Author Topic: The Iron Maiden Thread v. The Merge of Souls  (Read 89363 times)

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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #105 on: March 23, 2015, 01:47:44 PM »
It's still my favorite tour from them.

I wish there was a professional recording from that tour.  Ive seen the Paris boot so I got the idea of how the show looked and all, but that tour really deserved a proper video.

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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #106 on: March 23, 2015, 02:21:07 PM »
It's still my favorite tour from them.

I wish there was a professional recording from that tour.  Ive seen the Paris boot so I got the idea of how the show looked and all, but that tour really deserved a proper video.
Have you seen the bootleg from Troy NY? I think I've had the boot since 1988 and it's still one of my all time favorite boots.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzDfYZK1nSM

The Sheffield '86 one is pretty good too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBADdLUvidA
Bruce sounds terrible!
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #107 on: March 23, 2015, 02:33:56 PM »
People like myself who didn't become fans until after reunion, see the album from a different view (maybe because synths in metal is common?). 

I became a fan post-reunion and SiT and SSoaSS are toward the bottom of my rankings, and 2 of their albums (along with FotD) that I never listen to (the only one I do not have is NPftD).
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #108 on: March 23, 2015, 02:48:20 PM »
You're missing out on some good stuff there, Chris. Lots of great songs on FOTD.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #109 on: March 23, 2015, 02:59:40 PM »
and thats where I disagree... FotD and NPftD are two of their worst albums, sure a few good songs, but not good albums.

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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #110 on: March 23, 2015, 03:02:23 PM »
No Prayer is definitely one of their worst, but Fear Of The Dark is to me, 8 songs deep. It was the first album they made in the CD age, and is about 3 songs way too long. Now in its totality, Fear is definitely near the bottom, so I think we are in agreement somewhat.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #111 on: March 23, 2015, 03:36:42 PM »
The only worthwhile songs on Fear are Afraid to Shoot Strangers and Judas Be My Guide, imho. The title track is extremely boring in the studio version, and the rest is just awful. I'd take No Prayer over it any day of the week. The title track on that one is better than the entirety of Fear already.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #112 on: March 23, 2015, 03:46:52 PM »
I remember when No Prayer came out and it was clear right away that it was their weakest album. But when Fear came out I was so happy that Maiden was rocking again. Yeah some definite filler but lots of great tunes.
And while the title track is so freaking amazing live, and we've had 23 years worth of live versions, I vividly remember rolling down my windows and cranking the motherfucker out.

One major issue that Fear has is that it is easily Bruce's worst performance on a Maiden album.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #113 on: March 23, 2015, 03:49:27 PM »
I loved Somewhere In Time on release, but it was the first album by Maiden that people kind of went "huh" towards, and at the time, Seventh Son was a massive disappointment for a lot of people. Which sounds unbelievable given that a lot of people love it massively today, but back then it just didn't work well with Maiden's US fanbase at least. It grew on me over the years, but I still prefer SiT to it.

No Prayer is the worse Dickinson album and Fear of the Dark is about four songs too long.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #114 on: March 23, 2015, 03:57:27 PM »
No Prayer is the worse Dickinson album and Fear of the Dark is about four songs too long.
Agreed.

and at the time, Seventh Son was a massive disappointment for a lot of people. Which sounds unbelievable given that a lot of people love it massively today, but back then it just didn't work well with Maiden's US fanbase at least.
The people I knew loved it, but its issue, to me, was that Can I Play With Madness sucks, and it made a horrible single. Not sure any non Maiden fan could relate to it, and for Maiden fans, it was way to heavy on the keyboards, especially in the chorus. Thankfully the rest of the album kicked ass. I think if they had released The Evil That Men Do first, it would've had more of a chance.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #115 on: March 23, 2015, 04:13:10 PM »
I actually loved Can I Play With Madness when I first started getting into IM, likely cause it was a single so it was a song I had come across that sparked my interest... but yea now that I am knowledgable in their entire catalogue, its not a good song in comparison and I wish theyd stop playing it live.

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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #116 on: March 23, 2015, 04:15:15 PM »
I can say without a doubt that No Prayer is the worst Bruce album. I honestly don't even know what other album would even come into the discussion.

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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #117 on: March 23, 2015, 04:16:26 PM »
I can say without a doubt that No Prayer is the worst Bruce album. I honestly don't even know what other album would even come into the discussion.

Id only rate V11 as a worse IM album but that doesnt have Bruce and Im not even sure it is a worse album.  The good songs on that album are better than the good songs on NPftD.

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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #118 on: March 23, 2015, 04:16:44 PM »
I can say without a doubt that No Prayer is the worst Bruce album. I honestly don't even know what other album would even come into the discussion.

If you had been reading the thread, you would know that Fear of the Dark comes into the discussion. :P
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #119 on: March 23, 2015, 04:18:24 PM »
I can say without a doubt that No Prayer is the worst Bruce album. I honestly don't even know what other album would even come into the discussion.

Id only rate V11 as a worse IM album but that doesnt have Bruce and Im not even sure it is a worse album. The good songs on that album are better than the good songs on NPftD.
Bolded for truth.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #120 on: March 23, 2015, 04:24:43 PM »
I'll never understand the disdain for No Prayer. I mean yes, you have some terrible songs like Bring Your Daughter, but there are some really good songs as well - the title track, for instance, is one of Maiden's finest.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #121 on: March 23, 2015, 04:26:24 PM »
I'll never understand the disdain for No Prayer. I mean yes, you have some terrible songs like Bring Your Daughter, but there are some really good songs as well - the title track, for instance, is one of Maiden's finest.

This.  And Run Silent Run Deep, Assassin.

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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #122 on: March 23, 2015, 04:30:36 PM »
The standout songs on No Prayer do so due to them swimming in a stew of utter mediocrity. They are a decade old twinkie when you've been homeless and eating garbage for years. On any other album they'd be middle of the road tracks.

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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #123 on: March 23, 2015, 04:40:27 PM »
I'll never understand the disdain for No Prayer. I mean yes, you have some terrible songs like Bring Your Daughter, but there are some really good songs as well - the title track, for instance, is one of Maiden's finest.

This.  And Run Silent Run Deep, Assassin.
Run Silent Run Deep has an awesome chorus and solo section, but the verse is pretty bad. But overall, I am a fan of the song and it makes my No Prayer Of The Dark mashup.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #124 on: March 23, 2015, 05:09:39 PM »
I'll never understand the disdain for No Prayer. I mean yes, you have some terrible songs like Bring Your Daughter, but there are some really good songs as well - the title track, for instance, is one of Maiden's finest.

This.  And Run Silent Run Deep, Assassin.
Run Silent Run Deep has an awesome chorus and solo section, but the verse is pretty bad. But overall, I am a fan of the song and it makes my No Prayer Of The Dark mashup.

It'd make mine too, for the solo section whcih I enjoy.  The title track is my favorite from the album though and really the only song that I think would still stand out on another IM album.

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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #125 on: March 23, 2015, 05:36:11 PM »
See, to me, Fear of the Dark is definitely the weakest Maiden album. It's not even close. It has about five songs I would ever even consider going out of my way to listen to (title track, Afraid to Shoot Strangers, Wasting Love, Judas Be My Guide, maybe Be Quick or Be Dead), and the rest is quite mediocre. Chains of Misery, The Apparition and Weekend Warrior are clearly Maiden's three worst songs. The album has some pretty strong standouts, but as an actual album-length listening experience, it's just not very good.

No Prayer for the Dying isn't great, and is probably my second-least-favorite Maiden album, but it's miles ahead of Fear. The first two songs are duds, but the title song through Run Silent Run Deep is actually a pretty good run. Hooks In You and Bring Your Daughter... to the Slaughter are pretty weird and mediocre, but the album finishes strong with Mother Russia. Fear's best songs are the best songs from either album, but it is not that good of a listening experience as an album start-to-finish, while No Prayer is pretty decent in that regard.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #126 on: March 23, 2015, 05:43:11 PM »
I'll never understand the disdain for No Prayer. I mean yes, you have some terrible songs like Bring Your Daughter, but there are some really good songs as well - the title track, for instance, is one of Maiden's finest.

This.  And Run Silent Run Deep, Assassin.
Run Silent Run Deep has an awesome chorus and solo section, but the verse is pretty bad. But overall, I am a fan of the song and it makes my No Prayer Of The Dark mashup.

It'd make mine too, for the solo section whcih I enjoy.  The title track is my favorite from the album though and really the only song that I think would still stand out on another IM album.
Agreed. It's a Top 15 Maiden track from me. I recorded the show in Providence on that tour, and Bruce has a great intro to it. He remarks that he is 32 years old, hopes he comes back when he's 42.
I would also like to say that this tour was AWESOME! So much energy coming from the band as Janick really pulled Dave out of his shell.
Plus the simple stage with a backline of endless Marshalls was very cool.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #127 on: March 23, 2015, 05:45:40 PM »
I'll never understand the disdain for No Prayer. I mean yes, you have some terrible songs like Bring Your Daughter, but there are some really good songs as well - the title track, for instance, is one of Maiden's finest.

This.  And Run Silent Run Deep, Assassin.
Run Silent Run Deep has an awesome chorus and solo section, but the verse is pretty bad. But overall, I am a fan of the song and it makes my No Prayer Of The Dark mashup.

It'd make mine too, for the solo section whcih I enjoy.  The title track is my favorite from the album though and really the only song that I think would still stand out on another IM album.
Agreed. It's a Top 15 Maiden track from me. I recorded the show in Providence on that tour, and Bruce has a great intro to it. He remarks that he is 32 years old, hopes he comes back when he's 42.
I would also like to say that this tour was AWESOME! So much energy coming from the band as Janick really pulled Dave out of his shell.
Plus the simple stage with a backline of endless Marshalls was very cool.

Thats awesome, and Ive seen boots from this tour too and noticed it had the simple stage and more of a raw feel to it, which I guess is what they aimed for with the album as well, just didn't churn out good songs IMO.

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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #128 on: March 23, 2015, 05:45:50 PM »
No Prayer is the worse Dickinson album and Fear of the Dark is about four songs too long.
Agreed.

and at the time, Seventh Son was a massive disappointment for a lot of people. Which sounds unbelievable given that a lot of people love it massively today, but back then it just didn't work well with Maiden's US fanbase at least.
The people I knew loved it, but its issue, to me, was that Can I Play With Madness sucks, and it made a horrible single. Not sure any non Maiden fan could relate to it, and for Maiden fans, it was way to heavy on the keyboards, especially in the chorus. Thankfully the rest of the album kicked ass. I think if they had released The Evil That Men Do first, it would've had more of a chance.

Huh. I love Can I Play With Madness.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #129 on: March 23, 2015, 05:46:48 PM »
Chains of Misery, The Apparition and Weekend Warrior are clearly Maiden's three worst songs.
Well, at least on this album. I actually like Chains Of Misery as it would make a decent B Side, but it's definitely not worthy of making the album.
I know a lot of people don't care for it, but I love Fear Is The Key. Has a great solo part, and Bruce does a wicked Ian Gillan.
And Childhood's End is awesome!

No Prayer is the worse Dickinson album and Fear of the Dark is about four songs too long.
Agreed.

and at the time, Seventh Son was a massive disappointment for a lot of people. Which sounds unbelievable given that a lot of people love it massively today, but back then it just didn't work well with Maiden's US fanbase at least.
The people I knew loved it, but its issue, to me, was that Can I Play With Madness sucks, and it made a horrible single. Not sure any non Maiden fan could relate to it, and for Maiden fans, it was way to heavy on the keyboards, especially in the chorus. Thankfully the rest of the album kicked ass. I think if they had released The Evil That Men Do first, it would've had more of a chance.

Huh. I love Can I Play With Madness.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #130 on: March 23, 2015, 05:51:03 PM »
Cram, going back to the '91 tour, the setlist was cool too.
After opening with Tailgunner and Public Enema #1 (which is a great song with a horrid title) they went full bore into:
Wrathchild
Die With Your Boots On
Hallowed Be Thy Name
22 Acacia Avenue

So 40 minutes into the set and it was like getting hit with a ton of bricks!
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #131 on: March 23, 2015, 05:54:41 PM »
See, to me, Fear of the Dark is definitely the weakest Maiden album. It's not even close. It has about five songs I would ever even consider going out of my way to listen to (title track, Afraid to Shoot Strangers, Wasting Love, Judas Be My Guide, maybe Be Quick or Be Dead), and the rest is quite mediocre. Chains of Misery, The Apparition and Weekend Warrior are clearly Maiden's three worst songs. The album has some pretty strong standouts, but as an actual album-length listening experience, it's just not very good.

No Prayer for the Dying isn't great, and is probably my second-least-favorite Maiden album, but it's miles ahead of Fear. The first two songs are duds, but the title song through Run Silent Run Deep is actually a pretty good run. Hooks In You and Bring Your Daughter... to the Slaughter are pretty weird and mediocre, but the album finishes strong with Mother Russia. Fear's best songs are the best songs from either album, but it is not that good of a listening experience as an album start-to-finish, while No Prayer is pretty decent in that regard.

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Virtual XI is *BY FAR* IM's worst album.    No Prayer is the worst Bruce album.   I can't believe people debate it.   Afraid and the title track alone completely blow away every single track from No Prayer.      Fear is not IM's best work, and it is near the bottom, but it was a step up from No Prayer....that album is just horrible.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #132 on: March 23, 2015, 05:59:02 PM »
J Dude, half of VXI is awesome though.
Futureal, The Clansman, The Educated Fool, and Don't Look To The Eyes Of A Stranger.
And while the "Don't look to..." part is about 16 bars too long, that wicked instrumental section at the end more than makes up for it.

If there was one Blaze era track that I'd like to see them pull out, it'd be The Educated Fool.

Edit: and I'm not trying to make VXI sound better than it is. It and No Prayer are still the two worst Maiden albums.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #133 on: March 23, 2015, 06:02:47 PM »
See, to me, Fear of the Dark is definitely the weakest Maiden album. It's not even close. It has about five songs I would ever even consider going out of my way to listen to (title track, Afraid to Shoot Strangers, Wasting Love, Judas Be My Guide, maybe Be Quick or Be Dead), and the rest is quite mediocre. Chains of Misery, The Apparition and Weekend Warrior are clearly Maiden's three worst songs. The album has some pretty strong standouts, but as an actual album-length listening experience, it's just not very good.

No Prayer for the Dying isn't great, and is probably my second-least-favorite Maiden album, but it's miles ahead of Fear. The first two songs are duds, but the title song through Run Silent Run Deep is actually a pretty good run. Hooks In You and Bring Your Daughter... to the Slaughter are pretty weird and mediocre, but the album finishes strong with Mother Russia. Fear's best songs are the best songs from either album, but it is not that good of a listening experience as an album start-to-finish, while No Prayer is pretty decent in that regard.

The Angel and the Gambler, Lightning Strikes Twice and When Two Worlds Collide would like to have a word with you. 

Virtual XI is *BY FAR* IM's worst album.    No Prayer is the worst Bruce album.   I can't believe people debate it.   Afraid and the title track alone completely blow away every single track from No Prayer.      Fear is not IM's best work, and it is near the bottom, but it was a step up from No Prayer....that album is just horrible.

I can. It's called having an opinion. Geez.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #134 on: March 23, 2015, 06:07:52 PM »
J Dude, half of VXI is awesome though.
Futureal, The Clansman, The Educated Fool, and Don't Look To The Eyes Of A Stranger.
And while the "Don't look to..." part is about 16 bars too long, that wicked instrumental section at the end more than makes up for it.

If there was one Blaze era track that I'd like to see them pull out, it'd be The Educated Fool.

Edit: and I'm not trying to make VXI sound better than it is. It and No Prayer are still the two worst Maiden albums.

Wow, you and are have such similar opinions here.  Educated Fool would be the best Bruce song if they ever were to pull another one out (which I doubt).

Cram, going back to the '91 tour, the setlist was cool too.
After opening with Tailgunner and Public Enema #1 (which is a great song with a horrid title) they went full bore into:
Wrathchild
Die With Your Boots On
Hallowed Be Thy Name
22 Acacia Avenue

So 40 minutes into the set and it was like getting hit with a ton of bricks!

Yea I liked how that tour they through Hallowed in the beginning of the set, shake it up a bit although I think thats a better closer.

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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #135 on: March 23, 2015, 06:11:53 PM »
Educated Fool would be the best Bruce song if they ever were to pull another one out (which I doubt).

Absolutely. Bruce could take that chorus to places that Blaze could only dream of.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #136 on: March 23, 2015, 06:26:13 PM »
The Angel and the Gambler, Lightning Strikes Twice and When Two Worlds Collide would like to have a word with you. 

Virtual XI is *BY FAR* IM's worst album.

Virtual XI is a solid album front to back. It exceeds both Fear and No Prayer. I don't know what else it would beat off the top of my head but I think it might put up a solid challenge to both Di'Anno albums. TAATG is the weakest song on the disc, but I would rather listen to it than half of Fear of the Dark. Same with WTWC and LST.


No Prayer is the worst Bruce album.   I can't believe people debate it.   Afraid and the title track alone completely blow away every single track from No Prayer.   Fear is not IM's best work, and it is near the bottom, but it was a step up from No Prayer....that album is just horrible.

Ah, if only FOTD was just those two songs and NPFTD was just its two best songs. Then FOTD would win. However, as an album, FOTD is way more mediocre, with just those two highlights, while NPFTD has numerous highlights throughout the album that make it a better listening experience as a whole.


J Dude, half of VXI is awesome though.
Futureal, The Clansman, The Educated Fool, and Don't Look To The Eyes Of A Stranger.
And while the "Don't look to..." part is about 16 bars too long, that wicked instrumental section at the end more than makes up for it.

If there was one Blaze era track that I'd like to see them pull out, it'd be The Educated Fool.

Don't Look to the Eyes of a Stranger is actually really cool musically. It's just too repetitive lyrically and vocally. VXI's main problem, in my opinion, is production. That and the fact that Blaze, god bless the guy, was pushed a little too far out of his element on this album. He's really good on The X Factor, though.
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #137 on: March 23, 2015, 06:30:58 PM »
VXI's main problem, in my opinion, is production. That and the fact that Blaze, god bless the guy, was pushed a little too far out of his element on this album. He's really good on The X Factor, though.
He's great on TXF.

But I liken VXI to FOTD in that they each follow quite different style of Maiden albums, and both go for the more comfortable Maiden stylings. That, in the end, did not suit Blaze.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #138 on: March 23, 2015, 06:56:51 PM »
V11's biggest problems are the production and TAATG, that song alone ruins the album in many ways for me although it came on random the other day and I thought it sounded better than I remembered it although it still sucked.

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Re: THE El Dorado Thread (and other Iron Maiden related musings)
« Reply #139 on: March 23, 2015, 07:04:12 PM »
In my opinion TAATG is a really cool song with a good vibe... that should be quite a bit shorter. The number of chorus repetitions hurts it quite a bit. As a 5 or 6 minute song it would be very good.


But I liken VXI to FOTD in that they each follow quite different style of Maiden albums, and both go for the more comfortable Maiden stylings. That, in the end, did not suit Blaze.

That's true, though I would add that Virtual XI provides much of the prototype for the more progressive style of songwriting that reached a greater expression on the four reunion albums. A lot of what Brave New World sounds like the VXI songwriting style refined and focused with a better production and the addition of Adrian and Bruce both as performers and songwriters. I don't think BNW would have happened the same way if not for VXI (not to mention the fact that several BNW songs were actually written in 1998 and considered for VXI, if memory serves: The Nomad, The Mercenary and maybe another one, speculated to be Blood Brothers?).
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