Mike's response to an open letter on his forum

[Chino]

One thing that I realized a little while ago in the car. I think MP was dead in the water as soon as he made his first announcement on leaving the band. I am kind of surprised that he opted to be the one to break the news instead of having the band make an official announcement. I feel like it would have been worded in a way that would have made Mike look no where near as bad.

[orcus116]

Yeah, people, calm down, he just saw The Wall last night.

I actually hadn't even thought of that. I imagine it's a bit of both; using a PF reference to signify a break (or at least drop in activity) from the net.

Perhaps not the best choice of words though. 

[ariich]

Yeah, people, calm down, he just saw The Wall last night.

I actually hadn't even thought of that. I imagine it's a bit of both; using a PF reference to signify a break (or at least drop in activity) from the net.

Perhaps not the best choice of words though. 

That's putting it mildly.

[wolfking]

To make my opinion brief, Mike needs to STFU and stop his bitching!  Sorry, but it's true.

[Ħ]

To make my opinion brief, Mike needs to STFU and stop his bitching!  Sorry, but it's true.

[Aniland]

Do you think he did that even as a sort of "I've become the Roger Waters of Dream Theater"?

[tri.ad]

To make my opinion brief, Mike needs to STFU and stop his bitching!  Sorry, but it's true.

3... 2... 1...

[wolfking]

Am I getting banned? 

Sorry.

[Chino]

Am I getting banned? 

Sorry.

At least scolded

[wolfking]

Am I getting banned? 

Sorry.

At least scolded

I guess I can handle that. 

[Samsara]

But...he did, right?  Sure, "they went their separate ways" is a nicer way to put it.  But is was his choice to leave.  DT made it clear that they would welcome him back if he chose to recind his decision.

You can look at it from either side. There's no reason that the band had to get back in the studio. The opposite of your approach would be to say that he wanted a hiatus (which a hell of a lot of fans would have agreed with, by the way) but they said no and gave him no choice.

The rest of the band wanted to get back to things, and he didn't. They didn't force him to and he didn't force them not to. Both sides agreed they weren't in the same place right now.

I don't know.  I really don't see why there couldn't have been some sort of compromise, if both parties really wanted it.  Like Portnoy saying "ok, I need some time off, can you guys record the next album with a temp guy and then I should be recharged and ready to go?"  Why did it have to be one of two extremes?

-J

I said that exact same thing hundreds of time since this happened, and everyone skips it over. No one asks Mike or the band that question. Trunk didn't, no one did.

Unless there is something else in play, all Mike had to do was ask for a leave of absence for an album/tour cycle. No need to quit the band, or force the band to go on hiatus.  But nope, he took it to extremes (or the band did, NO ONE KNOWS).

Frustrating.

[KevShmev]

In general Mike hasn't been handling things well, that much is obvious. I actually think that particular response to the "open letter" was a good one though. He admitted jumping to conclusions and publicly apologised to everyone include CJS.

Still, he apologised and pledged to take some time off from internet posting.

ariich, do you honestly think that was an apology last night?  I mean, an apology is not just saying, "I am sorry," or "I apologize."   It is how you say it, not really what you say.  And what he basically said was he was sorry while not sounding not sorry at all.  Saying the words doesn't mean you actually mean it.  Just saying...

Do you think he did that even as a sort of "I've become the Roger Waters of Dream Theater"?

I doubt that is a position anyone wants to be in, since Waters was an outcast from Floyd for, oh, close to 20 years.  

[tri.ad]

Still, he apologised and pledged to take some time off from internet posting.

ariich, do you honestly think that was an apology last night?  I mean, an apology is not just saying, "I am sorry," or "I apologize."   It is how you say it, not really what you say.  And what he basically said was he was sorry while not sounding not sorry at all.  Saying the words doesn't mean you actually mean it.  Just saying...

Yup, that's basically what I tried to say, but I beat around the bush quite a bit more there...
Anyway, I agree.

[ariich]

@Samsara: Pretty sure that was discussed earlier on, and I can't imagine that it would work at all. I mean, everyone would know they were doing an album without MP, but that he was still the DT drummer, so it wouldn't feel like a proper DT record, and people wouldn't take it seriously. Especially not whoever filled in for that album.

@Kev: Do you really think that everyone apologises in exactly the same way? Not everyone is going to post "omg I am so so sorry, please forgive me". Mike has ALWAYS been very open and genuine with his posts, but he is obviously a stubborn person and apologies are obviously a hard thing for him to do. People are happy to attack him when he is too open about his negative feelings, but quick to be sceptical when he apologises.

[orcus116]

Well for starters you don't see stuff like this in an apology:

"I dont know who I owe an apology to"

"Honestly, I'm not exactly sure what I did wrong.."

"I'm still not sure how *I* started it? "

A little fact checking on his part wouldn't have hurt too in regards to hypocritically believing Blabbermouth and still believing DT.net expunged all Portnoy related information. He's clearly in the wrong for misinformation alone which happens to everyone but when you've got a dozen or so posters pointing it out for you and you still ignore it, well....

[ariich]

His post covered a lot of different stuff. Regarding the misunderstanding, he apologised for it. If you want to not believe it, fine, but don't go trying to turn everyone else cynical as well.

[wolfking]

Well for starters you don't see stuff like this in an apology:

"I dont know who I owe an apology to"

"Honestly, I'm not exactly sure what I did wrong.."

"I'm still not sure how *I* started it? "

To me, he's pulling shit and trying to come across that's he's the victim.

[Ħ]

Well for starters you don't see stuff like this in an apology:

"I dont know who I owe an apology to"

"Honestly, I'm not exactly sure what I did wrong.."

"I'm still not sure how *I* started it? "

To me, he's pulling shit and trying to come across that's he's the victim.

[TheOutlawXanadu]

Rich, there is no way that open letter was "good" if by "good" you mean "good apology".

Any apology consisting of the lines highlighted by Orcus above is not a good one. It actually reminds me of a Curb Your Enthusiasm episode.

[LieLowTheWantedMan]

The funny thing about this is I can't take sides. Whenever a fan posts something nice and new, I immediately take their side. Yet as soon as MP explains himself, I take his side.

[wolfking]

Well for starters you don't see stuff like this in an apology:

"I dont know who I owe an apology to"

"Honestly, I'm not exactly sure what I did wrong.."

"I'm still not sure how *I* started it? "

To me, he's pulling shit and trying to come across that's he's the victim.

I should just STFO myself now hey? 

[j]

@Samsara: Pretty sure that was discussed earlier on, and I can't imagine that it would work at all. I mean, everyone would know they were doing an album without MP, but that he was still the DT drummer, so it wouldn't feel like a proper DT record, and people wouldn't take it seriously. Especially not whoever filled in for that album.

I don't see why that would have to be the case at all.  I'm sure most drummers would be thrilled at the chance to record an album with DT, even if they knew it would probably be a one-time thing.  And if not (which again, I think is highly unlikely), surely they could find somebody with a little artistic integrity who would put in 100%.

As for it not "feel[ing] like a proper DT record", to whom?  The fans?  Band lineups change, and this one has done it plenty of times.  I can't see a significant number of people boycotting a DT album just because one member was taking a hiatus, especially in light of recent events.

@Samsara: Sorry if I glossed over this point when you made it earlier.  I may have subconsciously absorbed it while browsing the forum, which would explain the sudden revelation.

-J

[antigoon]

Eh, I agree with Rich on this one. I just couldn't see something like that happening.

[Samsara]

@Samsara: Pretty sure that was discussed earlier on, and I can't imagine that it would work at all. I mean, everyone would know they were doing an album without MP, but that he was still the DT drummer, so it wouldn't feel like a proper DT record, and people wouldn't take it seriously. Especially not whoever filled in for that album.

Why not? The honesty from MP and the band on that, and the fact the person was a touring drummer? Again, JP is the majority songwriter in Dream Theater. People would so take it seriously. It all comes down to again - Mike is a drummer. He's a damn good one, and he writes some lyrics and once in awhile gives a riff idea. But losing Mike isn't like losing DeGarmo, or a Petrucci, or a Page.

Proper DT record? I dunno my man, I think if it was explained honestly, and the reasons given, people would give it a hell of a shot, particularly if the right drummer came on board (say Mark Zonder, or someone of that caliber).

Mike Portnoy was not, and is not, the lynch pin in Dream Theater. That is John Petrucci. And quite honestly, I think Portnoy knows that, and is frustrated and this is why, partly, he's acting the way he is. He knows the band will go along just fine without him. Maybe not do all the things Mike Portnoy wants them to do, but he knows they'll go along and make good music and make good money and be successful without him behind the drums. And it is eating at him. Just my .02, and God knows folks are going to disagree, but that's my thought.

[Shadow2222]

I think that thread is gone now. My god, this day was very... dramatic.

[Weymolith]

I think that thread is gone now. My god, this day was very... dramatic.

It has been removed because of Blabbermouth linking to it.

[orcus116]

Some real top notch journalism they got going on over at Blabbermouth.

[emindead]

I think that thread is gone now. My god, this day was very... dramatic.

It has been removed because of Blabbermouth linking to it.

MP.com doesn't allow to link to other websites?

Edit: woops, got it.

[TAC]

@Samsara: Pretty sure that was discussed earlier on, and I can't imagine that it would work at all. I mean, everyone would know they were doing an album without MP, but that he was still the DT drummer, so it wouldn't feel like a proper DT record, and people wouldn't take it seriously. Especially not whoever filled in for that album.

Proper DT record? I dunno my man, I think if it was explained honestly, and the reasons given, people would give it a hell of a shot, particularly if the right drummer came on board (say Mark Zonder, or someone of that caliber).

Sam, This is how I felt at first.  Like you said, if it was explained to the fans honestly, we would absolutely accept it and an interim drummer.

And honestly this is what I would hope would've happenned, but it doesn't seem like the BAND was up for that.

[Infinite Cactus]

It would make even more sense if he just sucked it up for the album and had a temporary touring drummer. He gets the writing credit and gets to take a break. He could have been Brian Wilson(without the acid flashbacks and weight gain).

[Perpetual Change]

Some real top notch journalism they got going on over at Blabbermouth.

Lol. Blabbermouth's method: take whatever controversial event is happening in the rock world, and treat it like the Clinton scandal.

I think that thread is gone now. My god, this day was very... dramatic.

It has been removed because of Blabbermouth linking to it.

Huh?

So Mike gets mad at James based on something Blabbermouth says, out of context, and then has his threads deleted when Blabbermouth links to them? Does Mike think that out-of-context Blabbermouth does a better job of representing the situation than people being able to read his actual thread would?

Not putting you on the spot or anything, Wey, and nor am I expecting an answer. I just think this is kinda odd, but it perfectly sums up everything that's bizarre about this situation IMO.


Anyway, I'd post more in this thread but Sam's already doing a good job of stating an opinion very close to mine. Including what I'd consider to be "out of bounds."

[Volk9]

"I dont know who I owe an apology to"

"Honestly, I'm not exactly sure what I did wrong.."

"I'm still not sure how *I* started it? "

If I said any of that to Rina while shes upset (and I have), I would recieve a swift butt kicking

[Weymolith]

Just to be clear, I removed the thread. NOT Mike, NOT at Mike's request.

Why did I do it? Because after Blabbermouth linked to that article, we had numerous new user registrations, many of which are going to be nothing more than trolls from BM.

[Perpetual Change]

Hm. Well, thanks for clarifying. That's all I'll say about it.

[FlashCE]

0. Says he doesn't like James' voice publically.
1. Leaves band.
2. Cry about being forced to leave.
3. Get mad over discussions of possible future drummers on his forum.
4. Delete threads with such discussions.
5. Says that the rest of the band would need to put 110% into everything they do to fill his shoes.
6. Says that it would be a tragedy if he never plays with the band again.
7. Bitch about Blabbermouth taking things out of context yet fall into their trap and remove James' tour dates.
8. Posts an apology in a half hearted way "okay fine whatever sorry".
9. Calls himself a victim.

Literally still have fans that defend him wow.