Author Topic: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread  (Read 137754 times)

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Offline KevShmev

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #700 on: August 13, 2016, 09:26:16 AM »
I think the first album might still be their best (if we count Wicked World as the 2nd to last track, not Evil Woman).

Side 1 has to be one of the greatest album sides of the early 70s:

Black Sabbath
The Wizard
Behind the Wall of Sleep (most underrated awesome Sabbath song from the classic era!!)
N.I.B.

 :metal :metal

Offline LudwigVan

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #701 on: August 13, 2016, 10:23:31 AM »
I actually despise Supernaut. Go figure.

Dude, that makes like zero sense.  :)

My thoughts exactly.  :o
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Offline ozzy554

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #702 on: August 13, 2016, 01:41:25 PM »
Sabotage is my Favorite Ozzy era album. The writ and Megalomania are also two of my favorite Sabbath songs. I was really surprised to learn that The Writ was mostly written by Ozzy.

My least Favorite Ozzy era album is Technical Ecstasy. The rest I have no idea how to rank. Though I do think Never Say Die is underrated.
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Offline Mosh

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #703 on: August 13, 2016, 01:46:49 PM »
Never Say Die certainly has its moments and is far superior to the previous album. I think the problem is mostly lack of direction. It feels like they are taking 2 or 3 different directions instead of settling on one and building on that. Everything just seems really half baked.
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Offline TAC

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #704 on: August 13, 2016, 01:52:38 PM »
Sabotage is my Favorite Ozzy era album. The writ and Megalomania are also two of my favorite Sabbath songs. 

Same here.


Never Say Die certainly has its moments
I love Junior's Eyes. Amazing. Johnny Blade and the title track as well. And even though I've often defended NSD, if I'm being honest, there really isn't much beyond that.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #705 on: August 13, 2016, 01:59:45 PM »
As great as The Writ is, it sounds like one of those songs they had no clue how to end.  The last 40 seconds or so is basically that heavy riff repeated over and over, with no real progression to it, eventually fading out.

Offline TAC

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #706 on: August 13, 2016, 02:01:18 PM »
Hey, I like that part!
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #707 on: August 13, 2016, 02:03:28 PM »
Hey, I do, too! 

It just sounds like they had no clue how to end the song, so they just did that.  Drugs can do that to your mind. :lol :lol

Offline Imaginos

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #708 on: August 13, 2016, 05:45:26 PM »
Woah, Junior's Eyes just blew my mind. Johnny Blade was great too. Prior to this the only song off NSD I knew was the title track. Now I'm kind of regretting all the times I've found this album for a couple bucks and passed on it.

This thread really makes me want to even up my Sabbath collection.

Offline LudwigVan

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #709 on: August 13, 2016, 06:24:57 PM »
The thing about Never Say Die was that it moved away from the doom metal thing that Sabbath was known for. It had more of a straightforward hard rock sound which I honestly think was a blueprint for Ozzy's solo stuff.
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Offline TAC

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #710 on: August 13, 2016, 06:32:08 PM »
Woah, Junior's Eyes just blew my mind. Johnny Blade was great too. 

 :metal

would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline wolfking

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #711 on: August 14, 2016, 03:59:48 AM »
Never Say Die is a wonderful album.  I always loved Air Dance, so good.  Tony's jazz influences in full flight here.
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Offline Zydar

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #712 on: August 14, 2016, 04:01:22 AM »
Never Say Die is a wonderful album.  I always loved Air Dance, so good.  Tony's jazz influences in full flight here.

I agree, on both accounts. Such a great album.
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Offline The King in Crimson

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #713 on: August 14, 2016, 09:59:36 AM »
Back to Master of Reality, even though I think it is easily the least best of the first six, I get why so many love it.  It was kind of the start of the whole doom and sludge thing, which became big in the metal world, so I get why that appeals to a lot of people; I am just not a big sludge or doom metal guy, so there ya go.
Disagreed. Vol. 4, for me, is easily the worst of the first six albums. Never understood the love that one gets.

I'm not sure how I'd rank the albums exactly, but some combination of Paranoid, SBS, Sabotage, and Heaven and Hell would be my favorites. Master of Reality is a great album but a bit uneven and, while I do enjoy it, I much prefer the sludgier doom and weird experimentation of the later albums over the bluesier noodling of the debut.

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #714 on: August 14, 2016, 10:09:43 AM »
I guess, for me, Volume 4 has two of their all-time good ones in Wheels of Confusion and Under the Sun, and most of the rest is good (Changes, notwithstanding).  In my eyes, nothing on Master of Reality can touch those two greats from Vol. 4.

Offline TAC

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #715 on: August 14, 2016, 10:54:36 AM »
I definitely would take Vol 4 over MOR, but Into The Void is the best song on either. I also love The Straightener. Wish they could've formed that into something a bit more.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #716 on: August 14, 2016, 01:40:12 PM »
I think Solitude is highly underrated and pretty damn good actually.  Love the vibe.

Offline Imaginos

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #717 on: August 14, 2016, 01:53:11 PM »
I think Solitude is highly underrated and pretty damn good actually.  Love the vibe.

Same here. I always wished Sabbath would've done more songs in the Solitude/Planet Caravan style. Zeitgeist was alright, but not quite the same.

Offline El Barto

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #718 on: August 14, 2016, 03:06:33 PM »
Woah, Junior's Eyes just blew my mind. Johnny Blade was great too. 

 :metal
Yeah, took me forever to finally listen to NSD, and when I did I had the exact same reaction. J's really floored me. JB is alright, but pretty disjointed.
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Offline Mosh

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #719 on: August 14, 2016, 06:38:50 PM »
Have you guys heard this cover of Changes?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xi49yirJiEA


Gave me new appreciation for the song.
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Offline TAC

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #720 on: August 14, 2016, 06:45:18 PM »
WOW! That's awesome!! Nice find.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline LudwigVan

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #721 on: August 14, 2016, 07:53:36 PM »
Have you guys heard this cover of Changes?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xi49yirJiEA


Gave me new appreciation for the song.

What an odd song to cover   :lol

Well that was certainly better than the original, which probably ranks as my least favorite Ozzy - era Sabbath song.
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Offline TAC

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #722 on: August 14, 2016, 07:55:03 PM »
Your least favorite? 
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline LudwigVan

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #723 on: August 14, 2016, 07:58:04 PM »
Yeah. I find it to be dirge-like.
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Offline TAC

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #724 on: August 14, 2016, 08:02:36 PM »
Gord, where are you on Master Of Reality?

I listened to it yesterday. I do agree with Kev that it is sludgey. It was the first Sabbath album (I had the 8 track) that I had. It's probably the reason why I never really got into Ozzy era Sabbath in my formative years.

It was only when Halford fronted them in Cosa Mesa in 1991 that I truly bought into Into The Void, which is now a Top 5 Ozzy era track for me.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline LudwigVan

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #725 on: August 14, 2016, 08:12:39 PM »
Gord, where are you on Master Of Reality?

I listened to it yesterday. I do agree with Kev that it is sludgey. It was the first Sabbath album (I had the 8 track) that I had. It's probably the reason why I never really got into Ozzy era Sabbath in my formative years.

It was only when Halford fronted them in Cosa Mesa in 1991 that I truly bought into Into The Void, which is now a Top 5 Ozzy era track for me.

I love Master of Reality but I do understand why Kev and others might not be crazy about the album. It's not as diverse as the rest of the discography. There's a saminess in all the song tempos and riffing.  I think I put it 4th or 5th, flip flopping with Vol 4 depending on my mood.
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Offline Mosh

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #726 on: August 14, 2016, 08:23:06 PM »
Have you guys heard this cover of Changes?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xi49yirJiEA


Gave me new appreciation for the song.

What an odd song to cover   :lol

Well that was certainly better than the original, which probably ranks as my least favorite Ozzy - era Sabbath song.
Charles Bradley is a soul singer, so it's actually an appropriate song for him to cover. The whole album is in a similar vein. Highly recommended btw.

I think there are far worse Sabbath era Ozzy tunes. Changes is a good song that is just totally inappropriate for Ozzy.
Who Are You, for example, is far worse. Probably my least favorite. You can give a song like Changes to a real soul singer and improve it a lot but a song like Who Are You is pretty unredeemable.
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Offline Art

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #727 on: August 15, 2016, 06:19:54 AM »
The Changes cover by Charles Bradley is awesome.

Speaking of great covers, i love Pantera's version of Planet Caravan and Ulver's Solitude. And i am a big fan of the first Nativity in Black album, with some cool versions from Biohazard, Bruce Dickinson, White Zombie, Type O Negative (best version of Black Sabbath ever) and others.

Offline ?

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #728 on: August 15, 2016, 12:13:05 PM »
Back to Master of Reality, even though I think it is easily the least best of the first six, I get why so many love it.  It was kind of the start of the whole doom and sludge thing, which became big in the metal world, so I get why that appeals to a lot of people; I am just not a big sludge or doom metal guy, so there ya go.
Disagreed. Vol. 4, for me, is easily the worst of the first six albums. Never understood the love that one gets.
While I like Vol. 4, I find it less focused than the rest of the first five albums, and it pales in comparison with the albums that came before and after it (MOR and SBS).

Offline NotePad

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #729 on: August 16, 2016, 10:24:26 AM »
I have a theory that stuff like Never Say Die! and even Technical Ecstasy was Sabbath trying to be more like Led Zeppelin. Those albums show how diverse they could really be, unfortunately although they're good i prefer darker Sabbath. That's what made them so great. Other albums like the Dio stuff and the Martin era, especially Tyr, showed a different side to them that was still dark and awesome. It's too bad the general public doesn't recognize those albums. Some of the post-Ozzy stuff was like a precursor to power metal.

Offline TAC

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #730 on: August 16, 2016, 12:36:59 PM »
The general public most definitely recognizes the Dio era.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline Stadler

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #731 on: August 16, 2016, 01:24:39 PM »
Yeah, Heaven and Hell is by some accounts (not mine, but close) their best album.   

Offline LudwigVan

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #732 on: August 16, 2016, 01:28:03 PM »
Yeah, Heaven and Hell is by some accounts (not mine, but close) their best album.

By TAC's account it is.
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Offline Orbert

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #733 on: August 16, 2016, 03:20:59 PM »
It's one of my favorites as well.

Offline TAC

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Re: Black Sabbath Discussion Thread
« Reply #734 on: August 16, 2016, 06:42:33 PM »
Yeah, Heaven and Hell is by some accounts (not mine, but close) their best album.

By TAC's account it is.

 :metal

Plus I have always maintained that Dio's absolute vocal peak was Mob Rules. Maybe into Holy diver era as well.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol