Author Topic: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News  (Read 1833 times)

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Offline kingshmegland

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #35 on: May 01, 2017, 04:44:36 PM »
That was the big change.  News used to be just that, news.  Now the reporting is slanted to the personal leanings.  I can't say when it happened but it just did.
There is (or was) a documentary on Netflix called The Best of Enemies, which follows the public debates and feuds between William F. Buckley and Gore Vidal.  They were apparently the first, or one of the first partisan commentators on national TV, featured by ABC (which was a relatively new network at the time) during the run-up to the 1968 presidential election.  Their debates got pretty hot and the documentary cites this as the precursor to the cable news shows and their partisan commentary.  Prior to this it was simply the evening news from the big networks where most people got their information.
It's on my list.


Thank you!  I'll check that out!
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Offline Cool Chris

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #36 on: May 01, 2017, 05:03:28 PM »
Their debates got pretty hot and the documentary cites this as the precursor to the cable news shows and their partisan commentary. 

That actually sounds not only reasonable, but something we should have more of: people discussing and debating differing viewpoints.
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Offline Stadler

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #37 on: May 02, 2017, 09:40:28 AM »
Not even O'Reilly specifically, but I've always found the idea of watching partisan pundit shows for entertainment a bit strange. That goes equally for left wing and right wing pundit shows. For me, I'll check the news quickly one a day just to see what's going on, or if something happens to get more information, but I can't imagine wanting to spend my downtime hearing a person from one side of the aisle complaining about people on the other, even if I agree with them.

I'm willing to just chalk this down as an "I don't get it" thing and move on.

I'm with you, 100%, and yet... I'd say we're the vast minority.   People seem to want to feel validated more than ever.   Does anyone disagree that social media is really just one big validation exercise?   

I used to have a stock question I would ask any artist I met - I was lucky enough to ask Paul Stanley, Michael Moorcock, and Fish this question personally - and it was something along the lines of "how do you get the courage to put out your work, and not be burdened by comparisons with the past?  If I write a song, and it's not at least as good as "Stairway to Heaven", what's the point?  Or a book that's not "Anna Karenina"?"   And all three said something to the effect that art is NOT validation for them.  They're not in competition with "Stairway..." and "Anna...".  It's a means of capturing an emotion for them and communicating that to the world in a new way, perhaps in a way that hasn't been done before.    I see that as the exact opposite of social media (though you will get all kinds of people claiming it's the same thing); social media is all about validating your mundane existence.  MY OPINION MATTERS!, when it really doesn't, not in the grand scheme of things.   It's just another leaf on the tree.   And yet we spend more time on our phones than we do talking to real human beings.  It's the same thing with our news.   It's not as bad the other way (because there are more choices the other way) but ask any declared liberal if they watch "Fox News" and gauge the reaction.  It likely will not be a polite "not usually".

Offline bosk1

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #38 on: May 02, 2017, 09:46:37 AM »
^That needs to be posted in almost every thread on the DT discussion side.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #39 on: May 02, 2017, 09:49:22 AM »
I don't think you are wrong, but I think you lumped all of social media into one category of opinionated social media.  Which facebook has become a cesspool of, but someone like myself never makes opinionated posts.  I am way more opinionated on this forum than any social media.  I personally have no desire for my friends to like my opinions or start a public argument.  I use social media strictly for broadcasting my life in a way, sharing pictures mostly and I pretty much only engage in others who do the same (mostly because that's my view on social media and how I would like to use it).  I'm not even popular to get likes  :lol

Offline XeRocks81

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #40 on: May 02, 2017, 09:52:02 AM »
Not even O'Reilly specifically, but I've always found the idea of watching partisan pundit shows for entertainment a bit strange. That goes equally for left wing and right wing pundit shows. For me, I'll check the news quickly one a day just to see what's going on, or if something happens to get more information, but I can't imagine wanting to spend my downtime hearing a person from one side of the aisle complaining about people on the other, even if I agree with them.

I'm willing to just chalk this down as an "I don't get it" thing and move on.

I'm with you, 100%, and yet... I'd say we're the vast minority.   People seem to want to feel validated more than ever.   Does anyone disagree that social media is really just one big validation exercise?   

I used to have a stock question I would ask any artist I met - I was lucky enough to ask Paul Stanley, Michael Moorcock, and Fish this question personally - and it was something along the lines of "how do you get the courage to put out your work, and not be burdened by comparisons with the past?  If I write a song, and it's not at least as good as "Stairway to Heaven", what's the point?  Or a book that's not "Anna Karenina"?"   And all three said something to the effect that art is NOT validation for them.  They're not in competition with "Stairway..." and "Anna...".  It's a means of capturing an emotion for them and communicating that to the world in a new way, perhaps in a way that hasn't been done before.    I see that as the exact opposite of social media (though you will get all kinds of people claiming it's the same thing); social media is all about validating your mundane existence.  MY OPINION MATTERS!, when it really doesn't, not in the grand scheme of things.   It's just another leaf on the tree.   And yet we spend more time on our phones than we do talking to real human beings.  It's the same thing with our news.   It's not as bad the other way (because there are more choices the other way) but ask any declared liberal if they watch "Fox News" and gauge the reaction.  It likely will not be a polite "not usually".

Those artists are still looking for the "validation" of having people connect with what they are putting out, be it in the immediacy of live performance or the long-term feedback on studio albums.   Meaning seeking some validation isn't a bad thing per se

Offline Stadler

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #41 on: May 02, 2017, 10:13:17 AM »
I don't think you are wrong, but I think you lumped all of social media into one category of opinionated social media.  Which facebook has become a cesspool of, but someone like myself never makes opinionated posts.  I am way more opinionated on this forum than any social media.  I personally have no desire for my friends to like my opinions or start a public argument.  I use social media strictly for broadcasting my life in a way, sharing pictures mostly and I pretty much only engage in others who do the same (mostly because that's my view on social media and how I would like to use it).  I'm not even popular to get likes  :lol

No, no, you're right.    But generally speaking, I think I am on to something. 

I signed up for Instagram to track my daughter (only to find out she's on like ten other social media platforms).   But I was at a beauty school competition for my stepdaughter this weekend and one of the categories was "People's Choice", judged by "number of likes".    And she did pretty well; something like 600 likes.   There are like 250 comments, many from family and friends, which you can dismiss, but many from well-meaning professionals that offered great commentary and constructive criticism.  I got into it with one guy that says "SLOPPY.  Looks like a student did that".  She IS a student.   :) And he came back at me justifying his credentials, and I finally said something like, "Look dude, I get it; you're right and the whole world is wrong, because it's the INTERNET.  But if you're REALLY the professional you think you are, you would have a) gotten your facts right, and b) brought something new to the table."  His reply?  "I'm a professional I know what I'm talking about".  And it was ridiculous, the degree to which the entire exchange - which, as an adult, a father and a reasonably secure, intelligent person I am rather embarrassed about this morning - was not about making my daughter better, or teaching her, but about establishing his bona fides.    And there were two other "negative" comments and both (not engaged by me) were similar.  Not at all about helping her be better, or contribute more to the fashion community, but rather tearing her down to validate themselves.   It is really sickening.   

Offline cramx3

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #42 on: May 02, 2017, 10:44:27 AM »
And you are right too.  I was merely just trying to say that all social media shouldn't be lumped into what you described although I think what you described is a huge part of social media.  Your example above makes me mad.  It's the stuff like that that ruins the internet IMO and why a place like DTF is awesome.

Online Chino

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #43 on: May 02, 2017, 10:47:38 AM »
I want to follow Bill on Instagram...

Offline portnoy311

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #44 on: May 02, 2017, 01:37:03 PM »
Message boards are social media. Do you find this place a waste of time echo chamber?

Offline bosk1

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #45 on: May 02, 2017, 01:39:44 PM »
*raises hand*  I do.  :)
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Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #46 on: May 02, 2017, 01:41:07 PM »
Message boards are social media. Do you find this place a waste of time echo chamber?
I don't see message boards as social media.  I mean, I get what you're saying, but I am on various social media, and I understand how they work, but message boards were here before social media, and they don't really work the same way or do the same things.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #47 on: May 02, 2017, 01:42:18 PM »
I see similarities, but I wouldn't say they are the same either.

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #48 on: May 02, 2017, 01:58:14 PM »
Message boards are social media. Do you find this place a waste of time echo chamber?
I don't see message boards as social media.  I mean, I get what you're saying, but I am on various social media, and I understand how they work, but message boards were here before social media, and they don't really work the same way or do the same things.

I would also say this isn't social media. It's a dedicated online community.

Offline pogoowner

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #49 on: May 02, 2017, 05:05:06 PM »
Social media is what you make of it. The people you follow and interact with are your choice. It can be constructive, educational, entertaining, or a complete waste of time.

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #50 on: May 03, 2017, 04:02:14 AM »
Social media is what you make of it. The people you follow and interact with are your choice. It can be constructive, educational, entertaining, or a complete waste of time.

I think you just nailed the difference on what makes DTF not a social media platform. On social media, I choose who to follow, what kind of content I see, and have the ability to ban whatever pages I choose to no longer care about. On DTF, we have none of those abilities.

Offline cramx3

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #51 on: May 03, 2017, 08:47:32 AM »
Yea my slow process of removing all political posts from facebook has actually worked.  In fact, it worked so well, sometimes Facebook tells me there isn't any new stories to show me  :lol  Which I actually read about, how a lot of people have done that and it's hurting facebook advertisers because less content is going through the system.  But to me, it also shows how powerful facebook is for pushing political agenda.

Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #52 on: May 03, 2017, 11:04:52 AM »
Yea my slow process of removing all political posts from facebook has actually worked. 

I completely deleted my Facebook account. Not signed out....deleted. It was fueled by the political posts but also had to do with how much time I wasted flipping through that place. Can't say I miss it at all. It was nice for a couple uses but all in all...couldn't be happier not having a Facebook account.

I do still use Twitter and just consider DTF my 'facebook'  :lol
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Offline TAC

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #53 on: May 03, 2017, 11:08:52 AM »
Yea my slow process of removing all political posts from facebook has actually worked. 

I completely deleted my Facebook account. Not signed out....deleted. It was fueled by the political posts but also had to do with how much time I wasted flipping through that place. Can't say I miss it at all. It was nice for a couple uses but all in all...couldn't be happier not having a Facebook account.

I do still use Twitter and just consider DTF my 'facebook'  :lol

I've always said that DTF is my Facebook, so I'm with you.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Online Chino

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #54 on: May 03, 2017, 11:17:17 AM »
Yea my slow process of removing all political posts from facebook has actually worked. 

I completely deleted my Facebook account. Not signed out....deleted. It was fueled by the political posts but also had to do with how much time I wasted flipping through that place. Can't say I miss it at all. It was nice for a couple uses but all in all...couldn't be happier not having a Facebook account.

I do still use Twitter and just consider DTF my 'facebook'  :lol

All your stuff is still there, it's just deactivated. Facebook doesn't let you delete.

Offline TAC

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #55 on: May 03, 2017, 11:28:10 AM »
All your stuff is still there, it's just deactivated. Facebook doesn't let you delete.

Really? That's fried.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Online Chino

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #56 on: May 03, 2017, 11:42:59 AM »
All your stuff is still there, it's just deactivated. Facebook doesn't let you delete.

Really? That's fried.

Yeah. It's pretty weak. I guess it's good if you decide after a decade to come back and all of your pictures and friends are still there. I'm sure law enforcement also appreciates the fact that someone can't just wipe their slate clean after doing something stupid.

Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #57 on: May 03, 2017, 11:57:29 AM »
Yea my slow process of removing all political posts from facebook has actually worked. 

I completely deleted my Facebook account. Not signed out....deleted. It was fueled by the political posts but also had to do with how much time I wasted flipping through that place. Can't say I miss it at all. It was nice for a couple uses but all in all...couldn't be happier not having a Facebook account.

I do still use Twitter and just consider DTF my 'facebook'  :lol

All your stuff is still there, it's just deactivated. Facebook doesn't let you delete.

Well. I've deactivated in the past. The delete feature is there if you dig deep enough. When you deactivate your basically just logged out and can log back in. When you choose to delete they ask if 'youre' sure'....then when you click yes there is a two week grace period to make sure you want to because they let you know that you will not be able to access anything associated with that log in account again...you'd have to re-register and create a new account. After that two weeks you can't log on with whatever account info. you had before. So, in essence....yeah...it's deleted.

I'm sure it's all still there on a server somewhere but as far as me trying to log in with my old account info....it's gone. If I want to 'do' Facebook again I'd have to create a whole new account.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #58 on: May 03, 2017, 12:20:47 PM »
All your stuff is still there, it's just deactivated. Facebook doesn't let you delete.

Really? That's fried.

Yeah. It's pretty weak. I guess it's good if you decide after a decade to come back and all of your pictures and friends are still there. I'm sure law enforcement also appreciates the fact that someone can't just wipe their slate clean after doing something stupid.

They need to do that for legal liability reasons and reasons relating to legal obligations to preserve and retain records.  It may seem stupid to Average Joe Citizen, but they are exposing themselves to potential legal problems if they do not do so.
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Offline jasc15

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #59 on: May 04, 2017, 07:21:30 PM »
Their debates got pretty hot and the documentary cites this as the precursor to the cable news shows and their partisan commentary. 

That actually sounds not only reasonable, but something we should have more of: people discussing and debating differing viewpoints.
Not so fast.  At one point, Buckley got so amped up that he threatened to punch Vidal in the face (for being called a Crypto Nazi) on a live televised debate.  That haunted him for years, and stained his reputation.  These were two very well educated and well read guys, but their bouts often degraded into high-brow name calling.

Offline Stadler

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #60 on: May 05, 2017, 07:42:21 AM »
Their debates got pretty hot and the documentary cites this as the precursor to the cable news shows and their partisan commentary. 

That actually sounds not only reasonable, but something we should have more of: people discussing and debating differing viewpoints.
Not so fast.  At one point, Buckley got so amped up that he threatened to punch Vidal in the face (for being called a Crypto Nazi) on a live televised debate.  That haunted him for years, and stained his reputation.  These were two very well educated and well read guys, but their bouts often degraded into high-brow name calling.

Vidal had that effect on people; didn't that happen between him and Norman Mailer, as well?   If memory serves, it was on the Dick Cavett show, and Mailer was pretty much in the wrong on that one, but still. 

Offline El Barto

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #61 on: May 05, 2017, 08:08:15 AM »
All your stuff is still there, it's just deactivated. Facebook doesn't let you delete.

Really? That's fried.

Yeah. It's pretty weak. I guess it's good if you decide after a decade to come back and all of your pictures and friends are still there. I'm sure law enforcement also appreciates the fact that someone can't just wipe their slate clean after doing something stupid.

They need to do that for legal liability reasons and reasons relating to legal obligations to preserve and retain records.  It may seem stupid to Average Joe Citizen, but they are exposing themselves to potential legal problems if they do not do so.
FB's compliance with data retention laws doesn't seem stupid to me. Data retention laws do, though.
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Offline TAC

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #62 on: May 05, 2017, 03:21:20 PM »
There's laws against deleting personal accounts?
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline El Barto

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #63 on: May 08, 2017, 12:23:33 PM »
There's laws against deleting personal accounts?
Data retention laws aren't about you or I deleting our stuff. It's about your ISP, search engine and websites you visit being required to keep your data so the government can see it. Every once in a while congress tries to enact a national requirement so Comcast will keep everything for two years, because Won't Somebody Please Think of the Children! For the most part it no longer matters, though, and I suspect that's the last thing LEO wants at this point. Amazon and Google will keep your data for years anyway and Uncle Sam doesn't have to jump through legal hoops to get it. If data retention were enacted into law there would no doubt be all sorts of annoying constitutional protections getting in their way. Besides which, the NSA has it all anyway.

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Offline Ben_Jamin

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #64 on: May 18, 2017, 09:16:22 AM »
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Offline Stadler

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Re: Bill O'Reilly Is Out At Fox News
« Reply #65 on: May 18, 2017, 09:43:11 AM »
What are your thoughts about this?

http://www.latimes.com/business/hollywood/la-me-roger-ailes-dies-20170518-story.html

Sad that someone died.   He changed the game with respect to the role of television as part of the news process.   He'll likely be more known for the allegations against him than his accomplishments, but so be it.