Spock's Beard Discography thread

[The Letter M]

Here's an idea- buy the compilation, rip the album for yourself, then give it to a friend for a Christmas gift! Or give it first, then ask if you could copy it. Either way, you could get the new song AND introduce SB to someone new!

-Marc.

[KevShmev]

Unfortunately, burying new material in compilations has been a successful sales tactic for a long while now. And it still works – certainly the recent Steven Wilson vinyl-only pop song compilation is a fitting example. This is, quite likely, the only way to sell the entire compilation to anyone except the hardcorest and newest fans.

  That SW compilation doesn't have any new songs.

I get that it is a successful sales tactic, but that was in the past when buyers had to buy whole albums or nothing; it was long before we could buy individual songs on amazon or iTunes.  It's a tired sales tactic that shouldn't be done anymore, given the way the industry works now.

[seasonsinthesky]

Unfortunately, burying new material in compilations has been a successful sales tactic for a long while now. And it still works – certainly the recent Steven Wilson vinyl-only pop song compilation is a fitting example. This is, quite likely, the only way to sell the entire compilation to anyone except the hardcorest and newest fans.

  That SW compilation doesn't have any new songs.

I get that it is a successful sales tactic, but that was in the past when buyers had to buy whole albums or nothing; it was long before we could buy individual songs on amazon or iTunes.  It's a tired sales tactic that shouldn't be done anymore, given the way the industry works now.

Not new songs, new recordings/mixes. Seems to be the same league to SW, since he's doing it yet again on the new EP with "Don't Hate Me."

And you do have to buy the whole compilation – or, rather, you do now that they realized their mistake, apparently.

The actual mechanic of having to buy the whole thing for a new song still works quite well in the prog sphere, where labels like Inside Out still make a decent profit on physical product. Seems they think a lot of progheads just need any excuse to hit the Buy button.

[kaos2900]

I just think the band would make an even bigger profit if the released the song on it's own and charged $5 for it. I wouldn't mind paying $5 for a 20 minute song. I refuse to pay for an entire album of songs that I already own.

[kirksnosehair]

For what it's worth to anyone who's wondering, I bought the "First Twenty Years" thingy and the old songs definitely have been tweaked in terms of their sonic impact.  I always thought that "The Light" sounded pretty dull and flat on the original album. (killer track, though!).  In fact, a friend of mine who has done a lot of the artwork for Neal Morse's stuff and the early Spock's Beard days gave me a copy of the live album "The Beard is Out There" and that is a better-sounding version than the original studio version - and it's live! 


So, yeah, I definitely noticed that "The Light" sounds bigger, warmer and not so demo-ish sounding like the original is.  The whole album sounds great.  The new song is cool I haven't had a lot of time to listen to it.  Only heard it once so far, but it sounded pretty good.


I get why a band like Spock's Beard would do a compilation like this.  They've got a lot of albums over a long and somewhat legendary journey.  Someone who hasn't followed them for all these years could hear "The Light" followed by "On a Perfect Day" followed by "Postcards From Perdition" and they might not even realize they were all from the same band.


A disc like this gives a new fan the chance to hear some of the best classics (Neal's Beard) and mid-era (Nick's Beard) stuff along with their recent output with their current configuration (Ted's Beard)


I remember getting into Aerosmith that way.  I bought their "Greatest Hits" album (around 1980 or so) then started buying their back catalog, starting with the albums that had my favorite songs on the Greatest Hits record.


I've blown twice this much money on dumber stuff, so I figured what the hell.


Good disc, I'd buy it again

[kirksnosehair]

I just think the band would make an even bigger profit if the released the song on it's own and charged $5 for it. I wouldn't mind paying $5 for a 20 minute song. I refuse to pay for an entire album of songs that I already own.

I get where you're coming from, but I think you're probably the exception and not the rule. Would they really make more money just selling the single song for $5.00?   I'm sure they'd sell a few of the $5.00 digital downloads of the song, but that's not what they recorded the track for.  It was recorded specifically as a teaser to entice existing fans to buy.  Keep in mind that they'd have to sell 5 digital downloads to equal the revenue generated by the sale of 1 unit of this new collection.  The numbers just don't  work and again, they didn't record the song to sell it individually.  Welcome to the music business circa 2015. 


You're not refusing to pay for only an entire album of songs you already own.  You're refusing to pay for the remastered collection of existing Spock's Beard songs, the new 20+ minute epic featuring all three of the band's lead vocalists, and the DVD with rare footage from Progfest '97 and the recording sessions for "The Kindness of Strangers" album.  $25 is a little steep, I'll agree with you there. 


But I think it's perfectly fine that they put this song on a compilation and that's how you get it: by purchasing the compilation. They're betting that a sizeable portion of their fans will buy the compilation to get the new song and/or the rare footage. (I did)  The new song was written and produced precisely for that purpose. It's a tool to lure existing fans into buying the compilation.  In the age of torrents this is how music business is done now. 

[KevShmev]

I think I'd be more swayed if I saw more positive feedback about the new song, but most of the comments I have seen say it is good, but almost as an afterthought, making me think it is a "by the numbers" Neal Morse epic.  Granted, I usually lap those up with a spoon , but I guess I was hoping for reviews of it that were a bit more...glowing.

[The Letter M]

I think I'd be more swayed if I saw more positive feedback about the new song, but most of the comments I have seen say it is good, but almost as an afterthought, making me think it is a "by the numbers" Neal Morse epic.  Granted, I usually lap those up with a spoon , but I guess I was hoping for reviews of it that were a bit more...glowing.

Not trying to sway YOU personally, but my thoughts on the song, as I recall when I first heard it, was that I was blown away. It was definitely Neal, but not entirely by the numbers. The song opens with the usual instrumental overture, but the drumming by Nick in this part, as well as the keyboard and guitar parts, are definitely something fresh-sounding from Neal AND the Beard. The first few minutes definitely wows me with every listen.

When the vocals come, Neal handles the first part's verses expertly, but Ted's chorus parts definitely shine brightly, and he's got some soaring melodies that really stand out. The chorus just pops into my head every now and then, even when I haven't herd the song in a day or two. Nick's vocal section in the next part really really rocks, and it feels and sounds SO natural with the rest of the band, it almost felt as if he had never left and was "just away" for two albums. It was kind of surreal, but amazing to hear him sing with the band again.

The next part with the dueling drums is a highlight, especially if you're a fan of drums, drum solos/duets/battles, or a fan of Jimmy and/or Nick and their drumming. The split audio for their parts (I believe it is Nick on the left, Jimmy on the right) makes it easy to pick out their parts, and they play some sick fills in their solos. Jimmy went into further detail on the recording of the drums for the WHOLE song on Facebook, whcih was awfully nice of him to share!

The closing reprise of the song is typical, but handled VERY expertly as Ted's soaring and soulful vocals return, giving us an epic vocal send-off into some great guitar soloing from Al. The very end of the song is also kind of surreal, a very blissfully performed ending for an epic. It's not entirely bombastic as you'd might expect a Neal epic to be, but it fits for Spock's Beard, of ANY era and line-up.

Over-all, this epic is definitely SB, but still quite fresh-sounding. We don't get the usual Neal/SB-isms that you'd expect, like a Latin section, or layered vocal trade-offs a la Gentle Giant, or long, grandiose piano excursions, but what we DO get is some expert playing from the drummers, Al, and some tasteful keyboards, all balanced well, with some gret vocals from ALL THREE vocalists.

I say, if you get the chance to listen to it, and are impressed enough by it, buy the compilation. It'll be worth owning, and if you're a huge fan of the band, it's nice to just have as a capstone to the band's first 20 years of their career. I enjoy seeing it on my shelf with all of the other SB releases, and knowing I own the song, physically, makes me feel great. I've no regrets buying the compilation, and I hope others don't either. I'm just thankful that Neal even thought to write new music for it, because otherwise, I'm sure they would've just released it was it was without it!

-Marc.

[KevShmev]

To take this is another direction, I have seen it said before, but I am not sure why a "Latin section" is considered a Neal trademark.  There aren't that many sections like that in his songs.  He has a million epics and the only ones I can think of off hand that have a prominent section with a section like that are The Light, The Separated Man and The Conflict.  And when Neal busts out the acoustic, whether it be flamenco-style or not, it's almost always awesome, so I say, bring them on.

[The Letter M]

To take this is another direction, I have seen it said before, but I am not sure why a "Latin section" is considered a Neal trademark.  There aren't that many sections like that in his songs.  He has a million epics and the only ones I can think of off hand that have a prominent section with a section like that are The Light, The Separated Man and The Conflict.  And when Neal busts out the acoustic, whether it be flamenco-style or not, it's almost always awesome, so I say, bring them on.

There's also "A Whole 'Nother Trip". I think since Sola Scriptura, he hasn't really done those types of musical movements and sections, but up to that point, it was kind of a thing for him on every other album, or at least it felt like it. But because he hasn't really done that in nearly a decade now, it's easy to forget about them. I do agree, though, that those acoustic/flamenco guitar sections are pretty good!

-Marc.

[RoeDent]

At the End of the Day (from V) has a Latin section on it too.

[KevShmev]

I forgot about the one in A Whole Nother Trip, but I think of The Man Who Would Be King as more of a song from a suite rather than a smaller piece of a single song.

I wouldn't really call that short section in At the End of the Day a Latin section, especially since his playing there is strumming, not really Flamenco-style picking.

[kirksnosehair]

I think I'd be more swayed if I saw more positive feedback about the new song, but most of the comments I have seen say it is good, but almost as an afterthought, making me think it is a "by the numbers" Neal Morse epic.  Granted, I usually lap those up with a spoon , but I guess I was hoping for reviews of it that were a bit more...glowing.

It's a nice song and there are some pretty cool parts.  I really like how they mingled all three vocalists together and it sounds pretty nice, especially Ryo's patches, I love his patch choices.  Dave's bass has a meatier sound on this (like a lot of the Ted era stuff), but it sounds like they either switched bases in the middle of the song, which is entirely possible or it's just the editing but I heard passages that sounded very bright and Rickenbacker-ish sounding.


Overall I'd say there is a pretty decent value here, if not a bit overpriced, but I don't mind.    Not essential for anyone other than completist nerds with disposable income 

[kirksnosehair]

Neal really loves to throw those Flamenco passages in there, doesn't he?     


That might be a requirement for any Neal Morse song longer than 10 minutes, which is what, 98% of his catalog? 

[Orbert]

Ha ha, I agree.  Neal and the Flamenco is like Jordan and his circus tunes.  Yeah, it's clever shit, but really dude?

[KevShmev]

Eh, I don't see the problem.  That's like telling John Petrucci never to shred.  It's one of Neal Morse's greatest strengths as a player, so why wouldn't he do it?

[Mosh]

I still don't understand the purpose of this compilation. There's no way you can convince me that this is meant to introduce fans to the band. Total cash grab.

[The Letter M]

I still don't understand the purpose of this compilation. There's no way you can convince me that this is meant to introduce fans to the band. Total cash grab.

This can't possibly be any more of a cash-grab than Steven Wilson's latest compilation, which was a limited-released, vinyl-only collection of singles, which he released to be aimed at obtaining new fans. Way to single out your target demographic, Mr. Wilson.

At least this new compilation from SB covers the band's whole career, includes some great video footage of the band in their formative years, as well as new interviews with all 7 band members. Getting this as a present for friends to introduce them to the band that existing fans already know and love is a GREAT way to spread the Beard around, with some great selections from each album, all remastered by Rich Mouser.

More over, it's just a celebration of the band's career, which they all seem to be very proud of. Twenty years together, after 2 major line-up changes, is no easy feat, especially to continue making music of the quality that they have been. Whether or not it was the band, or the label that wanted the compilation makes no difference. At least they made it special by including a new epic and a documentary DVD, rather than just being a poorly slapped together compilation (looking at you, Mercury with your Rush compilations that make NO sense).

Either way, if you don't like it, no one ever forces anyone to buy them, and if anything, buying them only benefits the band in the end.

-Marc.

[KevShmev]

Huh?  How does that make any sense?  Wilson releasing a compilation, that had NO new songs, that is available only on vinyl, something only a tinny tiny percentage of music fans can still buy since most do not own a record player, is a cash grab?  Seriously? 

But hey, you are pretty good with the spin there, Marc.  The band should hire you to be their spokesman. 

[The Letter M]

Huh?  How does that make any sense?  Wilson releasing a compilation, that had NO new songs, that is available only on vinyl, something only a tinny tiny percentage of music fans can still buy since most do not own a record player, is a cash grab?  Seriously? 

I call it more of a cash-grab because SW knows that his die-hards will buy ANYTHING he puts out, even if it's a vinyl-only compilation that offers up nothing new. If SW really wanted to reach out to new fans, the compilation would've been made on CD, digital downloads, and sent to brick-and-mortar stores across the world, but I don't think it ever did that. The fact that the INTENTION was to make new fans but seriously limit the reach of the album made no sense (as far as compilations go), and so the only fans who'd probably buy it anyway would be the existing ones, and I'm sure plenty of them did. And as much of a fan of SW as I am, I didn't, mostly because I don't own a record player, and also because I didn't see the value in a compilation that didn't even offer up anything new, unless you enjoy edited versions of already long and great songs. Besides, with only 4 studio albums under his belt at the time, why bother making a compilation when getting the albums themselves is still really easy and fairly cheap to do? What's to celebrate...five years of not being Porcupine Tree?!

At least with SB's compilation, new content and remastered old songs definitely made it worth the price, and the fact that it's widely available makes more sense as a compilation meant to reach out to new fans. If I had enough disposable income, I'm sure I'd buy another one or two of these to give to close friends and give them a chance to check out one of my top 5 bands of all time! Giving someone a 2CD/DVD set seems a lot more practical than a double-vinyl, especially, as you say, most people don't have record players, despite the resurgence of them.

At any rate, I won't say that SB's compilation ISN'T a cash-grab, because lets face it, most of the time, ALL compilations are cash-grabs, but I'm just glad the band, especially Neal, had the chance to put their input into it, have the old stuff remastered, and have Randy put together an excellent documentary. Had this been done by almost any other label, it definitely would NOT have been worth buying at all.

But hey, you are pretty good with the spin there, Marc.  The band should hire you to be their spokesman. 

Hah, thanks, I guess? I mean, I am a huge fan of the band, but I doubt they'd need me to talk them up any more than they already have. Just trying to spread the love and joy that is Spock's Beard!

-Marc.

[KevShmev]

Well, I don't want to get into a prolonged debate over SW vs SB, but I will just say that I think SW released that as a kind of cool thing for fans who love vinyl to have, regardless of what he says his intentions were (I think he is someone who loves taking the piss by always voicing misdirection ).  I never even considered buying it, and I would describe myself as a SW diehard who is usually of the "shut up and take my money" mindset.

Back to the Beard, I think the new album has three keepers:

Bennett Built a Time Machine
The Center Line
Disappear

Everything else ranges from pretty good to good, but those three stand out the most, I think.

[Mosh]

I still don't understand the purpose of this compilation. There's no way you can convince me that this is meant to introduce fans to the band. Total cash grab.

This can't possibly be any more of a cash-grab than Steven Wilson's latest compilation, which was a limited-released, vinyl-only collection of singles, which he released to be aimed at obtaining new fans. Way to single out your target demographic, Mr. Wilson.

Don't know what SW has to do with it, wasn't aware of him having a new compilation. But that sounds like a cash grab too, so they're both guilty as far as I'm concerned.

[The Letter M]

I still don't understand the purpose of this compilation. There's no way you can convince me that this is meant to introduce fans to the band. Total cash grab.

This can't possibly be any more of a cash-grab than Steven Wilson's latest compilation, which was a limited-released, vinyl-only collection of singles, which he released to be aimed at obtaining new fans. Way to single out your target demographic, Mr. Wilson.

Don't know what SW has to do with it, wasn't aware of him having a new compilation. But that sounds like a cash grab too, so they're both guilty as far as I'm concerned.

 

Are *all* compilations just cash-grabs to you? Or to anyone else for that matter?! I mean, when you think about, anything that anyone puts out for money could be a "cash-grab". I mean, they've release product that is to be SOLD to consumers, so it's literally out there just to grab cash from fans.

New albums? Cash grab. Tours? Cash grab. Tour merch that is waaaaay too expensive?! Instant cash-grab.

I'm not sure what's worse, though - compilations or endless remasters/remixes? Some bands are guilty of both, though, especially Yes, who have been known to have fans triple- or quadruple-dip albums and songs. How shameless!

As for SB, this being their first compilation, I say we just cut them some slack. If they had released one or two prior to this, I could see room for complaints, but since its their first, I say we let them slide.

-Marc.

[seasonsinthesky]

I think a good example of a well done compilation is The Road Back Home by The Flower Kings. At the bare minimum, every song is remixed, and some are previously unreleased edits/versions.

[Mosh]

The problem is that compilations are really obsolete these days, especially for prog bands where the complete album experience is very important. I'm almost positive that SW and Spock's are releasing these comps specifically aimed at existing fans who already have the material but are going to buy it anyway because they're completionists. If you're fine with that, then by all means buy it. But I don't see what's wrong with feeling disappointed that they would do that in the first place.

There are lots of great compilations from before the days of digital downloading that actually work as ways of reeling in new fans (which is what a compilation is supposed to do). Most relevant example has to be Classic Yes. It's a single disc, isn't overpriced, does a good job at showing the new listener the different sides of the band at the time, while appropriately focusing on the increasingly progressive direction they were taking.

[hefdaddy42]

Why be disappointed?  They just released a new album, so it's not like you are missing out on anything that this collection replaced. If it is something you want, great. If not, don't buy it. But there is nothing disappointing.

I got the new collection for Christmas, and although I haven't had time to listen to the discs yet, the documentary was fantastic. The packaging is really nice as well. It's a great value.

[Kwyjibo]

I'm not interested in the remixes, the discs I own sound fine enough and I probably don't even hear the differences, I'm not interested in the documentary (well maybe mildly) because I see myself watching it once an then shelf it. I'm not interested in a compilation because I already have most of the songs and when I listen to the Beard I normally listen to complete albums start to finish, and not a song compilation or playlist or whatever.

The only thing I'm interested in is the new song, and to have it I have to buy all the things I'm not interested in for 20+ Euros. That's a bit steep and that is why I'm disappointed.

[hefdaddy42]

Well, the only reason there IS a new song is because of the compilation to celebrate 20 years.  So I don't blame the band one bit for doing it this way. 

The documentary has a TON of footage of classic SB playing from Progfest in 1997.  Lots of Neal with long hair lol.

Also, listened to the new song Falling to Forever this morning on the ride in to work.  Wow, really cool tune.  Definitely sounds like Spock's Beard.  Lots of great melodies, fantastic playing and composition, the drum duet is pretty cool.

[kirksnosehair]

Yeah, I'm actually quite happy with the purchase, too.  The video content alone was worth it.  The new track and remastered classic tracks are bonus material as far as I'm concerned.


This is marketing 101.  I get the disappointment, but it's not like this is a new thing they're doing.  Bands have been putting out compilations like this for decades and they almost always toss an extra something in there to try to entice the existing fans to buy.  They'd be idiots if they didn't. 

[devieira73]

tô purchase ll, the only reason there IS a new song is because of the compilation to celebrate 20 years.  So I don't blame the band one bit for doing it this way. 

The documentary has a TON of footage of classic SB playing from Progfest in 1997.  Lots of Neal with long hair lol.

Also, listened to the new song Falling to Forever this morning on the ride in to work.  Wow, really cool tune.  Definitely sounds like Spock's Beard.  Lots of great melodies, fantastic playing and composition, the drum duet is pretty cool.

Any idea of how much time of live footage and what songs? I'm still in the fence to purchase it... specially because of the price of the delivery and taxes. But I purchased the new song alone at iTunes - it was possible when it was just released.
  Thanks!
PS By the way, falling. .. is a fantastic song! 

[hefdaddy42]

The entire documentary is around one hour, 45 minutes, I believe.  A large portion is performance from the 1997 Progfest, maybe as much as half of the runtime.  The rest is interviews with every member, starting with the forming of the band, all of the struggles they dealt with (including working with Kevin Gilbert, and how his death affected the band), on through Snow and Neal leaving, Nick taking over lead vocals and bringing in Jimmy Keegan on drums, and then Nick leaving and bringing in Ted Leonard.  It's all-encompassing, with other old behind-the-scenes footage (rehearsal, other stuff).

Also, finished my listen of disc one.  The remixes are really good.  Everything is crisp, clear, lush, and warm.  It sounds fantastic, and it's a good group of songs as well.

[devieira73]

Thanks a lot for all the detailed info!

[hefdaddy42]

We aim to please.

You aim too, please.

[The Letter M]

This seemed like a good of a place as any to announce that my Spock's Beard survivor is now UP AND RUNNING, so please check it out! Thanks!

-Marc.

[Mindflux]

Snow and The Kindness of Strangers Vinyls up for preorder on RadiantRecords.com

Both available in black or clear.


Their shipping is a bit bonkers though.