New Millennium

[Nic35]

I never paid attention that song since yesterday, and now I can't stop listening to it. I don't know why I always skipped it, but now I realize how good that song is. The instrumental section is one of their best IMO.

*appreciates*

[SystematicThought]

I love this song. I also like the Budokan version. All in all, it's a great song and I agree with you about the instrumental section.

I love FII too. It's a great album. The album that they wanted them to go mainstream and make shorter songs, is also one of their longest studio albums

[TL]

It's a fantastic song, and the whole album is very solid.
Since I became a fan years after it came out, I wasn't around for the initial backlash. I heard about the negative reaction, which led to me being pleasantly surprised when I first heard the album. It just has a really cool vibe to it. I guess I can see how it would have come as a bit of a shock after IaW, Awake, and ACOS, but it provides a good balance to their discography.

[ACID_FOX]

The album that they wanted them to go mainstream and make shorter songs, is also one of their longest studio albums

Wow, nice observation!

[Jarlaxle]

But it has an average song length that is probably conisderably less than most other albums.

[Stoneyman]

As I mentioned in the other thread about what the next cd should sound like, I think New Millennium has all the cool stuff I love about DT in one place.  Cool proggish riffs, catchy lyrics, and tasteful balls and chunk when necessary.  I liked how Derek's contribution never seemed forced or "too much." 

I have always loved FII.  IMO its some of DT's best work (Trial, Lines, etc.)

[Aniland]

But it has an average song length that is probably conisderably less than most other albums.

But it is their longest album.

[MykeHavoc]

I haven't gotten into this song yet. Still bores me.

[The Letter M]

But it has an average song length that is probably conisderably less than most other albums.

But it is their longest album.

You know Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence is longer, right? Unless you're counting their B-Sides...

-Marc.

[?]

I haven't gotten into this song yet. Still bores me.

I don't like this song very much, either.

[Zydar]

Live At Budokan made me appreciate this song. Great opener to the album.

[Lowdz]

  I liked how Derek's contribution never seemed forced or "too much." 

I have always loved FII.  IMO its some of DT's best work (Trial, Lines, etc.)

What I liked about this album compared with the ones that followed was that the keyboards sounded like keyboards and not like guitars. The soundscape was much more varied. i love JR's work, he is a monster, but the recent direction has held him back. It sounds like I'm not a fan of the recent stuff, but I very much am. Ilove listening to a mix of BC&SL I did with the stems with the keys higher in the mix. there's so much cool stuff buried in there.

[delossantosj]

i think the beggining is jsut obnoxious lol. thats the main reason i dont listen to it often, but when i do i usually enjoy the song. it just frustrates me taht beggining

[Dublagent66]

Yeah, I didn't like it much at first but it has a tendency to grow on ya.  Good tune.

[Ħ]

I cannot lie, New Millennium was in my top 10 at one point.

[bosk1]

i think the beggining is jsut obnoxious lol. thats the main reason i dont listen to it often, but when i do i usually enjoy the song. it just frustrates me taht beggining

This makes no sense to me.

[Bone_Daddy]

Love the tune myself.
Dig the album.
Enjoyed the tour but LaBrie's voice struggled.
Lines In the Sand is my fav from the album.

This album infused more 'groove' if that means anything to anyone else besides me.

[Orbert]

The Chapman Stick prominent in the opening lick announced that Dream Theater was back, and with a "new, improved" sound.  New keyboard player, some new axes in the armory, and a new direction.  It was only later that I learned about all the crap that went on prior to this album and how much DT (or at least MP) hates it.  I for one liked that the songs were concise, as I still think that's where DT's strength lies. 

I'm a die-hard proghead and have no problem with longer tunes if the concept warrants it.  If it takes 15 minutes to make the musical statement you want to make, go for it.  But too many of DT's later songs sound like the instrumentals were literally shoved in (think silicon) to make them bigger and more impressive.  Bigger does not equal more impressive, and yes I'm still talking about music, even if that sentiment applies to other things.

[MykeHavoc]

Derek was on ACOS, so to say it announces a "new" keyboardist (a member of the band for about 3 years at that point) isn't really accurate.

[Ħ]

Yes, but I don't think Derek had any song-writing input on ACoS, while he did on NM.

[Orbert]

Also, Dream Theater has always considered ACOS an EP.  FII was their first album with Derek.

[MykeHavoc]

Yes, but it was not his debut with the band. That's the point I was making.

[Samsara]

It's a fantastic song, and the whole album is very solid.
Since I became a fan years after it came out, I wasn't around for the initial backlash. I heard about the negative reaction, which led to me being pleasantly surprised when I first heard the album. It just has a really cool vibe to it. I guess I can see how it would have come as a bit of a shock after IaW, Awake, and ACOS, but it provides a good balance to their discography.

Great song, and overall great album. I do disagree that the record came as a shock. It shouldn't have. There are a few more mainstream songs on it, to try for radio, and it worked pretty well, at least on Long Island. And then there are the classic longer DT tunes as well.

Truth be told, and I have said this a number of times, FII for DT is akin to Empire for Queensryche. The albums took the complex sound each band was known for, kept its integrity, but tweaked some things to garner mainstream attention. It worked for both bands, although obviously Queensryche got much more exposure (time period had something to do with that).

To be frank, I think Portnoy's slamming of FII has made a lot of people turn into sheep and dis on FII when it wasn't deserved. Portnoy was pissy because John went and worked with an outside songwriter to help work on the songs, and while I don't necessarily like that myself, when MP blabbed about it, people crapped on the album with him, which is totally unfair.

Anyway, New Millennium is a good track on a damn good album. It deserves a lot more credit than it got and I sincerely hope they (DT) incorporate its more successful elements into whatever they do in the future. That album allowed songs to breathe, and it is something that really has been missing from DT's sound (in this fan's humble opinion) for many years now.

[bosk1]

To be frank, I think Portnoy's slamming of FII has made a lot of people turn into sheep and dis on FII when it wasn't deserved. Portnoy was pissy because John went and worked with an outside songwriter to help work on the songs, and while I don't necessarily like that myself, when MP blabbed about it, people crapped on the album with him, which is totally unfair.

Honestly, I'm not so sure that's what happened.  I never heard any widespread public sentiment about the album from Mike until around 2004 or so (maybe later).  Sure, plently of people piled on when we went on record with his feelings about the album, but there were plenty of fans that were taken aback by the album on first listen (as many QR fans were with Empire).  

I remember hearing one of the FII tracks on the radio back around 1998 and not liking it.  I didn't buy the album until 2002, and when I did, I was quite surprised by how different it sounded.  I didn't hate it by any stretch, but it was easily my least favorite album for a while, and it took a little while for the songs to individually start sinking in.  Maybe that wasn't the case for you, but I can say for certain that a lot of fans felt the same way I did because they told me so.  When newer fans would post on the DT.net boards way back when and ask what albums they should get next, I would always say FII should probably be the last of the JLB albums because it was so different in its sound and track structure, and while it is a great album, it takes getting used to and can be offputting at first.  I remember a lot of people agreeing with those sentiments every time I posted, and I don't recall having heard a word about Mike's thoughts on the album back then.

But as a whole, I haven't really noticed people dissing on the album as a whole even now that Mike's thoughts on the album are VERY well known.  People generally seem to like it, even those like myself that rank it in the bottom half of the DT discography (for me, it sits at #7 out of 10, ahead of SC, TOT, and WDADU).

[hefdaddy42]

People that dislike it don't dislike it because MP dislikes it.  Most new fans actually like it.  Most people who dislike it (or rank it lower than most others) are people who loved Images & Words and then loved Awake, and then got FII.  It was a huge letdown.  SFAM redeemed DT for me.

[Dublagent66]

Well, I liked I&W, then Awake and FII.  It was different and took some getting use to, but wasn't a huge letdown by any means.

[Orbert]

Same here.  FII was different, but just as good IMO.  At that time, every DT album had a different sound.

[bosk1]

At that time, every DT album had a different sound.

True, but I think FII was easily the biggest "shocker" prior to Six Degrees.  The majority of fans didn't really follow DT back when WDADU came out, and the differences can be explained by (1) different singer, (2) much poorer production on the first album, and (3) the usual type of growth and change you see from a new band between first and second album.  But anyway, from I&W to Awake, there are differences in sound, but not huge.  Definitely a logical "growth" kind of progression in sound rather than a flat-out change in sound.  When the ACOS EP came out, it still really had that same core sound from I&W and Awake.  FII definitely was a big departure from those two earlier albums and the EP, and the contrasts were even more starkly highlighted, IMO, when SFAM came out and was, again, albeit with a definite progression and growth in sound, a return to the feel of I&W, Awake, and ACOS. 

[Orbert]

I guess.  I hadn't heard WDADU yet, so I really only had 2.5 albums to compare it with.  I do remember thinking FII wasn't as heavy, but I was okay with that, as I've always been more into DT for the prog than the metal.  So maybe I wasn't as shocked because it was a change that I kinda liked.

[Samsara]

To be frank, I think Portnoy's slamming of FII has made a lot of people turn into sheep and dis on FII when it wasn't deserved. Portnoy was pissy because John went and worked with an outside songwriter to help work on the songs, and while I don't necessarily like that myself, when MP blabbed about it, people crapped on the album with him, which is totally unfair.

Honestly, I'm not so sure that's what happened.  I never heard any widespread public sentiment about the album from Mike until around 2004 or so (maybe later).  Sure, plently of people piled on when we went on record with his feelings about the album, but there were plenty of fans that were taken aback by the album on first listen (as many QR fans were with Empire).  

bosk, the moment Portnoy announces his feelings on something, the sheep fall in line. Not everyone, sure. But there is a certain contingent that do, and I noticed it as HUGE when Portnoy was vocal about his disdain for FII and the process of its creation.

And, when MP talked about (it may have been in the book) about how when John went to go tweak the songs with Desmond Child or whoever it was, and how he was (I think he said upset, but I forget the adjective), again, bunches of people fell in line.

It's the nature of the beast with bands. There are people who latch onto a figure and spout what they say as Gospel, and woe to those who don't. And from my observation, at least a few years back, there were a TON of those people.

Now? Maybe people have finally opened their eyes and accepted it a bit more for what it was, and slowly are giving it the credit it deserves.

[TAC]

Sam, perhaps some of what you say may be true but...

People that dislike it don't dislike it because MP dislikes it.  Most new fans actually like it.  Most people who dislike it (or rank it lower than most others) are people who loved Images & Words and then loved Awake, and then got FII.  It was a huge letdown.  SFAM redeemed DT for me.

This is the truth right here.

I was a huge fan and I remember getting FII the day it came out. The first thing I noticed was the change in band name font. Then New Millenium started the CD. It starts off OK, but it always struck me that they tried to hard to recreate a Metropolis type song. That was my first impression. Now, I can appreciate the Rush influences, but I thought it (the song) was a relatively weak attempt.

I've mentioned this in a couple other threads recently. FII has aged well for 2 reasons.
1. It's easily DT's best sounding album
2. It creates a great dichotomy to 3 of the last 4 DT albums.

Even back then I thought it was only good for 3 songs..Lines In The Sand, Peruvian Skies, aand Trial Of Tears. The 04 reworking of Hollow Years, the 05 reworking of JLMB, not to mention the original BMS played in 02 has also helped enhance these limited songs.

[King Postwhore]

I remember liking it a lot.  My brother and I would talk about how different the 3 CD run was in style from I & W to FII.  We liked that they streched themselves and that trend continued up to the last 2 CD's.  At least for me.

[hefdaddy42]

I will also say that there is a reason that various members of the band have called SFAM a make-or-break album.  And that reason was FII.

[Dublagent66]

The reason is SFAM was the first self-produced effort by the band.  Their relationship with the record company led up to that.  The record itself (FII) had nothing to do with it.

[Marvellous G]

I say it again, I prefer Vicarious' ripoff of NM's intro.