Author Topic: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge  (Read 18874 times)

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Offline The Letter M

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #105 on: June 25, 2016, 08:56:23 PM »
I don't think bland means not varied, and in that regard, I kind of see what he means in regards to Desolation Rose, which was a mix of great stuff and, well, some bland moments. Even the best songs on that record seem to have some bland moments. I like the record, but it's not one I revisit a lot. 

Now...Banks of Eden is another story.  The more time passes, the more I realize that is one of their best albums.  Phenomenal from start to finish (and even moreso if you count the bonus tracks).

I guess I interpreted "bland" to mean more along the lines of something like the last Yes album. Oddly enough, when BoE came out, I didn't really latch on to it. Nothing really grabbed me, either on the main album or the bonus disc, except the opening epic. After DR came out, I went back to revisit BoE and found that I enjoyed it more. I guess I needed time away from it for a bit, and I think I like it a BIT more than DR anyway, but DR is still pretty good, and in the bigger picture of all TFK studio albums, I'd say it's at least better than A&E and The Rainmaker for me, even with all of the bonus tracks.

Either way, I hope all of this time apart from TFK will give Roine a good chance to write some great stuff for their next album, but that's neither here nor there.

As for Invention Of Knowledge, I cannot wait to receive my pre-order from Reingold Records, and it seems many fans are slowly getting theirs across the world.

-Marc.
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #106 on: June 25, 2016, 09:03:31 PM »
Well, not to get into a TFK ranking contest :lol;, but I think Desolation Rose is definitely better than The Rainmaker and The Sum of No Evil (easily their two least best), and that's it.  Adam & Eve has its flaws, but there is something oddly charming about it.  And it has some really great songs on it (Love Supreme, Timelines and Driver's Seat), something I cannot really say about the bottom three albums, although I am pretty high on Serious Dreamers, and DR does have a few songs that were thisclose to being great. The Sum of No Evil is a nice listen, especially since it sounds great (something about Zoltan's drumming made every album he was on sound awesome sonically), but none of the songs are close to being one of their best or even great.

Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #107 on: June 29, 2016, 12:12:25 PM »
heh, that's still my favorite of theirs.  :lol

Offline James Mypetgiress

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #108 on: June 29, 2016, 02:58:32 PM »
This album is fantastic. That is all I have to say.

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #109 on: June 29, 2016, 04:32:08 PM »
Looks like it is available now here in the States...at Radiant Records...for 18 bucks. :facepalm: :facepalm:

Ah, the Radiant Record Rip-Off never fails. :lol :lol

I'll wait and get it for much less next week. :coolio

Offline King Postwhore

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #110 on: June 29, 2016, 04:40:06 PM »
Same here!
I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down'.” - Bob Newhart
So wait, we're spelling it wrong and king is spelling it right? What is going on here? :lol -- BlobVanDam
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Offline James Mypetgiress

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #111 on: June 30, 2016, 12:19:16 AM »
I got it for around £10 (around $13 I think) on a pre-order from HMV. How come it's so expensive over there?

Offline Stadler

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #112 on: June 30, 2016, 07:44:51 AM »
Looks like it is available now here in the States...at Radiant Records...for 18 bucks. :facepalm: :facepalm:

Ah, the Radiant Record Rip-Off never fails. :lol :lol

I'll wait and get it for much less next week. :coolio

Do you know what (if any) Neal's involvement with Radiant is?  If I buy from Radiant, is it the same as buying from, say, Marillion or Fish?

Offline The Letter M

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #113 on: June 30, 2016, 09:39:36 AM »
Looks like it is available now here in the States...at Radiant Records...for 18 bucks. :facepalm: :facepalm:

Ah, the Radiant Record Rip-Off never fails. :lol :lol

I'll wait and get it for much less next week. :coolio

Do you know what (if any) Neal's involvement with Radiant is?  If I buy from Radiant, is it the same as buying from, say, Marillion or Fish?

As far as I know, Radiant Records is OWNED by Neal Morse, but he also sells albums from other companies like InsideOut, since his albums are released by them as well (and typically, they produce the better product - see Transatlantic's Whirld Tour 2010 box sets).

If you want to buy the Anderson/Stolt album from someone involved with that band directly, you can buy it from the Flower Kings store, or from Reingold Records (where I ordered mine), which is Jonas' own label/store front. Of course, these are coming from Europe, and they'll cost just as much, if not a bit more because of shipping, but you'd be buying directly from the artists involved with the album.

-Marc.
ATTENTION - HAKEN FANS! The HAKEN SURVIVOR 2023 has begun! You can check it out in the Polls/Survivors Forum!!!

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #114 on: June 30, 2016, 07:36:55 PM »
Looks like it is available now here in the States...at Radiant Records...for 18 bucks. :facepalm: :facepalm:

Ah, the Radiant Record Rip-Off never fails. :lol :lol

I'll wait and get it for much less next week. :coolio

Do you know what (if any) Neal's involvement with Radiant is?  If I buy from Radiant, is it the same as buying from, say, Marillion or Fish?

For the most part, yes.  If I am not mistaken, his wife runs it.

I would love to support him more by buying from Radiant, but I had a bad experience with them about a decade ago, where I got ? nearly two weeks after its release and the communication by them was really piss poor, plus their prices are really high.

Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #115 on: July 01, 2016, 08:31:26 AM »
I don't buy too much from them either, mostly stuff I find in their bargain section.  But I do buy Neal's solo discs from Radiant.  Same with Transatlantic.  They don't have the resources that a lot of your major outlets like Amazon or Play or whatever so I go into it knowing that if things go awry it may take a while to get it straightened out.  I just avoid buying things from Radiant if I want them to come in on release day.   




Offline Stadler

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #116 on: July 01, 2016, 09:13:01 AM »
I just bought Cover to Cover and Cover to Cover 2 as a bundle, One Special Edition, ?, and the Transatlantic Whirlwind Live DVD, and got it all within a week.  The One was the wrong version, so I sent an email.  No response, so I sent another, and "Amy" replied saying "sorry, I'll send out the new one immediately".   No waiting for the return or anything (in fact, she didn't even mention it).  I'm not that guy, so I sent the version I had of One back and sent her an email which she replied to promptly.

Other things at the site were expensive, but this was a good transaction in every way.   

Is "Amy" Neal's wife? 

Offline Orbert

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #117 on: July 01, 2016, 04:42:36 PM »
Great interview with Roine about Invention of Knowledge.  Talks about everything from how it first came about to how they how they did it.  Lots of detail about collaborating via software/Internet on two continents, and also touches on other things Jon is doing (Anderson-Rabin-Wakeman) and Roine is doing (Kaipa, his band from back in the 70's).

Click this!

Offline goo-goo

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #118 on: July 01, 2016, 05:22:37 PM »
I just bought Cover to Cover and Cover to Cover 2 as a bundle, One Special Edition, ?, and the Transatlantic Whirlwind Live DVD, and got it all within a week.  The One was the wrong version, so I sent an email.  No response, so I sent another, and "Amy" replied saying "sorry, I'll send out the new one immediately".   No waiting for the return or anything (in fact, she didn't even mention it).  I'm not that guy, so I sent the version I had of One back and sent her an email which she replied to promptly.

Other things at the site were expensive, but this was a good transaction in every way.   

Is "Amy" Neal's wife?

I think Neal's wife is called Cherry (or Cherrie). Might have screwed the spelling.

Offline goo-goo

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #119 on: July 01, 2016, 05:23:19 PM »
www.lasercd.com has the CD for 10 bucks plus shipping.

Offline Hanz Gruber

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #120 on: July 03, 2016, 10:33:09 AM »
This album is fantastic. That is all I have to say.

Good to hear.  It is a late present for my dad (thought is was supposed to be released late June but got bumped to July 8th in the states)  Also ordered myself a copy.

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #121 on: July 09, 2016, 12:31:53 PM »
Finally was able to purchase this... :hat

Almost through one listen and it sounds...nice.  The reviews saying it is very vocal-heavy and bereft of Roine solos for the most part, are right on the money.  Might take some time to get used to that.  While Anderson's voice always give it a Yes flavor, this definitely doesn't sound like 70s Yes like some had said.  His voice still sounds great, for sure, regardless.  :tup :tup

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #122 on: July 09, 2016, 12:38:42 PM »
Oh, and I shit you not, but there is a vocal melody at both the beginning of the 2nd long song and near the end of the last song that is eerily similar to Surrey with the Fringe on Top. :eek :lol

Offline Mladen

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #123 on: July 09, 2016, 01:55:20 PM »
This album really left me cold. I'm extremely underwhelmed by it, the first three songs feature some memorable melodies but the rest of the album has such a dull vibe that I have trouble staying interested until the end. Easily my biggest disappointment of the year...

Offline PROGdrummer

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #124 on: July 09, 2016, 08:01:46 PM »
Interesting to see that some people here aren't enjoying it.
I don't post here much anymore, but I just had to pop in to say that I think this might be my favorite album of all time... Everything about it is just magical. Whenever I put it on I just get taken to another world and I just get totally lost in the music, which basically has not happened since the first time I discovered prog music with Dream Theater some 7 years ago or whenever it was. Everything about this album from the sounds of the instruments, the production, the melodies, the lyrics, and vocals (how does Jon still sound this nice?).... It's flawless in my opinion.  I'm only 21 years old, so take whatever opinions I have about 40-50 year old music with a grain of salt, but I can't help but feel like this bests Yes' entire discography. Fragile, Close To The Edge, Going For The One, Topographic Oceans... While all amazing records, none of them for me hold a candle to what I'm hearing here. It's a 10/10 album if I have to be completely honest... possibly the best album I've ever heard. I don't know. I've just rarely get this moved by music anymore.  If this is a career closing record for Jon, I feel that there is no better note to go out on.   

Offline The Letter M

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #125 on: July 09, 2016, 11:35:19 PM »
I'll echo the sentiments that this album is quite vocal-heavy. I realized this the other day when I was listening to some of it while showering, then while getting dressed for work. There weren't any major instrumental sections in the songs, and when there were, they were short. I sort of expected some grandiose musical excursions in the middle of these sprawling epics, but seeing as how they divided the longer songs into 2 or 3 tracks, it's apparent they did so because each track has a good deal of vocals, and they aren't simple just movements within a piece, movements that may or may not be instrumental in sections.

I was kind of hoping a bit of CTTE or Relayer with these long tracks, or even the obvious comparisons made to TFTO, but there's a lot instrumental-breathing room on there, too. Not that Jon's vocals aren't bad, but I was kind of hoping to see Roine and the other players get a chance to flex their musical muscles, but given that the vocalist is the one who wrote nearly all of the music, it's no wonder he wrote music that would give him the most amount of time to sing and vocalize. I don't blame him, though. This is one of his biggest releases in years, so I'm sure he wants to sing his heart out, so good for him. But given the amount of famous players on this album, it's a shame that they don't really get a chance to shine beside, or ahead of Jon and his voice.

All that aside, it's still very pretty, beautiful music, but it's also a lot of Jon's whimsy, and not much else in terms of what made Yes, as there aren't and real rip-roaring guitar solos, extended keyboard excursions, and in-your-face bass grooves. Everything feels...nice, and pretty, and at-times, fragile (no pun intended) and glass-like. It's like a thing, glass musical vase - looks great, holds beautiful flowers and has a lot of bright colors and shapes, but it's not very heavy or hard-hitting like a rock or brick, it doesn't have the kind of OOMPH you hear in some Yessongs, like "Heart Of The Sunrise", "Sound Chaser", or parts of "Awaken". Those had great moments of being soft, but also brilliant moments of spastic instrumental exercises.

I'm sure this album will do well as the year progresses, being featured in many fans' and critiques' Top 10 lists, and it'll probably win an award or two, but to tout this as "Yes music" is only a thin veil of a label, simply because Jon is involved. Sure, he wrote music and lyrics for Yes, but this one was mostly Jon and some friends (that I've never even heard of) writing music over years and years, then letting Roine and company cover it with embellishments to Jon's liking, and that's not really how Yes worked (I think...).

Honestly, I had kind of hoped this was a strictly JOINT venture, 50/50 on music and lyrics, with even Roine singing. Or heck, even a Yes-inspired album by Roine, with help from Jon, and Jon on vocals. Couldn't you imagine some TFK songs sung by Jon?! THAT would be something to pay for, and something I'd like to see. Jon singing on TFK epics like "Stardust We Are" or even "The Truth Will Set You Free" - THAT would be an amazing kind of album.

-Marc.
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #126 on: July 10, 2016, 07:21:57 AM »
I've only listened once, so I am not going to pass judgment on it yet, but the album being so wordy does have me a little concerned as to how much I might eventually like it.

I cannot remember where I saw it - I have scoured the 'net for reviews of it everywhere - but I saw one review that basically said, "If Yes would have done an album in between Tales and Relayer, this is what it would have sounded like," which sounds like utter crap.  Tales and Relayer had tons of adventurous, long instrumental sections, something Invention of Knowledge appears to not have (that is a statement of style, not quality, since, again, I have only listened once).

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #127 on: July 12, 2016, 04:57:53 AM »
After three listens now...not really digging it.  It sounds like nice background music, but none of the melodies are staying with me.  I hope it grows on me, but so far, I am incredibly disappointed, and this is coming from a huge Roine Stolt fan.  :(

Offline Kwyjibo

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #128 on: July 12, 2016, 06:17:01 AM »
I've listened to it twice and think while it starts out relatively strong it loses me in the end. So far not what I hoped it would be.

I read a lot of reviews who compare this to Tales and equally praise it. I'm not that fond of Tales but this is not nearly as good as Tales is, regardless of it's flaws. And I echo the sentiment of others that there is a severe lack of strong instrumental passages.

Maybe this needs more time and more spins but as of now I file it under mildy disappointing.
Must've been Kwyji sending all the wrong songs.   ;D

Offline countoftuscany42

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #129 on: July 15, 2016, 05:38:40 PM »
I've tried not to be bothered by the issues with Radiant Records because overall my experiences with them have been good, but they really need help  :facepalm:
Ordered Anderson/Stolt on blue vinyl and decided to pick up TA's Kaleidoscope LP set as well, which their site describes as the green LP that radiant released as opposed to the Inside Out version.  Records finally arrive today; first thing i notice is that there is no sort of bubble wrap around the records, they are both just in the box--thanks to this there is a nice dent in the TA box, not enough to damage the records but still annoying for a $40 record.  Next, I open up both records; both of them are just black vinyl.  Radiant didn't have a black version for sale, only the blue, so I'm assuming they just ran out and got black from some other distributor, either way their website should have reflected that.  And with TA it is the Inside Out version, which again is mentioned nowhere.  Im guessing Radiant's version is also sold out, but it'd have been nice to know that ahead of time.    Definitely asking them to either resend the correct versions, or at the very least offer some sort of store credit.  good times with Radiant  :lol

Offline Orbert

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #130 on: July 15, 2016, 09:05:27 PM »
That's a bummer to hear.  Just recently they had a big sale and I went to their website and yeah, there are some great deals, but when I went to check out, I don't know, it didn't quite feel right.  I didn't end up ordering anything.

Offline KevShmev

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #131 on: July 15, 2016, 09:10:06 PM »
Pretty sure I'd be sending those records back, if they had dents in the boxes.

Bummer that a great guy like Neal has such an awful site like that.

Offline James Mypetgiress

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Re: Jon Anderson & Roine Stolt - Invention of Knowledge
« Reply #132 on: July 17, 2016, 12:22:03 PM »
Yeah, that's kinda crummy. I'd definitely send them back, if it's damaged as well as being the wrong thing... I don't think those Anderson/Stolt coloured vinyls were limited edition, either, so it's not like that should be a problem.