Would DT 6.0 survive a flop?

[cthrubuoy]

Being in Rihana's band does nothing for his credability as an artist.

WUT? Vai played with Nelly Furtardo and that didn't affect his 'credibility' at all. I don't see how Nuno touring with Rhianna is any different.

[lord-ruler]

well I personally think Vai is talented technically but his song writing ability is not that impressive to me.  I haven't heard a single on of his songs that I want to hear again.  Just my opinion.

[hefdaddy42]

Being in Rihana's band does nothing for his credability as an artist.

WUT? Vai played with Nelly Furtardo and that didn't affect his 'credibility' at all. I don't see how Nuno touring with Rhianna is any different.

This.  It's a gig.

[Funkafonik]

Yes but what has Nuno done since?  Mostly just unlistenable garbage.   He was still going strong in waiting for the punchline but there last album is horribly bad.

Nuno was the cause of Extreme's downfall.   He made his album Shizophic (posing as a woman on the cover)  Then he decided he enjoyed having 100% control over his songs and he quit extreme.   After that he totally changed his way of playing and focused on singing and song structure over concentrating on playing his guitar which is a shame.   I would compare it to J.P leaving Dream Theater and joining a Kurt Cobain cover band.  Nuno even admits he does not practice all that much anymore.   Being in Rihana's band does nothing for his credability as an artist.

What has he done since? You're obviously not a fan if you're asking that. So why would anyone take your opinion as anything of value about Nuno? Maybe you haven't heard of Mourning Widows, Population 1/DramaGods and producing and doing session work for loads of artists. Might not be your cup of tea, but to call it "unlistenable garbage" is just ignorant.

Nuno was Extreme's downfall? Wrong, their label was their downfall... He released Schizophonic to finish off their 5-albums deal ASAP...
Left to have 100% control?? euh... just take a look at the songwriting credits for 95% of Extreme's songs. He actually left because he wanted more creative inputs from the other guys, which they weren't really up for it since his stuff kicked so much more ass....

To comment on the thread topic though, DT 6.0 will be just fine. 

[lord-ruler]

Extreme was my favorite band when Nuno left in september 1998 the same month and year my ex wife did.  I was a huge fan of his and have all of his solo albums since he left but none of them comes even close to his playing on "III sides" or even "waiting for the punchline"  I had high hopes for his solo career (I even bought the baby animals c.d because he played on a few songs) but he has sorely disappointed.  Actually I think the best he has done is some of the stuff he did on dweezil zappa's album.  He ripped the other guitar players to shreds in that jam session.

[Lowdz]

Yes but what has Nuno done since?  Mostly just unlistenable garbage.   He was still going strong in waiting for the punchline but there last album is horribly bad.

Nuno was the cause of Extreme's downfall.   He made his album Shizophic (posing as a woman on the cover)  Then he decided he enjoyed having 100% control over his songs and he quit extreme.   After that he totally changed his way of playing and focused on singing and song structure over concentrating on playing his guitar which is a shame.   I would compare it to J.P leaving Dream Theater and joining a Kurt Cobain cover band.  Nuno even admits he does not practice all that much anymore.   Being in Rihana's band does nothing for his credability as an artist.

What has he done since? You're obviously not a fan if you're asking that. So why would anyone take your opinion as anything of value about Nuno? Maybe you haven't heard of Mourning Widows, Population 1/DramaGods and producing and doing session work for loads of artists. Might not be your cup of tea, but to call it "unlistenable garbage" is just ignorant.

Nuno was Extreme's downfall? Wrong, their label was their downfall... He released Schizophonic to finish off their 5-albums deal ASAP...
Left to have 100% control?? euh... just take a look at the songwriting credits for 95% of Extreme's songs. He actually left because he wanted more creative inputs from the other guys, which they weren't really up for it since his stuff kicked so much more ass....

To comment on the thread topic though, DT 6.0 will be just fine. 

I was a huge Nuno fan. Loved his songwriting and his guitar playing but "unlistenable garbage" sums his stuff since III Sides up nicely for me too.
He was awesome on Dweezil's album though. The Kiss is a great song. Unfortunately he went all Jane's Addiction and that's where I bailed.

[CrimsonE]

I won't say much about the Nuno argument other than he should have been the next successor to Eddie Van Halen.

However, I don't think DT will fall into the same trap that Extreme did.  WFTPL was just a bad album, which didn't need to be bad.  They simply changed their sound too much to try to fit in, and alienated the fans that liked them for who they were. Def Leppard tried the same thing with Slang, and they also never really recovered from that.  Sure, they had some solid albums and were a consistent live act, but they never quite reached the heights they were on Hysteria & Adrenalize. 

My guess is that DT will continue to maintain their unique sound, regardless of who is drumming, and it will likely to pretty well for the band.  The key test will be on how well the next tour does.  Van Halen's album with Gary Charone sold pretty well, but the tour itself didn't exactly overhwelm the fans (Although I thought it was pretty solid, especially since they brought out more DLR material than Sammy usually sang). 

[Global Laziness]

And another thing to look at is that the two principle songwriters, Petrucci and Rudess, are still in the band. Yes, Portnoy wrote some music and offered a lot of guidance and direction, but I really don't think the style will change much without him. As such, it's hard to see this being a flop.

[EPICVIEW]

my answer is NO.

with Mike saying he would come back.....if the new band is a flop it could be a very bad day

[Ben_Jamin]

Yes they will. Mike Portnoy didn't have to leave. Yet, he did and that's that. Now, how many of those who want him back now actually cared before he left or after? Who cares who their new drummer is as long as they continue making great music, rockin or not, and perform live.

[jonny108]

As much as I am excited for the next release, people seem to think that it's going to be like I&W or Awake. There is so much hype that JM is going to come out of his shell, and they are going to sound like they used too back in the day that when they bring out this album which is still relatively there unique modern sound, people won't like it.

[King Postwhore]

As much as I am excited for the next release, people seem to think that it's going to be like I&W or Awake. There is so much hype that JM is going to come out of his shell, and they are going to sound like they used too back in the day that when they bring out this album which is still relatively there unique modern sound, people won't like it.

What I think people are hoping for is the more melodic style of I & W with the sound of today. 

[EPICVIEW]

As much as I am excited for the next release, people seem to think that it's going to be like I&W or Awake. There is so much hype that JM is going to come out of his shell, and they are going to sound like they used too back in the day that when they bring out this album which is still relatively there unique modern sound, people won't like it.

What I think people are hoping for is the more melodic style of I & W with the sound of today. 

Id like that for sure..

[orcus116]

As much as I am excited for the next release, people seem to think that it's going to be like I&W or Awake. There is so much hype that JM is going to come out of his shell, and they are going to sound like they used too back in the day that when they bring out this album which is still relatively there unique modern sound, people won't like it.

What I think people are hoping for is the more melodic style of I & W with the sound of today. 

I'd love to see them get back in that mindset but I honestly think they've grown beyond whatever they were doing back then stylistically for that to even happen. I could see them experimenting with An Evening With... stuff but in a more band setting.

[MetalManiac666]

DT 6.0 would definitely survive a flop.  However, I feel that the guys are too determined to prove themselves to create a bad album.

[Major Thirteenth]

As much as I am excited for the next release, people seem to think that it's going to be like I&W or Awake. There is so much hype that JM is going to come out of his shell, and they are going to sound like they used too back in the day that when they bring out this album which is still relatively there unique modern sound, people won't like it.

Little chance of a flop:

1) John Myung is already way out of the shell and is in a highly contributory state.
2) Friction and tension have been mitigated by the breakup. Creativity and energy will be at higher point than in the recent past.
3) The Iron Maiden tour undoubtedly increased the fan base by a significant amount.
4) The controversy has not been pretty, but controversy still enhances visibility and interest. The enthusiastic AND borderline fan base will be in high anticipation of the next release.
5) The strong early performance of BC&SL indicates more widespread attention and interest.
6) Jordans huge success with MW will generate more interest in DT.
7) The band knows they have to "bring it" on the next album. Musicians of this calibre understand the challenge and will have a high chance of delivering the goods.

All signs really seem to indicate that the next album will not be a flop.

[JasonScandopolous]

I think, even if the next album sucks, it won't be a flop in the commercial sense.  Has there ever been a greater urgency/curiosity to hear what DT's next album is going to sound like?  As long as early reviews aren't >80% bad (even SC didn't have this), people will still buy it and want to hear it for themselves.

[RazielSR]

One thing that "scares" me about the new album is that is gonna be again with RR, isn't it?

If yes... do you all really think the label will allow the guys to release a really prog album with a completely new and fresh direction? Or do they will be forced to produce some random/"just DT" stuff just to get more casual listeners attention?

[rumborak]

I was a huge Nuno fan. Loved his songwriting and his guitar playing but "unlistenable garbage" sums his stuff since III Sides up nicely for me too.

Actually, Schizophonic is an excellent album. The stuff after that, yes, shite, complete shite. Same with Gary Cherone really, only that he never had a successful solo album. His stint in Van Halen was atrocious.

rumborak

[hefdaddy42]

One thing that "scares" me about the new album is that is gonna be again with RR, isn't it?

If yes... do you all really think the label will allow the guys to release a really prog album with a completely new and fresh direction? Or do they will be forced to produce some random/"just DT" stuff just to get more casual listeners attention?

According to their deal, DT has complete control.  No one from RR hears anything until the album is done.

[RazielSR]

One thing that "scares" me about the new album is that is gonna be again with RR, isn't it?

If yes... do you all really think the label will allow the guys to release a really prog album with a completely new and fresh direction? Or do they will be forced to produce some random/"just DT" stuff just to get more casual listeners attention?

According to their deal, DT has complete control.  No one from RR hears anything until the album is done.

Ok, so the musical change that many people says was due to RR, it wasjust bcause of DT. Ok, then I have no problem with RR.

[hefdaddy42]

One thing that "scares" me about the new album is that is gonna be again with RR, isn't it?

If yes... do you all really think the label will allow the guys to release a really prog album with a completely new and fresh direction? Or do they will be forced to produce some random/"just DT" stuff just to get more casual listeners attention?

According to their deal, DT has complete control.  No one from RR hears anything until the album is done.

Ok, so the musical change that many people says was due to RR, it wasjust bcause of DT. Ok, then I have no problem with RR.

No one says that their change was due to RR.  Whatever "change" you may be talking about.

[RazielSR]

One thing that "scares" me about the new album is that is gonna be again with RR, isn't it?

If yes... do you all really think the label will allow the guys to release a really prog album with a completely new and fresh direction? Or do they will be forced to produce some random/"just DT" stuff just to get more casual listeners attention?

According to their deal, DT has complete control.  No one from RR hears anything until the album is done.

Ok, so the musical change that many people says was due to RR, it wasjust bcause of DT. Ok, then I have no problem with RR.

No one says that their change was due to RR.  Whatever "change" you may be talking about.

No one? Oh well, then I was reading my own hallucinations while reading around here and another forums that DT became more comercial oriented and just "DT sound" mainly in the albums where the label is RR. BTW, y like a lot BC&SL, not that much SC.

[cthrubuoy]

I've never seen anyone here say that?

[KevShmev]

Some probably said that because "Constant Motion" sounded like an attempt to write a somewhat catchy modern metal song, and since RR was gonna be giving the band a push, some may have thought that they decided to start writing songs to appeal to some of the masses, but the truth is that just about every DT album has had a song or two that, with the right push, could have been minor mainstream rock hits.  I mean, "I Walk Beside You" was a clear attempt to write a song for mainstream rock radio, but their old company wasn't doing anything for them, so I don't think that was ever even released as a single or whatever they are calling songs that get played on the radio these days.

[Jamesman42]

I think I know what Raziel is saying. Some people have indeed said/implied that DT going to RR kind of influenced them in a more metal direction after Octavarium.

[rumborak]

Well, here's the thing: RR might not have been the prime cause of the sound on SC, but they might have been the prime catalyst. DT knew they were going to get much more push from RR than they ever did with Atlantic, and thus DT(MP) may have decided that this could be the opportunity to propel DT into mainstream acceptance. And you don't do that with old prog sound. So, the new sound might have been an attempt to "align the stars" correctly in order to use RR's push to the fullest extent.

rumborak

[Jamesman42]

Well, here's the thing: RR might not have been the prime cause of the sound on SC, but they might have been the prime catalyst. DT knew they were going to get much more push from RR than they ever did with Atlantic, and thus DT(MP) may have decided that this could be the opportunity to propel DT into mainstream acceptance. And you don't do that with old prog sound. So, the new sound might have been an attempt to "align the stars" correctly in order to use RR's push to the fullest extent.

rumborak

Exactly this.

[RazielSR]

Yes, thats what I meant.  And I'm not sure if the next album will be more "metal" and not that prog just to gain some more attention exploiting the "new band position without MP". I mean, this could be a double-edged sword.

[cthrubuoy]

Well, here's the thing: RR might not have been the prime cause of the sound on SC, but they might have been the prime catalyst. DT knew they were going to get much more push from RR than they ever did with Atlantic, and thus DT(MP) may have decided that this could be the opportunity to propel DT into mainstream acceptance. And you don't do that with old prog sound. So, the new sound might have been an attempt to "align the stars" correctly in order to use RR's push to the fullest extent.

rumborak

They should have gotten masks and 4 new members.

[rumborak]

I have to be honest, I actually wouldn't know what type of music would make me really like their newest album. To say it like Antone Ego in Ratatouille: "Surprise me!". You know, I wouldn't mind if DT pulled a Kid A or an Achtung Baby. I mean, for the fact that they have absolute creative control, they have been boringly consistent really.

rumborak

[Jamesman42]

Dreamknot

Slip Theater

Mushroom Theater

Dream Head

Mud Theater

Dreamvayne

yh2408g h3obebgffbgfn

[RazielSR]

 

Sometimes I wonder, it is the listener or the musician when we say that a band is not releasing good albums anymore? It is because we get used to the band or it is, in fact,  because the band is worst?

[rumborak]

Well, it's always the combination of the writer and the reader. But, the more readers you consider, the more the influence of the writer sticks out.

rumborak

[RazielSR]

True. I think that when a band become more commercial (more listeners to consider) is when a band goes downhill. Mainly cause they are not listening to their own soul anymore and all the magic is gone . Anyway, they'll keep saying that "this is the music we feel" and all that things