Most obscure/Underrated awesome Dream Theater song.

[Sycsa]

Innocence Faded. Hands down JLB's best performance ever and the solo at the end is fantastic as well.

[bl5150]

Innocence Faded. Hands down JLB's best performance ever and the solo at the end is fantastic as well.

Good one...............that guitar outro is right up there with my favourite JP moments ever.

[chaossystem]

Four songs that immediately come to mind because they either get a lot of HATE on here, or are just ignored or overlooked, are:

1) As I Am
2) The Root of All Evil
3) Forsaken
4) A Rite of Passage

These are all among my favorite songs, and they are all songs that I seem to be one of the FEW people who will stand up for them and defend them.

[hefdaddy42]

I'm not sure why any songs need anyone to defend them.

Having said that, your first two choices there are thought of mostly favorably here, in my experience.  And a good number like the other two, as well (although I don't particularly).

[jjrock88]

Four songs that immediately come to mind because they either get a lot of HATE on here, or are just ignored or overlooked, are:

1) As I Am
2) The Root of All Evil
3) Forsaken
4) A Rite of Passage

These are all among my favorite songs, and they are all songs that I seem to be one of the FEW people who will stand up for them and defend them.

I really like Forsaken too

[Nearmyth]

Where Are You Now?

I never see that one. Then again, all of CotC kind of belongs here.

[TheGreatPretender]

Where Are You Now?

I never see that one. Then again, all of CotC kind of belongs here.

I'd say "The Way It Used To Be", but yeah, when talking about obscure, it's definitely one of the ones from the FII sessions. At least Speak To Me, Cover My Eyes and Raise The Knife got official live releases. But all of them were good.

But then again, I think there's a difference between obscure and underrated. When it comes to underrated, I'd give it to Peruvian Skies, just for the fact that I think it's an amazing track, and it rarely ever gets mentioned. At least on DTF.

[Mosh]

That's a good one. It's a really great song but for some reason it doesn't resonate with me the way some of their others do. Something there doesn't click all the way.

[wasteland]

"Don't Look Past Me", and I can't believe I am the first to mention it. It's one of my favorite B-Sides and it really should have been on IAW.

This one, really. An early masterpiece of a song that I really wish one day will make its live debut, despite all the technical challanges it poses to the performers.

"When someone says "my heart needs lifting"
don't ask "how come", ask "how high".

[seasonsinthesky]

At least Speak To Me, Cover My Eyes and Raise The Knife got official live releases. But all of them were good.

"Speak to Me" in studio form was also released officially with the Japanese FII bonus disc. i bet it's cheaper than trying to buy COTC!

my vote goes to "Bombay Vindaloo." i have a crazy stupid love for that jam that no one ever talks about. Live at the Marquee in general is one of my top-listened DT releases – studio reparations or not, James completely kills on the whole disc, even better than on I&W.

[bl5150]

my vote goes to "Bombay Vindaloo."

   Came to mind for me too.

[Prog Snob]

At least Speak To Me, Cover My Eyes and Raise The Knife got official live releases. But all of them were good.

"Speak to Me" in studio form was also released officially with the Japanese FII bonus disc. i bet it's cheaper than trying to buy COTC!

my vote goes to "Bombay Vindaloo." i have a crazy stupid love for that jam that no one ever talks about. Live at the Marquee in general is one of my top-listened DT releases – studio reparations or not, James completely kills on the whole disc, even better than on I&W.

Good call with Bombay Vindaloo.  One of my favorite JP moments.

[425]

But then again, I think there's a difference between obscure and underrated. When it comes to underrated, I'd give it to Peruvian Skies, just for the fact that I think it's an amazing track, and it rarely ever gets mentioned. At least on DTF.

See, in my view, Peruvian Skies gets way more praise than it deserves. Opinions, I guess.

[Prog Snob]

But then again, I think there's a difference between obscure and underrated. When it comes to underrated, I'd give it to Peruvian Skies, just for the fact that I think it's an amazing track, and it rarely ever gets mentioned. At least on DTF.

See, in my view, Peruvian Skies gets way more praise than it deserves. Opinions, I guess.

I think it sticks out pretty well if you consider the CD it appears on.  It really didn't have too much competition.

[TAC]

"When someone says "my heart needs lifting"
don't ask "how come", ask "how high".

Such a great line.

[Mosh]

But then again, I think there's a difference between obscure and underrated. When it comes to underrated, I'd give it to Peruvian Skies, just for the fact that I think it's an amazing track, and it rarely ever gets mentioned. At least on DTF.

See, in my view, Peruvian Skies gets way more praise than it deserves. Opinions, I guess.

I think it sticks out pretty well if you consider the CD it appears on.  It really didn't have too much competition.

I disagree. I think it fits in well with most of the album and there's a lot of great stuff on there. Only 3 or 4 songs I dislike really. Granted that's a lot for a DT album, but there are still like 7 songs on there I can enjoy.

[ToT-147]

I'll go for the Majesty-era:

        -Cry for Freedom
        -A Vision                           
        -March of the Tyrant

At least deserve to be mentioned.. (JM rules on these songs.. I know, Chris Collins kind of ruins them a bit, but they also deserve to be heard )

[425]

I think Peruvian Skies is one of the three weakest songs on FII, along with You Not Me and Anna Lee.

[Prog Snob]

I'll go for the Majesty-era:

        -Cry for Freedom
        -A Vision                           
        -March of the Tyrant

At least deserve to be mentioned.. (JM rules on these songs.. I know, Chris Collins kind of ruins them a bit, but they also deserve to be heard )

March of the Tyrant is a good song.

I think Peruvian Skies is one of the three weakest songs on FII, along with You Not Me and Anna Lee.

I definitely agree with the latter two. You Not Me is just....sad especially considering what they left off the CD. 

[425]

See, I actually somewhat like You Not Me, but it's certainly not as good as the other songs on FII. I don't know any of the non-album tracks beside Raise the Knife (which is excellent) that well because (aside from RTK) I only have them in demo form, which I find hard to listen to.

[Prog Snob]

See, I actually somewhat like You Not Me, but it's certainly not as good as the other songs on FII. I don't know any of the non-album tracks beside Raise the Knife (which is excellent) that well because (aside from RTK) I only have them in demo form, which I find hard to listen to.

They are worth the listen, especially The Way It Used To Be. Heavily U2 inspired if you like that sort of thing.

[Stadler]

See, I actually somewhat like You Not Me, but it's certainly not as good as the other songs on FII. I don't know any of the non-album tracks beside Raise the Knife (which is excellent) that well because (aside from RTK) I only have them in demo form, which I find hard to listen to.

"Demo form" as in boots, or "demo form" as in on the Ytsejam releases?  If the latter, what is hard to listen to about those? 

[hefdaddy42]

Yeah, the only form that RTK is available in  (other than the live version from SCORE) is in demo form.  It sounds fine, as do the other FII demos.

[cramx3]

Yea pretty much all those FII songs that didnt make it to the album are pretty decent quality.

I will add this:

RAW DOG

So much hate but its a fun song IMO

[The Presence of Frenemies]

The thing that really makes The Way It Used To Be work for me is the big solo at the end, which is something U2 wouldn't do.

[Rodni Demental]

RAW DOG

Surprised it took this far into the thread for someone mention this.  Although it certainly didn't cross my mind.

It's definitely obscure, and I think it's pretty awesome for what it is. It's a bit hard to compare in the normal sense because it was built to create a mood and used in a theatrical way for dramatic and atmospheric effect. And I personally think it does that very well. I find it a bit unfair to compare it to more developed songs and it doesn't really hold up in this regard, but I still think it's pretty badass for what it is. Quite experimental too which is exactly what I like to see with DT and possibly one of the heaviest tracks they've made.

"Don't Look Past Me", and I can't believe I am the first to mention it. It's one of my favorite B-Sides and it really should have been on IAW.

I think it sounds like it was more suited for WDADU. It just sounds more like a song from that album than from I&W at least to me. It's kind of got similar 'flow' to the WDADU songs. I think it was the right call to not include it on I&W because I don't think it's as strong as the rest of those songs, BUT then again I doubt it would necessarily have done any harm to add a bit more diversity to the album. And both albums certainly had enough space for more tracks.

[hefdaddy42]

RAW DOG

It's definitely obscure, and I think it's pretty awesome for what it is. It's a bit hard to compare in the normal sense because it was built to create a mood and used in a theatrical way for dramatic and atmospheric effect. And I personally think it does that very well. I find it a bit unfair to compare it to more developed songs and it doesn't really hold up in this regard, but I still think it's pretty badass for what it is.

What are you talking about?  Why shouldn't it be compared to other songs?  It's a song.

[Rodni Demental]

I dunno, it's just so many aspects about it's creation are not exactly typical for DT. It was made for dramatic effect for a sound track for a videogame. Sure it's a song. It does have a weird structure though that reflects various themes intended to create different atmospheres, almost like a game developer could pick and choose which section creates the appropriate mood theatrically for whatever cutscene or environment the section is used in. Not to mention the song is written to be an infinite loop.

I think with some of these things in mind, the band's intent was very different to almost anything else they've written. To answer your question, I'm not saying it shouldn't be compared to other songs, I'm just saying it's so different from the ground up and doesn't really work as well as a stand alone song as it does within the context of what it was written for. So I just find the comparison a bit partial because you could say it's getting relatively judged, slightly out of context. Nothing wrong with comparing things on their own, it's just more an observation regarding these comparisons to other instrumentals or songs.

[ToT-147]

RAW DOG

It was made for dramatic effect for a sound track for a videogame. It does have a weird structure though that reflects various themes intended to create different atmospheres, almost like a game developer could pick and choose which section creates the appropriate mood theatrically for whatever cutscene or environment the section is used in. Not to mention the song is written to be an infinite loop.

No.. The track wasn't intended for the game, but for an album about it.. I quote from Wikipedia: "The God of War: Blood & Metal EP is a heavy metal homage by various bands on the Roadrunner Records label, and features original music inspired by the God of War video game series."

It doesn't appear (nor Raw Dog, nor any of the other songs) IN the game.. I assure you that, I've played the whole game (great one btw..) So unless you have the "repeat" option turned on, the track won't be looping  at all..

PS: Yeah, Raw Dog is indeed obscured and pretty underrated, though is not "awesome" IMO.. Is just good.. (Despite having one the best JP's solo..)

[Rodni Demental]

It's not in the game? Really? Okay. This is surprising to me, although I admit I haven't actually played God of War 3 but thanks for clearing that up. What I do remember is that it was used on the title screen (where it infinitely loops) and during the sort of montage trailer during the pre-release demo (it might still be on the PSN store?). So I kinda just assumed it would have been presented in a similar style for the full game. Guess not. 

[hefdaddy42]

It's not in the game? Really? Okay. This is surprising to me, although I admit I haven't actually played God of War 3 but thanks for clearing that up. What I do remember is that it was used on the title screen (where it infinitely loops) and during the sort of montage trailer during the pre-release demo (it might still be on the PSN store?). So I kinda just assumed it would have been presented in a similar style for the full game. Guess not. 

It's been kind of common knowledge ever since the game came out.

So, the song is a composed song, just like any other.  And judged that way, it come up alarmingly short.

[Zook]

The music in the God of War games is much better than Raw Dog anyway.

[mike099]

Misunderstood

[425]

See, I actually somewhat like You Not Me, but it's certainly not as good as the other songs on FII. I don't know any of the non-album tracks beside Raise the Knife (which is excellent) that well because (aside from RTK) I only have them in demo form, which I find hard to listen to.

"Demo form" as in boots, or "demo form" as in on the Ytsejam releases?  If the latter, what is hard to listen to about those?

Demo form as in Ytse Jam. Which is practically unlistenable for me (I'm pretty sensitive to certain types of poor sound quality, admittedly). The bass is WAY too far forward in the mix and the whole thing sounds just muddy and distant. Like it was recorded in somebody's garage. Which I don't fault the band for or anything, because it is a demo and wasn't meant for public consumption, but that's why I don't ever listen to those songs. If I had a properly mixed version, like I do for Raise the Knife (Score), then I would be able to listen to those songs and have a formed opinion on them. As is, I just can't do it.

[Rodni Demental]

We must be talking about the same thing and maybe you are just quite sensitive to the sound quality. But from what you describe, it sounds like you're talking about the Awake demos, or the second half of the I&W pre-production demos because they sound like they were recorded in a garage. The FII demos really sound just fine to me. Sure they're just not quite as polished as a finished studio album, but it's not far off.

On a related note, I've heard various comments about Cleaning out the Closet tracks sounding clearer than the FII demos. Is there any truth to this?