DT14 speculation thread

[ToT-147]

Interesting, I never looked at it like that. That makes sense; JM's one known song with him having some ideas was Lifting Shadows.

Hmm, Idk.. He's credited way more than that.. I wanna think he has contributed, in a way, at least with some percentage in about half of DT's songs.. Otherwise they wouldn't have reasons to establish the "Myung, Petrucci, Portnoy, Rudess," in the credits of a lot of songs... not mentioning the ones in which is a sure thing he participated, like Vacant, the ones in ADToE/DT12 or the songs he wrote the lyrics..

I didn't mean his only one idea. I meant his one big song, or at least one of them. It has been made clear his other contributions.

I see.. I never knew he was the main composer of that song, but somehow makes sense..

[Vandalism]

Also we can hear the band members crediting JM for a lot of cool riffs in the LSFNY commentary. (riff post verse 2 in SDV, middle riff in BTL etc.)

JR : "When JM speaks.........we listen!"

[Pragmaticcircus]

Whatever DT14 is can it have way more chocolate cake, ass, balls? 

[red barchetta]

Whatever DT14 is can it have way more chocolate cake, ass, balls? 

There are certainly many fans hoping for something different, something that sounds like a prog metal band.

[Kotowboy]

Also we can hear the band members crediting JM for a lot of cool riffs in the LSFNY commentary. (riff post verse 2 in SDV, middle riff in BTL etc.)

JR : "When JM speaks.........we listen!"

Also Sprach Myung.

[ToT-147]

Whatever DT14 is can it have way more chocolate cake, ass, balls? 

There are certainly many fans hoping for something different, something that sounds like a prog metal band.

I don't think so.. The last couple of albums were prog metal enough for a band that doesn't need to demonstrate they're just a "prog metal band".. They're in another state now.. Doing a lot of things more than what they did before.. I'd say DT fans in general are more inclined to like the diversity and innovation against the mediocrity and predictable an only "prog metal" album would have..

[Kotowboy]

Sonics of The Astonishing please but slightly rockier overall.

[DoctorAction]

Hope JP takes the bait from Maiden and Meshuggah and they record (basic tracks at least) live in the studio. If there's one band that (a) has amazing ability to show off; and (b) does not benefit at all from the lack of feel that over-clean production gives; it's DT. Especially post-MP. They really need to push MM to the front and make it sound natural and authentic, IMO.

And short too. Really, almost no-one EVER has enough juice in the tank to make a double (6doit the only exception I can think of atm)

[Bertielee]

Hope JP takes the bait from Maiden and Meshuggah and they record (basic tracks at least) live in the studio. If there's one band that (a) has amazing ability to show off; and (b) does not benefit at all from the lack of feel that over-clean production gives; it's DT. Especially post-MP. They really need to push MM to the front and make it sound natural and authentic, IMO.

And short too. Really, almost no-one EVER has enough juice in the tank to make a double (6doit the only exception I can think of atm)

Yes, but 6DoIT is 2 different discs, TA is one single story throughout, which may not help (even if I like the album a lot). I may sound a little pessimistic, but I don't see any change coming our way. They sound too clinical these days, but the trend was not initiated when MM joined, it began with SC, IMO.

B.Lee

[Pragmaticcircus]

I hope they completely alienate EVERYONE and record an album that doesn't resemble there usual sound, but keep the complexity. Take all the elements of their sound they known for (both positively and negatively) and flip it on it's head. 

[nikatapi]

I really hope we get more from JM and MM this time, it seems like they have a great chemistry, and parts of DT12 where it was only drums and bass were very cool.

Also, i hope for more JLB involvement in the lyrics department, he is a good lyricist and JP seems to have a tendency towards cheesy lyrics in the recent years, so i would love more diversity in terms of lyrics. Also, less forced epicness and grandiose song closures would be very welcome.

[rumborak]

I hope they completely alienate EVERYONE and record an album that doesn't resemble there usual sound, but keep the complexity. Take all the elements of their sound they known for (both positively and negatively) and flip it on it's head. 

That's what I've been hoping for forever, but it's exceedingly unlikely to happen at this point I think. The adjustments to their sound have been incremental at best over the years.

[TheOutlawXanadu]

While I would have no objection to a complete curve ball of an album, the band's usual approach of putting a more minor twist on their core sound with each new record is usually more than enough for me. While the changes don't always seem all that significant at first, if you compare albums with several years between them, you realize that DT have actually done a really nice job of trying out new things. I know quite a few metal heads who love Train of Thought and the self-titled but don't really enjoy Falling into Infinity or The Astonishing because they're simply not heavy enough.

In fairness to the band, I also think that the difference between DT12 and TA was quite drastic. On a one to five scale of "We're experimenting with our sound, maaaaaan" where a 1/5 is Ride the Lightning -> Master of Puppets and a 5/5 is Watershed -> Heritage, I'd say that DT12 -> TA was a solid 4/5. Between the shorter songs, lighter tone, cheesier lyrics, and increased acoustic playing, it feels like a very different record to me, at least.

[rumborak]

I'm totally on board with the songwriting shakeup on TA, but sound-wise I frankly hear virtually no difference in the 3 MM-era albums. Sure, TA isn't as brickwalled as DT12, but the instruments overall sound exactly the same. IMHO.

[Ben_Jamin]

I feel the band would have never done what they have if they hadn't continued the momentum.

The thing with Mancini is he plays to suit the music, which ends up blending with the melodies and patterns. His parts are great and I love when I can enjoy the songs melodies while having a nice drum beat and bass to go with it.

I'm hoping they'll try something new studio wise. Producer, mixing and all that fun stuff.

[Thematt202]

I'm pretty sure they're gonna go really heavy next time (which is a shame IMO).  I'd lose my shit if they announced The Astonishing Part 2....

I think there's more chance of MP rejoining and the next record being a hip-hop opera, sadly.  One can at least dream.

[Lax]

I'm totally on board with the songwriting shakeup on TA, but sound-wise I frankly hear virtually no difference in the 3 MM-era albums. Sure, TA isn't as brickwalled as DT12, but the instruments overall sound exactly the same. IMHO.

On a global view, maaaaybe, but in details I disagree
Technically, we feel less differences between albums because volume war and hardware are not changing as drastically as in 90's.
JP has his sound, and I think the mark2c+ is here to stay
Rudess used much more "liquid tension" or "solo" sounds on TA than before.

But mainly mangini, I can't tell for TA since only the best fills stand out, else it's buried. But I don't think at all his sound his the same between ADTOE and DT12, I personnaly prefered the first one.

I hope DT14 will be produced way more groovy, and with a blasty drum, not a clickety feeling

[mikeyd23]

I hope DT14 will be produced way more groovy, and with a blasty drum, not a clickety feeling

Yes. In fairness though, this isn't really an MM-specific issue. IMO, even though MP is a very groovy, hard-hitting, bombastic drummer, DT hasn't got a GREAT drum sound on record since SDOIT. I think the ToT sound was a little muffled, Oct was a little flat, SC was a little to hot on the kick, and BC&SL sounded very close mic'd like there was no room sound.

[nikatapi]

I hope DT14 will be produced way more groovy, and with a blasty drum, not a clickety feeling

Yes. In fairness though, this isn't really an MM-specific issue. IMO, even though MP is a very groovy, hard-hitting, bombastic drummer, DT hasn't got a GREAT drum sound on record since SDOIT. I think the ToT sound was a little muffled, Oct was a little flat, SC was a little to hot on the kick, and BC&SL sounded very close mic'd like there was no room sound.

That's true, after SDOIT MP's sound passed through different phases, but still i think it was a lot better than MM's, especially on the cymbal department, that's my main problem with the last albums. And sure i would welcome a more organic sound since MM plays with a lot of dynamics.

[mikeyd23]

That's true, after SDOIT MP's sound passed through different phases, but still i think it was a lot better than MM's, especially on the cymbal department, that's my main problem with the last albums. And sure i would welcome a more organic sound since MM plays with a lot of dynamics.

Oh I agree, it just thought it was worth mentioning that MP didn't always have some incredible studio sound either. MP's cymbals definitely sounded better than MM's that seems to still be a struggle for DT in the MM era, the cymbal sound. I guess MP being mixed WAY louder helped in that department a little.

[Ben_Jamin]

That's true, after SDOIT MP's sound passed through different phases, but still i think it was a lot better than MM's, especially on the cymbal department, that's my main problem with the last albums. And sure i would welcome a more organic sound since MM plays with a lot of dynamics.

Oh I agree, it just thought it was worth mentioning that MP didn't always have some incredible studio sound either. MP's cymbals definitely sounded better than MM's that seems to still be a struggle for DT in the MM era, the cymbal sound. I guess MP being mixed WAY louder helped in that department a little.

Plus, his drumkit isn't constructed the same way. Which I think may be causing the low cymbal sound, or is hard to capture in studio recordings.

[mikeyd23]

Plus, his drumkit isn't constructed the same way. Which I think may be causing the low cymbal sound, or is hard to capture in studio recordings.

Yup, I actually think that has a lot to do with it.

[Ben_Jamin]

I don't fault MM either in that department because he never really was part of a band, or a member as much as he is in DT now. He barely finally got use his dream kit, and has since experimented with it. He doesn't have his own drum sound but he does have his own uniqueness of his musical knowledge.

I hope he finds a way to get that good Tom sound with the cymbals intact.

[Fritzinger]

With DT12 and TA being very melodic, chocolate-y and everything, I hope DT14 to be a little more heavy as well. And I really am not a metal fan. As always it would be great to have some concrete MM/JM contributions, but I'm pretty sure I (and everyone else) said that the last two times. I wasn't so stunned by Myungs Surrender To Reason lyrics though.
I think MMs Drum sound on TA was an improvement after DT12 (wich probably had the worst Snare drum sound ever to me), but I still think it could sound a little more organic. Have you guys seen MMs video where he plays The Enemy Inside on YouTube? Drums sound so natural, suddenly the song started to groove way better. Also I feel that his cymbals could take a slightly more prominent role in the sound.

[AboutToCrash]

As much as I like Portnoy and have the upmost respect for him it would be interesting and maybe refreshing hearing a heavy DT album without his vocal lines and input, since he left they haven't gone too heavy but I think it would definitely be the right move for them at this point, as someone said before the cinematic tracks are becoming a little overdone. Creating something a bit more raw would help, and I believe less overdubs and layering would create far more opportunity to hear individual instruments more pronounced and clear (Especially the bass)

[rumborak]

I don't fault MM either in that department because he never really was part of a band, or a member as much as he is in DT now. He barely finally got use his dream kit, and has since experimented with it. He doesn't have his own drum sound but he does have his own uniqueness of his musical knowledge.

I possibly could have bought into that argument after ADTOE, and indeed I (and many others) were very protective of him after that album. However, he has been a fulltime drummer for 5 years now, is a Berklee professor, and has played with Vai, Extreme, Annihilator etc. There is just no argument you can make that he is too "inexperienced" to have a good drum sound.

[smegolas]

I hope they completely alienate EVERYONE and record an album that doesn't resemble there usual sound, but keep the complexity. Take all the elements of their sound they known for (both positively and negatively) and flip it on it's head. 

Absolutely this.  The guys in DT are arguably some of the most talented rock musicians on the planet.  But they are getting older and closer to the end of their careers.  The Astonishing was a great step in the right direction, but I'd love to see them push themselves further, maybe in a completely new direction.  Problem is I think James is the limiting factor (as good as he was on TA). 

[SwedishGoose]

I for one love what they did with TA... it is now my favorite album of theirs (been a fan since I&W was released).

Not sure I would want a TA part 2 though. The thing with TA was that it was so unexpected, new and fresh. Another one in that line would not be as fresh.

I just hope that they do whatever they want to do as a group. I am pretty sure that I will at least like it whatever they choose to do. No hopes of the next one ever topping TA for me though.

[smegolas]

I for one love what they did with TA... it is now my favorite album of theirs (been a fan since I&W was released).

Not sure I would want a TA part 2 though. The thing with TA was that it was so unexpected, new and fresh. Another one in that line would not be as fresh.

I just hope that they do whatever they want to do as a group. I am pretty sure that I will at least like it whatever they choose to do. No hopes of the next one ever topping TA for me though.

I don't think anyone expects another TA, just something that is at least as big a surprise, but in a different direction.

[As I Am]

I've said it before, but they will need to do something HUGE and drastic for the next album. Whether a fan of it or not, I feel they need to do a Train of Thought type album to show everyone they still have their metal balls! That should bring back a good portion of those who have dismissed the last album or two.

[Bertielee]

I've said it before, but they will need to do something HUGE and drastic for the next album. Whether a fan of it or not, I feel they need to do a Train of Thought type album to show everyone they still have their metal balls! That should bring back a good portion of those who have dismissed the last album or two.

And alienate another portion that didn't like ToT because of its heaviness (of which I am not a part because I absolutely loved ToT).

B.Lee

[TAC]

I've said it before, but they will need to do something HUGE and drastic for the next album. 

I don't get this sentiment.

Didn't they just do something "HUGE and drastic"?

[hefdaddy42]

I've said it before, but they will need to do something HUGE and drastic for the next album. 

I don't get this sentiment.

Didn't they just do something "HUGE and drastic"?

Yes.

[bosk1]

I've said it before, but they will need to do something HUGE and drastic for the next album. 

I don't get this sentiment.

Didn't they just do something "HUGE and drastic"?

Yes.  But it didn't fit his specific tastes.  Therefore, the band were wrong and must do something huger.  And drasticker. 

[hefdaddy42]

DT14

HUGER AND DRASTICKER