2017 NFL thread v. Patriots Dynasty

[El Barto]

On the lighter side of sports news. In an unusual display of class the Cowboys cut Lucky Whitehead on Monday after reports surfaced that he was wanted for shoplifting and no-showing at his arraignment. The day after they cut him it comes out that it was a bit of mistaken identity. Dude hadn't done anything wrong at all. "Well, we wanted to cut him anyway." 

[PowerSlave]

On the lighter side of sports news. In an unusual display of class the Cowboys cut Lucky Whitehead on Monday after reports surfaced that he was wanted for shoplifting and no-showing at his arraignment. The day after they cut him it comes out that it was a bit of mistaken identity. Dude hadn't done anything wrong at all. "Well, we wanted to cut him anyway." 

I seen that the other day. I wonder if he would have any recourse?

[Destiny Of Chaos]

Jerry Jones is a clown.

[Dublagent66]

Jerry Jones is a clown.

You just figured that out?   

[DragonAttack]

On an even more lighter side,

https://www.sbnation.com/2017/7/27/16050256/nfl-nipple-ring-david-irving-training-camp-cowboys

Nobody, but nobody, ever grabs you there in a game or practice.

Question:  did his teammate get called for holding, or a personal foul?

(as to the Ravens.....what looked like a semi-reasonable chance of getting to ten wins this season fades week by week)

[Stadler]

I think that focusing on someone's haircut is rather foolish. Some very recent players in the league have sported some abnormal hair styles. Troy Polamalu, anyone?

However, if he were to focus on his image as far as how he's perceived then I can understand the sentiment even though I think that it's mis-placed. Personally, I have no issue with anything that he's done. He chose to protest peacefully, and he excersized a constitutional right in a non-violent manner. A lot of the times that I hear people bashing him for it it sounds like hypocrisy. There are felons and criminals on every roster in the NFL, but I hardly hear a single word about those players unless one of them decides to beat the shit out of their wife in an elevator.

Are we that sensitive as a society that we can't withstand a sports figure taking a knee during our anthem? I think that it reflects much more poorly on us as a nation than on him as a player.

I'm with Bosk on this 100%, but I have to note:  I think this is part of the problem with the internet (I say figuratively).   Mike Vick is certainly no brain surgeon, but he's no dummy, either, and I don't at all think he meant - literally - "the haircut".   And that's part of the problem here.   I don't at all like the contrived apologies - they are a check box on the PR "Image Restoration Checklist"^TM and are about as sincere as Peter Criss's "I love you!"'s after Beth on tour.   But we - the consumer - have put these people in that position.   If the "internet" (I guess it's a thing now, according to Yahoo! "News", since they repreatedly refer to the "Internet" as if it is a living, sentient being) would take a collective breath and actually think about ALL the permutations of how Vick said that before they jump down his throat and try for their 75 seconds of fame, we wouldn't have this problem.   I'm not saying the "Internet" is wrong or that Michael Vick is right, but it seems like in cases like this we don't even bother to consider whether they MIGHT be.   

There are a handful of things that I would entrust Michael Vick to know more than me about - torturing dogs, weed, outrunning a defensive end that is almost as fast and twice my size, waking up on Monday not being able to feel my toes - and public image is one of them.   

Almost as much as I hate the "faux apology", I hate this Twitter-fed idea that our public figures are one-dimensional caricatures, and are either saints, right about all things (Bruce Springsteen; John Mellencamp) or devils, who are evil incarnate in all ways (Trump, Vick, Gene Simmons).   It's just not accurate, and we all suffer for the simplification.

[PowerSlave]

I think that focusing on someone's haircut is rather foolish. Some very recent players in the league have sported some abnormal hair styles. Troy Polamalu, anyone?

However, if he were to focus on his image as far as how he's perceived then I can understand the sentiment even though I think that it's mis-placed. Personally, I have no issue with anything that he's done. He chose to protest peacefully, and he excersized a constitutional right in a non-violent manner. A lot of the times that I hear people bashing him for it it sounds like hypocrisy. There are felons and criminals on every roster in the NFL, but I hardly hear a single word about those players unless one of them decides to beat the shit out of their wife in an elevator.

Are we that sensitive as a society that we can't withstand a sports figure taking a knee during our anthem? I think that it reflects much more poorly on us as a nation than on him as a player.

I'm with Bosk on this 100%, but I have to note:  I think this is part of the problem with the internet (I say figuratively).   Mike Vick is certainly no brain surgeon, but he's no dummy, either, and I don't at all think he meant - literally - "the haircut".   And that's part of the problem here.   I don't at all like the contrived apologies - they are a check box on the PR "Image Restoration Checklist"^TM and are about as sincere as Peter Criss's "I love you!"'s after Beth on tour.   But we - the consumer - have put these people in that position.   If the "internet" (I guess it's a thing now, according to Yahoo! "News", since they repreatedly refer to the "Internet" as if it is a living, sentient being) would take a collective breath and actually think about ALL the permutations of how Vick said that before they jump down his throat and try for their 75 seconds of fame, we wouldn't have this problem.   I'm not saying the "Internet" is wrong or that Michael Vick is right, but it seems like in cases like this we don't even bother to consider whether they MIGHT be.   

There are a handful of things that I would entrust Michael Vick to know more than me about - torturing dogs, weed, outrunning a defensive end that is almost as fast and twice my size, waking up on Monday not being able to feel my toes - and public image is one of them.   

Almost as much as I hate the "faux apology", I hate this Twitter-fed idea that our public figures are one-dimensional caricatures, and are either saints, right about all things (Bruce Springsteen; John Mellencamp) or devils, who are evil incarnate in all ways (Trump, Vick, Gene Simmons).   It's just not accurate, and we all suffer for the simplification.

I think that I touched on that when I mentioned the perception of his image. Mike certainly had to rebuild himself in full view of the public, and you'll get no argument from me that his knowledge about that subject is miles beyond mine. In fact, I'm in favor of someone in his position being able to rebuild their life, and I would have said that even prior to him playing for my favorite team. God knows that if any of you would ever see my criminal record that there's a couple of blemishes on it that don't exactly cast me in a favorable light, either. There's nothing on there that is at the level of the crime(s) that he was convicted of, but I have to believe in the ability of someone to rehabilitate themselves, or I would be able to have zero faith in myself.

However, I would maintain that Colin Kaepernick's actions have been overblown by some in our society. I'm not saying that applies to either of you gents. In fact, I welcome the fact that we can disagree with each other peacefully on the subject, and exchange our ideas on it in a civil manner. Our ability to do that is one of the things that are at the heart of this subject. That, unfortunately, isn't always the case with this subject in general with the public overall.

[bosk1]

However, I would maintain that Colin Kaepernick's actions have been overblown by some in our society.

Well, sure.  I think, arguably, his problem is not one of repairing himself as much as repairing his image.  And I think that is what Vick was mostly getting at.  Regardless whether any of us, and "us" includes Michael Vick for purposes of this discussion, subjectively feel Kaep has personal flaws that need to be repaired, I think it's important to distinguish that what I think Vick was getting at is:  In order to repair his image, and thus make himself marketable to a team, he needs to do X. 

[DragonAttack]

People really care, and discuss, what the dog killer etc.  thinks?

Next thing you know, Pete Rose and ARoid will be giving their opinions about baseball on Fox........
(green text for the line above)

[King Postwhore]

Fuck showed remorse and went through the steps and that was the real message he was trying to get across.

[bosk1]

Fuck showed remorse and went through the steps and that was the real message he was trying to get across.

[TAC]

Fuck showed remorse and went through the steps and that was the real message he was trying to get across.

What version of Autocorrect is that? How can I get it?

[King Postwhore]

 

I swear it was auto correct!

Vick!  Vick!


I've got to look before I hit send.  lolo

[PowerSlave]

I've called someone a Fuck before as an insult. I just thought it was your pet name for him 

[King Postwhore]

 

Nope.  What he did was atrocious, but he did show remorse, went to jail, came out and did community service for animal shelters ect... and that's all you can ask for to give someone a second chance.

How he communicated that about Kap was poorly executed but I get what he meant.

[DragonAttack]

^
(Not shouting, just commenting)

Ron Mexico did indeed do all that was asked of him after he was caught.  He served his time, he did this, he did that, etc., etc., and good for him.

But, from HS on he was a <expletive deleted>.   On a personal note, I care <zero about what he says or does.

Ray Rice was blacklisted from the league, Kaepernick seems to be in the same mold.  But they let Mr. Mexico back into the league.

As to what you called me an auto correct illogical sorry but Siri cannot understand 'whestahwant'

[King Postwhore]

 

[PowerSlave]

Ray Rice was blacklisted from the league, Kaepernick seems to be in the same mold.  But they let Mr. Mexico back into the league.

I was on board with your post until this sentence. I completely fail to see how anyone can equate Ray Rice's actions with CK's actions. That's not to say that people shouldn't find CK's actions objectionable. I can understand why they do even if I disagree with their reasoning. However, one of them committed a violent crime while the other one peacefully protested. I don't understand how they can "be in the same mold".

[TheCountOfNYC]

Ray Rice was blacklisted from the league, Kaepernick seems to be in the same mold.  But they let Mr. Mexico back into the league.

I was on board with your post until this sentence. I completely fail to see how anyone can equate Ray Rice's actions with CK's actions. That's not to say that people shouldn't find CK's actions objectionable. I can understand why they do even if I disagree with their reasoning. However, one of them committed a violent crime while the other one peacefully protested. I don't understand how they can "be in the same mold".

[KevShmev]

Ray Rice was blacklisted from the league, Kaepernick seems to be in the same mold.  But they let Mr. Mexico back into the league.

I was on board with your post until this sentence. I completely fail to see how anyone can equate Ray Rice's actions with CK's actions. That's not to say that people shouldn't find CK's actions objectionable. I can understand why they do even if I disagree with their reasoning. However, one of them committed a violent crime while the other one peacefully protested. I don't understand how they can "be in the same mold".

They are in the same mold in the sense that they had too much baggage to be worth rostering.  Yes, the baggage was very different, but baggage is baggage, and if you have too much of it, you had better be so good that it doesn't matter.  Ray Rice wasn't.  Neither is Kaepernick.

[King Postwhore]

Don't forget dwindling play.  That makes the baggage worse.

[hefdaddy42]

A point to consider: it isn't Kaep's action (kneeling during the anthem) that infuriated many people.  Rather, it was who he is/what he looked like and the reason he gave for his action.

I think that if the golden boy Tom Brady (or some other similar fine upstanding example of All-American-ness, like Aaron Rodgers or whomever) performed the same ACTION (kneeling during the anthem) and gave a different REASON for it (say, protesting the poor treatment some veterans receive from the VA), the outcry would have been much less.

Be that as it may, one thing I found really tiresome during the whole thing was the assumption that his actions were disrespectful to "the troops", as if the flag and the anthem only represented the military and soldiers, and no other facet of American life.

[King Postwhore]

If he was playing at the level early in his career he wouldn't receive the flack he did.


No doubt.

[KevShmev]

It seems like most people still bitching about Kaepernick not having a job in the NFL have a political agenda, which is clouding their view.

[King Postwhore]

I wonder if he still asking for start on money?

[KevShmev]

Nobody knows, because he never says. But he sure spoke up awfully quick when Vick made the hair comment last week.  I am not sure Kaepernick even wants to play football anymore, but it's clear that he wants to be a martyr.

[hefdaddy42]

It seems like most people still bitching about Kaepernick not having a job in the NFL have a political agenda, which is clouding their view.

Hard to not see a political agenda when the Ravens signed Dave Olson, late of the Kansas City Phantoms of the Champions Indoor Football League, rather than sign Kaep.

Just sayin'.  You can't complain about people seeing politics when politics is there to be seen. 

Kaep definitely isn't elite.  But there are just as definitely a lot of shitty QBs getting signed in the league. 

[Destiny Of Chaos]

It seems like most people still bitching about Kaepernick not having a job in the NFL have a political agenda, which is clouding their view.

Hard to not see a political agenda when the Ravens signed Dave Olson, late of the Kansas City Phantoms of the Champions Indoor Football League, rather than sign Kaep.

Just sayin'.  You can't complain about people seeing politics when politics is there to be seen. 

Kaep definitely isn't elite.  But there are just as definitely a lot of shitty QBs getting signed in the league.

The Ravens' plan was to only carry Joe Flacco, Ryan Mallett and maybe Dustin Vaughn into the regular season roster. Olson was signed because they needed a warm body for training camp so that Mallett and Vaughn weren't having to throw everything.

If either Flacco or Mallett went down LONG TERM, then yes, the Ravens would be wise to sign Kaepernick from a football stand point, but them signing Olson over Kaepernick for training camp mop up duty should not be construed as a slight to Kaepernick.

We still don't know what Kaepernick is asking for in terms of salary, but we do know that the Ravens are cash-strapped. If he came out and said that he's willing to play for the veteran's minimum for a year to get on a roster and prove himself, things might be different.

The political/sensational side of this should not be understated. Sure the Ravens, (and other teams) have guys who have said or done things far worse than Kaepernick "did" (Google Suggs Bleach). But Kaepernick pissed off a lot of people, with his peaceful protest, his wearing cop pig socks in public, and wearing a Castro t-shirt. A lot of owners look at that and say, thanks but no thanks. If Brady or Rodgers did something so outlandish, maybe things would be different given their skillset, but then again, Brady and Rodgers don't ever seem to put themselves in that sort of situation.

As a Baltimore Ravens football fan and a human being, I would like to enter 2017 with Flacco and Kaepernick on the team. I was initially outraged by his peaceful protest, but as I thought on it, and talked with others, what he did was fine, and certainly within his rights as an American citizen.

[KevShmev]

Do any of these shitty QBs come with the baggage that Kaepernick does?

I'll hang up and listen.

[hefdaddy42]

They come with the baggage of not being any good.

[TAC]

 



I think if Kaep did these things off the field, that would be fine, but no owner, or team, wants that kind of thing on their dime. Not while in Uniform. He represents the team on the field. What he does off the field is represent himself.

[KevShmev]

Great post, DOC.

You reap what you sow, and Kaepernick has no one to blame but himself if he ends up not getting a job again in the NFL.

Besides, he would be a TERRIBLE fit for the Ravens offense.  Like Mark Schlereth (a great, hard-nosed analyst who pulls no punches and never has any agenda) said recently, if you sign Kaepernick as your backup, you have to then have your first team practicing a completely different offense to run in case the starter gets hurt and Kaep has to play.  You can't just plug him into your existing offense.

[Destiny Of Chaos]

Thanks, and great point. Of all of the ways to look at this situation, I overlooked one's fit into the offensive system.... kind of important!

[KevShmev]

A little bit, yeah.

[King Postwhore]

Like I've said before. Owners are willing to deal with outspoken players if the skills are top notch.  I don't think he's put the best effort because of the demise of SF.  That owner destroyed the franchise and Kap suffered for it but he let his focus get away from football and now no owner is willing to take a chance.


Should he get a chance?  Yes but I think he did some damage to his career.