Author Topic: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion  (Read 144378 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline PROGdrummer

  • Posts: 719
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #735 on: May 18, 2017, 09:04:44 PM »
The Watchmaker doesn't sound at all like The Cinema Show, hence the "Um, what?"  Oh, but wait, they both have an acoustic guitar, mellotron and flute!!!  :lol :facepalm:

And the "la la la" bit, and the overall structure of the song.   They're extremely similar in a lot of ways.

Offline KevShmev

  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 41963
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #736 on: May 18, 2017, 09:10:13 PM »
Yeah, The Watchmaker has a several minutes long keyboard solo section just like The Cinema Show.

Oh wait, no it doesn't.

But wait, the second half of The Watchmaker is all instrumental just like The Cinema Show.

Oops, missed on that one, too.

But hey, at least The Watchmaker comes to an end with a slow crawl, leading into the album's last song.

What, it doesn't?  Damn.


Offline PROGdrummer

  • Posts: 719
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #737 on: May 18, 2017, 10:53:46 PM »
Yeah, The Watchmaker has a several minutes long keyboard solo section just like The Cinema Show.

Oh wait, no it doesn't.

But wait, the second half of The Watchmaker is all instrumental just like The Cinema Show.

Oops, missed on that one, too.

But hey, at least The Watchmaker comes to an end with a slow crawl, leading into the album's last song.

What, it doesn't?  Damn.

Yeesh. Didn't mean to hurt anyone's feelings. I'll take my opinion and stuff it back up my ass if that's what you'd prefer mister.

Actually, fuck it. Just ban this account please, I'll go back to lurking.  I forgot people on the internet got this testy about any opinions they didn't have. holy fuck.  :lol
« Last Edit: May 18, 2017, 10:59:38 PM by PROGdrummer »

Offline KevShmev

  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 41963
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #738 on: May 19, 2017, 06:12:31 PM »
WTF, simmer down, man.  I am not getting testy, just totally disagreeing with you in a sarcastic and smart ass way. :biggrin:

Offline jammindude

  • Posts: 15237
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #739 on: May 19, 2017, 11:26:53 PM »
Seriously guys...  Close your eyes and imagine Steve Hackett, Peter Gabriel, and Tony Banks having a full on prog rock super group.

Every time I hear modern IQ, I imagine that's what that imaginary supergroup would sound like.

IQ - The Province

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atkCHYjw5fA
"Better the pride that resides in a citizen of the world.
Than the pride that divides when a colorful rag is unfurled." - Neil Peart

The Jammin Dude Show - https://www.youtube.com/user/jammindude

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19225
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #740 on: May 20, 2017, 08:51:53 PM »
Holy shit, this is good stuff!

Offline jammindude

  • Posts: 15237
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #741 on: May 21, 2017, 07:44:21 AM »
Seriously.   And the whole Frequency album is that good.   And the newer album Road of Bones is just as amazing.   

The only reason I put it here is because there are SO many moments when I feel like they are channeling "the Genesis that could have been"
"Better the pride that resides in a citizen of the world.
Than the pride that divides when a colorful rag is unfurled." - Neil Peart

The Jammin Dude Show - https://www.youtube.com/user/jammindude

Offline Fritzinger

  • Posts: 2556
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #742 on: May 21, 2017, 03:15:23 PM »
I feel the same way about IQ. They even got better with the last two albums Frequency and The Road Of Bones, as you guys said. One of the best Neo-Prog bands.

Cant imagine Steven not liking Genesis. I do agree that The Watchmaker sounds lot like Genesis, but not Cinema Show especially. I'd go as far to say.. If you don't like Genesis, you don't like Progressive Rock. Genesis is the ultimate classic Progressive Rock band for me. Okay, now slaughter me :D
any rock can be made to roll

Offline ytserush

  • Posts: 5376
  • Like clockwork...
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #743 on: May 28, 2017, 08:11:44 PM »
So Steven Wilson doesnt like Genesis eh?
I call bullshit.  :lol
Come on Wilson, have you heard The Watchmaker? It's Cinema Show 2.0

Um, what?

https://www.facebook.com/pg/swremixes/posts/?ref=page_internal

I can't link the post directly, but in his post about the Marillion remixes he mentions not liking Genesis, only really liking Steve Hackett and Peter Gabriel solo-stuff. But that's got to be the biggest load of BS I've ever heard. He has to love at least the first 4 albums.

I don't know if  that's how he really feels or not, but if it is the way he feels (about Gabriel-Genesis), I completely understand where he's coming from.





Never got into IQ either for what it's worth.

Offline Stadler

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 43016
  • Gender: Male
  • Pointing out the "unfunny" since 2014!
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #744 on: May 30, 2017, 06:59:07 AM »
So Steven Wilson doesnt like Genesis eh?
I call bullshit.  :lol
Come on Wilson, have you heard The Watchmaker? It's Cinema Show 2.0

Um, what?

https://www.facebook.com/pg/swremixes/posts/?ref=page_internal

I can't link the post directly, but in his post about the Marillion remixes he mentions not liking Genesis, only really liking Steve Hackett and Peter Gabriel solo-stuff. But that's got to be the biggest load of BS I've ever heard. He has to love at least the first 4 albums.

I'm not sure why "the first four albums" are the ones he "has to love".    The first two - Genesis to Revelations and Trespass - are sketchy at best, and show a band really searching for the door in a dark room.   Sure, Nursery Cryme is very strong, as is Foxtrot, but this idea that somehow the Peter era is the only real "prog" of Genesis is malarkey.   Balderdash.  Tomfoolery.  Hijinx.   

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19225
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #745 on: May 30, 2017, 11:05:23 AM »
A lot of people start counting Genesis albums with Nursery Cryme, which is when Phil Collins and Steve Hackett joined.  Many don't count Trespass, and many probably don't even know about From Genesis to Revelation.  To them, the "first four" are the four studio albums with Collins and Hackett.

Offline KevShmev

  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 41963
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #746 on: May 30, 2017, 05:32:02 PM »
Trespass has The Knife, which is awesome.  That alone makes it worthy of mention.

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19225
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #747 on: May 30, 2017, 06:26:04 PM »
Maybe he means Trespass through Selling England by the Pound.  I don't have The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway, but I can't remember the last time I played it.

Offline Cyclopssss

  • Vocal Dinosaur pre-heat combustable
  • Posts: 2993
  • Gender: Male
  • Connoseur of love
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #748 on: May 31, 2017, 01:10:55 AM »
I remember hearing 'Nursery Cryme' for the first time and my jaw hitting the ground.
From the ocean comes the notion that the realise lies in rhythm. The rhythm of vision is dancer, and when you dance you´re always on the one. From the looking comes to see, wondrous realise real eyes....

Offline SoundscapeMN

  • Posts: 6432
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #749 on: May 31, 2017, 05:29:43 AM »
Steven must only make an exception here since this is with Steve Hackett? lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Do2eVAwEa4A

Offline Fritzinger

  • Posts: 2556
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #750 on: May 31, 2017, 05:36:41 AM »
Now I remember. Of course, he sang Can Utility on that album and mentioned it's his favorite Genesis track.

I think it's wrong to reduce Trespass on The Knife. The Live version of The Knife is way better anyway because of Phil. But Trespass has Stagnation, Dusk and Looking For Someone!! The latter one in a way is a predecessor of Dancing With The Moonlit Knight, in terms of structure and feeling.
any rock can be made to roll

Offline SoundscapeMN

  • Posts: 6432
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #751 on: May 31, 2017, 05:41:47 AM »
and White Mountain.

Trespass is on par with all of the Gabriel records sans for the debut.

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19225
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #752 on: May 31, 2017, 09:57:02 AM »
Maybe he means Trespass through Selling England by the Pound.  I don't have The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway, but I can't remember the last time I played it.

Wow, weird typo.  I don't hate The Lamb.  Of course I have it.

Offline Herrick

  • Posts: 1966
  • Gender: Male
  • Hello Mangs
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #753 on: August 25, 2017, 08:02:46 PM »
Seriously guys...  Close your eyes and imagine Steve Hackett, Peter Gabriel, and Tony Banks having a full on prog rock super group.

Every time I hear modern IQ, I imagine that's what that imaginary supergroup would sound like.

IQ - The Province

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atkCHYjw5fA

That was very good. Mang, another band to check out. I came to this thread to learn more about Genesis because I've just started to check them out. Now I have to check out IQ.
DISPLAY thy Breasts, My Julia!

Offline Stadler

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 43016
  • Gender: Male
  • Pointing out the "unfunny" since 2014!
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #754 on: August 26, 2017, 09:58:54 AM »
Speaking of Genesis, I saw The Neal Morse Band utterly destroy (in a good way) The Similitude of a Dream live last night.  I was struck in the live setting by how much that band owes to Gabriel era Genesis.  There are a number of keyboard parts that evoke memories of the Firth of Fifth-era Tony Banks sound (including one passage that reminisces about the intro itself).  Mike is channeling his inner Phil with the way the fills lead the music.   Neal uses costumes and effects - minimal, but impactful - to make the point of the lyrics, and even the stage set lends itself to comparisons with the band.


All this is to be incredibly complimentary; at no point did the NMB sound derivative, or like a rip.  But if you liked that sort of thing then, you may be able to experience it now.

Offline Herrick

  • Posts: 1966
  • Gender: Male
  • Hello Mangs
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #755 on: August 26, 2017, 01:31:48 PM »
Speaking of Genesis, I saw The Neal Morse Band utterly destroy (in a good way) The Similitude of a Dream live last night.  I was struck in the live setting by how much that band owes to Gabriel era Genesis.  There are a number of keyboard parts that evoke memories of the Firth of Fifth-era Tony Banks sound (including one passage that reminisces about the intro itself).  Mike is channeling his inner Phil with the way the fills lead the music.   Neal uses costumes and effects - minimal, but impactful - to make the point of the lyrics, and even the stage set lends itself to comparisons with the band.


All this is to be incredibly complimentary; at no point did the NMB sound derivative, or like a rip.  But if you liked that sort of thing then, you may be able to experience it now.

I saw a live clip of a few songs from that last album...or perhaps it was one long song. It was a good performance. Portnoy dropped a stick, made some funny gesture, grabbed another stick and kept on playing like it was nothing :lol

I haven't heard the latest Neal Morse Band album yet but I've listened to The Grand Experiment once. I liked it enough to give it another listen. I kind of want to look more into older prog though so I might try to focus on '70s Genesis for now. But "gotdamn" I got distracted by this IQ band now.
DISPLAY thy Breasts, My Julia!

Offline ytserush

  • Posts: 5376
  • Like clockwork...
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #756 on: August 27, 2017, 11:20:02 AM »
Speaking of Genesis, I saw The Neal Morse Band utterly destroy (in a good way) The Similitude of a Dream live last night.  I was struck in the live setting by how much that band owes to Gabriel era Genesis.  There are a number of keyboard parts that evoke memories of the Firth of Fifth-era Tony Banks sound (including one passage that reminisces about the intro itself).  Mike is channeling his inner Phil with the way the fills lead the music.   Neal uses costumes and effects - minimal, but impactful - to make the point of the lyrics, and even the stage set lends itself to comparisons with the band.


All this is to be incredibly complimentary; at no point did the NMB sound derivative, or like a rip.  But if you liked that sort of thing then, you may be able to experience it now.

Not a wholesale rip larger than a riff or two, but the derivation of a ton of influences is there and Gabriel-Genesis was but one of them. My wife and I were going back and forth a bit trying to pick them out.

That said, I thought it was the best Neal Morse show I've seen yet.  Neal really seems to have a blast when he's out there.

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19225
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #757 on: August 27, 2017, 07:46:40 PM »
I think that when Neal puts together a bunch of musicians of that calibre, it's gonna be pretty good stuff anyway.  If there are callouts to classic prog, blatant or subtle, that's fine.  It's all part of it.

Offline Stadler

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 43016
  • Gender: Male
  • Pointing out the "unfunny" since 2014!
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #758 on: August 27, 2017, 08:42:24 PM »
Please don't misunderstand.  I wasn't saying it was derivative or a copy or anything like that.   I just was trying to paint a picture.  It was just touch points is all and a way to convey a sense of what it was like without using subjective terms. 

For me  was one of the most joyous concert experiences I've ever had.  I had a smile the entire time.  It was very uplifting, especially The Call.  If it was a secular band I would have no problem saying it was a religious experience, but that term is loaded here. 

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19225
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #759 on: August 27, 2017, 10:52:45 PM »
If it was a secular band I would have no problem saying it was a religious experience, but that term is loaded here. 

Heh heh.

Offline Stadler

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 43016
  • Gender: Male
  • Pointing out the "unfunny" since 2014!
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #760 on: August 28, 2017, 07:34:57 AM »
If it was a secular band I would have no problem saying it was a religious experience, but that term is loaded here. 

Heh heh.

It was though; I was in a room with about 450 people, plus-minus, and there was more energy there than I've seen in some arena shows.    It was palpable.   The closest thing I can think of to what I saw was not a concert, but a southern Baptist funeral.  Where people just shout out or break into song as the case may be, and it's a CELEBRATION of the person's life, not a lament.    I have literally never smiled so much as at that Neal Morse Band show, and it's not even close.

Offline romdrums

  • Posts: 4509
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #761 on: September 01, 2017, 01:14:15 PM »
I was getting ready to take my 2 year old son to daycare this morning, and when I started up my car, the Three Sides Live version of Abacab came up on my iPod.  Not ten seconds into the song, my son shouts, "Dada! That's prog rock! That's prog rock!" I was a proud dad!
Though we live in trying times, we're the ones who have to try. -Neil Peart, 1952-2020.

There is a fundamental difference between filtered facts and firehosed opinions. -Stadler.

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19225
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #762 on: September 01, 2017, 10:52:57 PM »
When your 2-year-old recognizes and calls out prog rock, you're doing something right!  :tup

Also, synchronicity!  I just heard the Three Sides Live version of Abacab tonight in my car.  It came on shuffle on my iPod.  I love the keyboard/guitar duet jam at the end.  Great ending to a great song.  I was in a band back in the 80's and we did that version.

Offline rumborak

  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 26664
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #763 on: September 03, 2017, 04:16:09 AM »
I'm preaching to the choir here probably, but to me Phil Collins is one of the drumming greats of all time. He was incredible at creating beats that both perfectly complemented the song, and at the same time are unique and complex.
"I liked when Myung looked like a women's figure skating champion."

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19225
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #764 on: September 03, 2017, 06:42:43 AM »
Preach on!  For a while, he was also in the fusion band Brand X, and he brought some of the really crazy, adventurous riffage back to Genesis with him.  Phil was amazing in his prime.

Offline ytserush

  • Posts: 5376
  • Like clockwork...
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #765 on: September 03, 2017, 01:49:31 PM »
Please don't misunderstand.  I wasn't saying it was derivative or a copy or anything like that.   I just was trying to paint a picture.  It was just touch points is all and a way to convey a sense of what it was like without using subjective terms. 

For me  was one of the most joyous concert experiences I've ever had.  I had a smile the entire time.  It was very uplifting, especially The Call.  If it was a secular band I would have no problem saying it was a religious experience, but that term is loaded here.

Yup there were touch points.

I've had religious experiences at concerts before (Neal Morse concerts too.) but for whatever reason, that night wasn't one of them (although it was probably the best Neal Morse Band show I've seen.)

It's a great feeling when it happens. It was great you had that good of a time. I that feeling with the Testimony and Testimony II shows myself.

Offline ytserush

  • Posts: 5376
  • Like clockwork...
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #766 on: September 03, 2017, 01:52:12 PM »
When your 2-year-old recognizes and calls out prog rock, you're doing something right!  :tup

Also, synchronicity!  I just heard the Three Sides Live version of Abacab tonight in my car.  It came on shuffle on my iPod.  I love the keyboard/guitar duet jam at the end.  Great ending to a great song.  I was in a band back in the 80's and we did that version.

I'll admit to hitting the repeat button repeatedly for an hour while listening to this version in the car. I think it's my favorite live version of that song ever.

Offline ytserush

  • Posts: 5376
  • Like clockwork...
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #767 on: September 03, 2017, 01:53:21 PM »
Preach on!  For a while, he was also in the fusion band Brand X, and he brought some of the really crazy, adventurous riffage back to Genesis with him.  Phil was amazing in his prime.

I love Brand X. Thanks for the suggestion. I'm pulling some of this off of the shelf tonight.

Offline KevShmev

  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 41963
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #768 on: September 04, 2017, 06:08:41 AM »
I'm preaching to the choir here probably, but to me Phil Collins is one of the drumming greats of all time. He was incredible at creating beats that both perfectly complemented the song, and at the same time are unique and complex.

Agreed. The blinding hatred many have for Collins the pop star has made his greatness as a drummer something that many now overlook or have simply forgotten.

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19225
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis Appreciation/Discussion
« Reply #769 on: September 04, 2017, 08:45:38 AM »
Interesting way to put it, but yeah that's pretty much it, for a lot of people anyway.