Author Topic: Nightwish...  (Read 317121 times)

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Offline aprilethereal

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1330 on: April 12, 2014, 05:15:26 AM »
Listened to The Last Sled (I think that's what the song was called), and the lyrics were pretty laughable. Nothing really exciting musically either imo.

Offline bl5150

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1331 on: April 16, 2014, 12:12:00 PM »
The full album is up on YT for the moment anyway.......... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-fjnnBRw1E

haven't checked it out myself yet.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1332 on: April 16, 2014, 12:27:32 PM »
Listened to bits and pieces of it.  Its not really my type of music overall but sounds very similar to orchestral parts of nightwish.  Not bad or anything, in fact parts were really nice music, just like I said, not my cup of tea.

Offline MrBoom_shack-a-lack

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1333 on: April 17, 2014, 04:04:07 PM »
Anette Olzon - Lies

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TylGOJJJISI

I just heard that a buddy of mine will be drumming for Anette on her summer tour. Pretty damn cool!
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Offline CrimsonSunrise

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1334 on: June 18, 2014, 03:06:41 AM »
So.....  2 months ago someone turned me on to Kamelot.  I REALLY enjoy The Black Halo, Kahn's vocals, and the bands style.  Since then, I've been listening to some other similar new music.  When, I find this band Nightwish.  Man....  I must have been living in a DT cocoon for the last 20 years  :lol  I think I've actually heard of them, just never listened to any of their material....my loss, until now!

I started watching the 2013 Wacken Open Air show on YT a week or so ago and just really love it!  The Band is awesome, but the vocalist is just spectacular.  So, I've been trying to catch up a bit on the bands history, in particular the 3 different vocalists, and really at this point favor Floor.  Now, I've only watched a few vids of Tarja and Annette so I can't really judge objectively just yet.  I'm going to order the Showtime Storytime BR tomorrow.  Then I'll have to start diving into their discography. Awesome find and I look forward to the journey.  By the way... great crowd at Wacken, peeps are really into the band!

Offline Cyclopssss

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1335 on: June 18, 2014, 03:17:41 AM »
Enjoy the ride! I only got into NW this year, so you´re not alone!
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Online jingle.boy

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1336 on: June 18, 2014, 05:32:02 AM »
So.....  2 months ago someone turned me on to Kamelot.  I REALLY enjoy The Black Halo, Kahn's vocals, and the bands style.  Since then, I've been listening to some other similar new music.  When, I find this band Nightwish.  Man....  I must have been living in a DT cocoon for the last 20 years  :lol  I think I've actually heard of them, just never listened to any of their material....my loss, until now!

I started watching the 2013 Wacken Open Air show on YT a week or so ago and just really love it!  The Band is awesome, but the vocalist is just spectacular.  So, I've been trying to catch up a bit on the bands history, in particular the 3 different vocalists, and really at this point favor Floor.  Now, I've only watched a few vids of Tarja and Annette so I can't really judge objectively just yet.  I'm going to order the Showtime Storytime BR tomorrow.  Then I'll have to start diving into their discography. Awesome find and I look forward to the journey.  By the way... great crowd at Wacken, peeps are really into the band!

Welcome aboard Greg.  The early albums from Tarja are truly operatic in nature as far as the vocal style goes.  Her last two albums are the best, showing a lot more power and range from her.  With respect to those two albums, my standard line is that Once is great, but Century Child is the best them.  Annette's voice is more melodic in nature, she doesn't have the capabilities that Tarja did.  Coupled with the fact that Dark Passion Play was written before they chose Annette to replace Tarja, the vocal melodies weren't written with her style in mind, so she had to adapt.  It's arguably one of their weaker albums, though it does have a few bright spots.  Floor absolutely combines the best qualities from both of them - and probably my favorite female voice in prog-metal. 

You want another great live concert with a wild crowd, go check out End of an Era.

They've got quite a storied (and dramatic) history when it comes to their vocalists.  I'm so looking forward to a studio album from them with Floor.  :drool:

Oh, and then there's this.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hAnVFJFmFx8
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Offline bosk1

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1337 on: June 18, 2014, 08:20:14 AM »
Welcome aboard Greg.  The early albums from Tarja are truly operatic in nature as far as the vocal style goes.  Her last two albums are the best, showing a lot more power and range from her.  With respect to those two albums, my standard line is that Once is great, but Century Child is the best them.  Annette's voice is more melodic in nature, she doesn't have the capabilities that Tarja did.  Coupled with the fact that Dark Passion Play was written before they chose Annette to replace Tarja, the vocal melodies weren't written with her style in mind, so she had to adapt.  It's arguably one of their weaker albums, though it does have a few bright spots.  Floor absolutely combines the best qualities from both of them - and probably my favorite female voice in prog-metal. 

You want another great live concert with a wild crowd, go check out End of an Era.

I fully endorse each and every word of this post.  Every.  Word.

Oh, and this:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_DOJU1DY10


EDIT:  Oh, and while Wacken is VERY good, this is perhaps the definitive version of Ghost Love Score:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4V_eoR6r1Tw  The money note at the end...I just about lost it.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2014, 08:36:58 AM by bosk1 »
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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1338 on: June 18, 2014, 09:09:07 AM »
Yeah... knew that was the Argentina version of Ghost Love Floor before I even clicked it.  That is a great version, and comes with the Wacken DVD.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1339 on: June 18, 2014, 09:34:10 AM »
Yeah... knew that was the Argentina version of Ghost Love Floor before I even clicked it.  That is a great version, and comes with the Wacken DVD.

Oh, really?  Somehow, I never realized that.  Shows how busy I have been.  :lol  I have watched the main show a few times, but have not looked at anything else on that DVD at all.
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Offline DarkLord_Lalinc

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1340 on: June 18, 2014, 09:37:16 AM »
Floor floored me in that video. #Overdonejoke


She's one of the best female metal vocalists out there (if not, the best). She's what Nightwish deserved all along, from the time they departed ways with Tarja.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1341 on: June 18, 2014, 09:42:06 AM »
Yeah... knew that was the Argentina version of Ghost Love Floor before I even clicked it.  That is a great version, and comes with the Wacken DVD.

Oh, really?  Somehow, I never realized that.  Shows how busy I have been.  :lol  I have watched the main show a few times, but have not looked at anything else on that DVD at all.

Theres a really long documentary as a bonus as well.  Worth watching.

Offline bosk1

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1342 on: June 18, 2014, 09:52:31 AM »
Floor floored me in that video. #Overdonejoke

She's one of the best female metal vocalists out there (if not, the best). She's what Nightwish deserved all along, from the time they departed ways with Tarja.

The best thing about getting her in the band is her versatility.  She can sing anything in their catalog well, and probably anything Tuomas would want to write. 

Theres a really long documentary as a bonus as well.  Worth watching.

I will have to make some time for that.
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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1343 on: June 18, 2014, 10:45:26 AM »
Theres a really long documentary as a bonus as well.  Worth watching.

I bought the digital version of the concert, so I don't know what documentary is on the DVD, but stumbled across a Finnish spken/English subtitle one that follows them all throughout the tour on YT.  Is that the one you mean?  Very interesting stuff if so. 
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Offline 425

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1344 on: June 18, 2014, 12:06:34 PM »
Personally I didn't find the Showtime, Storytime documentary to be that interesting beyond the first twenty-or-so minutes when they talked about replacing Anette. I don't actually think I saw it all the way to the end, but I just didn't see much of interest in there. Maybe it's just me.

But the actual concert is amazing; I've seen it maybe three times now. And I am absolutely in love with the now-famous Ghost Love Floor bonus video.

As for albums, I'll second jingle.boy's statement that Century Child is the best and that End of an Era is fantastic. I will also say that the latest album, Imaginaerum, is my other favorite. I also agree that Dark Passion Play is one of the weaker ones, but it's still a solid album that can be really good if I'm in the proper mood for it.

Since we are indeed on DTF, anyone up for album rankings?

Century Child
Imaginaerum
Wishmaster
Once
Dark Passion Play
Oceanborn
Angels Fall First


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Online Evermind

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1345 on: June 18, 2014, 12:10:53 PM »
I've bought Imaginaerum a year ago and Showtime, Storytime like a half-year ago and ironically I still haven't listened to either. I need to fix that as soon as possible.

End of an Era is one great DVD, and both Once and Century Child are impeccable.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1346 on: June 18, 2014, 12:25:23 PM »
Okay...  bosk's ranking:
1.  Century Child:  This is the album that got me hooked on Nightwish.  It holds a special place in my heart despite that Once might actually be just a hair stronger.
2.  Once:  A VERY close second. 
3.  Imaginaerum:  Too bad Anette just isn't a very good live singer, because she does some REALLY good work on this album.  I do not find it as consistently good as the top 2, but it has some VERY strong moments.
4.  Some combo of Oceanborn, Wishmaster, and Angels Fall First (see below).
5.  Dark Passion Play:  Some good moments, but overall, a weak album.  Part of it is that Anette seems very vanilla, but that is really not her fault, as the album was not written with her voice and style in mind.  But aside from her, the album just is not that great. 

Unranked:  I do not have Angels, and never really took the time to listen to Wishmaster or Oceanborn much.  I would put them ahead of DPP, but since I cannot really recall as much from them as I would like, I cannot really put them in the ranking.



As far as the live albums:
-End of an Era is spectacular.  You would hardly guess that both Tarja and Marco were so under the weather.
-Showtime/Storytime is very good.  The performance is really good, and the audience is really into it.  My only critiques are:  (1) Floor is a bit tentative, which is understandable.  She still sounds great, but I think she was perhaps playing it a bit safe and had not yet really developed enough of a connection with some of the songs to make them her own.  (2) The set list is good, but I would have loved a DVD from this tour that featured the entire album as more of a production.  It is, in essence, somewhat of a "concept album," so it would have been great to get the entire thing done up in style.  Also, another minor criticism is, the stage banter is SO awkward and bad.  :lol  For example, "I want my tears back" is a clever and evocative lyric and songtitle.  Introducing it with "alright guys, keep your eyeballs wet, because the tax collector is comin'!" is neither. 

I also was able to procure a bootleg of the Lowlands show from, I think, 2007 or so.  Not as flashy, but it is a REALLY solid performance from the Once era.  And the fact that it was pro shot makes it a lot more enjoyable to watch than the typical video bootleg.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2014, 12:36:29 PM by bosk1 »
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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1347 on: June 18, 2014, 12:35:03 PM »
The first three albums only get sporadic play from me.  I just find Tarja isn't diverse enough to capture my interest for very long.  There are a couple of standout tracks, but by-and-large, I don't go to them very often.  Might have to give them a spin today just to see.

the documentary I watched was titled "Please Learn the Setlist in 48 hours".  It's 2 hours in Finnish, but was very interesting.  Starts of with the firing of Annette, then follows them for the remainder of the tour, up to the filming at Wacken.

-End of an Era is spectacular.  You would hardly guess that both Tarja and Marco were so under the weather.

And you'd hardly guess that the guys had already 'fired' Tarja, just hadn't told her.  Although, Tuomas has a certain look in his eyes a few times that you can tell exactly that he's thinking 'you're gonna get yours after the show'. 
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Offline bosk1

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1348 on: June 18, 2014, 12:39:21 PM »
And you'd hardly guess that the guys had already 'fired' Tarja, just hadn't told her.  Although, Tuomas has a certain look in his eyes a few times that you can tell exactly that he's thinking 'you're gonna get yours after the show'. 

Yeah, there are some very telling looks from Tuomas during the show.  And of course I have no idea what was on his mind at any given moment, but there are also some times where he appears to be feeling doubt/regret over what is about to occur.  But hard to say.
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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1349 on: June 18, 2014, 12:50:17 PM »
And you'd hardly guess that the guys had already 'fired' Tarja, just hadn't told her.  Although, Tuomas has a certain look in his eyes a few times that you can tell exactly that he's thinking 'you're gonna get yours after the show'. 

Yeah, there are some very telling looks from Tuomas during the show.  And of course I have no idea what was on his mind at any given moment, but there are also some times where he appears to be feeling doubt/regret over what is about to occur.  But hard to say.

True
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Offline 425

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1350 on: June 18, 2014, 12:53:18 PM »
The first three albums only get sporadic play from me.  I just find Tarja isn't diverse enough to capture my interest for very long.  There are a couple of standout tracks, but by-and-large, I don't go to them very often.  Might have to give them a spin today just to see.

I somewhat feel that way about Oceanborn. I like a lot of the songs, but there's very little diversity on the album which makes it somewhat less interesting on the whole. Angels Fall First is more diverse which can make it more interesting, but it falls below Oceanborn for me because the songwriting is significantly weaker on Angels. Wishmaster, to me, has the strongest songwriting of the three despite a few weaker songs (Wanderlust and Crownless, to me, but Oceanborn has Sacrament of Wilderness which is just as forgettable and doesn't have anything at the level of Dead Boy's Poem or FantasMic).

To me there's no question that the band stepped it up on Century Child and has maintained a good combination of strong songwriting and diversity ever since (Dark Passion Play was a dip in songwriting quality but not by too much, plus it has some truly excellent tracks—namely the memorable bookends to the album that are The Poet and the Pendulum and Meadows of Heaven). Imaginaerum was a new height in this regard, in my opinion, as it has a lot of songs that are well outside the norm for Nightwish (could anyone have seen Slow, Love, Slow coming?), and the songs that were more conventional were stellar (Storytime).

However, I still think the pre-Century Child era is still very good and quite worth investigation—and I don't even like power metal. Songs like Angels Fall First, Stargazers, Gethsemane, Swanheart, Walking in the Air (yeah it's a cover, but still), Sleeping Sun, She Is My Sin, Wishmaster, Dead Boy's Poem or FantasMic alone would propel any band who had them in their discography to "noteworthy" status, and just the very existence of Century Child and Ghost Love Score, to say nothing of a lot of other really great material, on top of that is easily enough to make Nightwish great.

the documentary I watched was titled "Please Learn the Setlist in 48 hours".  It's 2 hours in Finnish, but was very interesting.  Starts of with the firing of Annette, then follows them for the remainder of the tour, up to the filming at Wacken.

That's the one that's in the DVD. I think I may have gotten bored during the "follows them for the remainder of the tour part" and shut it off before getting to the Wacken part. But the first part, from the beginning to Floor's first performance with the band, was very interesting.

-End of an Era is spectacular.  You would hardly guess that both Tarja and Marco were so under the weather.

And you'd hardly guess that the guys had already 'fired' Tarja, just hadn't told her.  Although, Tuomas has a certain look in his eyes a few times that you can tell exactly that he's thinking 'you're gonna get yours after the show'.

One could speculate that this is also why he cries during the intro to Ever Dream.
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Offline Ben_Jamin

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1351 on: June 18, 2014, 01:07:43 PM »
And you'd hardly guess that the guys had already 'fired' Tarja, just hadn't told her.  Although, Tuomas has a certain look in his eyes a few times that you can tell exactly that he's thinking 'you're gonna get yours after the show'. 

Yeah, there are some very telling looks from Tuomas during the show.  And of course I have no idea what was on his mind at any given moment, but there are also some times where he appears to be feeling doubt/regret over what is about to occur.  But hard to say.

Like the beginning of phantom,  he has that. Damn, I might never get to play this again.
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Offline aprilethereal

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1352 on: June 19, 2014, 01:06:01 AM »
Once is the only Nightwish album I'd call amazing. I enjoyed all the other ones a lot for some time (except for Angels Fall First and Wishmaster which I haven't heard yet, and DPP which is really bland and boring in my opinion), but if there is one album by them I go back to regularly and that has no weak spots, it's Once for me :2metal:

Offline gazinwales

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1353 on: June 19, 2014, 04:30:12 AM »
Once for me, is NW at their absolute peak, where everything comes together and gels perfectly.
The other 2 that are special for me as AFF, I remember being totally stunned when I first heard, nothing like it had ever been heard.
Then Oceanborn, was a killer follow up, as much as love Once, OB is still my fave NW album and I doubt will ever be beaten.

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1354 on: June 19, 2014, 06:19:24 AM »
OB is still my fave NW album and I doubt will ever be beaten.

With Floor in the band now, I believe they have the potential to surpass anything they've done before. I believe Tuomas is very inspired and eager to make a big point with their next album.

I haven't been this eager to hear a new release from a band or artist in quite a long time. So, I hope it delivers.

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1355 on: June 19, 2014, 06:32:45 AM »
OB is still my fave NW album and I doubt will ever be beaten.

With Floor in the band now, I believe they have the potential to surpass anything they've done before. I believe Tuomas is very inspired and eager to make a big point with their next album.

I haven't been this eager to hear a new release from a band or artist in quite a long time. So, I hope it delivers.

:iagree:
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Offline 425

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1356 on: June 19, 2014, 06:55:47 AM »
See, I'm not as in love with Once as a lot of people seem to be. It's a fantastic album, but I don't think it's nearly as consistently great as Century Child or Imaginaerum. I think it has some great songs, yes (Dark Chest of Wonders, Ghost Love Score, Higher Than Hope), but also some songs that are more on the weak side by Nightwish standards (Wish I Had An Angel, Dead Gardens, Planet Hell [I know, I know, I'm in the minority on this one], plus Creek Mary's Blood which is very good in the beginning but long overstays its welcome). Plus, I think Once has some of Tuomas's worst lyrics (leaving aside of course Nymphomaniac Fantasia). True, it also has some of his best in songs like Ghost Love Score, Higher Than Hope and Dark Chest of Wonders; but I really just do not like the lyrics of Planet Hell or Creek Mary's Blood at all. And The Siren has an undoubtedly cool lyrical concept but it's simply not as emotionally evocative as most of Nightwish's songs. It's still a very good album, but, personally, I can't get along with the idea of it being their high point. And I certainly have a hard time seeing it as better than Century Child.
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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1357 on: June 19, 2014, 07:26:54 AM »
I certainly have a hard time seeing it as better than Century Child.

It's not, but it's great.  I think Planet Hell's lyrics are great... mind you, I'm always a sucker for any fantasy/mythology themed lyrics.
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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1358 on: June 19, 2014, 09:04:49 AM »
I don't think it has bad lyrics, and looking at them again, I'd say my previous phrasing was too strong—I don't even think I'd say I dislike them—but I'm not a fan of the overall message of "mankind has doomed itself, the world is ending." I think a more accurate descriptor of my feelings towards them is ambivalence, which is bad by Nightwish standards because I tend to enjoy Tuomas's lyrics a great deal. Creek Mary's Blood is the bigger culprit on the album for me lyrically, because to me it feels like it means to evoke a sense of guilt for a crime that no one who is alive is guilty of committing. It seems overly and wrongfully accusatory to me in tone, and perhaps because of the subject matter of Planet Hell and its place on the album right nest to Creek Mary's Blood, I conflated that feeling that I got from Creek Mary's Blood with it as well.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1359 on: June 19, 2014, 11:40:43 AM »
Once is my favorite, then its close between Century Child and Wishmaster.  Imaginearium after those.

Offline gazinwales

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1360 on: June 19, 2014, 02:18:57 PM »
I'm a long time fan of Floor's voice (After Forever and ReVamp) and I have seen her live with NW, yet I am not thoroughly convinced that she is the right voice for NW.
I do hope she proves me wrong with the next album.
Imaginarium is my least played and fave from NW, so I hope the new material is more inspiring.

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1361 on: June 19, 2014, 02:34:58 PM »
Once and Century Child have a few duds, but Imaginaerum is flawless.

Offline bosk1

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1362 on: June 19, 2014, 03:08:36 PM »
I don't think it has bad lyrics, and looking at them again, I'd say my previous phrasing was too strong—I don't even think I'd say I dislike them—but I'm not a fan of the overall message of "mankind has doomed itself, the world is ending." I think a more accurate descriptor of my feelings towards them is ambivalence, which is bad by Nightwish standards because I tend to enjoy Tuomas's lyrics a great deal. Creek Mary's Blood is the bigger culprit on the album for me lyrically, because to me it feels like it means to evoke a sense of guilt for a crime that no one who is alive is guilty of committing. It seems overly and wrongfully accusatory to me in tone, and perhaps because of the subject matter of Planet Hell and its place on the album right nest to Creek Mary's Blood, I conflated that feeling that I got from Creek Mary's Blood with it as well.

I hear you.  I find Tuomas' lyrics to often be overly pretentious and just not very good as it is.  But since they aren't blatantly offensive to me, I just largely ignore that because I can still find lots of enjoyment in the music and vocal melodies, and a lot of the lyrics are just fine, so it works out. 

And, yes, I agree wholeheartedly about Creek Mary's Blood.  What you said, plus the fact that he is not an American or an American Indian, so he is therefore not an ancestor of either the perpetrators or victims of the wrongs that the song is about, which leaves me feeling a bit like...well...like it's not really any of his business.  I mean, not that you cannot write about social injustices that you yourself are not directly connected to.  If you are moved by something enough to want to write about it, have at it.  But it is that fact, combined with, as you said, a sense of trying to evoke a sense of guilt for a crime that no one who is alive is guilty of committing that leaves me a bit cold.  Contrast that with, for example, Chuck Billy's lyrics on Trail of Tears, which is much more genuine to me.
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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1363 on: June 19, 2014, 03:49:46 PM »
I really love Cold Creak Marys Blood, the performance on End of an Era is great too, love the Native American (dont know his name off the top of my head).  I never really looked too far into the lyrics in terms of who wrote them and how it correlates to the meaning of the song.

Offline gazinwales

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Re: Nightwish...
« Reply #1364 on: June 20, 2014, 10:21:14 PM »
The native Indian is John Two Hawks.
I guess if the lyrics/song wasnt authentic,  then he wouldn't have performed on the album or live.

I played Wishmaster in the car for the first time in years, it sounds great & perhaps I should rate it a lot higher.
Imaginarium, I will give it another couple of plays.
Dark Passion Play, I really like the songs, some of the orchestratal araangements are amazing.
But, Once still tops the NW charts for me,  and sits in my alltime top 20.