Author Topic: Star Trek: Thread Space 9  (Read 36719 times)

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Offline soupytwist

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1540 on: January 10, 2018, 05:08:02 AM »
Also Frakes is really whoring himself at the minute.

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1541 on: January 10, 2018, 05:11:15 AM »
Whoring? It's called getting work.




Not that I know much about work, but apparently it's a thing people do to make money.
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Offline soupytwist

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1542 on: January 10, 2018, 06:06:58 AM »
Whoring? It's called getting work.

Those are hardly mutually exclusive!   ;D

Anyway was meant as tongue in cheek (or dick in mouth) I like Frakes, it's a shame his chance to direct more movies was killed with the awful Thunderbirds movie, and quite a lot of his TV directing work since ST has been on low budget/crap shows.  Is he going to be doing anymore Orville/Disco work, you know?

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1543 on: January 10, 2018, 06:15:52 AM »
Oh god, please don't call it Disco! :lol


I get the feeling that him directing an episode of STD was token fan-service to bring in fans, just like the string of "executive producer" credits etc they handed out like candy to ex-Trek people when the show was first being announced, all of which amounted to nothing. They might throw him another episode in S2 for the same reason.

I could definitely see Orville getting him again though, as they've maintained that strong Trek connection throughout. They've had him, and Robert Duncan McNeill. Who's left out of the Trek actor directors? Roxanne Dawson, Levar Burton, they could make a season of it!
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Offline soupytwist

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1544 on: January 10, 2018, 06:23:25 AM »
Oh god, please don't call it Disco! :lol

Yeah, fair point.   I deserve a slapping for that.

Who's left out of the Trek actor directors? Roxanne Dawson, Levar Burton, they could make a season of it!

SHATNER!

Offline El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1545 on: January 10, 2018, 08:37:33 AM »
Oh god, please don't call it Disco! :lol


I get the feeling that him directing an episode of STD was token fan-service to bring in fans, just like the string of "executive producer" credits etc they handed out like candy to ex-Trek people when the show was first being announced, all of which amounted to nothing. They might throw him another episode in S2 for the same reason.

I could definitely see Orville getting him again though, as they've maintained that strong Trek connection throughout. They've had him, and Robert Duncan McNeill. Who's left out of the Trek actor directors? Roxanne Dawson, Levar Burton, they could make a season of it!
It's easier to ask who didn't direct an episode. Troi, Data, Kira, Janeway, Seven, and Chakote seem to be about the only ones. It's interesting to look at their directorial resumes. Picard did mostly bad ones. Tim Russ only directed one episode, but it was the very good Living Witness where he demonstrated some talent. Worf and Cisko both seemed to be far better at directing than acting, hitting mostly long balls. I'd say they're both more consistent than Tores, Paris, and Geordi.

Worf:
DS9: In the Cards (1997) Inquisition (1998) When It Rains... (1999)

ENT: Two Days and Two Nights (2002)

Cisco:
DS9: Tribunal (1994) The Abandoned (1994) Fascination (1994) Improbable Cause (1995) Rejoined (1995) Body Parts (1996) Ties of Blood and Water (1997) Far Beyond the Stars (1997) The Dogs of War (1999)
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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1546 on: January 10, 2018, 08:54:24 AM »
I didn't realize Brooks directed any/many episodes. Actors often direct a episode of a show they're in for the hell of it, but often don't pursue it further. It's a wonder that Brooks directed so many episodes of DS9, then never directed anything else. If you look at some of the ones already mentioned, they've gone on to have quite successful directing careers outside of Trek, doing a lot of major mainstream shows.
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Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline soupytwist

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1547 on: January 10, 2018, 09:10:45 AM »
I'm amazed anything directed by Brookes came out coherent let alone good!

Offline El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1548 on: January 10, 2018, 09:25:42 AM »
I didn't realize Brooks directed any/many episodes. Actors often direct a episode of a show they're in for the hell of it, but often don't pursue it further. It's a wonder that Brooks directed so many episodes of DS9, then never directed anything else. If you look at some of the ones already mentioned, they've gone on to have quite successful directing careers outside of Trek, doing a lot of major mainstream shows.
I don't think it's really for the hell of it. I know there's a ST Director's school, and they pick and choose who gets to give it a shot. I think Tuvok had to ask and ask and ask. My hunch is that if you're a no-name ST actor, McNeil or Briggs, for example, you very likely use it to add another option to your career. It's the diehard ac-tors' that only want to act, very likely Brooks, who don't view it as a future path.

In any case, I agree with Soupytwist. I was surprised he cranked out some very good episodes. I also figure if they gave you one of the last five of DS9, Brooks and Dorn both, they're pretty happy with your ability.
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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1549 on: January 10, 2018, 09:44:13 AM »
I didn't realize Brooks directed any/many episodes. Actors often direct a episode of a show they're in for the hell of it, but often don't pursue it further. It's a wonder that Brooks directed so many episodes of DS9, then never directed anything else. If you look at some of the ones already mentioned, they've gone on to have quite successful directing careers outside of Trek, doing a lot of major mainstream shows.
I don't think it's really for the hell of it. I know there's a ST Director's school, and they pick and choose who gets to give it a shot. I think Tuvok had to ask and ask and ask. My hunch is that if you're a no-name ST actor, McNeil or Briggs, for example, you very likely use it to add another option to your career. It's the diehard ac-tors' that only want to act, very likely Brooks, who don't view it as a future path.

I meant "for the hell of it" as in they have the option, so they give it a try, but didn't necessarily have any intention of directing as a career goal beforehand. I'm talking about the actors who'll direct one episode, and that's it (not specifically talking Trek). It wasn't meant to be analyzed. :lol
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Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline soupytwist

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1550 on: January 11, 2018, 02:51:49 AM »
So the recent Black Mirror episode USS Callister.  The online rumours are starting of a stand alone TV show, not sure myself - the concept worked as a standalone, but it would basically be set in a game world - also would we still have any real world story?  and there is noway Brooker would commit to writing a series, so new writers would need to be found....I'd watch it - but my expectations wouldn't be too high.

If Brooker has more story to tell then a sequel as part of the next batch of Black Mirror episodes would probably be enough.

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1551 on: January 11, 2018, 03:04:09 AM »
These don't sound like reliable rumours to me. It was totally designed a standalone parody/homage episode and that's it. There's no way you can continue that story and keep what made the episode work.
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Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1552 on: January 15, 2018, 12:31:54 AM »
I thought they were going to kill off both gay characters in back to back episodes for a minute there. :lol
I got really annoyed with the hacky cinematography reusing the exact same zoom into the ship from outside trick being used like 3 times within a very short span of time. WE GET IT. FANCY CGI.
The Andorians looked ok. I wish they'd resist the urge to add random shit on the face every time they bring back a race, but at least they were instantly recognizable unlike the Klingons. I think the other guy was a Tellarite? Looked ok. They were never a featured race anyway. Did they even appear after TOS with that budget mask?
Really lame making the emperor that awful actress from the first couple of episodes. Not just because of her shitty acting, but because it makes the whole thing feel small and narrow. What a coincidence the emperor of the entire Terran empire happens to be one of the closest people to Michael and also bringing back a dead character. Yawn.
Not sure how I feel about mirror universe Sarek and his goatee. Pretty cheesy giving every evil Vulcan a goatee, but then again the entire mirror universe is cheesy at its core.

That said, these last two episodes have been more passable than the first half of the season, at the very least because there's less established in the mirror universe for them to shit on canon quite as hard.
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Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline soupytwist

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1553 on: January 15, 2018, 01:33:28 AM »

Really lame making the emperor that awful actress from the first couple of episodes. Not just because of her shitty acting, but because it makes the whole thing feel small and narrow. What a coincidence the emperor of the entire Terran empire happens to be one of the closest people to Michael and also bringing back a dead character. Yawn.

That's how the mirror universe has always worked.  The entire idea that everyone's family tree is the same in the mirror universe where everything is different is daft - yeah everyone's parents/grandparents etc still met and shagged at the very same time as the normal universe to create the same child......OK :)    As I said after last weeks episode I was quite pleased Discovery embraced the utter cheesiness (I agree with your choice of term) of the mirror universe rules.

As for the episode - it was OK, not as good as the last few.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2018, 03:18:03 AM by soupytwist »

Offline YtseJam

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1554 on: January 15, 2018, 03:08:03 PM »
That said, these last two episodes have been more passable than the first half of the season, at the very least because there's less established in the mirror universe for them to shit on canon quite as hard.

I liked the first half of the season a lot and didn't think I would at all. The first episode of the second half was a little hard for me to absorb but the second one was better. I just hope it doesn't end up being like the walking dead.

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1555 on: January 15, 2018, 03:12:19 PM »
I'm not a Star Trek fan but I just figured I'd share with you all. There's a guy I follow sometimes on YouTube who sits and just talks about various nerdy topics, video games and films and shows most geeks would enjoy. He's huge on Star Trek and has gone over all of Voyager and is working on DS9 and TNG. He's also got videos talking about every film under the Ruminations playlist. https://www.youtube.com/user/Archengeia/playlists

I enjoy his work because I like very long YouTube videos that discuss subjects in great detail and I've watched tons of his stuff before so I imagine being a huge Trekkie he's got a lot of worthwhile things to say, maybe someone here will enjoy them too.

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1556 on: January 15, 2018, 10:46:09 PM »
That said, these last two episodes have been more passable than the first half of the season, at the very least because there's less established in the mirror universe for them to shit on canon quite as hard.

I liked the first half of the season a lot and didn't think I would at all. The first episode of the second half was a little hard for me to absorb but the second one was better. I just hope it doesn't end up being like the walking dead.

The first half of STD actually reminded me a lot of Fear The Walking Dead. Latest series in popular franchise, not good, characters I don't care about at all, badly written forced drama etc. At least I've seen some improvement in STD. Not holding my breath on FWTD or TWD though. :lol
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Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline soupytwist

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1557 on: January 16, 2018, 05:53:22 AM »

The first half of STD actually reminded me a lot of Fear The Walking Dead. Latest series in popular franchise, not good, characters I don't care about at all, badly written forced drama etc. At least I've seen some improvement in STD. Not holding my breath on FWTD or TWD though. :lol

Season 2 of Discovery starring Jeffrey Dean Morgan as Q. 

Offline El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1558 on: January 17, 2018, 10:35:36 AM »

The first half of STD actually reminded me a lot of Fear The Walking Dead. Latest series in popular franchise, not good, characters I don't care about at all, badly written forced drama etc. At least I've seen some improvement in STD. Not holding my breath on FWTD or TWD though. :lol

Season 2 of Discovery starring Jeffrey Dean Morgan as Q.
Oh, for fuck's sake. The mirror universe thing that apparently isn't dreadful had me almost ready to watch this. Then they go and do something else to annoy the shit out of me. They should write an episode where Kang, the gorn, Apollo, and that chick from Andromeda team up to fight Trellain, Parmen, and Nomad for control of Emeniar 7. Tomalak can be the surprise spoiler for the 4th act.
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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1559 on: January 17, 2018, 10:38:29 AM »
souptwist was just making a joke since we were talking about TWD.
And I just realized that he was already in an episode of Enterprise as a Xindi.
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Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline YtseJam

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1560 on: January 17, 2018, 04:44:56 PM »
Off subject, I just finally saw the finale to Voyager this morning for the first time... It just ends and that's it. Did they abruptly pull the plug on that series? I never got into Voyager until recently.

Offline El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1561 on: January 17, 2018, 06:13:49 PM »
Off subject, I just finally saw the finale to Voyager this morning for the first time... It just ends and that's it. Did they abruptly pull the plug on that series? I never got into Voyager until recently.
They knew the end was coming for a while. I think seven seasons was pretty much the established norm so they knew it'd be their last. Blob and I have discussed this a few times and the ending didn't bother me, though it could have been a better episode. TNG didn't really end, as the very next morning after the poker game would just be the same banal shit as usual for all of them. DS9 was the opposite, where everything changes at the end. However, they were able to make the series finale essentially 6 episodes long, so they had no problem spending a full hour doing an epilogue. VOY was like DS9, in that their story is over and they begin a new one, but it wasn't serialized. They had two hours to wrap everything up. They could make a one hour episode and spend the second telling how Chakote gets a job at the academy, Paris opens a night club, and Kim becomes XO on some ship somewhere, ending with a celebratory toast to friendship. Or, they could make a good 2 hour episode, and leave us to fill in the blanks. Like I said, I don't have a problem with that, but the episode should have been better.
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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1562 on: January 17, 2018, 08:55:12 PM »
Yeah, those series were all intended to go 7 series, so they knew it was the end well in advance.
I think Endgame is a great standalone episode, but it does give blue balls as a finale for that payoff of getting home. It's more a criticism of what it isn't, rather than for what it is.
DS9 will always be the benchmark of a perfect finale to me. They gave themselves enough time to wrap up every arc in a satisfying way.
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Offline Adami

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1563 on: January 17, 2018, 09:02:23 PM »
Voyager didn't have a great finale, but it was....fine. It was great and then just ends, but doesn't actually get bad.


Enterprise, on the other hand, is my example of the worst actual ending to a show I've ever seen (that I can think of). I say actual ending to eliminate shows that just stopped and didn't get a real ending.
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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1564 on: January 17, 2018, 09:52:31 PM »
I remember hearing about how bad the Enterprise finale was and thinking "oh I'm sure it's not that bad, it's just internet bitching" but nope, it was pretty fucking bad.
The two parter before that makes a much better ending, even if it's not intended as an actual finale.
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Offline Adami

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1565 on: January 17, 2018, 10:22:42 PM »
I remember hearing about how bad the Enterprise finale was and thinking "oh I'm sure it's not that bad, it's just internet bitching" but nope, it was pretty fucking bad.
The two parter before that makes a much better ending, even if it's not intended as an actual finale.

Yea, every time I do a rewatch (not terribly often), I skip the final episode. It's so much better, but it's still a bit dirty knowing that it exists.
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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1566 on: January 17, 2018, 10:30:31 PM »
I've never done a rewatch of S4, except for In a Mirror Darkly I think. Actually, S3 is the only one I've rewatched.
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Offline Adami

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1567 on: January 17, 2018, 10:46:36 PM »
I've never done a rewatch of S4, except for In a Mirror Darkly I think. Actually, S3 is the only one I've rewatched.

I've done a few, not many.

I actually tried to do a HUGE rewatch in chronological order.

Enterprise - TOS - TAS - TOS movies - TNG - DS9 - Voyager (with the appropriate overlaps).

I didn't make it past TOS. I just don't have that same love for it that Barto has.
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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1568 on: January 17, 2018, 11:17:03 PM »
I never watched the series in order, I just went through each series individually in no particular order. I didn't even watch TOS in airing order, I started off by watching fan favourites first. Not a good idea in retrospect when I got to the remainder. :lol

I still haven't watched any of TAS. One day.
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Offline Adami

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1569 on: January 17, 2018, 11:21:38 PM »
I saw one episode of TAS. The story was actually very very cool but I just couldn't get past the animation.

I doubt there'll be any money in it, but I would be totally cool if they just completely re-animated the show in a much better way (even if it loses that ultra low quality 70's charm). Keep the story and voice work identical, just re-do the animation and I'm in.
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Offline soupytwist

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1570 on: January 18, 2018, 02:27:30 AM »


Enterprise, on the other hand, is my example of the worst actual ending to a show I've ever seen (that I can think of).

Dexter  ;D

I could do without the final goodbyes being set in Vic's bar on DS9, and I certainly could do without him singing.  But yeah DS9 mostly nails it's ending. Dukat turning into a computer game final boss is a little silly too.

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1571 on: January 18, 2018, 05:03:16 AM »
Just got into season 5 of TNG. The show really hit it's stride now. Romulan Yar made an appearance and I didn't hate her as much I thought I would when I first saw her.

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1572 on: January 18, 2018, 08:39:09 AM »
I never watched the series in order, I just went through each series individually in no particular order. I didn't even watch TOS in airing order, I started off by watching fan favourites first. Not a good idea in retrospect when I got to the remainder. :lol

I still haven't watched any of TAS. One day.
I still maintain that there is no proper order for TOS. As much as people bitch about the third season, they're all 3 a mixed bag, some slightly better than the others.

In any case, it's rare for me to watch complete series. I'll watch about 1/2 to 2/3 of each one, sticking with the more enjoyable, or more interesting episodes. If I do that I'll usually go with chronological order. Certainly with DS9, where it matters most.

And I've seen about half of TAS. It's good for background entertainment, but the animation really is a bummer. For the other-worldly stuff it's pretty good. For the main characters not so much. Also, the alternate music is a hoot. Gene Roddenberry didn't want to pay for the original music so he had somebody crank out a cheap facsimile of it. Cheap bastard.

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1573 on: January 18, 2018, 08:56:34 AM »
I still maintain that there is no proper order for TOS. As much as people bitch about the third season, they're all 3 a mixed bag, some slightly better than the others.


True. I can't think of any episode that is necessary to watch before another (maybe there's some example, but I can't recall it). That's pretty typical of the era.
For me, the first half of S1 is weak/spotty at best, the second half is largely killer. S2 is very solid overall, still with the occasional duds planted in there. S3 does have less winners, but the quality of the weaker episodes isn't any weaker than the weaker episodes from the first two seasons though.

And fuck it, I still maintain that Spock's Brain is a good fun episode that's no worse than the average. :lol
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Offline soupytwist

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Re: Star Trek: Thread Space 9
« Reply #1574 on: January 18, 2018, 09:17:46 AM »
And fuck it, I still maintain that Spock's Brain is a good fun episode that's no worse than the average. :lol

I wouldn't go as far as calling it average, but it's totally outlandish story is campy execution at least makes it somewhat fun (same with 'The Way to Eden').  The worst ones are the really boring ones, like 'The Lights of Zetar' and 'That Which Survives' or in Next Gen terms 'Devil's Due' (or any episode where Geordie stalks a woman).