Author Topic: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread  (Read 539676 times)

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Offline Ħ

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1085 on: September 28, 2012, 12:50:26 PM »
T2 is way different than T1.
"All great works are prepared in the desert, including the redemption of the world. The precursors, the followers, the Master Himself, all obeyed or have to obey one and the same law. Prophets, apostles, preachers, martyrs, pioneers of knowledge, inspired artists in every art, ordinary men and the Man-God, all pay tribute to loneliness, to the life of silence, to the night." - A. G. Sertillanges

Offline Nick

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1086 on: September 28, 2012, 12:59:57 PM »
T2 is way different than T1.

And about 5 times better.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1087 on: September 28, 2012, 01:12:35 PM »
"The Supreme Court of the United States has descended from the disciplined legal reasoning of John Marshall and Joseph Story to the mystical aphorisms of the fortune cookie."

Offline Nick

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1088 on: September 28, 2012, 01:20:53 PM »
Sorry, Bosk is right, T2 is 10 times better.
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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1089 on: September 28, 2012, 01:23:16 PM »
Sorry, Bosk is right, T2 is 10 times better.

Psh. I just listened to T1 again, on my various drives around town over the last few days, and it's a pretty great album. It still holds up against all of Neal's works over the last 10 years and I'd say it's still one of his best works.

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Offline Nick

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1090 on: September 28, 2012, 01:25:10 PM »
Sorry, Bosk is right, T2 is 10 times better.

Psh. I just listened to T1 again, on my various drives around town over the last few days, and it's a pretty great album. It still holds up against all of Neal's works over the last 10 years and I'd say it's still one of his best works.

-Marc.

I'll tell ya what, it's definitely one of his best 9 albums.
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1091 on: September 28, 2012, 01:48:06 PM »
T1 is really good, but suffers from:

a) being way too long
b) not having a real bass guitar player (this was before Randy George started working with him)
c) pretty pedestrian electric guitar playing (Neal has gotten much better over the years since that record)
d) being way too long (it needed repeating, unlike many of the themes on the actual record)


Offline darkshade

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1092 on: September 28, 2012, 02:26:02 PM »
T2 is 1000x better than T1. If T1 was condensed into one disc, it might be about equal; there ARE great moments on T1, but it's too bloated. T2 gets the job done in one disc, and has overall better material IMO.

Offline Ħ

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1093 on: September 28, 2012, 03:16:21 PM »
Uhhh T1 blows all of Neal's other stuff (including Spock's stuff) clean out of the water. One is the only one that comes close.
 
EDIT: OK, it's understandable how a person might not like T1 due to the length. But if you break up the listening experience into chunks, it's much more palatable and full of great music.
"All great works are prepared in the desert, including the redemption of the world. The precursors, the followers, the Master Himself, all obeyed or have to obey one and the same law. Prophets, apostles, preachers, martyrs, pioneers of knowledge, inspired artists in every art, ordinary men and the Man-God, all pay tribute to loneliness, to the life of silence, to the night." - A. G. Sertillanges

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1094 on: September 28, 2012, 03:24:40 PM »
Uhhh T1 blows all of Neal's other stuff (including Spock's stuff) clean out of the water. One is the only one that comes close.
 

LOLnuggetz o/

EDIT: OK, it's understandable how a person might not like T1 due to the length. But if you break up the listening experience into chunks, it's much more palatable and full of great music.

True, listening it in the car during my commutes over a couple of days really helped the album stand out a bit more, rather than listening to it all in one sitting, which can be a bit tedious, I'll admit, especially being a fan who loves double albums.

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Offline Ħ

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1095 on: September 28, 2012, 03:25:45 PM »
*\o
"All great works are prepared in the desert, including the redemption of the world. The precursors, the followers, the Master Himself, all obeyed or have to obey one and the same law. Prophets, apostles, preachers, martyrs, pioneers of knowledge, inspired artists in every art, ordinary men and the Man-God, all pay tribute to loneliness, to the life of silence, to the night." - A. G. Sertillanges

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1096 on: September 28, 2012, 05:05:04 PM »
H and M, help me--your brother in the clan of single-letter DTF usernames--appreciate T1.  It is my least favorite thing by Neal Morse I have heard, from any of his projects (granted I have not heard T2 or this newest solo album, and I have probably missed some other stuff too).  The album just doesn't have anything that grabs me or sticks with me, although I've only listened to it twice.

-J

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1097 on: September 28, 2012, 05:10:50 PM »
H and M, help me--your brother in the clan of single-letter DTF usernames--appreciate T1.  It is my least favorite thing by Neal Morse I have heard, from any of his projects (granted I have not heard T2 or this newest solo album, and I have probably missed some other stuff too).  The album just doesn't have anything that grabs me or sticks with me, although I've only listened to it twice.

-J

What really helped me was that I watch the Testimony Live DVD set, which features Neal, Mike, Randy, and a whole band of key/guitar/wind/string players (I believe 5 in addition to Mike and Randy), performing all of the album, as well as some extra SB/TA tunes for the encores. It's a great live DVD and show and really captivates the power and energy of the album, as well as the magical moments.

As for the studio album itself, it just needs repeated listens. Try to do what I did - listen to it in chunks, either as it's 5 parts, or just whenever you aren't doing much else (on commutes, going running/jogging/exercising, or other tasks), and it'll slowly sink in.

-Marc.
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Offline Ħ

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1098 on: September 28, 2012, 05:19:12 PM »
H and M, help me--your brother in the clan of single-letter DTF usernames--appreciate T1.  It is my least favorite thing by Neal Morse I have heard, from any of his projects (granted I have not heard T2 or this newest solo album, and I have probably missed some other stuff too).  The album just doesn't have anything that grabs me or sticks with me, although I've only listened to it twice.

-J
It is the first NM release I had heard (other than Smpte by TA), so maybe that was a contributing factor. I like it because it's not super preachy or corny like his other albums. This album was really just an autobiography of sorts, so it has a more sentimental feel to it. It's more theatrical and lyrical than musical, admittedly, but that's what I like about NM.
"All great works are prepared in the desert, including the redemption of the world. The precursors, the followers, the Master Himself, all obeyed or have to obey one and the same law. Prophets, apostles, preachers, martyrs, pioneers of knowledge, inspired artists in every art, ordinary men and the Man-God, all pay tribute to loneliness, to the life of silence, to the night." - A. G. Sertillanges

Offline darkshade

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1099 on: September 28, 2012, 05:50:30 PM »
I will say that I enjoy the second disc of T1 more than the first. I realize that the major factor of the album feeling bloated to me is the first disc.

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1100 on: September 28, 2012, 06:34:40 PM »
H and M, help me--your brother in the clan of single-letter DTF usernames--appreciate T1.  It is my least favorite thing by Neal Morse I have heard, from any of his projects (granted I have not heard T2 or this newest solo album, and I have probably missed some other stuff too).  The album just doesn't have anything that grabs me or sticks with me, although I've only listened to it twice.

-J
It is the first NM release I had heard (other than Smpte by TA), so maybe that was a contributing factor. I like it because it's not super preachy or corny like his other albums. This album was really just an autobiography of sorts, so it has a more sentimental feel to it. It's more theatrical and lyrical than musical, admittedly, but that's what I like about NM.

Really? I feel like the entirety of Part 5 on the album is very preachy, but that doesn't mean I don't love it.

I feel like his later albums, particularly ? and Sola Scriptura, are all LESS preachy than Testimony, mostly because they're more like rock-operas with a conceptual narrative, they have stories, rather than being straight-up preachy songs, like much of Lifeline and parts of Testimony. The sequel to that album, however, is quite a bit less preachy than the first, and it seems Neal has slowly gone away from inserting "Jesus" and "God" and "the one" and "Him/He" in much of his songs. It's more or less implied, now, than it was when he started with Testimony and One...much more like his early albums with Spock's Beard. I mean, we all knew what he meant with "The Light" and "The Doorway", but he didn't explicitly say it out right. Same with some Transatlantic songs.

This is also what I really like about "Seeds Of Gold", much of the material on Momentum, and Transatlantic's The Whirlwind - the lyrics are a bit less direct and obvious, there's subtlety and open-interpretation to them. And for those of us who really know and understand Neal, we can choose to believe his interpretations, or we can come up with our own as they fit our beliefs and interests.

-Marc.
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Offline Tick

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1101 on: September 29, 2012, 06:46:35 AM »
I don't call someone who stands behind his convictions preachy. Most of his lyrics are personal. and not aimed at anyone.
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Offline faemir

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1102 on: September 29, 2012, 10:41:41 AM »
EDIT: OK, it's understandable how a person might not like T1 due to the length. But if you break up the listening experience into chunks, it's much more palatable and full of great music.

If i have to break up the listening of an album, it's too big and bloated. It's supposed to be a big epic long set of songs, but now I'm having to break it up to not get bored? That doesn't work.

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1103 on: September 29, 2012, 10:58:15 AM »
If i have to break up the listening of an album, it's too big and bloated.
Maybe for you, but not everyone has to listen to albums that way.
"All great works are prepared in the desert, including the redemption of the world. The precursors, the followers, the Master Himself, all obeyed or have to obey one and the same law. Prophets, apostles, preachers, martyrs, pioneers of knowledge, inspired artists in every art, ordinary men and the Man-God, all pay tribute to loneliness, to the life of silence, to the night." - A. G. Sertillanges

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1104 on: September 29, 2012, 11:03:47 AM »
The whole point of the album is that it's a long conceptual journey - breaking it up might work, but it's against the point of it.

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1105 on: September 29, 2012, 11:05:02 AM »
Do you read a novel in one sitting?
"All great works are prepared in the desert, including the redemption of the world. The precursors, the followers, the Master Himself, all obeyed or have to obey one and the same law. Prophets, apostles, preachers, martyrs, pioneers of knowledge, inspired artists in every art, ordinary men and the Man-God, all pay tribute to loneliness, to the life of silence, to the night." - A. G. Sertillanges

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1106 on: September 29, 2012, 12:46:52 PM »
Do you read a novel in one sitting?

If that novel is Animal Farm, which takes about as long as a typical concept album, then yes. Otherwise your analogy is horrible.
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Offline darkshade

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1107 on: September 29, 2012, 12:51:36 PM »
Do you read a novel in one sitting?

Albums (especially concept albums) and movies are created and meant to be appreciated in one sitting. Now, you can watch or listen to these things in chunks, but it surely takes away some of the magic. The novel analogy doesn't work because you can pause between chapters, reading a novel is like watching a TV series. You're not going to watch 6 seasons on Lost in one sitting (it would take you over 100 hours to do so anyway).

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1108 on: September 29, 2012, 01:55:25 PM »
Do you read a novel in one sitting?

Albums (especially concept albums) and movies are created and meant to be appreciated in one sitting. Now, you can watch or listen to these things in chunks, but it surely takes away some of the magic. The novel analogy doesn't work because you can pause between chapters, reading a novel is like watching a TV series. You're not going to watch 6 seasons on Lost in one sitting (it would take you over 100 hours to do so anyway).

Luckily, Neal Morse's Testimony and Testimony 2 albums are divided into 8 "Parts", ranging from 10-41 minutes long, which, to me, are kind of like Chapters. Being an auto-biographical concept album, each Part is sort of a Chapter in Neal's story, so if one really wanted to, they could listen to Parts 1 and 2 (Disc 1 of T1) in one sitting, pause for a time, then coming back and listen to the next 3 parts.

Comparing albums with movies is difficult, since it has always been easy to fit films into a single-piece medium - for a long time, films would be long (or short) enough to fit into one cassette or laserdisc or dvd or blu-ray. Rarely do films exceed the capacity of a single-piece format.

Albums, however, have had a long history of exceeding the given format of the time - double albums go a long way back, mostly because the format back then (vinyl), only allowed for single albums up to 40-50 minutes in length. Now, in the age of CDs, albums can be double that length and still fit into a single piece, so I think the idea that being able to listen to an album NOW in a single sitting can be a bit tedious, whether or not it's a Double CD.

I agree, films are meant to be viewed in single sittings, but I can't expect all artists to believe that for albums, especially long double albums like The Flower Kings' Unfold The Future. And now that we're in the digital age, a lot of fans only listen to music casually, on their iPods, when they typically are doing other tasks. It's not a sit-down-and-pay-full-attention ritual like fans did way back in the day when they unwrapped their vinyl's double-gatefold cover, slipped the vinyl on their turntables and turned down the lights.

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Offline Ħ

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1109 on: September 29, 2012, 08:57:56 PM »
Do you read a novel in one sitting?

Albums (especially concept albums) are created and meant to be appreciated in one sitting.
Some are. Others aren't. T1 feels like it's one that isn't.
"All great works are prepared in the desert, including the redemption of the world. The precursors, the followers, the Master Himself, all obeyed or have to obey one and the same law. Prophets, apostles, preachers, martyrs, pioneers of knowledge, inspired artists in every art, ordinary men and the Man-God, all pay tribute to loneliness, to the life of silence, to the night." - A. G. Sertillanges

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1110 on: September 30, 2012, 06:06:09 AM »
Do you read a novel in one sitting?

Albums (especially concept albums) are created and meant to be appreciated in one sitting.
Some are. Others aren't. T1 feels like it's one that isn't.
Because it's way too fucking long.
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Offline ronnibran

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1111 on: October 01, 2012, 10:16:12 AM »
I don't think T1 has to be listened to in one sitting to really enjoy.  Disc one, yeah probably.  Disc two, yeah probably.  But they're very distinct and I think they work well apart from eachother.  Heck, in the live DVD they had intermission between the two and put on different color clothes to represent different chapters.

That said, I listen to disc 1 far more often than disc 2.

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1112 on: October 01, 2012, 12:07:06 PM »
^ You're right on the money. T1 doesn't have to be listened to in one sitting, and no one should expect albums to always be constructed for that.

And I listen to disc 1 more often too. :)
"All great works are prepared in the desert, including the redemption of the world. The precursors, the followers, the Master Himself, all obeyed or have to obey one and the same law. Prophets, apostles, preachers, martyrs, pioneers of knowledge, inspired artists in every art, ordinary men and the Man-God, all pay tribute to loneliness, to the life of silence, to the night." - A. G. Sertillanges

Offline bosk1

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1113 on: October 01, 2012, 12:20:42 PM »
Eh, I think it is self-explanatory and implicit in the very idea of a concept album that it is designed to be listened to in one sitting.  But if you choose not to do so, I'm certainly not going to lose sleep over it either.
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1114 on: October 03, 2012, 11:11:19 PM »
Neal's U.S. tour started in Nashville last night, and according to a post at his forum, the set list was:

Momentum
Weathering Sky
Author of Confusion
Testimony Medley
Thoughts Pt. 5
The Conflict
Cradle to the Grave (with Wil Morse)
? Medley (The Temple, Another World, The Outsider, Sweet Elation, the end of 12 and Entrance)
World Without End
Sing it High
Reunion

Looks pretty good, although I'd like to know what was in the Testimony medley.  Given that the Testimony medley on the last tour was mostly Part 5 (IIRC), I think playing all of Part 2 would be awesome. 

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1115 on: October 05, 2012, 10:39:29 AM »
Several days later, no one has still posted on Neal's board what was part of the Testimony medley. :facepalm: :facepalm:

What is the point of posting a set list if you are gonna sum it up like that?  That would be like DT playing five songs in a row from Scenes at a show, and someone posting the set list and saying, "Scenes medley."  It really doesn't say anything.

I am not a member of that forum, and I am not gonna sign up just to ask, but if any of you guys are (bosk1?), feel free to ask them what was part of that medley.  We need to know!!!! :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1116 on: October 05, 2012, 10:43:18 AM »
listened to Solo Scriptura this week for the first time in quite a while.  I forgot how awesome that album is.
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1117 on: October 05, 2012, 10:45:30 AM »
Sola Scriptura took quite a while to really grow on me, but I like it a lot now.  The whole Keep Silent section from The Door is one of his best sections/songs from his entire solo career. :tup :tup

Offline Big Hath

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1118 on: October 05, 2012, 10:59:11 AM »
the guitar solo near the end of The Door is absolutely ripping.  I'm guessing it's in the "Upon the door" section.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: Official Neal Morse Appreciation Thread
« Reply #1119 on: October 05, 2012, 11:23:16 AM »
the guitar solo near the end of The Door is absolutely ripping.  I'm guessing it's in the "Upon the door" section.

Yes.  My favorite solo of all time by anyone, which is saying a lot since I grew up on '80s guitar-slingers.  (Prior favorite since forever had been Alex Skolnick's solo on Return To Serenity)
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