground-breaking because there is nothing really new with this song. It's very average and severely under-produced.

Solid points and thats the difference between a feel player like Portnoy and a technical math wiz like Mangini, both are awesome but I prefer Portnoy. I will say that the Lyric video has much better sound quality than the stream from yesterday and did give me a better appreciation for the song. Although I am still not blown away at all. I'm sure the rest will be better, but my excitement level has dwindled.

[JimmyJava]

No balls. No chunk.

John Petrucci is a great guitar player. No dispute. But he makes for an awful producer.

The chorus is very watered down - no emotion - no umph from LaBrie. Not impressed with the overall sound nor with the arrangement. This particular music feels like it should belong in a video game running in time lapse.

I do like the drumming, however, it's very scripted (very mathematical). And that's not a bad thing. It just sometimes comes off as forced.

I hope to hear better material from the rest of the new album. Thus far, there is nothing ground-breaking because there is nothing really new with this song. It's very average and severely under-produced.

QFT!!!

[LTE3]

^ yup, when he "fully" comes in, it's such a great twist and his work here reminds me a lot of Scenes/SDoIT.
[/quote]

Exactly it is not original or interesting, especially when comparing to the two of the greatest albums of all time.

[Aythesryche]

I can understand why people might enjoy them, but its confusing to me why someone can't possibly fathom why someone else might not enjoy them. lol. Personally, I never liked anything that reminds me of the circus. I went to one once when I was a kid and it was a pretty dull experience. Where the kid next to me was yelling YAY and clapping his hands frantically when the clown came out and fell on his face with sounds of a slide whistle, I just sat there thinking how I wanted to gtfo. I'm not afraid of clowns or anything, they are just the embodyment of lies and trash in my opinion. So I'm not a big fan its theme in the music I listen to.

I adore the single btw.

[Thoughtspart3]

I hate to report this, but the dynamic range of The Enemy Inside is 5.  I downloaded the single that comes with the album pre-order.  This album is heavily compressed.  It is actually much higher than Systematic Chaos.  I just remastered SC and TEI is much hotter. I was hoping the new engineer would restore the dynamics to DT's music but he has unfortunately made it even worse.

I know it is said that the download might be different but this has not been the case with any of their recent albums.  Our only hope is that HD Tracks will release a dynamic version like they did with ADTOE.  That one was awesome and I encourage you all to buy it to support the dynamic releases.   

[detemete]

Too compressed for my liking. But that's the way most of the music is nowadays anyway. But still that little bit of clipping during the part at 1:05 sucks.

Guitar tone is good. But guitars are mixed a little on the loud side, a bit overwhelming.

Bass is way too low and hardly audible. Part of it is caused by JM's tone too.

The keyboard break is awesome I think. For me, it's the best part of the song, very cool melody.

Drumming is good but nothing reeeaaaalllyy special. Snare tone is meh.

Overall cool song, definitely has the Megadeth vibe. I can even stand JLB's voice

[Laich21DT]

I don't get the hate for Jordan's goofy sections and patches. The little keyboard interlude in Endless Sacrifice (I'm sure you know what I mean ) is one of my favourite DT moments ever.

Personally, I don't care for that part, or most of his other "circus" or "cartoony" sounds. However, I really like the direction he's taken starting with ADTOE. I feel that he's used patches that are a little more serious sounding, and I'm digging it. With all that said, I really like the keyboard solo in The Enemy Inside. I see why some will say it's just Jordan being Jordan. But to my ears, I hear a difference in what he's doing now, versus what he was doing pre-ADTOE.

[lyfeternl]

I hate to report this, but the dynamic range of The Enemy Inside is 5.  I downloaded the single that comes with the album pre-order.  This album is heavily compressed.  It is actually much higher than Systematic Chaos.  I just remastered SC and TEI is much hotter. I was hoping the new engineer would restore the dynamics to DT's music but he has unfortunately made it even worse.

I know it is said that the download might be different but this has not been the case with any of their recent albums.  Our only hope is that HD Tracks will release a dynamic version like they did with ADTOE.  That one was awesome and I encourage you all to buy it to support the dynamic releases.   

Too compressed for my liking. But that's the way most of the music is nowadays anyway. But still that little bit of clipping during the part at 1:05 sucks.

Guitar tone is good. But guitars are mixed a little on the loud side, a bit overwhelming.

Bass is way too low and hardly audible. Part of it is caused by JM's tone too.

The keyboard break is awesome I think. For me, it's the best part of the song, very cool melody.

Drumming is good but nothing reeeaaaalllyy special. Snare tone is meh.

Overall cool song, definitely has the Megadeth vibe. I can even stand JLB's voice

It's as if people joined the forums just to post negative comments on the single

[detemete]

I hate to report this, but the dynamic range of The Enemy Inside is 5.  I downloaded the single that comes with the album pre-order.  This album is heavily compressed.  It is actually much higher than Systematic Chaos.  I just remastered SC and TEI is much hotter. I was hoping the new engineer would restore the dynamics to DT's music but he has unfortunately made it even worse.

I know it is said that the download might be different but this has not been the case with any of their recent albums.  Our only hope is that HD Tracks will release a dynamic version like they did with ADTOE.  That one was awesome and I encourage you all to buy it to support the dynamic releases.   

Too compressed for my liking. But that's the way most of the music is nowadays anyway. But still that little bit of clipping during the part at 1:05 sucks.

Guitar tone is good. But guitars are mixed a little on the loud side, a bit overwhelming.

Bass is way too low and hardly audible. Part of it is caused by JM's tone too.

The keyboard break is awesome I think. For me, it's the best part of the song, very cool melody.

Drumming is good but nothing reeeaaaalllyy special. Snare tone is meh.

Overall cool song, definitely has the Megadeth vibe. I can even stand JLB's voice

It's as if people joined the forums just to post negative comments on the single

I believe I pointed out a bunch of good things about the single too, no? Does it have to be black & white where we have to either absolutely love or absolutely hate a certain thing?

[Whatsername]

It's as if people joined the forums just to post negative comments on the single

That. I don't mind the constructive posts that aren't just all negativity, but some of these posts go past that. o.o

[mikeyd23]

Personally, I don't care for that part, or most of his other "circus" or "cartoony" sounds. However, I really like the direction he's taken starting with ADTOE. I feel that he's used patches that are a little more serious sounding, and I'm digging it. With all that said, I really like the keyboard solo in The Enemy Inside. I see why some will say it's just Jordan being Jordan. But to my ears, I hear a difference in what he's doing now, versus what he was doing pre-ADTOE.

Yeah I hear a difference on TEI and all of ADToE.  I know exactly what you mean about more serious sounding patches, I thought his work on ADToE was great, I enjoyed his contributions to the new single as well.  Count me into the crowd that likes what he brings to the table in general, and in particular on this track!

[Podaar]

 

It's as if people joined the forums just to post negative comments on the single

That's not uncommon. New people want to fit in and if they've been lurking for quite a while they've probably noticed that regular posters have strong opinions. I'm sure their concerns and issues are genuine but it takes awhile to get the feel for tone. We'll get used to their style after awhile too, just like none of us think it's harsh when BVD puts down Awake.

[kirksnosehair]

I'm not afraid of clowns or anything, they are just the embodyment of lies and trash in my opinion.

I don't know why but this sentence made me pee a little bit in my trousers 

[lyfeternl]

I believe I pointed out a bunch of good things about the single too, no? Does it have to be black & white where we have to either absolutely love or absolutely hate a certain thing?

You did. "Negative" was probably not the right word...perhaps "nit-pick" would've been a good alternative.

I suppose I was remembering when I joined DTF and it was to share my love for OTBOA, not to critique it per se.

It's all good though. (belated) Welcome! 

[Podaar]

I'm not afraid of clowns or anything, they are just the embodyment of lies and trash in my opinion.

I don't know why but this sentence made me pee a little bit in my trousers 

I gleeked.

[JayOctavarium]

It's as if people joined the forums just to post negative comments on the single

That's not uncommon. New people want to fit in and if they've been lurking for quite a while they've probably noticed that regular posters have strong opinions. I'm sure their concerns and issues are genuine but it takes awhile to get the feel for tone. We'll get used to their style after awhile too, just like none of us think it's harsh when BVD puts down Awake.

His description of Scarred has left me... Scarred...

[Whatsername]

I'm not afraid of clowns or anything, they are just the embodyment of lies and trash in my opinion.

I don't know why but this sentence made me pee a little bit in my trousers 

I wholeheartedly concur with this sentiment. Clowns are evil.

[TheGreatPretender]

It's as if people joined the forums just to post negative comments on the single

That's not uncommon. New people want to fit in and if they've been lurking for quite a while they've probably noticed that regular posters have strong opinions. I'm sure their concerns and issues are genuine but it takes awhile to get the feel for tone. We'll get used to their style after awhile too, just like none of us think it's harsh when BVD puts down Awake.

His description of Scarred has left me... Scarred...

Their venom's not family here.

[Sycsa]

I don't get the hate for Jordan's goofy sections and patches. The little keyboard interlude in Endless Sacrifice (I'm sure you know what I mean ) is one of my favourite DT moments ever.

Absolutely. And quite frankly, the ragtime keyboard solo he played on A Change of Seasons in LSFNY and the Instrumedley, was way better and more interesting than the original.

Yes, music can be dark, and minor and serious, but splicing a little light heartedness into it, like in TDEN, can give it an extra dimension. It doesn't make a joke out of the song, or take away from the tension. Heck, personally, I felt like in TDEN and TDOE, the ragtime solos actually added a bit of a sinister edge to the songs.

I also love Jordan's little interludes (TDOE ragtime was my ringtone for a while), except for his ACOS solo. It's way too cheesy for a song that deals with the death of a loved one. It was fine for Instrumedley and on LSFNY when they were all goofing around with baseball and the Simpsons theme, but after that he should have moved on to something more serious and fitting. The timing in Derek's solo is exciting and I prefer it to all the other versions. 

[detemete]

I believe I pointed out a bunch of good things about the single too, no? Does it have to be black & white where we have to either absolutely love or absolutely hate a certain thing?

You did. "Negative" was probably not the right word...perhaps "nit-pick" would've been a good alternative.

I suppose I was remembering when I joined DTF and it was to share my love for OTBOA, not to critique it per se.

It's all good though. (belated) Welcome! 

Thank you I guess some of what I've written might have come across as negativity as I was trying to chime in on what people are mainly opinionated about the new single. But that wasn't my intention at all.

The only thing I definitely don't like about the single is the abundant compression though. I naturally hate it when bands do it for commercial purposes but I just don't get it when a band like dream theater falls into this trap since they don't get much radio play or anything plus their music is of the virtuoso nature where everything would be better off crystal clear with all the nuances.

[TheGreatPretender]

I also love Jordan's little interludes (TDOE ragtime was my ringtone for a while),

Mine too! 

except for his ACOS solo. It's way too cheesy for a song that deals with the death of a loved one. It was fine for Instrumedley and on LSFNY when they were all goofing around with baseball and the Simpsons theme, but after that he should have moved on to something more serious and fitting. The timing in Derek's solo is exciting and I prefer it to all the other versions.

I just generally don't like Derek's solo. It feels so rushed and really lacking any kind of definition. Musically speaking, I'd rather listen to JR's ragtime solo. Now, if Derek had done something a bit more melodic, like JR's piano solo in OTBOA, that would've suited ACOS a lot better, IMO.

[rush-signals]

LOL

Seriously, I was reading those comments thinking to myself, "Huh? Is this still Blabbermouth??"

[The Boomr]

I've just never ever been reminded of the circus/carnival by JR's patches. Maybe that's because I almost never went, as a child? I dunno. I've always just heard them as fun, goofy patches, and that suits me perfectly, because I take myself really seriously a lot of the time, but have to remember to lighten up a bit on a regular basis to keep my life balanced I totally agree with an above post, too, about the ragtime in TDEN, it doesn't even feel goofy, it actually adds to the sinister/heavy for me.

[rush-signals]

When you see this it makes you appreciate the song even more!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-FDLyW-iQs

[Whatsername]

I just listened to the single on Spotify Premium with "high-quality streaming" checked, and I think that may have helped. It could be a placebo effect, but I feel like the mix sounded a lot cleaner and more alive.

Also HOLY CRAP, the piano version of Wither sounds amazing through high-quality.

[RodrigoAltaf]

When you see this it makes you appreciate the song even more!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-FDLyW-iQs

Impressible!!! 

[wolven74]

When you see this it makes you appreciate the song even more!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-FDLyW-iQs

I hear the song, but I don't hear the guitar? was he plugged in?? 

[EstyMaJ]

I listened to the song twice yesterday and about 6 more times today I loved it at first listen and still do I can see why some fans are disappointed that this one track is still on that heavy side But for me its ok I like heavy riffs but I also like to hear solos like lines in the sand and the jazzy bluesy stuff they use to throw in here and there , but remember this is a single song that we all got to hear before the whole album / cd whatever you buy is,,,, and I just heard a much better sounding track on youtube so I'm sure it's gonna sound so much better once we get our hands on it.

I don't get all the it's same ole DT of late ,, it's heavy yeah and there a few hints of past DT ditty's , but I disagree.

One complaint I don't really get is the sound of the snare is awful , I mean its a little low and the tone of it is softer less snap than some but I don't hear any problem with it I have played drums and guitar for years but I'm not hearing anything that sounds off to me maybe its a little bit low and doesn't stand out as much as usual snare , I dunno to me it sounds like a real snare with very little reverb added to it .
I did notice you really can hear everything MM is playing cymbals and high hat work is unreal  much clearer then ADTOE ( Still great album though).

Not sure I buy the chocolate cake thing yet buy yeah the tone JP has is really nice smooth and you can here everything well I guess I was expecting a huge change in tone , I know I can't wait to hear the rest!!!!!!!

[bosk1]

I've just never ever been reminded of the circus/carnival by JR's patches.

Probably because they have nothing to do with circuses or carnivals.  But somebody made that comparison once, and it apparently stuck, so all the cool kids who have nothing constructive to say can just throw that out there and act like it is a valid criticism.