Do you agree or disagree with the new "no cameras" rule?

[goo-goo]

I have never seen a band so strict with phones they won't even let you use it during intermission ha one person right in front of me got kicked out for recording in all honesty I wouldn't have boughten a ticket if I didn't see a few videos fans recorded on YouTube since I wasn't nuts about the album

You haven't been to a King Crimson show..LOL..There are stories were Fripp just stops playing..

I like the no camera policy. You enjoy the show way much better than trying to nail the perfect shot/vid.

[cramx3]

What I mean by common sense is "Take some pics here and there, but don't stand with your arm raised the whole damn time" as many others have said. I'm an amateur photographer, and I love to take pictures at concerts; I have always my camera at hand, and I take a lot of pics, but I still enjoy the concert. I singalong, I jump, during songs that really move me I even forget about the camera and stand there in adoration, but I never stay with my camera held high all the time. If the band releases a video of the show after the tour makes no difference for me, I want a visual memory of *my* concert, of what happened when *I* was there.

Pretty much this minus me being an amateur photographer.  Taking pictures or even video clips has never lessened my fun or experience at a concert.  In fact I've filmed clips at other shows where I was jumping, singing, fist pumping and filming all the same time, probably more involved in the concert than most people even while having my camera.  It's a misconception to believe that just because you are trying to get a picture, that you aren't having a blast.

I thought it was the venues' policies, rather than the band's. The Facebook post about it asked us to respect venues' policies on cameras.

I've also edited the thread title, as I'm pretty certain nobody thinks it would be ok to talk on the phone at a gig.

Just so we all know what the band is saying, here is the quote from facebook

It’s great to see photos of fans enjoying themselves at our shows, coming in costume, pre-partying, wearing DT merch, flying the banners of Ravenskill and GNEA, and more. Please be aware however, that each venue has its own rules about cameras and their use.
Please be respectful of each venue’s rules regarding photography at our shows. And always know that you cannot take pictures or video of our live performances. Post photos of yourselves at shows online with the hashtag ‪#‎theastonishing‬, but defer to the venue, please.*
*And remember, Zippy’s there to take your photo with our NOMAC in the lobby of each venue before the show. Thanks!

This implies it is the band's decision.  They say to respect the venue's rules, but you are not allowed to take pics/videos of the band regardless of the venue's policy.  The wording is a bit odd in that it seems like they are pointing at the venue, but then they explicitly say their own policy.

[romanticrocker]

I have never seen a band so strict with phones they won't even let you use it during intermission ha one person right in front of me got kicked out for recording in all honesty I wouldn't have boughten a ticket if I didn't see a few videos fans recorded on YouTube since I wasn't nuts about the album

You haven't been to a King Crimson show..LOL..There are stories were Fripp just stops playing..

I like the no camera policy. You enjoy the show way much better than trying to nail the perfect shot/vid.

Ha now that would be something to remember for a long time

[King Postwhore]

I thought it was the venues' policies, rather than the band's. The Facebook post about it asked us to respect venues' policies on cameras.

I've also edited the thread title, as I'm pretty certain nobody thinks it would be ok to talk on the phone at a gig.

It was posted on the front doors that the band requested the no cell phone rule and it did say "cell phones" 

Also the "hall monitors" did tell us it was the band's wishes.

[romanticrocker]

What I mean by common sense is "Take some pics here and there, but don't stand with your arm raised the whole damn time" as many others have said. I'm an amateur photographer, and I love to take pictures at concerts; I have always my camera at hand, and I take a lot of pics, but I still enjoy the concert. I singalong, I jump, during songs that really move me I even forget about the camera and stand there in adoration, but I never stay with my camera held high all the time. If the band releases a video of the show after the tour makes no difference for me, I want a visual memory of *my* concert, of what happened when *I* was there.

Pretty much this minus me being an amateur photographer.  Taking pictures or even video clips has never lessened my fun or experience at a concert.  In fact I've filmed clips at other shows where I was jumping, singing, fist pumping and filming all the same time, probably more involved in the concert than most people even while having my camera.  It's a misconception to believe that just because you are trying to get a picture, that you aren't having a blast.

I thought it was the venues' policies, rather than the band's. The Facebook post about it asked us to respect venues' policies on cameras.

I've also edited the thread title, as I'm pretty certain nobody thinks it would be ok to talk on the phone at a gig.

Just so we all know what the band is saying, here is the quote from facebook

It’s great to see photos of fans enjoying themselves at our shows, coming in costume, pre-partying, wearing DT merch, flying the banners of Ravenskill and GNEA, and more. Please be aware however, that each venue has its own rules about cameras and their use.
Please be respectful of each venue’s rules regarding photography at our shows. And always know that you cannot take pictures or video of our live performances. Post photos of yourselves at shows online with the hashtag ‪#‎theastonishing‬, but defer to the venue, please.*
*And remember, Zippy’s there to take your photo with our NOMAC in the lobby of each venue before the show. Thanks!

This implies it is the band's decision.  They say to respect the venue's rules, but you are not allowed to take pics/videos of the band regardless of the venue's policy.  The wording is a bit odd in that it seems like they are pointing at the venue, but then they explicitly say their own policy.

But are they the ones who make it where you can't even use it during intermission or is that the venues policy and there's nothing where it says about being able to text during intermission most bands have on the ticket no taking pics or recording but won't stop you if you take out your phone

[cramx3]

I will see them on Saturday so I am not sure, but judging by King's post, it looks like this is clearly DTs decision.

[bosk1]

Just so we all know what the band is saying, here is the quote from facebook

It’s great to see photos of fans enjoying themselves at our shows, coming in costume, pre-partying, wearing DT merch, flying the banners of Ravenskill and GNEA, and more. Please be aware however, that each venue has its own rules about cameras and their use.
Please be respectful of each venue’s rules regarding photography at our shows. And always know that you cannot take pictures or video of our live performances. Post photos of yourselves at shows online with the hashtag ‪#‎theastonishing‬, but defer to the venue, please.*
*And remember, Zippy’s there to take your photo with our NOMAC in the lobby of each venue before the show. Thanks!

This implies it is the band's decision.  They say to respect the venue's rules, but you are not allowed to take pics/videos of the band regardless of the venue's policy.  The wording is a bit odd in that it seems like they are pointing at the venue, but then they explicitly say their own policy.

What they are saying is:  The band's policy is no pictures or video of the band performing.  But on top of that, some venues do not allow cameras at all or have other restrictions and we should respect the venue's policies as well.  Again, the band policy has been in place for quite awhile, although it isn't enforced by every venue.  At other venues, one issue that comes up is that they misinterpret the band's policy and over-enforce, and blame it on the band.  I have personally seen this happen as well.  But the band has no policy on not having phones/cameras at all, and they have no policy about not being able to take pics or video in the venue other than the performance itself.

[King Postwhore]

Bosk1. I should have taken a picture at the front doors that said, and I quote,  "At the band's request".

[bosk1]

Yeah, you should have.  But in lieu of that, feel free to take a pic of the following quote:

At other venues, one issue that comes up is that they misinterpret the band's policy and over-enforce, and blame it on the band. 

[King Postwhore]

That's lawyer speak good sir.  Btw, I had a great time. I just wish I had a few pictures to boast online about on of my favorite bands.

[bosk1]

It's not lawyer-speak.  It's the fact that security at venues aren't the sharpest tools in the toolbox, and don't necessarily understand the band's rules.  The band's official policy has been posted here, and much smarter people than your average security guard still can't seem to grasp it, so it should come as no surprise that your friendly neighborhood, orange vest wearing, concert venue security gorilla may not get it.

[King Postwhore]

I understand it's been a rule. Can we agree it's a poor rule?  Should I sit in at my computer watching a cellphone video of a sow or buy the official 5.1 for 20 buck?  Artists are behind the time on the intellectual property of music. They should look at it as promotion.

I'd like to promote my favorite band online with a few pictures and it saddens me.

[bosk1]

Can we agree it's a poor rule? 

No, not necessarily.  As has been posted in this thread, a good percentage of people think the rule is just fine.

[King Postwhore]

I disagree.   Most are upset of the people who obsess taking pictures or videos, not ones like myself who make sure not to upset others.

[King Postwhore]

Also remember reading this thread it seems except for 1 person, most are older and are not fan of cellphones.  It seems more of a generational thing. I wonder how many younger bands have this same protocol.

[SuperTaco]

Me and two buddies went to a show back in '07 and security at the front row told them to put their phones away. lulz. We got like two crappy pictures and that's it.

At least we will always have the memory.

[Rickharris1011]

Not a fan of this at all.  I'm guessing it has more to do with being a "show" than a "concert" this time around.  I'm pretty sure you are not allowed to take pictures during musical shows.

They were much more aggressive about no phones at this show than any musical I've been to.  When I was at Hamilton I was able to take pictures of the venue/the set before the show started and no one was coming around with flashlights every 2 minutes to look for phones.  Obviously it's out of line to record while the band is performing, but I nearly got thrown out pulling out my phone before the show even started to text a friend that we were in our seats!

Am I the only one who thought the flashlight police were more distracting than a camera would have been?

Anyway - don't want to take away from the fact this was an awesome show and James absolutely crushed it in Boston. 

[red barchetta]

Totally agree. First, it's a good occasion to realize that you can have a life without using your smartphone for a couple of hours.  Second, I'm not sure I would like to see my shows on the net for everyone before the end of a tour. Today's bands are not selling a lot of records for all the reasons we know, let them sell their concerts tickets and dvds.

[BlobVanDam]

Totally agree. First, it's a good occasion to realize that you can have a life without using your smartphone for a couple of hours.  Second, I'm not sure I would like to see my shows on the net for everyone before the end of a tour. Today's bands are not selling a lot of records for all the reasons we know, let them sell their concerts tickets and dvds.

Nobody is passing up on a good gig or DVD because of crappy camera phone live footage on Youtube.

I thought it was the venues' policies, rather than the band's. The Facebook post about it asked us to respect venues' policies on cameras.

I've also edited the thread title, as I'm pretty certain nobody thinks it would be ok to talk on the phone at a gig.

I disagree. If it weren't for phones at gigs, we wouldn't even have Johnny B. Goode.

[Madman Shepherd]

Just got back from a concert (not DT).  I think the rule should be you can put your camera in the air for a grand total of 45 (I'm willing to compromise and say 25-30 )seconds throughout the entire show.  If you are recording video, keep the camera at eye level so you are only blocking your own view.  This is what we did. 

Obviously, many people will not follow this rule so I say ban the damn cameras.  I wish people could be reasonable, but they cannot. 

While we're at it, people need to follow no smoking guidelines, and if you are at a general admission show and have to pee or grab a beer, you lose your spot and will not be allowed back in the front.  If you can waste time standing in line for a fucking beer in the middle of a show, you're obviously not a big enough fan to warrant pushing your way back through the crowd so you can get the spot back that you left for the last 15 minutes.  I guess I can go lenient on bathroom breaks because even hardcore fans should be cut some slack when you really gotta go. 

[Shooters1221]

I think the rule should be you can put your camera in the air for a grand total of 45 (I'm willing to compromise and say 25-30 )seconds throughout the entire show.

How would you monitor or enforce that for a few thousand people?

As a fan, I'm of the... I really don't care about this either way, view.

[Cyclopssss]

I personally thought it was a relief during the last DT show not having twenty/thirty arms go up to video a song. I'm guessing the following tours won't be that strict though.

[rumborak]

I thought it was the venues' policies, rather than the band's.

The Boston venue ushers were super-adamant about pointing out that this is all DT's rule. The venue itself even has a huge permanent poster on the side saying "pictures are fine, please be considerate".

I agree with King, at least for this concert it was excessive. The ushers were pacing up and down the aisles, and would start investigating even if a fan was just folding his/her hands on their legs.

To some degree I understand what they were going for. TA is all performed in theater venues, and the idea is that you're witnessing a play (of some sorts). Proper plays of course have a complete no-camera rule. That said, this just felt like a regular concert, they would have needed to do more to make it play-like. Unless you knew the plot beforehand, the background videos were of no help at all.

[cramx3]

I personally thought it was a relief during the last DT show not having twenty/thirty arms go up to video a song. I'm guessing the following tours won't be that strict though.

Here's the thing, if camera's weren't up in the air, would their arms be instead?  It's actually in an odd way, a form of flattery where if the camera is up, it's something worth seeing again and therefore a memorable moment.  Sure it's annoying if that camera is always up, but that's not even normal, only a couple people try to film extensively during a show.

[BelichickFan]

It's stupid and misguided IMO but it's their choice I guess.  It's free advertising on youtube, it's not like a youtube video would stop someone from buying a DVD.  I just saw Iron Maiden, phone cameras everywhere, youtube videos everywhere.  And lots of great videos to excite fans, generate interest in going to the show and maybe find new fans.

DT is my favorite band and if they're good with keeping their fan base as is good for them, I guess.  But not all of these shows are sold out, they would be well advised to let people see what the shows are.

[cramx3]

It's free advertising on youtube, it's not like a youtube video would stop someone from buying a DVD. 

It's not just free advertising either, if I uploaded a copyrighted DT song, the label is able to claim my video and keep the ad money generated from it (which is likely to be little or nothing unless the video gets 1000+ views) but there is a slight chance for the band (or more likely the label) to actually profit here.

[Dublagent66]

It's a stupid rule that can't be enforced.  I really don't need pics and videos at any show, but you can't stop everybody from doing it.  They are buying the albums and tickets to the shows.  Bands should just let them do their thing.  Everyone and their dog has a camera with them everywhere they go.  Welcome to the 21st century. 

[home]

I think it's a good rule but a little to extreme, I mean taking a few pictures throughout the show should really not be a problem! But having people around you filming the concert can be a bit lame, and for what, some crappy video's?

[ZirconBlue]

I'm sure they know that they're not going to be able to stop 100% of pics/filming.  But, by making and enforcing such a rule, it makes people at least be a little more circumspect in how they take pics or video. 

[SystematicThought]

I don't really mind the rule, but it was more boggling last tour where they had a photo contest where they encouraged photos and to share them on Facebook. Then you get to the venue and I get yelled at for taking a pic and they said it was the band's request.

Then why have a photo contest if I can't take a picture?

[bosk1]

I don't really mind the rule, but it was more boggling last tour where they had a photo contest where they encouraged photos and to share them on Facebook. Then you get to the venue and I get yelled at for taking a pic and they said it was the band's request.

Then why have a photo contest if I can't take a picture?

Well, again, the band's rule is NOT "no pictures at all."  The band's rule is: "no pictures during performance only," and they otherwise encourage pictures.  Some security teams at some venues are misinterpreting and enforcing it differently.  But that has been the case in the past as well.  I think it is just showing up as more of an issue this time around because they are playing a lot of different venues. 

Think of it this way.  The band talks to security managers at three different venues and it goes something like this:

Venue #1
DT:  Okay, so our policy is no pictures during the performance.  Please have your guys enforce it strictly.  But outside of the performance, we don't care if people take pictures, and we actually encourage it.  Got it?
Security Manager:  OKAY, GOT IT!  THIS IS WHAT WE DO, MEN!
DT:  Um...why are you yelling?
Security Manager:  NO PICTURES WHATSOEVER.  YOU SEE A CAMERA OR PHONE, YOU KILL THE MAN HOLDING IT, UNDERSTAND?
DT:  No, wait...that's not--
Security Manager:  VIPER 1 AND VIPER 2, YOU HAVE THE GUN TOWERS!  VIPERS 3-8, FRONT OF HOUSE!  VIPERS 9-12 ARE ROVING!  REPORT TO THE ARMORY!  MOVE, MOVE, MOVE!!!
DT:  Okay...we're just gonna go do sound check now...

Venue #2
DT:  Okay, so our policy is no pictures during the performance.  Please have your guys enforce it strictly.  But outside of the performance, we don't care if people take pictures, and we actually encourage it.  Got it?
Security Manager:  *takes a long, deep toke and then exhales*  I wonder if the snack bar has nachos out already...

Venue #3
DT:  Okay, so our policy is no pictures during the performance.  Please have your guys enforce it strictly.  But outside of the performance, we don't care if people take pictures, and we actually encourage it.  Got it?
Security Manager:  No pictures in the main auditorium during the show.  Pictures elsewhere, fine.  Got it.

[Enigmachine]

Just got back from a concert (not DT).  I think the rule should be you can put your camera in the air for a grand total of 45 (I'm willing to compromise and say 25-30 )seconds throughout the entire show.  If you are recording video, keep the camera at eye level so you are only blocking your own view.  This is what we did. 

Obviously, many people will not follow this rule so I say ban the damn cameras.  I wish people could be reasonable, but they cannot. 

While we're at it, people need to follow no smoking guidelines, and if you are at a general admission show and have to pee or grab a beer, you lose your spot and will not be allowed back in the front.  If you can waste time standing in line for a fucking beer in the middle of a show, you're obviously not a big enough fan to warrant pushing your way back through the crowd so you can get the spot back that you left for the last 15 minutes.  I guess I can go lenient on bathroom breaks because even hardcore fans should be cut some slack when you really gotta go.

This is pretty much what I think as well.

It's a stupid rule that can't be enforced.  I really don't need pics and videos at any show, but you can't stop everybody from doing it.  They are buying the albums and tickets to the shows.  Bands should just let them do their thing.  Everyone and their dog has a camera with them everywhere they go.  Welcome to the 21st century. 

But it is being enforced. That's what people have a problem with.

[King Postwhore]

It's never been enforced before and that is what bothers some.  Now I do also hate the person that has the phone or camera out for a large duration of the show.  I know it's hard to control what is the limit.  It just comes off as we are trying to steal their intellectual property or they are trying to dictate how we should enjoy the show. 

I know there are people who do those illegal things by recording a full show but the quality is so bad I never watch them personally online.  Just my thoughts really.  It's a tough thing to manage for a band and the stadium security. I do wonder if it was just that harsh at the one show as you are suggesting bosk1 or has it been ramped up this year in general on this tour because of the type of show they are putting on.

Weird thing is, I was at last years show for the DVD and everybody was taking pictures and no one was stopping them.  Of all the shows you'd figure that would be the one.

[cramx3]

What hurts DT more, a guy who pays the ticket and films the entire show and puts it on youtube or that guy not being there at all and no ticket purchase?  Honest question.

[Sir GuitarCozmo]

Well, again, the band's rule is NOT "no pictures at all."  The band's rule is: "no pictures during performance only," and they otherwise encourage pictures.  Some security teams at some venues are misinterpreting and enforcing it differently.  But that has been the case in the past as well.  I think it is just showing up as more of an issue this time around because they are playing a lot of different venues. 

Think of it this way.  The band talks to security managers at three different venues and it goes something like this:

Venue #1
DT:  Okay, so our policy is no pictures during the performance.  Please have your guys enforce it strictly.  But outside of the performance, we don't care if people take pictures, and we actually encourage it.  Got it?
Security Manager:  OKAY, GOT IT!  THIS IS WHAT WE DO, MEN!
DT:  Um...why are you yelling?
Security Manager:  NO PICTURES WHATSOEVER.  YOU SEE A CAMERA OR PHONE, YOU KILL THE MAN HOLDING IT, UNDERSTAND?
DT:  No, wait...that's not--
Security Manager:  VIPER 1 AND VIPER 2, YOU HAVE THE GUN TOWERS!  VIPERS 3-8, FRONT OF HOUSE!  VIPERS 9-12 ARE ROVING!  REPORT TO THE ARMORY!  MOVE, MOVE, MOVE!!!
DT:  Okay...we're just gonna go do sound check now...

Venue #2
DT:  Okay, so our policy is no pictures during the performance.  Please have your guys enforce it strictly.  But outside of the performance, we don't care if people take pictures, and we actually encourage it.  Got it?
Security Manager:  *takes a long, deep toke and then exhales*  I wonder if the snack bar has nachos out already...

Venue #3
DT:  Okay, so our policy is no pictures during the performance.  Please have your guys enforce it strictly.  But outside of the performance, we don't care if people take pictures, and we actually encourage it.  Got it?
Security Manager:  No pictures in the main auditorium during the show.  Pictures elsewhere, fine.  Got it.

So hungry for snack bar nachos...