Author Topic: The X-Men Thread v. (****LOGAN DISCUSSION/SPOILERS****)  (Read 4909 times)

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Offline Accelerando

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The X-Men Thread v. (****LOGAN DISCUSSION/SPOILERS****)
« on: May 03, 2016, 01:46:46 AM »
Well, we have a MCU and a DCEU thread, might as well start one about the original cinematic team up film franchise.

As far as Marvel comics go,  I didn't get into Captain America or Iron Man. It was always X-Men and Spider-Man. So least to say I was more than ecstatic way back when in middle school when the first X-Men movie came out. Seeing Wolverine and Cyclops on the big screen for the first time was just amazing. Then came X2: X-Men United, and which was and still one of the best superhero movies of all time.

This franchise has it's ups and downs, but none more glaring of a flaw than its continuity. I'm pretty sure it was the base for the MCU on what not to do with the continuity of their films. 2014's X-Men: Days of Future Past virtually erased the events of X-Men, United, and Last Stand, and now moving forward with Apocalypse as a sort reboot but not really a reboot. Unfortunately, Days of Future Past is probably the last time we're going see the original cast all together in one film. The third Wolverine spin-off will also be Hugh Jackman's last film we see him as Wolverine. Jackman's Wolverine is like Reeve's Superman. He defined the role, and it's going to be tough to replace him.

So far, I rank all the films as follows

1) X2: X-Men United
2) X-Men: Days of Future Past
3) X-Men: First Class
4) The Wolverine
5) X-Men
6) X-Men: The Last Stand
7) X-Men Origins: Wolverine

« Last Edit: March 06, 2017, 11:11:55 AM by Accelerando »

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2016, 03:50:29 AM »
Love the X-Men!

1. Days of Future Past
2. X2
3. First Class
4. X-Men
5. Wolverine
6. X-Men: Last Stand
7. X-Men Origins: Wolverine

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2016, 09:03:54 AM »
I think most people will probably agree on which films are the bottom two.

That being said, although I have liked the X-Men films to varying degrees, I'm not in love with any of them.  I would rather watch any MCU film and any Spider-Man film (or Blade film) than any of the X-Men films.

Fantastic Four?  Get that shit out of here.
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Offline Adami

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2016, 09:06:24 AM »
Hmmm, I'll just exclude Last Stand and Origins for obvious reasons.

1. Days of Future Past
2. Deadpool
3. X-Men
4. X-2
5. Wolverine
6. First class
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Offline bosk1

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2016, 09:10:40 AM »
Honestly, these all just kind of blur together in my mind as a big jumbled mess.  The only ones that kind of stand out as being different (and not necessarily in a good way) are the one where they were young and meeting for the first time (that was First Class, right?) and the Wolverine one that was pretty good up until they made Wade turn into some invincible teleporting mutation.
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Offline BlackInk

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2016, 09:50:22 AM »
I've never really been a fan of the X-Men. I feel pretty much the same about them as bosk does, except I know them all well enough to rank them.

01 - X-Men: Days of Future Past
02 - X2: X-Men United
03 - X-Men: First Class
04 - X-Men: The Last Stand (never had as much against this one as everyone else seems to)
05 - The Wolverine
06 - X-Men
07 - X-Men Origins: Wolverine
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Offline bosk1

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #6 on: May 03, 2016, 10:01:13 AM »
I really loved the comics when I was younger.  Like Accelerando, the various mutant story-lines (X-Men, X-Factor, New Mutants, etc.) and various Spider Man comics were my go-to books that I followed relentlessly.  I followed other titles from time to time, but those were my main books that were automatic buys.  So that said, the movies really disappointed me.  The first few, at least, weren't bad.  But they just didn't live up to expectations.
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Offline Adami

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2016, 10:14:12 AM »
I think the problem with the movies is how they handled they characters (most of them anyway).

They all seem to really get Professor X and Magneto, and to a lesser extent, Wolverine, but that was kind of it.

Cyclops
Jean Grey
Colossus
Rogue
Ice Man
Pyro
Sabertooth
Mystique (especially the new one)
etc etc

were all handled awfully. They generally just take the name/appearance and sometimes powers of the mutant and just make up the rest. These characters were popular for a reason, and when you completely re-write them, you're undermining that.

It's also the reason I'm really not pumped for Apocalypse. They look like they totally got everyone wrong again. I could be wrong and I'm open to being wrong, but the trailers didn't get me excited. Mystique is leading the x-men? Storm is a horseman? Angel is a punk teen cage fighter? Meh.

Just do the characters justice. It's honestly not terribly hard. They're great characters.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #8 on: May 03, 2016, 10:19:36 AM »
Yeah, I largely agree with that.  But I did like how they handled Sabertooth, at least in the Wolverine film; I can't remember whether he showed up elsewhere.  Actually, the more I think about that Wolverine movie, the more I remember really liking it up until they did the thing you just mentioned and got really goofy with Wade's character. 
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Offline Adami

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #9 on: May 03, 2016, 10:50:06 AM »
Yeah, I largely agree with that.  But I did like how they handled Sabertooth, at least in the Wolverine film; I can't remember whether he showed up elsewhere.  Actually, the more I think about that Wolverine movie, the more I remember really liking it up until they did the thing you just mentioned and got really goofy with Wade's character.

As much as I still hate that damn movie, I will agree with Liev played a very cool Sabertooth. My original post was referring more to his role in the first X-Men movie where he was just a random henchmen for Magneto with no lines (at least none that I can remember). If they ever decided to bring back Liev in the next Wolverine movie (which I think should have at least a cameo by Deadpool) then I am all for that.
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Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #10 on: May 03, 2016, 12:10:12 PM »
They generally just take the name/appearance and sometimes powers of the mutant and just make up the rest. These characters were popular for a reason, and when you completely re-write them, you're undermining that.

Just do the characters justice. It's honestly not terribly hard. They're great characters.

You just summed up Fox's approach to superhero films.  Exactly why I don't care for them.  They apparently don't care very much about the actual characters involved.  They just care about the bang-zoom!
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Offline kingshmegland

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #11 on: May 03, 2016, 12:16:45 PM »
I've enjoyed the last 2 movies and it's pulled my interest back into this franchise.
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Offline Adami

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #12 on: May 03, 2016, 12:44:12 PM »
They generally just take the name/appearance and sometimes powers of the mutant and just make up the rest. These characters were popular for a reason, and when you completely re-write them, you're undermining that.

Just do the characters justice. It's honestly not terribly hard. They're great characters.

You just summed up Fox's approach to superhero films.  Exactly why I don't care for them.  They apparently don't care very much about the actual characters involved.  They just care about the bang-zoom!

With the notable exception of Deadpool.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #13 on: May 03, 2016, 12:51:55 PM »
:who:
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Offline ariich

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #14 on: May 03, 2016, 12:53:00 PM »
1) X2: X-Men United
2) X-Men: Days of Future Past
3) X-Men: First Class
4) The Wolverine
5) X-Men
6) X-Men: The Last Stand
7) X-Men Origins: Wolverine
You know what, I think this is probably my exact ranking, except perhaps swap Wolverine and the first X-Men around. And you've left out Deadpool.

So I guess something like this.

1) X2: X-Men United
2) X-Men: Days of Future Past
3) X-Men: First Class
4) Deadpool
5) X-Men
6) The Wolverine
7) X-Men: The Last Stand
8) X-Men Origins: Wolverine

Offline Accelerando

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #15 on: May 03, 2016, 02:14:39 PM »
But is this new Deadpool part of the X-Men canon? I don't think that was ever confirmed.

Offline Adami

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #16 on: May 03, 2016, 02:17:40 PM »
But is this new Deadpool part of the X-Men canon? I don't think that was ever confirmed.

Yes it is. It just takes place in modern times, while the current x-men movie is set in the 80's.

They just took the piss out of the whole franchise (making fun of the X-Men actors, timelines etc.) but it's still part of it.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #17 on: May 03, 2016, 02:18:04 PM »
I'm not really sure there is official X-Men "canon" anymore.  Or if there is, I'm not sure anyone really has a clear answer as to what it is and isn't.  Part of that is because Fox hasn't really cared about keeping things consistent and having continuity, and part of it is because all bets are off once you start dealing with time travel and alternate timelines and stuff anyway.  But the bottom line is that they are so all over the place that I don't think the idea of "canon" even really applies.  They will just do what they want in any given moment, and if it meshes, great.  If it doesn't, that's fine with them too.
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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #18 on: May 03, 2016, 02:21:47 PM »
But is this new Deadpool part of the X-Men canon? I don't think that was ever confirmed.

Yes it is. It just takes place in modern times, while the current x-men movie is set in the 80's.

They just took the piss out of the whole franchise (making fun of the X-Men actors, timelines etc.) but it's still part of it.

But the movie only had the budget for 2 X-Men! :lol
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Offline Adami

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #19 on: May 03, 2016, 02:22:56 PM »
But is this new Deadpool part of the X-Men canon? I don't think that was ever confirmed.

Yes it is. It just takes place in modern times, while the current x-men movie is set in the 80's.

They just took the piss out of the whole franchise (making fun of the X-Men actors, timelines etc.) but it's still part of it.

But the movie only had the budget for 2 X-Men! :lol

I loved that part. Apparently ad libbed by Reynolds.
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #20 on: May 03, 2016, 06:37:25 PM »
Oh The X Men !!


Thought this was a thread for MTF Trans. :neverusethis:

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #21 on: May 04, 2016, 12:49:28 AM »
Just got tickets to see Apocalypse on the 18th! Really hyped.

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #22 on: May 04, 2016, 05:53:43 AM »
Adami is spot on about the characters.  However, despite all of that, the movies (for the most part) have still been entertaining.  I'd say they did an ok job with Jean Grey and Mystique in the original franchise.  Still not really sure why Sebastian Shaw was chosen as the lead antagonist in First Class, though it was pretty well written.  Beast has been well done in the new franchise.  So, I'd say they're hit-and-miss (mostly miss) with the character development over the years.

Despite it's flaws, I still really enjoyed Last Stand.

1 - X2
2 - DoFP
3 - X-Men
4 - First Class
5 - Last Stand
6 - The Wolverine
7 - Wolverine Origins (a very distant 7th)

Still looking forward to Apocalypse... and in 3D since it was ACTUALLY SHOT IN 3D!
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Offline Destiny Of Chaos

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #23 on: May 04, 2016, 12:15:28 PM »

1. Last Stand
2. First Class
3. DoFP
4. Origins: Wolverine
5. X2
6. X-Men
7. The Wolverine

Offline OpenYourEyes311

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #24 on: May 05, 2016, 06:34:31 AM »
1. Days of Future Past
2. X-Men United
3. X-Men
4. First Class
5. Origins
6. The Last Stand
7. The Wolverine

I enjoyed all of them to a point. My top 4 are really really good to amazing movies. Origins and Last Stand are okay. The Wolverine was a snooze-fest. I'll have to go through and watch all of them again at some point because I'd love to see if my thoughts about any of them change.

Offline jakepriest

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #25 on: May 06, 2016, 08:29:23 AM »
I have NO idea why people hate Wolverine:Origins. It's certainly much better than the terrible Wolverine standalone.

1. X-Men 2
2. Wolverine: Origins
3. First Class
4. Days of Future Past
5. Last Stand
6. X-Men
7. Wolverine
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Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #26 on: May 06, 2016, 08:37:04 AM »
That is certainly an unorthodox position.
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Offline Zantera

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #27 on: May 06, 2016, 09:05:12 AM »
I have NO idea why people hate Wolverine:Origins. It's certainly much better than the terrible Wolverine standalone.

1. Horrible CGI (Wolverine's claws looking like Roger Rabbit, CGI Xavier, CGI X-Men students running for the chopper)
2. Completely butchering Deadpool
3. Wolverine chopping down the ladder chasing Gambit looking like a scene from Looney Tunes

Point 2 can not be stated enough. The other standalone Wolverine movie opens pretty good and is overall a solid movie until the final fight where it goes off the rails.

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #28 on: May 06, 2016, 09:07:17 AM »
I have NO idea why people hate Wolverine:Origins. It's certainly much better than the terrible Wolverine standalone.

The effects are awful - at times it looks like an early 90s green screen for the background.  What they did to Wade Wilson.  Mind and body control from a green-screen?  Force-fitting Professor X (looking like a young Patrick Stewart) in at the end - which in no way creates the bridge between this movie and x-men (ie, how Charles knows so much about Logan).  Adamantium bullets cause amnesia?

That's just off the top of my head from what I remember when it came out.  I'm sure if I re-watched it, I'd have more reasons to be angry with it.  The main storyline wasn't horrible, but the execution, and some of the major points to the story were flawed.

Edit - :ninja: 'd

The other standalone Wolverine movie opens pretty good and is overall a solid movie until the final fight where it goes off the rails.

Agreed completely.
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Offline jakepriest

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #29 on: May 06, 2016, 10:06:58 AM »
The first time I saw the movie was actually some kind of a leak with most of the CGI not even finished, so that's probably why I don't even mind that it doesn't look that bad since I was used to a much worse version. I don't care for the Deadpool character at all so that's another thing that doesn't really bother me I guess.

Either way I love the first half of the movie so much that I don't care if the second half is a little bit wanky at times.  :lol
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Offline Destiny Of Chaos

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #30 on: May 06, 2016, 10:25:39 AM »
Origins was an awesome movie. They got Sabretooth right and to me, that outweighs the silliness with Deadpool.

The Wolverine was irrelevant and boring.

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #31 on: May 06, 2016, 03:46:05 PM »
The stupidest thing about Origins was the fact that Striker was holding that woman against her will, but the woman had mind control powers and could have just made him let her go.

Offline Adami

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #32 on: May 06, 2016, 03:51:26 PM »
The stupidest thing about Origins was the fact that Striker was holding that woman against her will, but the woman had mind control powers and could have just made him let her go.

I never even considered that. Probably because there was such an abundance of other stupid things about that movie.

It's sad, the opening scene of that movie is so good (not the stuff in the 1800's, but the war collage was awesome. A movie like that would have been amazing. We know how Logan got his metal, let's see him and Victor before that.
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #33 on: May 06, 2016, 03:57:56 PM »
The stupidest thing about Origins was the fact that Striker was holding that woman against her will, but the woman had mind control powers and could have just made him let her go.

I hate things like that in movies where someone has a power and doesn't use it at the most obvious / critical time.

Offline Adami

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Re: The X-Men Thread
« Reply #34 on: May 06, 2016, 03:59:26 PM »
I admit I haven't seen the movie in quite some time, (for good reason) but wasn't she working with Stryker till the end? Or am I confused?
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