Star Trek: Thread Space 9

[Adami]

Ohhhhh gotcha. Agreed.

Still dumb to put it in the old era.

[BlobVanDam]

Yeah, setting it around TOS (and then shitting all over it) is just as bad.
Had they set it after all of that, they could have had the best of both worlds. They would have had the freedom to come up with any stupid technology they want, and also have the option of occasionally including characters from the TNG-DS9-VOY era naturally without relying on the nostalgia factor. Have a cameo from one of them as an admiral, have someone in command of their own ship for an episode, whatever.

[soupytwist]

One of the more interesting aspects of the two episodes so far is......we still don't really know what or how this show will work.  Basically those two episodes were a prologue, we've not yet seen the 'Discovery' ship, we haven't meet most of the cast/crew - the Captain and the Klingon who looked to be setting up as the main antagonist are both dead (presumably).   I expect the next episode will tell us a lot more about the show going forwards than these first two have.

[BlobVanDam]

I think that setup was a poor idea considering it's behind a paywall in the US and they're trying to hook people in. We haven't even seen the titular ship and its crew yet, or the dynamic of the cast. I have no investment at all in Michael, who so far is a dull and unlikable character who I don't root for at all.

[soupytwist]

I think that setup was a poor idea considering it's behind a paywall in the US and they're trying to hook people in.

Yeah that's weird.  Over here in the UK it's just on Netflix one day after it's shown in the US.

[BlobVanDam]

I believe it's Netflix everywhere but the US (and I think Canada?). I guess they figured that was a better deal for them than trying to sell this to each individual TV market.

[Orbert]

Orbert is suggesting instead of a making Discovery they should make the new show focusing on the old cast. 

No, I'm not suggesting that at all.

I was responding to Rumby's statement that "It would be an implicit admission that they got nothing, and have to cling to the old storylines."  Worf had spin-off potential, and keeping established characters is not the same as clinging to the old storylines.  For some reason, you cut off the part where I said that it doesn't make any sense to do it now.

[soupytwist]

Orbert is suggesting instead of a making Discovery they should make the new show focusing on the old cast. 

No, I'm not suggesting that at all.

I was responding to Rumby's statement that "It would be an implicit admission that they got nothing, and have to cling to the old storylines."  Worf had spin-off potential, and keeping established characters is not the same as clinging to the old storylines.  For some reason, you cut off the part where I said that it doesn't make any sense to do it now.

Sorry my bad. 

[gmillerdrake]

I think that setup was a poor idea considering it's behind a paywall in the US and they're trying to hook people in.

Yeah that's weird.  Over here in the UK it's just on Netflix one day after it's shown in the US.

Yeah. The 'buzz' about the show has done nothing to persuade me to pay to see this. I'll wait the two or three years to watch the two or three season run it has on Its inevitable Netflix resting place

[rumborak]

I'm too much of a ST fan to not shell out the subscription.

[Adami]

I'm a huge Star Trek fan, but I see no reason to pay for this. Sorry.

[BlobVanDam]

I'm too much of a Star Trek fan to reward them for such a poor job of managing the show and franchise.
I'll watch the show, but CBS isn't getting anything from me.

[King Postwhore]

I will not pay at all.   I pay for CBS through my cable.  It's extortion. 

[gmillerdrake]

I will not pay at all.   I pay for CBS through my cable.  It's extortion.

This also. I already 'pay' for CBS programming and now they want some more $$ from me? Not going to give in to it.

[Orbert]

Orbert is suggesting instead of a making Discovery they should make the new show focusing on the old cast. 

No, I'm not suggesting that at all.

I was responding to Rumby's statement that "It would be an implicit admission that they got nothing, and have to cling to the old storylines."  Worf had spin-off potential, and keeping established characters is not the same as clinging to the old storylines.  For some reason, you cut off the part where I said that it doesn't make any sense to do it now.

Sorry my bad. 

No problem.  Your avatar gives me a chuckle every time, thus you get plenty of slack from me. 

[El Barto]

So aside from having a races called Klingon and Vulcan, is there actually anything Star Trek about this? As it stands now, I'm not even interested enough in it to spend 5 minutes steeling it, but if there's potential then I might give it a shot.

[abydos]

I just watched the first episode. It does absolutely nothing for me. Also, who the fuck likes the lens flare rape? Jesus, effin, Abrams, kill me now.

From the pilot, this has not a single blood of Trek in it. I'll give it a shot cos it's scifi but I am not holding my breath. I wish someone capable would just make a Mass Effect show based on the first trilogy.

[ReaperKK]

I haven’t watched he new series but I’ll check it out this weekend. One thing I forgot about my season 2 round up of TNG is that I can’t believe they ended on a clip show.

[Adami]

I haven’t watched he new series but I’ll check it out this weekend. One thing I forgot about my season 2 round up of TNG is that I can’t believe they ended on a clip show.

Writer’s strike. No one’s proud of that pile of turds.

[jammindude]

I haven’t watched he new series but I’ll check it out this weekend. One thing I forgot about my season 2 round up of TNG is that I can’t believe they ended on a clip show.

Writer’s strike. No one’s proud of that pile of turds.

Totally forgot about this. 

However, I would like to put in a plug for Dr Polanski.   I really thought she did a great job.   Yes, Beverly is better, but I honestly don't get the hate for Polanski. 

[Adami]

Both are good, Polaski was a more interesting person, and Crusher was just kind of......there for a long time. She got better over time.

[Orbert]

You guys are both silly.  It's Dr. Pulaski.  I remember that because I went to school with a guy named Joey Pulaski, and his mom was really hot, unlike Dr. Pulaski.  So, uh, yeah that's why I remember the name.

[BlobVanDam]

Pulaski was a salty old bitch. So glad she only survived one season, and and the worst one too.

So aside from having a races called Klingon and Vulcan, is there actually anything Star Trek about this? As it stands now, I'm not even interested enough in it to spend 5 minutes steeling it, but if there's potential then I might give it a shot.

Based on the first two episodes I'd say don't bother, as it's basically the JJ movies in series form. On the other hand, I would appreciate the backup, and being able to agree on something.

[soupytwist]

So aside from having a races called Klingon and Vulcan, is there actually anything Star Trek about this?

Well the doors go SWOOSH!!!

[DougMasters]

So aside from having a races called Klingon and Vulcan, is there actually anything Star Trek about this?

Well the doors go SWOOSH!!!

I honestly don't think it's that far off the mark, I mean it is if you're thinking TNG but there were many points of DS9 and Voyager, and the films that were buried in politics, and war.

The Undiscovered Country to me is one of the best Star Trek had to offer and I wouldn't say discovery was far off from that film. Political intrigue, pushing war, racial unification.

Undiscovered country was a fair bit more intricate and there was some revenge in the mix.

[DougMasters]

One of the more interesting aspects of the two episodes so far is......we still don't really know what or how this show will work.  Basically those two episodes were a prologue, we've not yet seen the 'Discovery' ship, we haven't meet most of the cast/crew - the Captain and the Klingon who looked to be setting up as the main antagonist are both dead (presumably).   I expect the next episode will tell us a lot more about the show going forwards than these first two have.

My biggest fear about where the show is going to go is all the "action" poses I see in the trailer for the next episode, and the sheer absurdity that someone in her position, in any imagination of human military existence, would ever be serving aboard a ship, ever again.

[Adami]

So aside from having a races called Klingon and Vulcan, is there actually anything Star Trek about this?

Well the doors go SWOOSH!!!

I honestly don't think it's that far off the mark, I mean it is if you're thinking TNG but there were many points of DS9 and Voyager, and the films that were buried in politics, and war.

The Undiscovered Country to me is one of the best Star Trek had to offer and I wouldn't say discovery was far off from that film. Political intrigue, pushing war, racial unification.

Undiscovered country was a fair bit more intricate and there was some revenge in the mix.

But those shows earned the war. They built that up and made it about the people involve and the ramifications of war on society.

I mean, if DS9 opened up on the Dominion war, we would have cared way less about it. What made it great was seeing characters you've very much established slowly lose or hold on to their humanity in times of moral ambiguity.

So you can completely ignore all nuance and context and just say "they're both war, so what's the difference?" but then you'll continue to be confused as to why people aren't treating them the same way.

[DougMasters]

I certainly don't want to ignore the context, and would never dream of doing so. That being said, I think there is a small amount of "pretending" among some trek fans, or perhaps it's more like forgetting as a self defense mechanism, that a lot of these elements exist within Star Trek in many different ways, including the JJ Abrams trek which was pretty popular and probably has a lot to do with people's renewed interest in Trek at all. That, and, the history of Klingons being a race of warriors isn't exactly played down in several installments of star trek.

To level with you I didn't find it the most enjoyable experience. It wasn't, IMO the most well executed way to introduce those elements. But I have a hard time saying that it isn't "trek"

[Adami]

And I have a hard time commenting much because I haven't see it. Though that is 100% due to me not wanting to sign up for a service to do so.

I'm a die hard Treky (however you spell that word) but I couldn't finish Into Darkness. Just couldn't. So unless this show somehow gets as horrible as that movie did, I would watch it, had I the opportunity that wouldn't cost me extra money.

[BlobVanDam]

Other Trek had these elements, but they were also built upon a lot of elements that Discovery so far is lacking, so it doesn't have the context to work in the same way it did in previous series.

[El Barto]

So aside from having a races called Klingon and Vulcan, is there actually anything Star Trek about this?

Well the doors go SWOOSH!!!

I honestly don't think it's that far off the mark, I mean it is if you're thinking TNG but there were many points of DS9 and Voyager, and the films that were buried in politics, and war.

The Undiscovered Country to me is one of the best Star Trek had to offer and I wouldn't say discovery was far off from that film. Political intrigue, pushing war, racial unification.

Undiscovered country was a fair bit more intricate and there was some revenge in the mix.

But those shows earned the war. They built that up and made it about the people involve and the ramifications of war on society.

I mean, if DS9 opened up on the Dominion war, we would have cared way less about it. What made it great was seeing characters you've very much established slowly lose or hold on to their humanity in times of moral ambiguity.

So you can completely ignore all nuance and context and just say "they're both war, so what's the difference?" but then you'll continue to be confused as to why people aren't treating them the same way.

That's certainly true, and beyond that it can be said that DS9 wasn't actually about the war, even during the last 3 seasons. It was still Star Trek. They were still dealing with sci-fi type stuff. Half of any of those seasons is still in the same vein as TOS or TNG. The same can be said of ENT's 3rd season; the one everybody liked. Half the episodes dealt with the Xindi and half of them were typical ST type shows. Hell, in the middle of the Xindi story they cranked out probably the best episode of the series which was just about textbook TNG.

The Abrams movies and, from what I gather, this thing aren't about being science fiction. They're about blowing shit up, and the political intrigue that recalls TUC or DS9 is simply there for that end.

[DougMasters]

Other Trek had these elements, but they were also built upon a lot of elements that Discovery so far is lacking, so it doesn't have the context to work in the same way it did in previous series.

Very true, it is only the pilot episode so we'll see what shakes out. It's usually hard to judge a science-fictiony  show on just one opening episode. Here's hoping for the best.

[soupytwist]

One of the more interesting aspects of the two episodes so far is......we still don't really know what or how this show will work.  Basically those two episodes were a prologue, we've not yet seen the 'Discovery' ship, we haven't meet most of the cast/crew - the Captain and the Klingon who looked to be setting up as the main antagonist are both dead (presumably).   I expect the next episode will tell us a lot more about the show going forwards than these first two have.

My biggest fear about where the show is going to go is all the "action" poses I see in the trailer for the next episode, and the sheer absurdity that someone in her position, in any imagination of human military existence, would ever be serving aboard a ship, ever again.

Pretty easy to image afterall this is from a franchise that put Neelix up as a morale officer.   Then there was Wesley 'Mary Sue' Crusher given ensign status, admittedly he did tend to save the enterprise every 3rd episode in the early days

I'm not sure there was much political intrigue in Star Trek to be honest, there was some OK stuff done with the Klingons that spanned several episodes and even crossed shows, but most of the time it was two warring one dimensional neighbouring species being mediated by the federation.  Or a new species (with a obvious flaw) trying to join the federation and being accessed by the incredibly smug federation.  It wasn't exactly Tommy Carcetti running for Major in the Wire!

[BlobVanDam]

I'm not seeing a problem in either of those cases (besides Wil Wheaton just being all around a shitty character ).
However this would at least be in line with rest of the JJ universe, with Star Trek 11 giving Captain Kirk command of the Enterprise after cheating his way onto the ship, getting ejected into space, illegally breaking his way back in via transwarp beaming (which was a dumb idea that should never have been added), being a dick to the captain to incite him to punch him, then assuming command of the ship with no authority. Definitely the kind of guy you want in charge of the flagship of the fleet.

[soupytwist]

I'm not seeing a problem in either of those cases (besides Wil Wheaton just being all around a shitty character ).
However this would at least be in line with rest of the JJ universe, with Star Trek 11 giving Captain Kirk command of the Enterprise after cheating his way onto the ship, getting ejected into space, illegally breaking his way back in via transwarp beaming (which was a dumb idea that should never have been added), being a dick to the captain to incite him to punch him, then assuming command of the ship with no authority. Definitely the kind of guy you want in charge of the flagship of the fleet.

Pike promoted Kirk to first officer before he beamed over to Nero's ship.  And he had kind off proved himself to the crew (along with Sulu) when they disabled the drill.  While it's far fetched*, it's not massively dumb compared to some of the silly stuff that happened in Star Trek : TOS  - the show it's based on. 

* The worst part in ST09 for me is the coincidence of Kirk just happening across prime Spock!

From the little we have seen of Discovery so far I'm not sure I'd put in the JJ style - aside from the annoying lens flare.  Those first two episodes weren't shot though with the quippy dialogue and sense of fun we got from JJ.   Oddly it reminded me of 'Nemesis' most in style.