Snare-HiHat

[LKap13]

I really hope that the Mangini we see in ADToE is predominantly Petrucci's vision for the drums and that Mangini's drum-writing potential wasn't exploited fully because for god's sake that HiHat-Snare pattern is stale.

[ResultsMayVary]

I really hope that the Mangini we see in ADToE is predominantly Petrucci's vision for the drums and that Mangini's drum-writing potential wasn't exploited fully because for god's sake that HiHat-Snare pattern is stale.

Mangini wrote his own drums. And the pattern is fine.

[FlyingBIZKIT]

I'm pretty sure hihats and snares are used in most songs.

[theseoafs]

I for one hope Mangini eschews the drum kit completely and plays a single bass drum for DT12.

[bosk1]

I really hope that the Mangini we see in ADToE is predominantly Petrucci's vision for the drums and that Mangini's drum-writing potential wasn't exploited fully because for god's sake that HiHat-Snare pattern is stale.

Mangini wrote his own drums. And the pattern is fine.

[lumpy33]

i thought that mike learned parts that were already written.  am i wrong?

to which patterns are you referring?  i haven't heard any boorishness or staleness in the parts...

[ResultsMayVary]

i thought that mike learned parts that were already written.  am i wrong?

to which patterns are you referring?  i haven't heard any boorishness or staleness in the parts...

John Petrucci wrote basic drums on a drum program and sent them to Mike. These beats were basic time keeping drums and simple fills. JP has said that multiple times. They sent Mike the complete demos with the basic drums in them and let him go nuts. One example JP brought up was the bass/drum unison in the instrumental section of Outcry. JP said he never would have even thought of something like that.

[IJewBear]

I don't remember what interview it was but Mike said that Petrucci only wrote the bass and snare patterns and some fills.

[Zook]

Doesn't every band in existence use the snare hi-hat pattern? What exactly are you referring to?

[cyberdrummer]

The only pattern that is slightly weird/simplistic, from a drummer's point of view, is the last chorus of BAI. It just doesn't work for me.

[Knguro]

Everything about this has been said already. I personally love what MM made on this record, is just simple amazing. Buuuuuuuuuuuut I would still love to hear the orginal demos sent to MM by JP.

[Cranky]

I know that Mangini is modest, and wants to play the supporting role instead of being a little more bombastic on the drums...
But, he really should have stepped it up a couple notches. I mean, the drumming on the album was great and all, but it was his FIRST album after the departure of Mike Portnoy, one of the greatest drummers in my opinion... They should have let Mangini go apeshit to show that he is more than capable of filling the shoes of Mr. Portnoy.

[theseoafs]

I know that Mangini is modest, and wants to play the supporting role instead of being a little more bombastic on the drums...
But, he really should have stepped it up a couple notches. I mean, the drumming on the album was great and all, but it was his FIRST album after the departure of Mike Portnoy, one of the greatest drummers in my opinion... They should have let Mangini go apeshit to show that he is more than capable of filling the shoes of Mr. Portnoy.

He wrote the drum parts. There was nothing the band didn't let him do.

And why does DT have to prove anything to the fans? I don't want them sticking unnecessary drum solos into their songs to prove to doubters that he's as good as Portnoy.

[Jaffa]

They should have let Mangini go apeshit to show that he is more than capable of filling the shoes of Mr. Portnoy.

I don't really get this mentality.  If anyone has any doubts on the abilities of Mike Mangini, they can pretty easily go on Youtube, search for 'Mike Mangini drum solo', and have their mind blown as many times as they want. 

I, personally, feel that if they'd tried to showcase him on the album they would have risked giving him too much attention.  I'd rather have him playing for the sake of the songs rather than showing off what he can do.

[ResultsMayVary]

Let the man play what he wants to play. There is certainly a fair amount of ridiculous drum parts on the record and the same goes for the simple beats. He played what ended up fitting the best for what the other guys were doing. It's about making good music, not making crazy parts for the sake of crazy.

[Elaitch]

I know that Mangini is modest, and wants to play the supporting role instead of being a little more bombastic on the drums...
But, he really should have stepped it up a couple notches. I mean, the drumming on the album was great and all, but it was his FIRST album after the departure of Mike Portnoy, one of the greatest drummers in my opinion... They should have let Mangini go apeshit to show that he is more than capable of filling the shoes of Mr. Portnoy.

Excuse me? He did "go apeshit" on some parts of the album, mind you x) Still, as Jaffa said, the proof of Mangini's greatness is only a youtube-search away. He doesn't need to over-complicate a Dream Theater-album to prove it.

[Pols Voice]

I for one hope Mangini eschews the drum kit completely and plays a single bass drum for DT12.

One word: TABLA

[dongringo]

I for one hope Mangini eschews the drum kit completely and plays a single bass drum for DT12.

One word: TABLA

Yeah, I guess they could have just got Zakir Hussain instead of MM. 

[tofee35]

This thread caught me off guard a bit because his snare/hi hat work is great. I love the Carter Beauford-esque ghost note pattern at 7:48 of BAI. I think the question is, do you like how the drumming fits the album? I absolutely do. I think it's one of the best drummed DT albums. My only gripe is the amount of double bass footwork. It's mostly on the slower paced passages that it gets repetitive. Now I'm having a side conversation with myself.

Tof

[Cranky]

They should have let Mangini go apeshit to show that he is more than capable of filling the shoes of Mr. Portnoy.

I don't really get this mentality.  If anyone has any doubts on the abilities of Mike Mangini, they can pretty easily go on Youtube, search for 'Mike Mangini drum solo', and have their mind blown as many times as they want. 

I, personally, feel that if they'd tried to showcase him on the album they would have risked giving him too much attention.  I'd rather have him playing for the sake of the songs rather than showing off what he can do.

Yeah, I know, I have seen most of the Youtube videos, I know he is an incredible drummer.
I think you missed my point by just a hair,
I'm not saying that he should be showing off and over-playing on every single section of every single song..
I'm saying that he should have done it more.

Excuse me? He did "go apeshit" on some parts of the album, mind you x) Still, as Jaffa said, the proof of Mangini's greatness is only a youtube-search away. He doesn't need to over-complicate a Dream Theater-album to prove it.

And, you're excused? Did you think that you farted but weren't sure if you did?

I know he is an incredible drummer, you are missing my point, no need to be offended.
And yeah, anyone can see him do his drum solos and on Youtube, I saw him for myself in Seattle... But, I feel as though he could of played some parts with a little bit more complexity to spice it up.

[Jamesman42]

He played what ended up fitting the best for what the other guys were doing. It's about making good music, not making crazy parts for the sake of crazy.

Good God, this.

[Cranky]

He played what ended up fitting the best for what the other guys were doing. It's about making good music, not making crazy parts for the sake of crazy.

Good God, this.

I agree, but at the same time... It's Dream Theater.
They do make some sections to be 'crazy just for the sake of being crazy'...
Nobody can deny that.

[ResultsMayVary]

He played what ended up fitting the best for what the other guys were doing. It's about making good music, not making crazy parts for the sake of crazy.

Good God, this.

I agree, but at the same time... It's Dream Theater.
They do make some sections to be 'crazy just for the sake of being crazy'...
Nobody can deny that.

Lost Not Forgotten tickle section and Outcry instrumental section. Two sections on the album who are both absolutely insane. And EVERYONE (with the exception of LaBrie since he has no singing there) shines and is doing something beyond the ability of the majority of musicians.

The point is that they don't need to be doing crazy ALL the time. This album is so great because (1) it's an essential return to form for DT, (2) there's nothing too ridiculous, and (3) that everyone has their time to shine and the album is balanced.

[namgalsipsclar]

I know that Mangini is modest, and wants to play the supporting role instead of being a little more bombastic on the drums...
But, he really should have stepped it up a couple notches. I mean, the drumming on the album was great and all, but it was his FIRST album after the departure of Mike Portnoy, one of the greatest drummers in my opinion... They should have let Mangini go apeshit to show that he is more than capable of filling the shoes of Mr. Portnoy.

Thats what the tour is for

[Cranky]

I know that Mangini is modest, and wants to play the supporting role instead of being a little more bombastic on the drums...
But, he really should have stepped it up a couple notches. I mean, the drumming on the album was great and all, but it was his FIRST album after the departure of Mike Portnoy, one of the greatest drummers in my opinion... They should have let Mangini go apeshit to show that he is more than capable of filling the shoes of Mr. Portnoy.

Thats what the tour is for

What do you mean by that?
Mike Mangini plays all the songs live as he does on the studio versions.

[namgalsipsclar]

I mean his mega solo halfway throught the set

[Cranky]

I think everyone is missing my point...
I am just saying that Mike Mangini could have over-played the songs a little bit more, and some of the crazy things that he IS during is kind of buried in the mix.

The new record is fine as it is, I love it... It's one of my favourite albums of all time already.
And, I am in no way saying that the album sucks, or Mangini sucks. 

[namgalsipsclar]

I think everyone is missing my point...
I am just saying that Mike Mangini could have over-played the songs a little bit more, and some of the crazy things that he IS during is kind of buried in the mix.

The new record is fine as it is, I love it... It's one of my favourite albums of all time already.
And, I am in no way saying that the album sucks, or Mangini sucks.

I actually agree(ish) with you. Its a kind of a 4/4.5 out of 5 drum performance

[Jaffa]

I think everyone is missing my point...
I am just saying that Mike Mangini could have over-played the songs a little bit more, and some of the crazy things that he IS during is kind of buried in the mix.

I don't think I'm missing your point, I just don't particularly agree with it.  You're perfectly entitled to your opinion, but in mine, I think what Mangini does on this album is pretty perfect, and I see no need for him to do more crazy stuff. 

[johncal]

This is really getting old.

[IronEarthTheater]

This is probably going to sound ignorant, but I don't really notice much of a difference.  I'm not a musician (obviously), but it seems to me that awesome drums have been replaced by awesome drums.  This album has its own sound, so to me, all the instruments sound different - even James sounds different.  I guess what I'm saying is, if I didn't know Portnoy had left, I wouldn't necessarily have noticed - any difference I would have chalked up to them trying something new.  Which is fine by me - that's not a dig at Mangini at all.  I loved the way DT sounded before, I love it now.

[energythief]

This is probably going to sound ignorant, but I don't really notice much of a difference.  I'm not a musician (obviously), but it seems to me that awesome drums have been replaced by awesome drums.  This album has its own sound, so to me, all the instruments sound different - even James sounds different.  I guess what I'm saying is, if I didn't know Portnoy had left, I wouldn't necessarily have noticed - any difference I would have chalked up to them trying something new.  Which is fine by me - that's not a dig at Mangini at all.  I loved the way DT sounded before, I love it now.

Yeah, as a fellow non-musician, I feel the same.

[BlobVanDam]

Wait..................



you can actually hear the high hats?


But seriously, his playing is perfectly fine. You just can't hear most of it.

[Jamesman42]

He played what ended up fitting the best for what the other guys were doing. It's about making good music, not making crazy parts for the sake of crazy.

Good God, this.

I agree, but at the same time... It's Dream Theater.
They do make some sections to be 'crazy just for the sake of being crazy'...
Nobody can deny that.

Lost Not Forgotten tickle section and Outcry instrumental section. Two sections on the album who are both absolutely insane. And EVERYONE (with the exception of LaBrie since he has no singing there) shines and is doing something beyond the ability of the majority of musicians.

The point is that they don't need to be doing crazy ALL the time. This album is so great because (1) it's an essential return to form for DT, (2) there's nothing too ridiculous, and (3) that everyone has their time to shine and the album is balanced.

I'm just gonna quote your post for emphasis in DT side from now on. I got your back.

[BlobVanDam]

*double post*