Author Topic: US IW&B Venue Cancellations / Venue Changes. Discussion and Info thread.  (Read 4522 times)

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Offline mike099

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If these shows have been cancelled, it seems odd that the reason would be ticket sales.  In most cases the tickets have been on sale a short period of time with some concerts being 3 months out.  I bought mine for Nashville the first day, but I should have not gotten my hopes up so soon.  I do feel like with Opeth selling fairly well for Nashville, that DT would have sold 1,500 thru 2,000.

Even more odd is Mt Caramel is in upper east tn(Kingsport area) and Thomas Wolfe Auditorium is in Asheville, NC.

Damn!!

Damn is right!!  Mt Caramel TN is less than 1.5-hours from me and would have turned an overnight trip to Raleigh NC into a quick run down I-81... no muss no fuss.  I'd say wires are crossed regarding that info since the venue listed for Mt Caramel is in Asheville NC.  Looks like someone rushed to get the info out without fact-checking it first...

And speaking of Asheville... if the Nashville show is moved to Asheville (which doesn't really make sense to me logistically as they'd be going North to just turn back South to the TX dates), perhaps the fans catching the Raleigh show and moving North to go home can stop at Asheville and catch the show again, maybe that's what they're thinking (I'm trying to be positive).

In any case, I hate to hear it for all of you that bought tickets to Nashville if it is now cancelled like many think (or any of the other shows that are being moved)... and I hate to see DT get bad PR out of this foul-up.


Yes, I was really pumped when DT was coming to my home town(Nashville) and directly across the street from where I work.  Now I feel like I got to first base and was thrown out trying to steal second.  Still debating making the 4.5 hour trip north to Cincy.
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Offline Tick

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It's really cool that DT took there time to make sure every detail was ironed out before releasing those NA tour dates.
I've been on vacation a week and I'm just seeing this thread now. After months and months of "soon" this is the result? Wow...
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Offline volwrath

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If these shows have been cancelled, it seems odd that the reason would be ticket sales.  In most cases the tickets have been on sale a short period of time with some concerts being 3 months out.  I bought mine for Nashville the first day, but I should have not gotten my hopes up so soon.  I do feel like with Opeth selling fairly well for Nashville, that DT would have sold 1,500 thru 2,000.

Even more odd is Mt Caramel is in upper east tn(Kingsport area) and Thomas Wolfe Auditorium is in Asheville, NC.

Damn!!

Damn is right!!  Mt Caramel TN is less than 1.5-hours from me and would have turned an overnight trip to Raleigh NC into a quick run down I-81... no muss no fuss.  I'd say wires are crossed regarding that info since the venue listed for Mt Caramel is in Asheville NC.  Looks like someone rushed to get the info out without fact-checking it first...

And speaking of Asheville... if the Nashville show is moved to Asheville (which doesn't really make sense to me logistically as they'd be going North to just turn back South to the TX dates), perhaps the fans catching the Raleigh show and moving North to go home can stop at Asheville and catch the show again, maybe that's what they're thinking (I'm trying to be positive).

In any case, I hate to hear it for all of you that bought tickets to Nashville if it is now cancelled like many think (or any of the other shows that are being moved)... and I hate to see DT get bad PR out of this foul-up.


Yes, I was really pumped when DT was coming to my home town(Nashville) and directly across the street from where I work.  Now I feel like I got to first base and was thrown out trying to steal second.  Still debating making the 4.5 hour trip north to Cincy.

This blows... First the Astonishing and now this...

Please come to Nashville Shattered Fortress and/or Haken

Offline mike099

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I believe that I just read today in the Haken thread that Haken is playing a 750 seat arena in St. Louis.  I feel that Nashville could sell 750.  Haken has come to Atlanta for the progressive festivals, but not sure how much if any they have toured in the southeast.
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Offline Gromit1710

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Good and Bad news for AZ.

Good news is, the show is officially rescheduled for the same date and new area (Chandler Center)

Bad news is, if you were someone like me who bought the Presale tickets, by the time you got your email from SoundRink with your link to get priority tickets because of the cancellation...

The tickets are already gone. No standard priority pre-sale tickets are available unless you want to go VIP.

So I guess I'll get in the queue tomorrow at 10am online and hope I don't end up with crap ones.

Offline Scottjf8

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Any idea if Texas is out of the woods yet?

Offline volwrath

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I believe that I just read today in the Haken thread that Haken is playing a 750 seat arena in St. Louis.  I feel that Nashville could sell 750.  Haken has come to Atlanta for the progressive festivals, but not sure how much if any they have toured in the southeast.

Yeo they are coming for Progpower this year too., but its kind of a weak lineup imo.

Offline Gromit1710

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Any idea if Texas is out of the woods yet?
They have two scheduled in TX.

DEC 1st at Bass Hall in Austin

Dec 2nd at The Pavillion in Dallas.

Offline Scottjf8

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So they canceled Houston?

Offline SystematicThought

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I believe that's one of the dates that disappeared
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Offline bosk1

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I hate to use the term "soon" in any of my posts because of the connotation that has taken on...  :lol

But let me just say, the band is aware of the issues and they are being resolved.  We should be getting some information ironing all of this out soon (really). 
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Offline Architeuthis

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I wish the band would pro-test the lack of any dates in the Pacific Northwest. I would think DT has enough clout to have a say-so in that call..
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Offline deadwinged

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Managed to grab tickets to the rescheduled Phoenix show today. Center section, Row K, pretty much dead center. I'm really excited to see DT in such a small venue for a change.

Offline erwinrafael

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JP just released a public apology on the cancellations.

Offline bosk1

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Link?  I have been talking to him about this, and he was very receptive to what I told him.  But I didn't know he was posting something.
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Offline Joshgirouard

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Bosk1 , it's on his twitter account.

Offline El Barto

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And on their facebook.
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Offline bosk1

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Quote
The band and I strive to bring the best show possible to our fans in every city that we play. To our fans in Houston, Nashville, Phoenix, and Buffalo, we apologize for the confusion around the announcement and subsequent cancellation of those shows. In Phoenix, we apologize for the unanticipated venue change, and Buffalo has now been moved to Rochester. Unfortunately the Images, Words & Beyond tour production didn’t fit into the original venues booked. We’re looking forward to playing for you all! We truly regret any inconvenience this may have caused, and to our fans in Houston and Nashville: we promise to be back!

We’re also aware of problems within our system getting tour dates and correct ticketing information up, especially in light of all the changes. We value your loyalty and dedication to Dream Theater immensely, and we ask for your forgiveness and patience. Safeguards are being put into place which will insure that this series of errors does not happen again.

—John Petrucci

https://www.facebook.com/dreamtheater/
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Offline cramx3

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Quote
The band and I strive to bring the best show possible to our fans in every city that we play. To our fans in Houston, Nashville, Phoenix, and Buffalo, we apologize for the confusion around the announcement and subsequent cancellation of those shows. In Phoenix, we apologize for the unanticipated venue change, and Buffalo has now been moved to Rochester. Unfortunately the Images, Words & Beyond tour production didn’t fit into the original venues booked. We’re looking forward to playing for you all! We truly regret any inconvenience this may have caused, and to our fans in Houston and Nashville: we promise to be back!
We’re also aware of problems within our system getting tour dates and correct ticketing information up, especially in light of all the changes. We value your loyalty and dedication to Dream Theater immensely, and we ask for your forgiveness and patience. Safeguards are being put into place which will insure that this series of errors does not happen again.
—John Petrucci

Offline Scottjf8

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Phew, hopefully everything else should be good.

Offline KevShmev

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The apology is nice, but it's a shame that this is basically the band being reactive instead of proactive.  The day these problems started, they should have gotten out ahead of it immediately, but now it just comes across a week or later like an apology that they had to be told to do.  And that is a shame, because I have no doubt that the band cares about and values their fans, but this is just a bad look for the band.

Offline mike099

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What do they mean by the 'tour production did not fit'.  Are there a lot of extras besides screens and the normal sound equipment?
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Offline goo-goo

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What do they mean by the 'tour production did not fit'.  Are there a lot of extras besides screens and the normal sound equipment?

Most likely stage size. They have minimum requirements in their tour rider for their stage setup. Somebody  drop the ball big time and did not read the rider thoroughly (promoter side). It probably gained DT's attention when most likely promoter started going over it and realized stages were smaller than the requirement and started changing venues. Not sure why management on DTs side did not check this before putting out the tour dates.

For the Phx gig. I've been to the Celebrity Theater and I just don't see how the Current tour stage setup was going to fit there. The setup and screens look very wide.
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Online TAC

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I that where they are playing? Holy shit is that a small place. I saw Iron Maiden there in 1998.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline goo-goo

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I that where they are playing? Holy shit is that a small place. I saw Iron Maiden there in 1998.

It was the original venue in Arizona. Now the show got moved to the Chandler Performing Arts Center in Chandler AZ.
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Online TAC

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Oh, OK. That makes more sense. No way they're getting in here:

would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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The apology is nice, but it's a shame that this is basically the band being reactive instead of proactive.  The day these problems started, they should have gotten out ahead of it immediately, but now it just comes across a week or later like an apology that they had to be told to do.  And that is a shame, because I have no doubt that the band cares about and values their fans, but this is just a bad look for the band.

What is amazing is that this is a band that's been touring the world for the last 25 years.  Someone in the organization is clearly not paying attention.
You're right, Kev. It is a bad look. I get that shit happens, but it does really make you wonder WTF is going on. Why tease the US fans back during the holidays?
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline Mladen

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Somebody is going to get fired over this mess.  :lol

Offline Chino

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When the shows got cancelled, I don't understand why it would have been so hard to immediately say to the fans "Sorry everyone, turns out some stages are too small. We're making new arrangements. Hang tight.".

Offline Skeever

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What do they mean by the 'tour production did not fit'.  Are there a lot of extras besides screens and the normal sound equipment?

No idea since it doesn't even seem to be a big show.

I feel like the band are being pretty dishonest here.

Offline cramx3

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Honestly, my personal opinion, play the shows and screw the stage sets.  You booked it, fans bought tickets, if the real reason is stage size (and I believe that is likely the reason) then play a scaled down show.  It is DT's (well DT's management/tour people, but still falls on DT at the end of the day) fault and got fans hopes up.  The stage show for this tour is not very impressive.  It's not like TA where it was a huge part of the concert.  There aren't even video screens.   Just play the music for the fans you just teased for 9 months.

Offline mikeyd23

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When the shows got cancelled, I don't understand why it would have been so hard to immediately say to the fans "Sorry everyone, turns out some stages are too small. We're making new arrangements. Hang tight.".

Yup, that probably would have been better, at least JP put out a statement now I guess, better late than never. These are the types of things I feel like probably happened a lot before with DT, but MP was always into ever detail and probably caught some of this sort of stuff ahead of time. Typically, I'd feel silly saying a band member would catch logistical things like that vs someone in management who is responsible, but MP is the only variable that's really changed, so I'm inclined to think it holds up.

No idea since it doesn't even seem to be a big show.

I feel like the band are being pretty dishonest here.

Huh? Why would you think that?

Offline Gromit1710

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Managed to grab tickets to the rescheduled Phoenix show today. Center section, Row K, pretty much dead center. I'm really excited to see DT in such a small venue for a change.

I managed to grab the first couple of seats on the center isle of the CR section in row H. Pretty good ones as well.

Did you not see them the last few times they came through town? The place they usually play, the Mesa Theater for Performing arts (or IDEKA) is about the same size. Looks almost identical in the pictures I've seen.

What do they mean by the 'tour production did not fit'.  Are there a lot of extras besides screens and the normal sound equipment?

Most likely stage size. They have minimum requirements in their tour rider for their stage setup. Somebody  drop the ball big time and did not read the rider thoroughly (promoter side). It probably gained DT's attention when most likely promoter started going over it and realized stages were smaller than the requirement and started changing venues. Not sure why management on DTs side did not check this before putting out the tour dates.

For the Phx gig. I've been to the Celebrity Theater and I just don't see how the Current tour stage setup was going to fit there. The setup and screens look very wide.


What do they mean by the 'tour production did not fit'.  Are there a lot of extras besides screens and the normal sound equipment?

No idea since it doesn't even seem to be a big show.

I feel like the band are being pretty dishonest here.


Admittedly, I was gobsmacked when I saw Celebrity Theater listed as the venue. I worked on DT's local crew for a couple midwestern shows as a PA tech a few years ago on the BCSL tour. (I think I did a thread here way back then with behind the scenes pictures).

They do have a pretty large production footprint and it doesn't look to have shrunk much since then.

Even if there's not a lot going on onstage with props and such, that doesn't mean there aren't other requirements they need to put the show on. For example:

They've always had a pretty intricate lighting program, dependent on a specific configuration of Box Truss downstage, upstage and overhead to place properly. The Celebrity Theater's round and minimalist layout would have made that darn near impossible to pull off and probably would have required reprogramming of all the scenes. This is something no lighting guy wants to do once the show is set, especially with the odd ball timings required.

They also have some pretty large screens on every tour I've seen them. They could have hung those, but it would have forced them to only use about 1/4 of the theater's capacity as the stage is meant to rotate, giving everyone a view from all sides. If the screens were facing only one way, only about a 1/4 of the audience would have been able to see them properly.

Not to mention Mangini's kit would have taken up a large portion of that stage. Most likely they have a specific stage size requirement listed on the rider (40' x 20' minimum or something). The ability for the production crew to get everything in, set up, placed properly and working in time depends on a standard configuration. One offs like a round stage complicate the fuck out of things when you're trying to manage a crew of people all working on different teams.


Yes, I was very surprised at the Celebrity's booking but also looking forward very much to seeing them there if they were going to pull that off. It would have been amazing to see them in that kind of intimate setting, but I'm not surprised it was booked in error. In the band's defense, they probably had no idea the clusterfuck was happening until it was too late as that's what they pay other people to deal with.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 07:56:01 AM by Gromit1710 »

Offline bosk1

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Gromit, thanks for the explanation.  That is very helpful.

I worked on DT's local crew for a couple midwestern shows as a PA tech a few years ago on the BCSL tour. (I think I did a thread here way back then with behind the scenes pictures).

Oh, that was you?  I remember that thread!  You need to post here more often!

In the band's defense, they probably had no idea the clusterfuck was happening until it was too late as that's what they pay other people to deal with.

Yeah, exactly this.  The whole process, beginning with the teasing back around the holidays and then the subsequent drought of information, and so on, was something that just spiraled one step at a time.  They would find out about each problem after the fact, work on correcting it, and then the next thing would happen, and so on.  And I don't think they really understood the extent to which it was frustrating the fans.  To John Petrucci's credit, I had a discussion with him about it yesterday, and he IMMEDIATELY jumped on this by putting a statement out--despite that the guy isn't even home and is on vacation!  I think he deserves a lot of credit for that, personally.  To respond to Kev's post, yeah, it's reactive rather than proactive.  But in life, sometimes you just find yourself caught behind the 8-ball, whether through your own fault, circumstances outside your control, or a combination of both.  That's just life.  When that happens, you can either deny and keep doing what you are doing, or you can stand up and own it, and try to make it right with the cards you are dealt.  To John's credit, he chose the latter.  And he did it because he genuinely cares what the fans think, and he really feels bad about it.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 08:12:50 AM by bosk1 »
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Offline goo-goo

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@bosk

When I saw JP's apology, I immediately thought that JP had read the forum LOL. I guess you kind of planted the seed in his brain.

But as Gromit said, that's why other people get paid. The promoters and DTs booking agents were not probably on the same page. I'm assuming DT's booking agent and promoters looked for other venues in the cities they cancelled before pulling the plug. Houston has a crapload of venues, so the fact they couldn't rebook it in the Houston area, tells me that the other venues with DT's requirements were booked. Same for Nashville and Phoenix (although they booked it at Chandler, AZ, which is relatively not far from where the Celebrity Theater is).
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