Portnoy invites the DT guys to play the 12 step with him

[TodJam]

MP is still MP... I like what he does with Winery Dogs, PSMS and others.
But I wish he could keep his mouth shut.

"Shoulda, coulda, woulda, shut up
I wished I kept my mouth shut 'Cause I can't change anything I did..."

[Madman Shepherd]

Here are some more quotes from the Mike Portnoy forum (from user DT2003)

Exactly! Just because the band has made it clear they have no intentions of playing with Mike doesn't mean they are holding a grudge. The band has moved on and there is nothing wrong with that.
 
Now if MP were to reach out to the guys to just say hi and see how they are doing and the guys wanted no part in it, than that would be wrong, but I doubt that has happened.

Mike's response

Uh, don't be so sure….
(at least with a few members…)


I've tried my best…pretty sad…but life goes on...

[Kotowboy]

I......MY......



100% those members are Myung and LaBrie...


This reminds me of " I tried to rejoin the band for the fans ( after they'd gone through all the legal shit with getting Mangini in and filmed the documentary )..But they made it clear the

door was closed...."

He always has to be the victim.

[MirrorMask]

Now if MP were to reach out to the guys to just say hi and see how they are doing and the guys wanted no part in it, than that would be wrong, but I doubt that has happened. [/i]

Well, but still, what's wrong in saying no?

"Hey, 'sup dude, care to join me on a cruise and play the suite?"
"Well, thanks Mike, but in that time we're busy, I don't like cruises, the wife can't take off that time from work... I really wouldn't mind but sorry, I can't just spend a week next April on a cruise"

Is this so horrible? of course if some bandmember would reply "Not in a chance in hell, I hope the boat sinks, screw you" that's different, but I don't see why they should want at all costs to go on a cruise just because it was offered.

[Kotowboy]

I've tried my best…pretty sad…but life goes on...

Sure you keep telling yourself that Mike. Keep telling everyone you're over DT.

[Lynxo]

Dear God, you're bitter.

[KevShmev]

I'm sure he has major regret still over having left the band, and my theory is that the many deaths by music legends in the last year has only punctuated that regret for him, since it's like a reminder that life is short, anyone could go at any time, and he might never get to play with his bandmates of 20+ years again.  I remember the chatter about his tweet about crying after Bowie's death when listening to Lady Stardust from the Ziggy Stardust album, where the chorus is:

And he was alright, the band was altogether
Yes he was alright, the song went on forever
Yes he was awful nice
Really quite out of sight
And he sang all night long

The band was altogether...I can definitely see the line be emotional for any musician who misses a band he used to be in, especially when a legend like Bowie just passed.  It doesn't excuse his passive-aggressive public comments, that he cannot seem to let go of, but I can sort of understand why he feels the way he does.  He would just be better off keeping such comments to himself, but I think he likes keeping his hardcore fans squarely on his side, and comments like some of the ones posted are like throwing red meat to them and always do a good job of making them dig their heels in more to defend him and view DT as the "bad guys," so to speak.  Meanwhile, DT continues to take the high road by saying nothing inflammatory whatsoever.

[TAC]

...and view DT as the "bad guys," so to speak.  Meanwhile, DT continues to take the high road by saying nothing inflammatory whatsoever.

Would you allow that maybe DT are the "bad guys", and maybe that "high road" really isn't that high?

[KevShmev]

No, because I have literally seen nothing that would indicate otherwise.  They have handled everything about this in the best manner possible for nearly six years now.

But hey, if you've got something, I am always willing to listen. 

[TAC]

I don't, but I truly believe that appearances here aren't all that they seem. I think some of MP's comments are fueled by his frustration about their "corporate silence", almost trying to cryptically say that they are not angels in all of this.

[KevShmev]

Well, that's his problem, not theirs. And honestly, their "corporate silence" is the best way to go.  By giving him nothing, they keep themselves out of drama or any possible headlines.  I am sure both DT and their legal team know that Portnoy loves to run his mouth, so if any of them would hang out with him and say anything about Dream Theater, suddenly Portnoy would be posting on Twitter about hanging about with an old friend with the quote "You never know what the future might look like..."  And then all of a sudden Blabbermouth is running a story wondering if DT is going to bring Portnoy back, DT starts getting asked about it, and drama is everywhere.  Their silence is THE best way to go, for the band and for their sanity.

[Kotowboy]

Well, that's his problem, not theirs. And honestly, their "corporate silence" is the best way to go.  By giving him nothing, they keep themselves out of drama or any possible headlines.  I am sure both DT and their legal team know that Portnoy loves to run his mouth, so if any of them would hang out with him and say anything about Dream Theater, suddenly Portnoy would be posting on Twitter about hanging about with an old friend with the quote "You never know what the future might look like..."  And then all of a sudden Blabbermouth is running a story wondering if DT is going to bring Portnoy back, DT starts getting asked about it, and drama is everywhere.  Their silence is THE best way to go, for the band and for their sanity.

It's like Noel Gallagher saying in every single interview that he's never getting oasis back together ( at least not with him in it ).. Every single interview. He literally cannot say "no" enough times.

[TAC]

Well, that's his problem, not theirs. And honestly, their "corporate silence" is the best way to go.  By giving him nothing, they keep themselves out of drama or any possible headlines.  I am sure both DT and their legal team know that Portnoy loves to run his mouth, so if any of them would hang out with him and say anything about Dream Theater, suddenly Portnoy would be posting on Twitter about hanging about with an old friend with the quote "You never know what the future might look like..."  And then all of a sudden Blabbermouth is running a story wondering if DT is going to bring Portnoy back, DT starts getting asked about it, and drama is everywhere.  Their silence is THE best way to go, for the band and for their sanity.

Oh, I completely agree with all of that.

I think my only point is that I wouldn't make any behind the scenes assumptions based on how MP does or how DT doesn't handle it publicly.

[Kwyjibo]

Sometimes I get the feeling that MP is still thinking that the split was more of a temporary hiatus on his side and that the reunion (and kicking out of MM) is inevitable and he's frustrated that it hasn't happened yet. While DT clearly see their future without him and have acted accordingly by not answering or commenting his tweets and postings and statements.

And even after an amicable split the band can decide that they don't want to do anything with MP, maybe not even have contact, and you can't really blame them because it was MP's decision to leave and their decision to carry on. They aren't obliged to anything outside of what was fixed by the lawyers. One may find this sad, one may hope that this changes, one may hope for a reunion or other projects or whatever, but clearly no one is obliged to do anything and crying on the internet is not going to change it. And the longer it takes MP to realize this, the lesser the chances are that anything happens at all.

I really hope MP pulls of a good performance of the 12 step suite and I really hope he gets some good musicians. He should change it up a bit to suit the performers and make it interesting. And I really hope he doesn't make a long birthday speech about DT and what could/should/would have been.

[Polarbear]

Well, that's his problem, not theirs. And honestly, their "corporate silence" is the best way to go.  By giving him nothing, they keep themselves out of drama or any possible headlines.  I am sure both DT and their legal team know that Portnoy loves to run his mouth, so if any of them would hang out with him and say anything about Dream Theater, suddenly Portnoy would be posting on Twitter about hanging about with an old friend with the quote "You never know what the future might look like..."  And then all of a sudden Blabbermouth is running a story wondering if DT is going to bring Portnoy back, DT starts getting asked about it, and drama is everywhere.  Their silence is THE best way to go, for the band and for their sanity.

This sums up the whole issue perfectly.

This MP/DT reunion case has been closed a long time ago, and Portnoy should have better things to do than open this up again..

Portnoy should focus he's energy into finding a lineup, that is able to perform the suite. I would like to see Sherinian, McAlpine, Sheehan and a great singer perform this with him.

[bosk1]

As cool as I thought the 12SS performance was when first announced, Mike's continued antics are really souring me on any desire to hear it, honestly.  Yeah, the music will be cool, and it's nice that it is something that has been so long in the making.  But he cannot seem to restrain himself from publicly attaching negativity to it all at every opportunity.  There comes a point, as with Tate, Axl, etc. that I get to, "Eh, just not interested."  I am rapidly approaching that point.  As others have said, his best course of action would have been to not say ANYTHING about the DT guys.  And if asked directly, he could have just said something like, "It would be really cool to perform it with them, but it's not in the cards right now," and leave it at that.  It's just a shame that he is  becoming so offputting to me that I am losing interest in ANYTHING he is associated with.

[erwinrafael]

I just wish that if he got the DT guys to agree, then post publicly, but if not, just don't say a word about it.

[TAC]

As cool as I thought the 12SS performance was when first announced, Mike's continued antics are really souring me on any desire to hear it, honestly.  Yeah, the music will be cool, and it's nice that it is something that has been so long in the making.  But he cannot seem to restrain himself from publicly attaching negativity to it all at every opportunity.  There comes a point, as with Tate, Axl, etc. that I get to, "Eh, just not interested."  I am rapidly approaching that point.  As others have said, his best course of action would have been to not say ANYTHING about the DT guys.  And if asked directly, he could have just said something like, "It would be really cool to perform it with them, but it's not in the cards right now," and leave it at that.  It's just a shame that he is  becoming so offputting to me that I am losing interest in ANYTHING he is associated with.

Bosk, I totally agree.

And it blows because I have not been remotely interested in anything he has done since leaving DT. Nothing. The closest thing is him filling in for Twisted Sister!!! How sad is that?

And I KNEW that was going to happen as soon as he left. It's the main reason why I was so bummed when he left.

[rumborak]

I think you're grossly overestimating how impossible DT parts are. Sure, they are very difficult for most musicians, but it's mostly the fact that DT was creative enough to write parts that are both complex and musical at the same time.

And just to be tooting my own horn here, here's me playing Glass Prison:

https://youtu.be/0VMrMe8BkGQ?t=85

(conveniently skipping my fuckup at the beginning  )

Mind you, by no means perfect, but we were all normal-working folks, and if we can play this, then some Berklee kid can definitely do a flawless job at it.

[KevShmev]

I don't think playing the material on its own is the same as playing it with the band.  For example, I am sure Portnoy can find three guys who can play the end of This Dying Soul with him, but getting the timing down, especially for three guys who have probably zero history of playing it, will be the tricky part. And if just one of them is off at all in that section, it'll be a train wreck. 

[cramx3]

I honestly think finding people to practice and play with him is the least of the problems here.  He knows a lot of people in the business, I'd imagine he could put together a nice cast of musicians and they will be fine playing the material. 

[TAC]

I honestly think finding people to practice and play with him is the least of the problems here.  He knows a lot of people in the business, I'd imagine he could put together a nice cast of musicians and they will be fine playing the material. 

Right.
They are professional musicians. Youtube is filled with Joe Blows playing DT.

Joe Blow =/= Rumbo!

[fadetoblackdude7]

I understand it's MP's event and it's his party.

But simply looking at it from JLB, JP, JR and JMX's point of views.....they've accepted MM as their new family member and therefore probably wouldn't do ANYTHING DT-related without him.

Sorry if someone said that already, didn't have the time to read every comment lol

[Cool Chris]

Would you allow that maybe DT are the "bad guys", and maybe that "high road" really isn't that high?

Suppose the guys really don't like MP as a person anymore and don't want anything to do with him. That doesn't make them bad people. No one owes anyone their undying friendship. Friends come and go throughout the course of all our lives.

[TAC]

Would you allow that maybe DT are the "bad guys", and maybe that "high road" really isn't that high?

Suppose the guys really don't like MP as a person anymore and don't want anything to do with him. That doesn't make them bad people. No one owes anyone their undying friendship. Friends come and go throughout the course of all our lives.

I think my only point is that I wouldn't make any behind the scenes assumptions based on how MP does or how DT doesn't handle it publicly.

[King Postwhore]

I think the opposite.  DT finally had enough of MP.  Sometimes you live a guy like a brother but you can't take the drama anymore

[TAC]

Get your ass back on the General Discussion side!





(I don't disagree)

[King Postwhore]

Yes Dad.  Lol.

[Mosh]

 

I understand it's MP's event and it's his party.

But simply looking at it from JLB, JP, JR and JMX's point of views.....they've accepted MM as their new family member and therefore probably wouldn't do ANYTHING DT-related without him.

Sorry if someone said that already, didn't have the time to read every comment lol

I think that's pretty much it. It's not so much that there are any grudges or they hate MP or whatever, at the end of the day they just don't want to entertain the idea of MP coming back or give ammo to the "DT was better with Portnoy" crowd. It's the same reason the original Kiss didn't perform together at the Rock  and Roll Hall of Fame a couple years ago. As soon as DT performs with MP, people are going to constantly ask when MP is rejoining the band and there's going to be even more of a "DT without MP isn't DT" sentiment than there already is. They've put a ton of work into validating this current lineup as the definitive version of the band, they aren't going to jeopardize that with a one off performance that, frankly, is going to be all about MP with DT as glorified backing musicians.

Which is unfortunate. If this could be a one off fun performance without any of that baggage, I'm sure they'd all be there.

[PetFish]

...and view DT as the "bad guys," so to speak.  Meanwhile, DT continues to take the high road by saying nothing inflammatory whatsoever.

Would you allow that maybe DT are the "bad guys", and maybe that "high road" really isn't that high?

I know *I* wouldn't allow if we are judging purely on what we, the public, know about the situation.

Are we into their personal lives and all that? Of course we aren't.  So all we have to go on is what's been going on out here in the land of the Internetz and the bitter-mometer is 99% pointing at MP for the way he's acted since the split.  We've barely heard a peep from the DT camp but plenty from MP.

If MP truly wanted things to be better he wouldn't be representing himself the way he has and the whole "well, that's just MP being MP" thing doesn't excuse the behaviour at all.

I *really* thought this would be the best and possibly only way we'd ever get to hear the 12SS by the original members and I'm bummed that it didn't work out but I'm also OK with the reasons for it not happening.

[DarkLord_Lalinc]

Portnoy put DT in a complicated place with his 'harmless' invitation (in my humble opinion), and here's why:

If LaBrie, Myung, Petrucci and Rudess agreed and went to that cruise, the original line-up would be reunited; sparking that eternal flame within MP hardcore fans that reject Mangini in any way possible. 'THIS IS THE TRUE DT! PLS COME BACK!', I can already read comments like those if that were to happen. That would really put MM in a complicated situation.

Mike Portnoy is a clever man, and his wording of situations is a clear example of that. In this matter, as in most matters DT-related in the past few years, his tone has been the following:
I have done everything in my book to be cool with the guys and have a nice reunion, but it's not up to me anymore...the ball is in their court now...not mine...it's them, not me.

That seems sincere (and probably is) of his part, but that's not the whole part of the story. Why make his invitation to DT public? What purpose does it have? To show the fans that he's the one that's cool and that LaBrie and Myung are bitter old men who hate him? I know JR and JP love him dearly (and probably JLB and JM do as well), but they have all the right in the world to be pissed at him for all the MP drama that has lingered in their backs for the past 6 years.

And now back to my original point, now that DT has (somewhat) rejected his invitation, MP stays as the good guy; the one that wanted one little harmless performance of his 12 Suite with his original bandmates, while the other guys look bad to the eyes of the fanatics. That's why I think MP put the band in a complicated position. I love Mike Portnoy and everything he's done in progressive rock, but this feels pretty lame to me. I really think he should have someone overseeing his social media posting, because at this point I think his constant 'sincere' wording is doing him more harm than good.

[Mosh]

Kind of unrelated, but why do some people assume that JM hates Portnoy now? Did I miss something? I keep seeing him brought up along with JLB as the ones on bad terms with MP. JLB is understandable, but haVe JM and Portnoy even mentioned each other since?

[Adami]

Kind of unrelated, but why do some people assume that JM hates Portnoy now? Did I miss something? I keep seeing him brought up along with JLB as the ones on bad terms with MP. JLB is understandable, but haVe JM and Portnoy even mentioned each other since?

Just look at any picture of Myung after the split, you can see the hate and rage and fury in his eyes.

[Darkstarshades]

The canadian SINGER and the korean BASSIST have proven to ME that THEY don't want this reunion possible. I wanted NOTHING but playing FOR THE FANS. And because I am such a good guy I WILL perform THE ASTONISHING completely through LIVESTREAM and make it clear that I am more than JUST a Drummer.

[MirrorMask]

And now back to my original point, now that DT has (somewhat) rejected his invitation, MP stays as the good guy; the one that wanted one little harmless performance of his 12 Suite with his original bandmates, while the other guys look bad to the eyes of the fanatics.

Well, but in the end it's not "one little harmless performance". Jordan or JP being in town when MP is playing and them showing up to play Pull Me Under is a little harmless performance; playing the entire suite needs basically a mini-reunion of rehearsals, and it should take place on a cruise also.

I remember an interview with Petrucci saying something like "Fans always ask these forgotten songs for the setlists, they want Octavarium but I don't play it since years, I'd have to re-learn it by now"... well, isn't The Glass Prison missing from the setlist since years? Petrucci, and maybe not only him, would have to re-learn it along as the other songs as well.

Wether MP is realizing this or not, he's not asking the band to join a party, he's actually asking them to reunite with him, even for a week. And due respect to him since it's his party, but if at all, it should be him to re-join for a one-off performance DT, not the other way around. The only other example that comes into my mind is when Ozzy asked Black Sabbath to play with him when he was, ehm, "retiring" in 1992 - and again, all due respect, Ozzy vs Black Sabbath is a completely different monster than MP vs DT.

Furthermore Ronnie James Dio was in Black Sabbath at the time and he got pissed off and didn't want to do the show (Black Sabbath should have opened for Ozzy) 'cause he knew it would have led to a reunion, and he was actually right. The reunion fell through, but there were talks about it. DT just don't want or need to give Mangini unnecessary bad thoughts.