Poll

How will it Sound?

It will sound great, making you forget that it's not the DT squad playing it.
27 (20.1%)
It'll sound alright, but there will be 'something' off a tad
91 (67.9%)
It's gonna be a trainwreck
16 (11.9%)

Total Members Voted: 134

Author Topic: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour  (Read 210731 times)

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Online Adami

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Re: Predictions for MP's Shattered Fortress Tour?
« Reply #245 on: February 12, 2017, 01:26:52 PM »


I'll grant you that poor quality vids aren't always a great way to make a judgement, but I really can't agree with this mentality that seeing it in person gives you an objective view on what happened, and a video can never be seen as worth judging. People who see things in person almost always say it's amazing, perfect or sublime and then when they rewatch it (even in amazing quality) they realize all the stuff they just didn't notice because of the energy at the time. Meanwhile, a bad video is only worth ignoring if it's REALLY bad quality. None of the videos posted here are such bad quality that we can't possibly make a judgment from them. Might that judgment change if a high quality video is released? Of course! But we lack that. And short of not having any discussion whatsoever, this is the best we can do.

Totally agree.  It's always easy to overlook or not care about flaws when caught up in the euphoria of the live show.  Heck, Neal Morse completely butchered his own guitar solo in Draw the Line when I saw them 2 1/2 weeks ago, but I was having so much fun, I couldn't have cared less.

I think another great example of this is Metallica's show in Demark that Het tried to stop. If you see the vids, he literally sounds like a barking dog. He sounded so bad that he told the audience they deserve better, but they loved it so much they told him to keep going, and I bet if he hadn't said anything, a lot of those people would have left the show thinking he sounded great.
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Offline Nick

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Re: Predictions for MP's Shattered Fortress Tour?
« Reply #246 on: February 12, 2017, 01:29:26 PM »
Man, if I were at home and not still on vacation it would take up all my time responding to some of the silliness in this thread. My ONLY complaints in an otherwise AMAZING set were that I wish they would have only used two guitarists at a time, and I wish Daniel didn't spend half of his song looking down at lyrics. Performance wise though everyone nailed it.
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Offline ClairvoyantCat

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Re: Predictions for MP's Shattered Fortress Tour?
« Reply #247 on: February 12, 2017, 01:35:46 PM »
he literally sounds like a barking dog.

Is that not the norm for Metallica?  (not in a bad way)

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Predictions for MP's Shattered Fortress Tour?
« Reply #248 on: February 12, 2017, 01:37:53 PM »
Man, the one time I saw Metallica ('97 or '98), the concert the was so loud that he could have barked like a dog the entire show, and no one would have been the wiser. :lol :lol

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Re: Predictions for MP's Shattered Fortress Tour?
« Reply #249 on: February 12, 2017, 01:39:09 PM »
he literally sounds like a barking dog.

Is that not the norm for Metallica?  (not in a bad way)

........no.
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Offline ariich

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Re: Predictions for MP's Shattered Fortress Tour?
« Reply #250 on: February 12, 2017, 01:41:01 PM »
Meanwhile, a bad video is only worth ignoring if it's REALLY bad quality. None of the videos posted here are such bad quality that we can't possibly make a judgment from them.
Disagree really quite strongly. Very loud concerts almost always create a lot of distortion on microphones which aren't designed for those sorts of volumes, like on phone cameras. And one of the ways that can be most keenly noticed is in vocal pitch/volume. This happens again and again and again and yet people for some reason use it as evidence of bad live vocals for basically every singer in the world.

With these ones, the TGP vid is the least bad of the bunch but still somewhat distorted, but the TDS and TROAE ones are awful.

And the argument that "we don't have anything better so we'll just make judgements based on these" is very silly.

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Offline Nick

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #251 on: February 12, 2017, 01:45:10 PM »
Answer to an much earlier question, Eric handled pretty much all of the solos, and was essentially the lead guitarist of the bunch.
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Online Adami

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #252 on: February 12, 2017, 01:45:34 PM »
What we have is fine. We can clearly tell the pitch/tone of voice in the video. The distortion is not a problem in these videos (can't speak for the TROAE one, since I haven't seen it), but all of the comments about the Haken guy are coming from a fine quality video. Not anything below professional is worth disregarding.

And the argument isn't silly at all BECAUSE what we have is fine. If we had nothing but truly terrible quality vids, you'd be right. But my point was that what we have is enough and saying "no judgments without a professionally filmed recording" is silly.
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Offline ariich

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #253 on: February 12, 2017, 01:45:52 PM »
Answer to an much earlier question, Eric handled pretty much all of the solos, and was essentially the lead guitarist of the bunch.
From the TDS video posted it looks like the three of them took it in turns for the unison at the end.

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Offline KevShmev

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #254 on: February 12, 2017, 01:50:14 PM »
What we have is fine. We can clearly tell the pitch/tone of voice in the video. The distortion is not a problem in these videos (can't speak for the TROAE one, since I haven't seen it), but all of the comments about the Haken guy are coming from a fine quality video. Not anything below professional is worth disregarding.

And the argument isn't silly at all BECAUSE what we have is fine. If we had nothing but truly terrible quality vids, you'd be right. But my point was that what we have is enough and saying "no judgments without a professionally filmed recording" is silly.

Agreed, especially since professional recordings are almost always touched up, fixed, etc.

But I will cut ariich some slack here, since I think the Haken singer is his cousin or something.  I'd be sticking up for a family member, too. :coolio

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #255 on: February 12, 2017, 01:54:59 PM »
But I will cut ariich some slack here, since I think the Haken singer is his cousin or something.  I'd be sticking up for a family member, too. :coolio
:lol Nah I don't really know Ross that well. And as I said the TGP recording is the least bad one of the three.

And I'm not talking about touched-up professional recordings, I'm just talking about good quality mics that don't distort. This has bugged me for ages - we get it with JLB all the time.

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #256 on: February 12, 2017, 02:06:24 PM »
Totally get that. I still don't think the videos for TGP were at that level. I think the quality wasn't great, but it was good enough to tell what was happening accurately.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I also didn't say the dude sounded bad by any means, just that he wasn't a great choice for the songs.
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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #257 on: February 12, 2017, 02:17:51 PM »
No again the TGP vid wasn't too terrible, though it was still distorting here and there. The TDS vid was shoddy though and you did also comment on DG's singing. :P

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #258 on: February 12, 2017, 02:27:01 PM »
Just to be clear I understand you correctly: a bad distorted recording just doesn't sound bad and distorted. It alters vocal pitch also? Serious question because I never heard of it before.
Must've been Kwyji sending all the wrong songs.   ;D

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #259 on: February 12, 2017, 02:28:50 PM »
There are TRoAE vids too?.. I couldn't find them anywhere...
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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #260 on: February 12, 2017, 02:37:20 PM »
Quote
I wrote all five of these songs with the intention of them being performed from start to finish

Portnoy's talking about the lyrics right? Might be misleading for people who don't know how the band wrote music when Portnoy was a member.

https://loudwire.com/mike-portnoy-shattered-fortress-not-new-band-project-is-event/?trackback=tsmclip

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Offline SwedishGoose

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #261 on: February 12, 2017, 02:39:35 PM »
A little bummed that it was just MP + Haken + Eric Gilette and a few singers but would still have loved to see it.
Don't feel like travelling too long for this though.

Soo sad that this was never done with MP in DT... oh well I guess a cover version of it is better than none at all.

But from what I understand this will never be officially released so I will never get to see or hear it properly.

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #262 on: February 12, 2017, 02:49:37 PM »
A little bummed that it was just MP + Haken + Eric Gilette and a few singers but would still have loved to see it.
Don't feel like travelling too long for this though.

Soo sad that this was never done with MP in DT... oh well I guess a cover version of it is better than none at all.

But from what I understand this will never be officially released so I will never get to see or hear it properly.

Would Portnoy be able to release it as an unofficial bootleg or was that only permissible while he was in Dream Theater?
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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #263 on: February 12, 2017, 02:56:10 PM »
Answer to an much earlier question, Eric handled pretty much all of the solos, and was essentially the lead guitarist of the bunch.
From the TDS video posted it looks like the three of them took it in turns for the unison at the end.

Yeah, Eric handled all the solos but they traded off on the TDS unison (which seems a bit cruel :lol) and there were a couple other spots where I think it would normally be a guitar + keyboard unison but they would have either Rich or Charlie playing the unison along with Eric and Diego.
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Offline ClairvoyantCat

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #264 on: February 12, 2017, 03:07:50 PM »
A little bummed that it was just MP + Haken + Eric Gilette and a few singers but would still have loved to see it.
Don't feel like travelling too long for this though.

Soo sad that this was never done with MP in DT... oh well I guess a cover version of it is better than none at all.

But from what I understand this will never be officially released so I will never get to see or hear it properly.

Would Portnoy be able to release it as an unofficial bootleg or was that only permissible while he was in Dream Theater?

He'd need their publisher's permission

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #265 on: February 12, 2017, 03:11:57 PM »
A little bummed that it was just MP + Haken + Eric Gilette and a few singers but would still have loved to see it.
Don't feel like travelling too long for this though.

Soo sad that this was never done with MP in DT... oh well I guess a cover version of it is better than none at all.

But from what I understand this will never be officially released so I will never get to see or hear it properly.

Would Portnoy be able to release it as an unofficial bootleg or was that only permissible while he was in Dream Theater?

He'd need their publisher's permission

There's an interview out there where MP said he wouldn't record/release anything. That it's too big a legal nightmare.
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Offline Mosh

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Re: Predictions for MP's Shattered Fortress Tour?
« Reply #266 on: February 12, 2017, 03:26:33 PM »
That seems exaggerated. Maybe someone who understands the copyright laws better can step in, but how is it that different from DT releasing a covers album? Or even PSMS doing a DVD that includes DT songs. Is it just that he doesn't want DT to earn any royalties?

I'd imagine it's pretty hard to just go from TDS to TROAE since they're in different tunings.
It really isn't that big of a deal though, TROAE can easily be played on a 7 string.
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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #267 on: February 12, 2017, 03:32:21 PM »
Just to be clear I understand you correctly: a bad distorted recording just doesn't sound bad and distorted. It alters vocal pitch also? Serious question because I never heard of it before.
Not only vocals (happens quite noticeably with guitar sometimes too), but yeah distortion can affect pitch (and also volume, obviously, as the different sounds compete for limited audio space).


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Re: Predictions for MP's Shattered Fortress Tour?
« Reply #268 on: February 12, 2017, 03:45:03 PM »
TDS

https://www.facebook.com/groups/nealmorseforum/permalink/380144832365639/

WOW!! AWESOME!!!!

WTF? Did the singer go offstage halfway through and grow a beard? :lol
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #269 on: February 12, 2017, 04:01:25 PM »
So basically it was Haken covering DT with MP on Drums and Eric Giellete as lead.
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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #270 on: February 12, 2017, 04:39:25 PM »
Musically, both TDS and TROAE were quite good.
TDS felt like it was going to fall apart at a few points with some misunderstandings of the time sig changes, but overall it was impressive that they managed such a full on song as well as they did. The singer was definitely the weak link with a lot of flat notes.
TROAE held together better, and the vocalist did an OK job considering.

I'm not disappointed by the fact this was basically Haken + MP. I don't believe they could have managed these songs as well as they did with a collection of unrelated musicians, as amazing as they may have been individually.
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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #271 on: February 12, 2017, 04:40:11 PM »
Where's the TROAE vid?
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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #273 on: February 12, 2017, 04:46:47 PM »
Hard to tell in the video, but are all of the guitarists playing Petrucci guitars?



Also this vocalist seems to fit the music a lot better than Daniel and the Haken dude. (see that Ariich? I said something positive)


Also, I just realized that of the singers that did sing, Daniel might have sounded really good on Repentance.
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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #274 on: February 12, 2017, 04:58:28 PM »
Hard to tell in the video, but are all of the guitarists playing Petrucci guitars?

Yeah, I believe so. From what I saw of the NMB sets on the cruise I think Eric normally plays one of the JP 7 string models, but Rich and Charlie definitely don't play those normally. I'm just assuming it's a tone thing, but I did think it was a little odd.
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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #275 on: February 12, 2017, 05:15:58 PM »
I don't know about Charlie but I remember Rich was playing JP guitars up until the Mountain era. I'm guessing for the Haken guys it was more out of homage than anything else.
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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #276 on: February 12, 2017, 05:33:26 PM »
Haken guys used JP models for their 7-string stuff before they switched to full Strandberg 8-string mode.

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #277 on: February 12, 2017, 05:39:59 PM »
TDS felt like it was going to fall apart at a few points with some misunderstandings of the time sig changes,

I did not notice this at all. I thought they pulled it off one hundred percent instrumentally.

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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #278 on: February 12, 2017, 05:46:48 PM »
TDS felt like it was going to fall apart at a few points with some misunderstandings of the time sig changes,

I did not notice this at all. I thought they pulled it off one hundred percent instrumentally.

Yeah, I think Blob was about to fall apart at a few points. :P
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Re: MP's Shattered Fortress Tour
« Reply #279 on: February 12, 2017, 05:52:41 PM »
TDS felt like it was going to fall apart at a few points with some misunderstandings of the time sig changes,

I did not notice this at all. I thought they pulled it off one hundred percent instrumentally.

Right before "All your sins will only..." MP made a little mistake with the time signature, although they quickly fixed it.... but apart from that, I didn't notice anything else either..
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