Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence vs Black Clouds & Silver Linings

[Outcrier]

Both discs (individually) are better than BC&SL 

[manticore999]

There's just no comparison between one of their greatest works - 6DOIT - and one of their weakest (BC&SL).  You're not even comparing apples to apples!

[Nearmyth]

1. TGP = No RORORORO DAY AFTA DAY

2. Blind Faith = No Bebot Solo

4. The Great Debate = A new song - not a medley.

6. SDOIT = No MAH BRUTHA SUCKIN ON HIS PIPE

 

Cracking up because I read this as the reasons those songs should lose, like "TGP sucks because it doesn't have RORORO"

[Octavarious]

I don't even have to do a song by song.  This is not a fair matchup.  6DOIT by miles and miles and miles.

No. Just no. This is not even a contest. I like BCASL plenty, but the best off BCASL would equal about the worst off SDOIT at best.

These. The only similarity is they both have 6 "songs".

Six Degrees for Every Track.

I love The Count Of Tuscany but Six Degrees is just light years better.

Approved and signed.

[TAC]

There are 2 things that 6D's clearly has over BC&SL.

1. 6 D's has a freshness of ideas from a band "on the rise" compared to BC&SL where it feels the band has truly "settled in".
2. The sound is way more pleasant on the ears.

That said, if you just look at the songs, to me, they are quite comparable.

Both have two songs that I absolutely love, which I would rank like this:
Disappear
TCOT
TBOT
Blind Faith

The first three are Top 15 tracks for me and BF might be Top 20.

Both have openers that, to me, are a chore to get through. Both feel bloated.

Track by track:

The Glass Prison vs A Nightmare To Remember
Like I said, it's a chore to get through both. I am not in love with ANTR, but no track in DT's discography has aged worse to me than TGP.

Bind Faith vs A Rite Of Passage
No contest here

Misunderstood vs. Wither
No contest here

The Great Debate vs The Shattered Fortress
The Great Debate is bloated too, but The Shatered Fortress was a huge disappointment. It ends pretty good, but maybe I'm just happy it finally ends.

Disappear vs The Best Of Times
I give the slight edge to Disappear, but I LOVE TBOT and both are upper echelon tracks to me.

Six Degrees vs The Count Of Tuscany
TCOT is incredible, where as 6 D's might be the biggest waste of a continuous 40 minutes in DT's catalog. Talk about mailing it in..

I do give 6 D's the edge but in no way does 6 D's "wipe the floor" with BC&SL.

[Zook]

...in no way does 6 D's "wipe the floor" with BC&SL.

Yuh huh!

The Glass Prison is DT's most bad ass song, and the quickest 14 minutes ever. In no way is it a chore. A chore would be having to edit a song just to make it listenable, which is the case for ANTR.

Not much to say about Blind Faith other than comparing it to AROP is an insult to Blind Faith.

The only thing I could complain about with Misunderstood is its ending, and the song itself took ages for me to appreciate, but I'd still take it over Wither, although Wither isn't a bad song.

I love The Shattered Fortress and The Great Debate. TSF has Portnoy's silly shouting, and TGD has that awful soundbite of the woman talking about god's will that makes me want to strangle her cause she's so dumb... The Great Debate easily.

Disappear is a made up story with so much emotion and creepiness that you'd think it was real. TBOT does not have the greatest lyrics, and if MP planned to never perform it live than it should have been a B-side.

TCOT is a monster of a song with the cheesiest b-movie style lyrics, but that's what makes it so great. It still can't compare to the even bigger monster that is Six Degrees. By far the quickest and most satisfying 42 minutes ever. Not a single complaint about this song, although I will say I used to think the Overture overstayed its welcome.

So yeah, opinions.

[TAC]

Yuh huh!

Nuh huh!! 

[Sacul]

Six Degrees wipes the floor with Black Clouds.

I don't even have to do a song by song.  This is not a fair matchup.  6DOIT by miles and miles and miles.

[Crow]

compares Images and Words to Octavarium because why not yolo

1. Pull Me Under vs. The Root of All Evil
TROAE is in my top 5, next

2. Another Day vs. The Answer Lies Within
TALW is nice but Another Day is just a much better ballad in every way.

3. Take The Time vs. These Walls
Take The Time is in my top 5, next

4. Surrounded vs. I Walk Beside You
Surrounded wins this one no contest.

5. Metropolis vs. Panic Attack
Panic Attack is great and all but Metropolis is Metropolis.

6. Under A Glass Moon vs. Never Enough
I like these both for completely different reasons but I'd definitely prefer UAGM at any given moment

7. Wait For Sleep vs. Sacrificed Sons
Somewhat unfair since I've never cared for Wait for Sleep much anyways, but yeah, Sacrificed Sons takes this one

8. Learning to Live vs. Octavarium
Battle of the "super-popular songs that I like but am not as crazy as most people over". That being said, Octavarium is my preferred choice.

So Images and Words took 5/8 matchups.
5/8. Nuggetz.
5 + 8 = 13 -> DT13 confirmed to be a rerelease of Images And Words

 

[JediKnight1969]

The Glass Prison vs A Nightmare To Remember

Bind Faith vs A Rite Of Passage

Misunderstood vs. Wither

The Great Debate vs The Shattered Fortress.

Disappear vs The Best Of Times

Six Degrees vs The Count Of Tuscany

[Ħ]

I cannot imagine giving it to Black Clouds. Six Degrees, no question. It's like asking: Dream Theater, or Metallica? The right answer is obvious.

[TheOutlawXanadu]

TGP vs ANTR
BF vs AROP
Misunderstood vs Wither
TGD vs TSF
Disappear vs TBOT
SDOIT vs TCOT

[bosk1]

I don't even have to do a song by song.  This is not a fair matchup.  6DOIT by miles and miles and miles.

No. Just no. This is not even a contest. I like BCASL plenty, but the best off BCASL would equal about the worst off SDOIT at best.

These. The only similarity is they both have 6 "songs".

Six Degrees for Every Track.

I love The Count Of Tuscany but Six Degrees is just light years better.

Pretty much all of this.  And not that Black Clouds doesn't have some greatness--it does.  But it does not even come close to Six Degrees for me.

The 'sucking on is pipe' and 'day after day' sections are mind numbingly horrible...

I like you a lot, but this is a fail of such epic proportion that I cannot even begin to respond.

[hefdaddy42]

Not sure how you don't see it, bosky.

[bosk1]

There is nothing "horrible" to see.  They are both great.

[hefdaddy42]

There is nothing "horrible" to see.  They are both great.

You think "Sucking on his pipe" is a "great" lyric?

[Prog Snob]

No issue here with TCOT lyrics but the "day after day"  grunts don't appease me.

[bosk1]

There is nothing "horrible" to see.  They are both great.

You think "Sucking on his pipe" is a "great" lyric?

I thought we were talking about that whole section (since the post is about the "sucking on his pipe section"), not just those 4 isolated words of the lyrics.  I'm not sure I would consider those lyrics "great," but they are certainly serviceable and convey what they are supposed to convey.  There is certainly nothing remotely approaching "mind numbingly horrible" about them.

[hefdaddy42]

There is nothing "horrible" to see.  They are both great.

You think "Sucking on his pipe" is a "great" lyric?

I thought we were talking about that whole section (since the post is about the "sucking on his pipe section"), not just those 4 isolated words of the lyrics.  I'm not sure I would consider those lyrics "great," but they are certainly serviceable and convey what they are supposed to convey.  There is certainly nothing remotely approaching "mind numbingly horrible" about them.

We can talk about those 4 words, that whole section, or the entire song, if you want, and I think they lean pretty far toward both mind-numbing and horrible, although I wouldn't necessarily combine the adjectives in that manner.  They are not serviceable.  They are, at best, unnecessarily cheesy, and at worst, just bad.

Which fits with much of the rest of the album.  So I am inclined to chalk it up to the album version of a bad day at the office.  The vast majority of albums before this show a much higher level of songcraft and lyrics, as do the two following albums, so it's not a big deal.  But I'm not going to pretend it's good, or serviceable, when I don't think it is either.

If you like it, then great. 

[bosk1]

...I think they lean pretty far toward both mind-numbing and horrible, although I wouldn't necessarily combine the adjectives in that manner.  They are not serviceable.  They are, at best, unnecessarily cheesy, and at worst, just bad.

That's fine if you think so.  You are certainly entitled to feel that way.  But for me, I cannot fathom any criteria that would put those sections in the same zip code as "bad."

[hefdaddy42]

*shrugs* 

Not sure how to see them in any other way.

[BlobVanDam]

There is nothing "horrible" to see.  They are both great.

You think "Sucking on his pipe" is a "great" lyric?

I thought we were talking about that whole section (since the post is about the "sucking on his pipe section"), not just those 4 isolated words of the lyrics.  I'm not sure I would consider those lyrics "great," but they are certainly serviceable and convey what they are supposed to convey.  There is certainly nothing remotely approaching "mind numbingly horrible" about them.

We can talk about those 4 words, that whole section, or the entire song, if you want, and I think they lean pretty far toward both mind-numbing and horrible, although I wouldn't necessarily combine the adjectives in that manner.  They are not serviceable.  They are, at best, unnecessarily cheesy, and at worst, just bad.

Which fits with much of the rest of the album.  So I am inclined to chalk it up to the album version of a bad day at the office.  The vast majority of albums before this show a much higher level of songcraft and lyrics, as do the two following albums, so it's not a big deal.  But I'm not going to pretend it's good, or serviceable, when I don't think it is either.

If you like it, then great. 

That's just like your opinion man.

[hefdaddy42]

Yeah, I know.

But it's not JUST mine.

[Dream Team]

The Glass Prison
Blind Faith
Wither
The Great Debate
Disappear
The Count of Tuscany

Yup, and especially:
Blind Faith>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>AROP

[DreamerTV]

I don't even have to do a song by song.  This is not a fair matchup.  6DOIT by miles and miles and miles.

[Zydar]

I don't even have to do a song by song.  This is not a fair matchup.  6DOIT by miles and miles and miles.

Pretty much.

[Dublagent66]

More like lightyears.  Miles doesn't even begin to measure the distance.

[Zook]

I don't think you can single out "sucking on his pipe". That whole passage is silly as fuck. I never minded the lyrics though. There are certainly worse out there.

[Dublagent66]

I think you can single out both "sucking on his pipe" and "day after day".  Lyrical, vocal and maybe even musical low points of those 2 songs.  Good thing those songs are long enough with a bunch of other really good material that the lows don't detract too much.

[FlyingBIZKIT]

SDOIT by miles and miles. The only remotely close matchup is TCOT and Six Degrees, but SDOIT is my favorite DT song so that's just tough luck for BC&SL.

[Cable]

All 6DOIT wins track by track for me.

[Dublagent66]

^that.

[bosk1]

Same here.  But Blind Faith only won because of the track sequence.  If it went up against ANTR, TSF, or TCOT, it would have been done for.

[Madman Shepherd]

I think every 6DOIT song beats every BC&SL song although the song 6DOIT might lose out to CoT if it wasn't for the terrible lyrics of CoT.  Musically, CoT may be better it is just too hard to judge it with the lyrics and subject matter in place.  I loved SDOIT when it came out but that song got pretty old for me pretty fast.  Whether DT wants to admit it or not, I cannot think of that song as one whole song.  It seems very disjointed to me. 

[BlackInk]

If all of TCoT was as good as its first few minutes and the short bits just before the break, then it would be musically better than SDoIT. Unfortunately, the music beneath the verses is pretty dull. The choruses are musically okay, but nothing special. So SDoIT all the way, musically and lyrically.