What do you want from DT's music?

[RoeDent]

What qualities do you want to hear in a DT song? BLAAGHMETALROOOAR? A more negative attitude in the lyrics?

This should not become a discussion about the following; we already have a thread for that. I'm starting this thread because I'm frustrated somewhat by all the hate that The Astonishing is getting. Especially as everyone was all like "WowOMGthisisamazing!!1!" when it first came out. How the hell can you hate an album with such lovely, melodious, memorable music in it? Those chords should tug at your heartstrings, if you have any. DT still maintain the power to write some of the most moving rock music ever written. Hating music like this is like looking at a flower or a waterfall and going "That's disgusting!"

[Tomislav95]

I want melodies from TA + more guitar riffing (ToT-like). I like ToT as it is but I really think it lacked some good vocal melodies. And I think most of DT albums don't really have memorable vocal melodies... and I'm sucker for those 

[Zydar]

I actually don't know what I want from DT anymore. I should be loving TA, since I requested strong melodies and proggy stuff before the release. But TA doesn't do much for me.

[Logain Ablar]

I'm starting this thread because I'm frustrated somewhat by all the hate that The Astonishing is getting. Especially as everyone was all like "WowOMGthisisamazing!!1!" when it first came out. How the hell can you hate an album with such lovely, melodious, memorable music in it? Those chords should tug at your heartstrings, if you have any. DT still maintain the power to write some of the most moving rock music ever written. Hating music like this is like looking at a flower or a waterfall and going "That's disgusting!"

Do you think there's been a general shift in opinion since TA first came out? My own opinion hasn't really changed much - I still like it as much as I did at the beginning, but I'm not playing it constantly every day like I was. This happens with any new album really.

I can understand people not warming to the concept, or the length, or the shorter strong structures, but IMO the music is still undeniably DT. I applaud them for taking a risk and making an album like this. I think they realise themselves that they won't please all of the people all of the time.

[Mladen]

I want it to be great.

The way The Astonishing is.

I'm starting this thread because I'm frustrated somewhat by all the hate that The Astonishing is getting. Especially as everyone was all like "WowOMGthisisamazing!!1!" when it first came out. How the hell can you hate an album with such lovely, melodious, memorable music in it? Those chords should tug at your heartstrings, if you have any. DT still maintain the power to write some of the most moving rock music ever written. Hating music like this is like looking at a flower or a waterfall and going "That's disgusting!"

Nicely put.

[Enigmachine]

I want it to be great.

The way The Astonishing is.

Yes. DT satisfy my music tastes just fine as is.

[Destiny Of Chaos]

I want DT to keep doing whatever they want. I've never been disappointed with any of their albums. I'm just grateful that my favorite band is still producing music.  I know a few die hard Tool fans, and they haven't had a new album in a decade!

[IDontNotDoThings]

I'm starting this thread because I'm frustrated somewhat by all the hate that The Astonishing is getting. Especially as everyone was all like "WowOMGthisisamazing!!1!" when it first came out.

Pre-release hype: it exists.

[dtvoices94]

I like the more melodic and less balls out metal side of the band.  For me at least, Dream Theater was always heavy progressive rock with some metal sprinkled in.  Train of Thought was great as a one-off but once the metal started dominating, I think the quality dropped.  Not that any of it was terrible, it just wasn't what I preferred from the band.  DT can do what they like..they are and will always be a first day purchase for me.

[TheOutlawXanadu]

I don't hope or expect for anything out of the band. In my opinion, building up expectations always ends up being a bummer. I just want them to continue writing music they enjoy, and hopefully I dig it too.

[Outcrier]

Progressive metal 

[bosk1]

I want DT to keep doing whatever they want. I've never been disappointed with any of their albums. I'm just grateful that my favorite band is still producing music.   

This

[erwinrafael]

I know what I don't want. I don't want them to equate progressive with long songs. Which is sort of what happened with SC and BC&SL.

What I want from them are musical choices that make sense. Which they have been delivering for the most part.

[BlackInk]

I want DT to keep doing whatever they want. I've never been disappointed with any of their albums. I'm just grateful that my favorite band is still producing music.   

This

I guess I agree with the overall point of this if I'm being unselfish and take the band's feelings into consideration. But if I don't, it is now a sad fact that the guys are no longer able to produce music that I enjoy. I've spent a lot of time thinking about it and it's so hard to point out why exactly. There's just nothing to it anymore, every note is just so tame in ways that they just didn't use to be (as much). So I guess that's what I want from DT right now, to stop being so tame in everything they do and produce anything with any kind of emotional resonance.

[rumborak]

It might be an odd thing to say, but maybe acknowledge their age a bit more and not try to be this "grimy" (for lack of a better word) metal band they have been since they signed RR. There is a ton of cool other musical influences they could draw, including, dare I say, jazz and fusion. I for example LOVE the Trial of Tears Holdsworth-y solo, but that was a one time thing and never appeared again.

[erwinrafael]

Well, they drew on Broadway, musical, 80s, swing, tango, Yes, and Queen in their last effort and sounded far from grimy metal stuff in their last album. You still did not like it.

[rumborak]

Well, they drew on Broadway, musical, 80s, swing, tango, Yes, and Queen in their last effort and sounded far from grimy metal stuff in their last album. You still did not like it.

I liked that they were trying actually, and I have high hopes for the next album. TA just didn't come together for me, it was too ambitious. Despite taking 2 years to create, too many aspects where just thrown together haphazardly. IMHO.

[Rickharris1011]

I would love to see them play a little looser in the next release.  Something that explores a more jazzy, improvisational side.  I may just be saying this because I listened to LTE recently - but I think it would be fun to see them explore this direction a little more. 

[Enigmachine]

So I guess that's what I want from DT right now, to stop being so tame in everything they do and produce anything with any kind of emotional resonance.

Not really sure what this means. TA wasn't really that tame.

[Dreamer]

The last 3 albums have been my faves by the band. Good songs, melody with challenging arrangements and exciting instrumental breaks. I think they got the balance about right with DT12.

[MirrorMask]

What I want from DT's music? well, I'll tell you when I hear it!

Elaborating a bit more on the issue... music is an elusive thing. It's art, it's personal preference, it's something that has to touch you. There is no perfect formula, no scientific proof that grants that if you put certain elements in a song, it will turn out a song you love. One of my absolute favorite songs from them is The Mirror, but I'm feeling very meh about This Dying Soul for example.

More generally, I want from Dream Theater, well, Dream Theater's music, nitpicking aside, I must say that I appreciate the very vast majority of their entire body of work. One specific thing I could do without is the random solo section that breaks the flood and the mood of the song, that is the single thing I actually don't care at all for. Metropolis has a very memorable solo section, to make another example Trial of Tears has a long solo section that keeps you "into" the song, but on the later albums we have examples such as The Ministry of the Lost Souls, Endless Sacrifice and Sacrificed Sons when they're singing about a serious issue and then ask me to completely forget about it while I hear them doodling on their instruments for five minutes before going back to whatever was the mood of the song. 

For the rest, I'm absolutely and completely in love with The Astonishing and I hope that this approach, translated into the common structure of a normal album rather than a double-disc rock opera, will be carried out with the next disc. A lot of emphasis on the melody and the freedom to explore different styles and weird song structures; I don't want to be able to listen to a two minutes ballad or an always changing epic with barely repeated parts only if they're on a concept album, I want them to come up with these odd songs in regular albums as well! but I'm willing to embrace with open ears and attitude whatever they will do next time; it's what I do since I became a fan in 1999 anyway.

[BlackInk]

So I guess that's what I want from DT right now, to stop being so tame in everything they do and produce anything with any kind of emotional resonance.

Not really sure what this means. TA wasn't really that tame.

It really is. 98% persent of the thing is just so emotionally neutral. With all the things it does it still manages to say nothing. The one and only exception being the "gabriel has always been..." and "evangeline, I swore to you" parts from The X Aspect. That's the absolutely only part of the entire overly long thing that has any sort of weight to it, lyrically and melodically.

[RoeDent]

That's more a reflection on your own emotional 'sensors', if it does nothing to you. Because the music moves many people, myself included. You absolutely cannot fake the goosebumps, or the way that certain songs just give you that feeling you cannot explain, but you cannot get enough of. It's special.

[BlackInk]

Well yes, obviously.

There is so much music out there that just gives me exactly what I want in those areas, but DT's music just doesn't have it anymore. From my point of view, they have completely lost it in pretty much all areas over the last four albums. That's a really sad thing though since DT is what got me into music on a more serious level in the first place and were the people in the music world I looked up to the most for a long time.

If you get those feelings from TA, then good for you. Although I cannot understand how because it's such an impersonal, non-emotional, musically dull album with either catastrophic and embarrasing lyrics or just fortune cookie wisdom that lacks any sort of passion whatsoever.

[Enigmachine]

So I guess that's what I want from DT right now, to stop being so tame in everything they do and produce anything with any kind of emotional resonance.

Not really sure what this means. TA wasn't really that tame.

It really is. 98% persent of the thing is just so emotionally neutral. With all the things it does it still manages to say nothing.

Emotionally neutral, eh? Cause that is pretty much entirely incorrect even objectively speaking. Saying it 'still manages to say nothing' is also really just an empty criticism that appropriately, means absolutely nothing.

That's more a reflection on your own emotional 'sensors', if it does nothing to you. Because the music moves many people, myself included. You absolutely cannot fake the goosebumps, or the way that certain songs just give you that feeling you cannot explain, but you cannot get enough of. It's special.

This.

BlackInk, it would probably be good for you to not project your own personal disappointment into a perceived lack of quality within the album. Saying that the album "lacks any sort of passion whatsoever" is just plain wrong considering the work and ambition that went into it.

[erwinrafael]

Well yes, obviously.

There is so much music out there that just gives me exactly what I want in those areas, but DT's music just doesn't have it anymore. From my point of view, they have completely lost it in pretty much all areas over the last four albums. That's a really sad thing though since DT is what got me into music on a more serious level in the first place and were the people in the music world I looked up to the most for a long time.

If you get those feelings from TA, then good for you. Although I cannot understand how because it's such an impersonal, non-emotional, musically dull album with either catastrophic and embarrasing lyrics or just fortune cookie wisdom that lacks any sort of passion whatsoever.

TA translates well emotionally if you can relate to the characters. I can relate to almost all the struggles here. From being an introvert plugged into the music to get through the day (Faythe), to having a kid I love so much (Arhys), to bearing the burden of expectations because of my status in the community (Gabriel), TA resonated a lot to me. The lyrics and the music are not dull, because they all made sense. I suspect that they all have a personal resonance to JP and JR as well. It must not be getting to you because you come from a different experience.

[BlackInk]

There are plenty of stories out there about things I haven't experienced personally that I can still relate to and enjoy because they are well told and engaging. But when it reaches the childish levels of naivety that TA does it just loses all relevance to me.

[erwinrafael]

Chldish? Naive? I am glad that I am like that because at least I enjoy more music than you.

[Outcrier]

There is so much music out there that just gives me exactly what I want in those areas, but DT's music just doesn't have it anymore. From my point of view they have completely lost it in pretty much all areas over the last four albums.[/b] That's a really sad thing though since DT is what got me into music on a more serious level in the first place and were the people in the music world I looked up to the most for a long time.

Read my mind.

Or one of us is a clone of the other 

[wideworldofmike]

TA is James finest hour. His performance is so amazing. Future albums I just want to hear Jordan get as weird as possible, break out the slide guitar again, JP to get SUPER HEAVY and bust out crazy solos and I want JM to be FEATURED like crazy, like we all refer to it as the DT bass album. MM to just be of the chain and samples galore and the lyrics to beyond emo. Basically stretch the limits of everyone. EXECPT also I want JL to maybe be in a more focused vocal range, he doesn't have to destroy his voice at this point. We all love his voice. He doesn't have to be all over the pace, just soulful.

Like maybe a 3 song record. A trilogy of epic power. And make it their shortest record ever so they can play plenty of classics on tour.

[red barchetta]

Well, just keep doing what they always do, great music. Hopefully, a good balance of metal and prog, great vocals and harmonies, incredible instrumental stuff, great sound from the instruments, I want to hear more the bass, I want to have goosebumps. TA, as an album, would have been a very good one for me, different than anything done before but still very good. As a double album (I'm calling it like that because of its lenght), they lost me.
I'm sure that if TA would have been my very first DT album, I would have loved it. So guys, I still love you, and yes I like long songs.

[BlackInk]

Chldish? Naive? I am glad that I am like that because at least I enjoy more music than you.

The fuck?

[BlobVanDam]

There are plenty of stories out there about things I haven't experienced personally that I can still relate to and enjoy because they are well told and engaging. But when it reaches the childish levels of naivety that TA does it just loses all relevance to me.

I feel the same (although I wouldn't word it that bluntly). For me the characters are not written well enough to resonate with me regardless of my experiences, and it's overall too simplistic and idealistic for me.
Musically they struck a lot of the right stuff to appeal to me on TA though, but I think they were overly ambitious and ended up with too much musical sameyness, and it's not musically/melodically strong enough to sustain two discs imo, despite containing a lot of great music.
I think the concept album / rock opera approach hindered the album more than it helped it, but if they take the best of what they achieved musically on TA and write a single CD album like that, with lyrics that aren't boxed in to fixed particular story beats, with the lyrical variety of JLB and JM contributing too, they'll be onto a definite winner for me. Or if they want to do something entirely different altogether, that's fine too! Music shouldn't just be a checklist of do's and don'ts.

[metrojam]

I actually don't know what I want from DT anymore. I should be loving TA, since I requested strong melodies and proggy stuff before the release. But TA doesn't do much for me.

After 27 years of love and support for DT, sadly, I have to agree totally with this. No longer have any idea what to expect or wish from the group anymore as I fear that (judging by the last 2 releases) they will never again release a record that will give me goosebumps like I&W and SFAM did. Glad a lot of people can really get something out of TA but for me, it does nothing at all apart from, and I'm really sorry to have to say this, bore me nearly to tears

[Polarbear]

I actually don't know what I want from DT anymore. I should be loving TA, since I requested strong melodies and proggy stuff before the release. But TA doesn't do much for me.

Couldn't have said it better myself...

They can, and should make the music that they are happy with. But my excitement for new DT music, has pretty much disappeared..