Why is every intersection not a rotary?

[Chino]

This weekend in CT, I encountered three rotaries. That's two more than I usually do. I think they are better than intersections in literally every way. Why are these not a thing everywhere? There's no stopping, and you can safely blow through them at 40mph.

[El Barto]

Learning curve
Pedestrian access
Larger footprint

I think the learning curve is the biggest issue, myself. Those things are nearly unheard of way down here, and you throw one of them up and we'll be crashing into each other all over the place. Once everybody gets the hang of it it probably is an improvement in many ways, but the early deployment would really cause a lot of problems.

[Chino]

I can see how in cities space could be an issue if the intersection has already been built traditionally.

[gmillerdrake]

They are pretty common in the outlying cities in St. Louis. I can think of a good (10) locations where they are around here. I like them as well, it takes a really good effort on someone's part NOT to understand what's going on there.

[Stadler]

I'm with Chino; they are awesome.  But you only need one moron to screw up the entire program.   

[Scorpion]

I'm afraid I don't know the term - what's a rotary?

[Kwyjibo]

I think it's what we call "Kreisverkehr"

[Kotowboy]

It's what most people call a "Roundabout" 

[ich bin besser]

Very efficient - even more when people would use the indicator when leaving it.

[Chino]

Get out of here with all your foreigny words!

[Big Hath]

roundabout, rotary, traffic circle, etc

[Kotowboy]

TRAFFIC CIRCLE

It's funny hearing an american sat nav go " Take the first exit on the 'RODAREE' "

[Stadler]

I think it's what we call "Kreisverkehr"

No one calls it that.  No one. 

[TioJorge]

Man, I don't know any of those terms and have no idea what this is. 

But with how people drive where I am, I'm really glad I don't know because everyone driving in them would be dead. Because people around here like to think that when cars smash together they softly caress one another and make tiny little baby cars after the ever so gentle collision.

Apparently.

But I just looked it up and yeah, fuck that. I mean, awesome! But...for where I live...fuck that.

[ich bin besser]

https://www.wimp.com/testroundabout/

[Chino]

I can't watch that at the moment, what'd they find?

[cramx3]

Only ever heard them called Roundabouts and I personally dislike them.  Yes it does help with traffic flow, assuming people aren't idiots, but that is a poor assumption and leads to my dislike to them in general.  They are more popular in Europe and I only know of one in NJ (which is fairly large, but always seems to confuse people).  NJ is also probably the worst place to use this (or best depending on how you feel) since you cannot even make left turns at intersections 

[TioJorge]

I stopped watching at the 8 minute mark because it's a moot point. For this to be a realistic scenario (for Chino's question, that is), you need realistic circumstances. First off, a few hundred individual drivers (hell, even then, that's a pretty small amount), not the handful that they have; you also need real-world circumstances...new drivers, dipshit people who drive while talking, texting, inebriated, children in the back screaming at each other and pooping all over the place, your wife giving you road-head (or prostitute, of course, duh), etc.

If this were implemented in the US, despite every opportunity to learn the ways of the roundabout, there'd be people driving up to it freaking out because they didn't learn and/or weren't taught properly. I mean hell, I encounter people every single day that still do not get a four-way stop; zero exaggeration there. The four-way stop has been a thing since most drivers who aren't wrinkled up and blind were born and people still can't keep their shit together. Keep in mind...I'm in Texas.

I get it for their 'myth-busing' purpose, but for your question, Chino...it's kind of useless and doesn't answer the question properly even a little. In my opinion, the true answer is: Cause 'murica. We have to do shit different just for the sake of doing so for almost every aspect of our society, it seems...even if it's undeniably worse.

(YES, I AM A TRUE PATRIOT) 

[El Barto]

I can't watch that at the moment, what'd they find?

Roundabout was about 30% more efficient. They used a simple, single lane version. I'd be curious to know what happens in a more complex, multi-lane roundabout. I'd also be curious how it compared to a properly controlled intersection with decent light timings (including flashing yellows).

[Chino]

I can't watch that at the moment, what'd they find?

Roundabout was about 30% more efficient. They used a simple, single lane version. I'd be curious to know what happens in a more complex, multi-lane roundabout. I'd also be curious how it compared to a properly controlled intersection with decent light timings (including flashing yellows).

Did they mention anything about fuel? I bet rotaries save thousands of gallons a year.

[El Barto]

I can't watch that at the moment, what'd they find?

Roundabout was about 30% more efficient. They used a simple, single lane version. I'd be curious to know what happens in a more complex, multi-lane roundabout. I'd also be curious how it compared to a properly controlled intersection with decent light timings (including flashing yellows).

Did they mention anything about fuel? I bet rotaries save thousands of gallons a year.

Not sure if that'd be the case or not. Idling uses very little fuel. Accelerating does, though, and the roundabout still requires a near stop and acceleration back to speed. Probably an improvement, but not necessarily a huge one. Moreover, I'm still thinking that better traffic management through signalling would make a huge difference. That might be one of the instances where we really could use Skynet.

[Chino]

Found this.

https://www.carmel.in.gov//index.aspx?page=123

In Carmel, where roundabouts have replaced signals or stop signs at intersections, the number of injury accidents has been reduced by about 80 percent and the number of accidents overall by about 40 percent. Our numbers are similar to those reported by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety.

[SystematicThought]

I'm all for roundabouts in place of four way stops. No one knows what to do at a four way stop or they'll go just as you're about to go. There's bound to be issues with roundabouts, but I think they are way easier to understand then four way stops.

Anyone else slow down at four way stops when they see another car coming at the other corner or speed up depending on how far away they are?

[TAC]

Get out of here with all your foreigny words!

Drove through that very rotary for 5 1/2 years on my way to work!

[cramx3]

Anyone else slow down at four way stops when they see another car coming at the other corner or speed up depending on how far away they are?

uh what?  Four way stop means you stop, so I don't care about anyone else I go my own speed until the intersection and then stop. Then right of way takes rule.

[Fiery Winds]

Anyone else slow down at four way stops when they see another car coming at the other corner or speed up depending on how far away they are?

uh what?  Four way stop means you stop, so I don't care about anyone else I go my own speed until the intersection and then stop. Then right of way takes rule.

I think he means adjusting your speed to not arrive at the same time, avoiding the game of semaphore to decide who wants to be the more considerate driver.

[SystematicThought]

Yeah, that's what I meant. I apologize, I should have been more clear.

I just hate playing that game because even if they have the right of way, they don't always realize that and then it gets messy sometimes

[Calvin6s]

I think he means adjusting your speed to not arrive at the same time, avoiding the game of semaphore to decide who wants to be the more considerate driver.

They already have rules for that though.  Although it appears some don't seem to get it.  It is more about being overly courteous or overly jerky when the real problems happen.

There is a roundabout that I pass through about 1 to 3x a year on average.  It is dual lane, so that adds to the confusion considering roundabouts are already highly uncommon.  It seems to work great until their is heavy traffic.  Then it is a nightmare.

[El Barto]

Anyone else slow down at four way stops when they see another car coming at the other corner or speed up depending on how far away they are?

uh what?  Four way stop means you stop, so I don't care about anyone else I go my own speed until the intersection and then stop. Then right of way takes rule.

I think he means adjusting your speed to not arrive at the same time, avoiding the game of semaphore to decide who wants to be the more considerate driver.

Yeah, I'm pretty proactive about that. The problem is that if you try to be last, no matter how slowly you keep rolling some people are just terrified that you're going to plow through the intersection and t-bone them at 4 mph. Some people just won't go until there's no movement anywhere within a 4 block radius.

They already have rules for that though.  Although it appears some don't seem to get it.  It is more about being overly courteous or overly jerky when the real problems happen.

Rules don't cover everything, and nobody seems to agree on them anyway. Four way stops are an instance where coordinated social order is more important than the state vehicle code.

[Chino]

Get out of here with all your foreigny words!

Drove through that very rotary for 5 1/2 years on my way to work!

It's one of my favorites. It's huge.

[TioJorge]

Slut.

[Dr. DTVT]

Roundabouts work great for some intersections, but if it is a low traffic density intersection, 2 way or 4 way stop signs are usually sufficient.  Barto nailed the cons of roundabouts pretty well, with size being the big one.

They are great for high density, low speed intersections though.

[Calvin6s]

They already have rules for that though.  Although it appears some don't seem to get it.  It is more about being overly courteous or overly jerky when the real problems happen.

Rules don't cover everything, and nobody seems to agree on them anyway. Four way stops are an instance where coordinated social order is more important than the state vehicle code.

At an intersection controlled by stop signs in all directions, you must yield the right-of-way to…

•Another vehicle that has already come to a full stop at the intersection

•A vehicle on your immediate right that has stopped at the intersection at the same time as you. Confusion can develop at four-way stop intersections.

-You should try to make eye contact with the drivers of other vehicles at the intersection to better judge their intentions and avoid accidents.


Read More: The Rules of a Four-Way Stop Intersection | https://fun107.com/the-rules-of-a-four-way-stop-intersection/?trackback=tsmclip

The confusion only comes from those that don't know the rules, not the rule itself.  It is clear.  And with so few rules for that instance, there is no excuse to not know them.

And it mostly comes down to confusion and jerks, but not the rules.  And the 4mph t-bone is legitimate.  Accidents are a pain in the ass even on small scales.  It could mean not having your car for 1 to 7 days.   I avoided the lowest speed side swipe collision possible just a couple months ago.  Slow as in it took 30 minutes to drive a 1/4 mile.  Jerks gonna be jerks.  Has nothing to do with the rules being unclear.

[TioJorge]

pooper-scoopers are fun.

[Nick]

For suburban to rural areas, I'm fine with roundabouts.

For anything urban or busy I wish them to die a fiery death. My area just last week had a PENNdot assessment to suggest 20-30 roundabout spots (they are unheard of here, right now), and I am not looking forward to them being implemented.