Why power metal is not a bigger draw for metal fans in America?

[WildRanger]

What would you say?
Power metal bands have a small following in the USA, unlike Europe, where they are a few very big power metal names(Helloween, Blind Guardian, Iced Earth, Manowar etc).
And despite the fact Manowar is an American band they are much more famous in Europe.

It seems that thrash metal is the most popular form of metal among American metalheads and power metal is far behind, while in Europe thrash and power are equally popular.

[The Walrus]

It's just a niche genre, and the USA is a very large country with very huge expanses of nothingness between populated areas, and it's very expensive for bands to tour here, so... yeah.

90% of people I have shown power metal to in my life have had extremely rude and condescending things to say about it and my taste, so, yeah. It's not really a popular thing here.

[jammindude]

Mostly it’s just not taken seriously. Most of it has a higher cheese factor than even the cheesiest Ayreon album. I went to a Hammerfall show (I was only there because Into Eternity was opening) and while I admit to having fun, I mostly couldn’t stop laughing. I’m not even exaggerating when I say it felt like a Spinal Tap show.

[The Walrus]

Mostly it’s just not taken seriously. Most of it has a higher cheese factor than even the cheesiest Ayreon album. I went to a Hammerfall show (I was only there because Into Eternity was opening) and while I admit to having fun, I mostly couldn’t stop laughing. I’m not even exaggerating when I say it felt like a Spinal Tap show.

This, too, is probably the biggest reason.

I'm a massive power metal fan. But a vast majority of the bands that people like in the genre are too corny or straight up terrible for me to enjoy. Everybody needs a fucking gimmick these days, dressing up in armor, singing about unicorns and taking Rhapsody's style to a new level of cheese (at least Luca was serious about his love for cinematic music and fantasy, these guys are just all taking the piss).

Not to derail the thread but it genuinely pisses me off that Alestorm and Gloryhammer and Twilight Force are these world famous, able to tour everywhere kind of power metal bands while the ones singing about actual meaningful subjects can barely afford to put out one album. Power metal has very high peaks and very low valleys, unfortunately the valley is where most fans seem to gather.

[Samsara]

Power metal is awesome, it is also, as some pointed out, cheesy as hell. I mean, I dig it...to a degree. But some of it I just can't take seriously. Helloween is probably the first power metal band I latched on to, and I dug the humor in the first two Keeper releases, particularly part 2. But then that became the template for European power metal, and a lot of the bands that built off of that into the 90s, 00s, and today really just went overboard.

But for the U.S. specifically, these are likely the reasons power metal hasn't really caught on with the mainstream:

1. U.S. infatuation with pop stars/reality shows/drama

2. The sheer size of the U.S. which makes it almost impossible for niche acts to really gain popularity

3. A stigma against metal that continues to exist

>>>>For smaller countries, those really aren't obstacles. But here, it certainly is.

All that said, however, in little pockets, you see some of these power metal bands filling up venues. Sabaton opened...I think for Iced Earth four years ago. I never would have seen them had it not been for Iced Earth, and to be honest, a huge contingent of the crowd was there for Sabaton.

So these power metal bands do have a cult following. But the U.S. is just too difficult a market for most to crack these days.

[LudwigVan]

In the Power Metal episode for the documentary series Metal Evolution, I think host Sam Dunn makes a pretty valid point about PM and its relationship to European fans. 

The genre as a whole is very much steeped in the trappings of Classical music... lots of operatic vocals and choruses and keyboard/guitar passages that could've been lifted from a Bach fugue.  Hell, look at the names of some of these bands.. Sonata Arctica, Symphony X, Rhapsody, Stratovarius, etc.  They all give a nod to their classical roots.

And Classical music obviously has its roots in Europe, countries that live and breathe the music, so much so that it's pretty much in their blood.  I just don't think Americans have that connection.

[lonestar]

The cheese factor is probably the primary thing, Americans are so fucking concerned with image that power metal could never get a hold. For me personally growing up in the SF Bay Area in the 80s, with the big 4 of thrash slowly building to a peak right in my backyard, power metal was barely a fart in the wind compared to that tsunami. I'm glad to have gotten in with the Prog Power crowd though, and am starting to really dig into it, especially the folk/viking/pirate/D&D metal. Shit's fucking epic, and nothing sounds better at full volume.

[bl5150]

The premise still holds (low draw) but there were power metal bands classed by many as "American power metal" that were not all that cheesy.   Vicious Rumors ,Sanctuary, Liege Lord and even Iced Earth aren't quite in the Hammerfall league.   But then there's Virgin Steele

The best of the lot (IMO) Savatage  continues on in some form as TSO who are pretty big, so there's that ..........clutching at straws

[MirrorMask]

Virgin Steele are massively awesome.

Power metal is usually the genre that makes you a metalhead when you're a kid... then you grow up 

Well, I still consider Helloween one of my favorite bands, but I agree that the double bass galore and unicorns lyrics get old pretty fast.

[bl5150]

Virgin Steele are massively awesome.

Power metal is usually the genre that makes you a metalhead when you're a kid... then you grow up 

Well, I still consider Helloween one of my favorite bands, but I agree that the double bass galore and unicorns lyrics get old pretty fast.

I like some Virgin Steele myself -  Burning of Rome is an all time classic tune.

Having said that - check out the video for Perfect Mansions and see how many absolute pissers you can find in there.   Also one of my all time faves but for different reasons 

[MirrorMask]

The song is awesome (and is actually an ideal sequel to the story of Burning of Rome), the video indeed is not  the cars passing on the road while the band is performing on a beach is so low budget that it's not even funny 

[bl5150]

At one point someone almost gets a punch in the face due to some wild arm movements (if memory serves correct).  There is just so many funny things in that vid it's ridiculous 

[wolfking]

I think it's all somewhat an image thing and as already said I don't think they would take power metal seriously.  Perhaps after the glam period we got the grunge era, but as far as metal goes Pantera and to a lesser extent Sepultura, Machine Head, Tool etc. become somewhat the saviours of the genre through that 90's period.  That style, look and stigma just sort of seemed to carry on in the US even with it's changes into the 2000's in some respect.  I think it's more the image and the culture and lifestyle over there.  It's almost like America on a whole weren't open to the big power metal movement of Stratovarius, Hammerfall etc. all that much compared to Europe. 

Saying that, Nu Metal was the big thing at the same time.  Nu Metal was kind of like what power metal was to Europe so you could argue why Nu Metal wasn't all that big in Europe.  Nu Metal went on for quite a number of years too, so as I said, they kind of like they just missed the big power metal movement and were preoccupied with something else.

[WildRanger]

 
Saying that, Nu Metal was the big thing at the same time.  Nu Metal was kind of like what power metal was to Europe so you could argue why Nu Metal wasn't all that big in Europe.  Nu Metal went on for quite a number of years too, so as I said, they kind of like they just missed the big power metal movement and were preoccupied with something else.

Power metal is musically a way superior than nu-metal.
I think Deftones and System of a Down were the only two good bands from nu-metal period, others sucked.

[Samsara]

 
Saying that, Nu Metal was the big thing at the same time.  Nu Metal was kind of like what power metal was to Europe so you could argue why Nu Metal wasn't all that big in Europe.  Nu Metal went on for quite a number of years too, so as I said, they kind of like they just missed the big power metal movement and were preoccupied with something else.

Power metal is musically a way superior than nu-metal.
I think Deftones and System of a Down were the only two good bands from nu-metal period, others sucked.

Not quite. Opinions and all that. You have bands like Sevendust that were lumped into the nu-metal category as well. And to be perfectly honest, I personally think the Deftones are terrible, and SoaD, while cool musically, are horrible vocally. Again, opinions galore. But I would not call power metal "musically superior" to nu-metal. it's just different, and not all bad.

[Dream Team]

America sucks for metal, always has besides the obvious draw of Metallica. I blame white kids embracing rap culture, the bizarre worship of talentless pop skanks and stuff like American Idol for keeping the US in permanent ignorance regarding music.

[Architeuthis]

America sucks for metal, always has besides the obvious draw of Metallica. I blame white kids embracing rap culture, the bizarre worship of talentless pop skanks and stuff like American Idol for keeping the US in permanent ignorance regarding music.

 There is a lot of truth to that statement.  Also a large majority of people in the U.S. are into country music. The radio stations are also limited to what they can play due to contracts..

[bosk1]

*listens to most recent album from incredible American metal band* 

[Stadler]

America sucks for metal, always has besides the obvious draw of Metallica. I blame white kids embracing rap culture, the bizarre worship of talentless pop skanks and stuff like American Idol for keeping the US in permanent ignorance regarding music.

 There is a lot of truth to that statement.  Also a large majority of people in the U.S. are into country music. The radio stations are also limited to what they can play due to contracts..

There's zero truth in that statement.  We're "ignorant" because we don't like metal?   One that's wrong because as much of a metal head as I am it's not the be all and end all of genres.  Two that's wrong because Van Halen, Kiss, Skid Row, Guns and  Roses, A7X, Alter Bridge, all of Grunge, etc. etc. etc.     Three that's wrong because  some of the biggest names in pop are god forbid, pretty goddamn talented.   Lady Gaga can sing her ass off; Carrie Underwood walked on stage at the recent Country Music Awards and sang her lungs out.  The place - all professionals who would presumably be able to tell a "pop skank" from a talented performer - were almost speechless they were so blown away.   Not one but TWO people were caught on camera saying "WTF was THAT?" it was so good. Demi Lovato.   Kelly Clarkson.   Four that's wrong because like kids play baseball here instead of soccer, we get a lot of very very talented musicians (Duane Allman, Vince Gill, Brad Paisley just to name three) that go a more Americana route. 

God I hate musical snobbery.   

[bosk1]

God I hate musical snobbery. 

I may just have to ban you from the forum then.  Not that you've done anything to deserve it.  But just for your own protection so you don't have an aneurism. 

[TAC]

We're "ignorant" because we don't like metal?   One that's wrong because as much of a metal head as I am it's not the be all and end all of genres.  Two that's wrong because Van Halen, Kiss, Skid Row, Guns and  Roses, A7X, Alter Bridge, all of Grunge, etc. etc. etc.     Three that's wrong because  some of the biggest names in pop are god forbid, pretty goddamn talented.   Lady Gaga can sing her ass off; Carrie Underwood walked on stage at the recent Country Music Awards and sang her lungs out.  The place - all professionals who would presumably be able to tell a "pop skank" from a talented performer - were almost speechless they were so blown away.   Not one but TWO people were caught on camera saying "WTF was THAT?" it was so good. Demi Lovato.   Kelly Clarkson.   Four that's wrong because like kids play baseball here instead of soccer, we get a lot of very very talented musicians (Duane Allman, Vince Gill, Brad Paisley just to name three) that go a more Americana route. 

Excellent post.

[The Walrus]

I used to get mocked for only liking power metal, now I get mocked by power metal fans because I dare to enjoy other genres of music and criticize metal genres I still like. I fucking love Stadler's post. GOOD MUSIC ISN'T BOUND TO ONE GENRE.

[Stadler]

God I hate musical snobbery. 

I may just have to ban you from the forum then.  Not that you've done anything to deserve it.  But just for your own protection so you don't have an aneurism. 

Haha, it's for my own good? 

[Ninjabait]

It's a number of things, really.

Power metal is something I've always associated specifically with the Alpine Region (plus Spain), since most of the important bands and developments have stemmed from there. It may technically have its "roots" in other countries, but most of the important bands that I would associate with power metal stem from that region. Especially Germany, I should note. It's easier to tour between countries in the European Union than it is to jump the Atlantic and tour in the US (and not to mention much more expensive!), so power metal bands have had an easier time spreading their wings in Europe.

Speaking of touring, the US is HUGE. Like, I've heard it joked that you can drive for 5 hours in Europe and end up in a different country, but drive for 5 hours in the US and you're still stuck in Mississippi. Plus, most of the big population centers are on opposite ends of the country, with huge areas of sparse population in between. Those big population centers are also very important artistic communities that draw artists in from hundreds of genres, meaning that there is a LOT of competition if you're touring there and people would rather shell out the cash for an artist they know than some metal guys from Germany. Plus, y'know, airfare ain't cheap and tickets can cost a couple grand. So it's more sensible to spend that airfare on establishing your name in countries like Brazil or Japan, which are a) smaller and b) have some established metal communities already.

Another thing is the stigma that was attached to metal in the 80s in America, which afaik was not as present in Central and Western Europe. This has kind of stunted the growth of metal here in general, and it's only in the past two decades or so that that has slowly started to lift.

tl;dr: it's most logistical stuff. Power metal could probably do decently well here if the conditions were right, but they aren't. C'est la vie.

[MirrorMask]

Speaking of touring, the US is HUGE. Like, I've heard it joked that you can drive for 5 hours in Europe and end up in a different country, but drive for 5 hours in the US and you're still stuck in Mississippi.

Just a different country? with the right combination, and even leaving aside micro-states, with 5 hours you can be in THREE different states. Hell, a couple of occasions I've been in three different nations in a single day myself 

[ganpondorodf]

Not to derail the thread but it genuinely pisses me off that Alestorm and Gloryhammer and Twilight Force are these world famous, able to tour everywhere kind of power metal bands while the ones singing about actual meaningful subjects can barely afford to put out one album. Power metal has very high peaks and very low valleys, unfortunately the valley is where most fans seem to gather.

The market has spoken! People enjoy fun music! Who'd have thunk it?

[The Walrus]

Not to derail the thread but it genuinely pisses me off that Alestorm and Gloryhammer and Twilight Force are these world famous, able to tour everywhere kind of power metal bands while the ones singing about actual meaningful subjects can barely afford to put out one album. Power metal has very high peaks and very low valleys, unfortunately the valley is where most fans seem to gather.

The market has spoken! People enjoy fun music! Who'd have thunk it?

Hey, I totally get that. I was a huge fan of Alestorm from before their debut up until their third album. I'm just a bit annoyed at gimmicky bands that focus on a singular subject and prioritize "fun" over serious lyrical content and get to tour the world, while I've seen bands that actually have some substance to their lyrics beyond a corny gimmick have to throw in the towel because it eats too much into their own pocketbooks just to get on the road. Especially considering Chris Bowes just takes the piss out of everything. I am genuinely annoyed by him, and to that extent, he probably thinks I'm a miserable cunt and couldn't be happier.  So at least one of us is happy. 

It just annoys me because it gives the entire genre a bad name and feeds into the greater perception that the whole genre is nothing but shitty gimmicks and playing make believe on a stage. Rabble rabble rabble, don't mind me.

[ganpondorodf]

Maybe it's a British Isles thing, but I've always enjoyed music, movies, books or whatever that revel in taking the piss. I dunno if you read much fantasy literature but if you do I gather you despise Pratchett

[The Walrus]

Maybe it's a British Isles thing, but I've always enjoyed music, movies, books or whatever that revel in taking the piss. I dunno if you read much fantasy literature but if you do I gather you despise Pratchett

I was huge on fantasy literature as a kid but high school and college made me hate reading in general so I've barely read anything in the last decade. Never read anything of Pratchett's (I know, I know, I'm a bad fantasy fan).

I don't mind things taking the piss, I'm just grumpy at how it's overshadowing a lot of other great, heartfelt, sincere power metal that doesn't rely on gimmicks. But the American heart wants what it wants... more Alestorm and Sabaton. 

[Anguyen92]

Speaking of touring, the US is HUGE. Like, I've heard it joked that you can drive for 5 hours in Europe and end up in a different country, but drive for 5 hours in the US and you're still stuck in Mississippi.

Just a different country? with the right combination, and even leaving aside micro-states, with 5 hours you can be in THREE different states. Hell, a couple of occasions I've been in three different nations in a single day myself 

If I'm driving from five hours from Anaheim, I better reach Las Vegas from there or I'm going to be upset about the time wasted.