Falling Into Infinity

[Evo]

I know this has been discusses many, many times in the past. But it still puzzles me to this day how many people keep dissing this album. It happens to be my favorite - it sounds incredibly mature to me, which I mainly attribute to the pre-production process, and how they let the songs grow and evolve before recording them, and select those that fit the best. Also, the production destroys anything the band has ever done. The sound quality/tones are out of this world imo. It has a couple of weaker songs (you not me and take away my pain in particular), but also some of the greatest songs the band ever wrote (Hell's Kitchen, Lines In The Sand, Trial of Tears, I also happen to love Hollow Years, etc.), and one of the things I appreciate the most about it, is that none of the songs have any unnecessary or superfluous moments. It's one of the things that annoys me about post 6DOIT albums, it seems like they're eager to record every single idea they get, like everything they come up with has to end up somewhere (yes yes it's an exaggeration).
I really wish they would work that way again - take the time to write the music, let it mature, and work with an excellent producer (somehow I'm expecting to be flamed for this).
Thoughts?

[JayOctavarium]

FII was butchered by the record company.

Thats all im saying on this matter

Good album... but if the record company hadn't of interfered... it would have been so much better.

[DarkLord_Lalinc]

FII was butchered by the record company.

I beg to differ. The demos are cool and sure, You not Me sucks, but outside of that there weren't any songs butchered. They did Burning my Soul a favor by removing that out-of-place instrumental interlude and converting it into the amazing Hell's kitchen, they did Lines in the Sand a big favor by bringing amazing vocals by Doug Pinnick. I could go on, lots of the FII "favorites" remained almost untouched. Lines in the Sand? Trial of Tears? New Millennium? Those songs are pretty much equal to their demo counterparts (with the sporadic little changes).

Yeah, amazing songs like Speak to Me and Cover my Eyes were left out, but I understand it was really difficult to make a double album at the time. I love Falling into Infinity, and I'd say you should re-listen the album with an open mind before saying it was butchered by the label, because it wasn't.  



/opinion.

[Blazinarps]

Here's my opinion of FII song by song.

New Millennium: Great song all the way through. Really like the odd sound that it has compared to other DT songs. Mike Portnoy has good drum parts, Chapman Stick is cool, and JP brings the funk.

You Not Me. HAHA.

Peruvian Skies: Not my favorite, but I like it overall. I feel the instrumental riffs go on maybe a little too long.

Hollow Years: A great ballad. Maybe a little cheesy, but really melodic and the song builds well.

Burning My Soul: Horrible song.

Lines in the Sand. Fantastic song.I really like how the keyboards in the intro are referenced in the guitar solo. Or vice versa, who knows. Having said that, The intro could have been chopped off and I would like it more. Don't like the whole call and response thing during the verse, and vocals can be too shrill at points. Lovely lyrics though, and top 10 guitar solo easily.

Hell's Kitchen: Great instrumental song, I just don't ever feel like I'm in the mood to listen to it though. I really love it the times I've heard it. Listened to it MAYBE 5 times since I got into DT (2000).

Take Away My Pain. I really like the lyrics. I can't remember exactly what the demo sounds like, but I remember liking the vibe of it more than the studio version. Great song IMO.

Just Let Me Breathe. Something about this song bothers me, I think it's the lyrics. Complaining in songs is childish as far as I'm concerned, and it makes the band look less professional. Cool unison part.

Anna Lee: Killer song. Really unique solo as far as JP's solos are concerned. I think the lyrics are great, the vocal delivery is at times not to my liking. I only know the words to the last verse when I look them up, because I don't understand them. Again, I can't remember the demo exactly, but I'm thinking maybe there was another verse that they cut out that I liked a lot.

Trial of Tears: Great song from start to finish. Love the interplay between guitars and vocals, and JP's tone is amazing throughout. Derek's solo is maybe the ONLY keyboard lead solo that I have liked on any DT song.

All in all, a hit and miss album. The misses are near and the hits are home runs. Thumbs up. I had at one point a mix of the album without YnM, BmS, HK and JlmB. I put on Cover my Eyes and Speak to Me. Listened to it a lot. Liked it a lot. Life was magical.

[Ħ]

New Millennium: Best album opener.  Absolutely flawless all the way through.  The weird time signature changes actually make sense in a song like this (unlike TDOE for example).

You Not Me: Honestly can't see why they didn't just replace it with Speak to Me.  The producers had so many great things to work with, and they chose this?  It's not much worse than You Or Me, btw.

Peruvian Skies: Really cool song.  Love the chunky transition.  Not necessarily a flawless song, but definitely a fun one.

Hollow Years: One of the more unique DT songs...love the Spanish feel.  And LAB version: 

Burning My Soul: Kinda cool riff, but mostly ew.  I mean......why?  Just why?

Hell's Kitchen: Overrated by many, but also underrated by many.  It's a very situational song....reminds me of running up a hill as the sun is rising.  It's got that "climbing up the mountain" vibe to it.

Lines in the Sand: Wow.  GREAT song...goes on a teensy bit too long for my taste though, and the vocals (both James and the other guy) are pretty week.  But instrumentally this song is gold.

Take Away My Pain: The demo version is way better. This version is super cheesy and the vocal performance is very weak.

Just Let Me Breathe: Used to lump this song together with YNM and BMS, but this song really isn't that bad.  But it's not that great.  It's just ok.  The lyrics and vocal performance are pretty good though.

Anna Lee: Never really got into it that much.  Doesn't compare with Disappear/S-DV though.  I always forget about this song.

Trial of Tears: Wow.  Just wow.  My favorite for a long time (although not anymore).

~Ranking~
New Millennium
Hollow Years
Trial of Tears
Lines in the Sand
-----------
Hell's Kitchen
-----------
Just Let Me Breathe
Peruvian Skies
Take Away My Pain
Anna Lee
-----------
Burning My Soul
You Not Me

[JayOctavarium]

sorry if i came off kinda harsh on what i said...

its all opinion.

and for the record... i think Burning my Soul ' 96 > album version

[WildeSilas]

I think a lot of fans hate it because the band (especially MP) ragged on it for so long. I for one think it's brilliant - everything from the writing to the production was just excellent, and I don't even mind You Not Me. That said, I think the track order makes it feel a little strange, and I wish they'd have ditched YNM, JLMB, and BMS for Cover My Eyes, The Way It Used To Be, and Raise The Knife, or simply added them. It's obvious to me that there was a great deal of time spent on the mixing of this record compared to more recent DT albums, and it sound fantastic with headphones. It's in my top 3 (Awake, SFOAM, FII).

[Jamesman42]

If they had replaced NM, BMS, YNM, and JLMB with RTK, CME, STM, it would be a stellar album. Heck, NM can stay if need be, although I am not a fan of it.

[DarkLord_Lalinc]

Speak to Me needed to be in the record somehow.

[Frosthawk]

I love Falling Into Infinity. At least in my top 4 from Dream Theater. Helps that it was also the first album I heard from them, I guess. But really, Peruvian Skies, Hell's Kitchen, Lines in the Sand and Trial of Tears are all masterpieces in my eyes. Hell's Kitchen, actually, remains one of my all time favorite DT songs, despite its short length.

[Jamesman42]

Hell's Kitchen is such a gem of a song. My favorite from the album and the decision for it to be a standalone song was smart.

[JediKnight1969]

My 4 favourites:

1- SFAM
2- I&W
3- Awake
4- FII

Totally unfairly underrated album. A beautiful record full of great music. Feel sorry for all the people who can't be able to enjoy it for "political" reasons. To hate You not me just because Desmond Child co-wrote it? Just because MP said horrible things about how the label was trying to re-direct the band? People were still upset about KM resignation and because everybody loves Awake so much they never fully accepted DS who is (again) totally unfairly underrated. Thankfully, I'm able to enjoy great music no matter who's playing who's songs. I'm sure I'm going to enjoy DT11 as well.

Long live rock 'n' roll.

[Ben_Jamin]

Burning My Soul would've been a better single than Hollow Years.
Where Are You Now? Could have replaced YNM.

Also, Peruvian Skies is the weakest song on the album.

[Bolsters]

It took me a while to warm up to this album, so I used to be one of the haters. But once I got into it, Falling Into Infinity became a favorite.

[Ben_Jamin]

The production gives of a real cool atmosphere. The cover art really describes it well.

[tri.ad]

FII is a very good album. It contains really great songs, but also some that fall short. One of its greatest highlights is the production. Sonically, it's my favourite DT album. Every instrument cuts through easily, and it doesn't sound too loud or too over-compressed.
And I agree with those who say that separating HK from BMS was a really good decision.

[reo73]

FII is a very good album. It contains really great songs, but also some that fall short. One of its greatest highlights is the production. Sonically, it's my favourite DT album. Every instrument cuts through easily, and it doesn't sound too loud or too over-compressed.
And I agree with those who say that separating HK from BMS was a really good decision.

I love FII.  Trial of Tears is in my top 3 and a few others are in my top 15.  There are a few skips I make, most notably BMS and TAMP, but the other songs are so good that I don't fault the album as a whole for it.

[KevShmev]

FII was butchered by the record company.

Thats all im saying on this matter

Good album... but if the record company hadn't of interfered... it would have been so much better.

Totally disagree.

If the record company hadn't "interfered," we never would have gotten "Hell's Kitchen."  That alone made it all worthwhile.  And besides, most of the final versions are better than the demos (except for "You Not Me," but "You or Me" blows, too).

[Bolsters]

I must be a lunatic, because I actually prefer You Not Me over You Or Me not saying there aren't things about You Or Me that I prefer to the album version, but overall, I think I do prefer You Not Me. I'm completely alone, rite?

[Mladen]

Hell's kitchen's just not worth it. The album could have easily worked for me without it. The problem here is the selection of songs - after hearing the demos, I actually realized the better songs didn't end up on the album. Raise the knife, Cover my eyes, Where are you now and The Way it used to be are all much better than half of the stuff that ended up on the record. It's such a shame that what could have been top 5 material turned out to be my least favorite Dream Theater album...

[Zantera]

It's probably my 4th favorite DT-album, after Awake, 6DOIT and SFAM.

[YtseBitsySpider]

I don't think a lot of DT fans are Derek fans....and it gets a bum wrap for his presence.

[E.S.]

Just to be "prog" and go against everyone else, I gotta say I think You not Me is a cool rock song. And Burning My Soul has a legendary solo by Derek.

[Zydar]

Just to be "prog" and go against everyone else, I gotta say I think You not Me is a cool rock song.

Thank you! Finally some non-criticism for this song.

[Hal Incandenza]

Just to be "prog" and go against everyone else, I gotta say I think You not Me is a cool rock song. And Burning My Soul has a legendary solo by Derek.

Agreed on the keyboard solo by Derek.  I'm a big Kevin Moore fan, but I always liked Sherinian's style and wasn't disappointed with his work at all.

You Not Me... well, it's a pretty decent pop rock song.  It gets targeted because it's not what DT fans expect from DT, and because as an attempted hit single it just falls flat.  Compare it to Queensryche's Hear in the New Frontier album which came out the same year.  Queensryche changed up their sound in an attempt to recapture former commercial success, the two resulting singles are significantly better than You Not Me, and were far more successful as pop rock radio tunes.  As a killer single, it was a bust.  As a DT song, within the usual expectations of being a DT song, it's crap.  On a good generic pop rock album it's middle grade, not worthy of being a single, but not filler either.

[?]

I have to say, I like Burning My Soul! I don't see what's so bad about it, maybe the lyrics, but they are IMO still better than most lyrics on Systematic Chaos.

[Ħ]

Just to be "prog" and go against everyone else, I gotta say I think You not Me is a cool rock song.

Nice!

Yeah here's how I'd compare the demo songs to the album songs (at least, just the ones that matter).

Album    ///////// Demo
You Not Me < You Or Me --------just barely.  Both are pretty terrible.
Hollow Years = Hollow Years -------extra lyrics are kinda cool, but don't really take away or add anything
Burning My Soul + Hell's Kitchen >>> Burning My Soul --------- BMS stinks and HK is great, glad they split it.
Lines in the Sand <<< Lines in the Sand ------------added lyrics are cool, plus you have the absence of the lame guy.
Take Away My Pain <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Take Away My Pain-------The studio version is AWFUL, and the demo is BRILLIANT.

So overall, the producers get a  from me.

[ricky]

i like how the songs have this modern, sonic type sound to them. FII is a cool album. sherinian came up with some cool parts.

but i do agree that it would have been better had the label not messed with the original songs. that being said, it's still very good.

[Aquila Chrysaetos]

I don't know about this one...

Somehow, for me, this is the only album that has a lot of songs that just don't stick in my head.
Exceptions maybe Peruvian Skies and Hollow Years.
Tried it a lot of times, but I never really got into it.

[jcmoorehead]

I'm in the camp that actually enjoys You Not Me, then again I'm also a huge fan of Meat Loaf and Bon Jovi so I can accept cheesy but cool rock songs a bit easier. It's problem is it just isn't a Dream Theater song (Whatever a Dream Theater song actually is), if Bon Jovi had put it out then fair enough but because it came from Dream Theater there is a sort of 'eh?' factor around it.

I will admit I was wary of FII before buying it because of it's reputation but I've noticed that it's reputation seems to be based on the initial reaction and some of the bands feelings towards it and isn't really representative of how DT fans feel about it now. I think as it stands FII is a good album but due to outside interference is more flawed then it should have been, a lot of the songs on it come across a lot better live too.

Also goes without saying that Dream Theater at their 'not so best' is a lot better then a lot of bands/artists out there anyway.

[jingle.boy]

As someone who heard FII right from the initial release, consider what was happening with the band and the fan base in 1997 (rather than rating all the indivudal songs - on FII, or on the cutting room floor) as a measure of why it gets dissed.  Coming off of Awake, and the release of ACOS, expectations were VERY high for the band.  Then, FII comes out with a very incosistent mix of songs and styles - not to mention weaker vocals from James resulting from his injury.  If anything, it was very confusing for the fan base.  To get such masterpieces as Lines in the Sand and Trial of Tears, mixed in with (arguable) turds like You Not Me, and Burning My Soul turned a lot of people off.  Several tracks (and the band admits) were influenced or designed to be more "commercially accepted", and that turned a lot of people off.  FII was (at the time) truly a divergence from the direction the band was going, or where they wanted to go.  Hence the reason how and why they got back on track with SFAM 2 years later.

So, knowing what we know now, the dis-respect the album gets I would say is unwarranted.  At the time 14 years ago, it was deserved.  Overall, it is the album that has aged the best for me.  If you try to let go of the stigma that songs like Burning My Soul and Anna Lee carried for so long, they're actually pretty good.  If listened to with fresh ears - which I suspect is the case for the new forum community - some of those old 'turds' are pretty enjoyable.

[Ħ]

I'm in the camp that actually enjoys You Not Me

What camp?

[KevShmev]

I'm in the camp that actually enjoys You Not Me

What camp?

A group of five that meet on Friday nights to drink and toast bad songs.

[Perpetual Change]

FII's on the lower tier of albums for me. I think that at least two or three Jordan albums are better than it, as well as both Images and Words and Awake. I'd say it's about equal with Octavarium. Plenty of awesomeness on both, mixed in with some pretty bad stuff. The difference is that on FII the awesomeness is spread out evenly throughout the record. On 8va, it's in big chunks toward the beginning and end.

[JediKnight1969]

Hopefully, one day maybe for an anniversary or something, they relaunch the album in a special 2 cd version with all the material originally recorded, remastered & remixed the way the band originally wanted to. That would be epic and totally deserved.