Author Topic: The history of U2 v. Discography Thread: Songs of Innocence (Read 23038 times)

KevShmev · « **Reply #140 on:** April 08, 2015, 04:12:48 PM »

Quote from: ReaperKK on April 07, 2015, 09:15:40 PM

I finished October and I loved it. I liked it a lot more than Boy. "Tomorrow is such a great song. My thoughts on the first couple albums is that I either love the songs or I think they are meh. So far I can't think of anything that is terrible. I would listen to War tonight but I can't really give it that much attention.

I agree with that.

Quote from: ReaperKK on April 07, 2015, 09:15:56 PM

btw Kev, I hope you finish this Discog discussion.

I will. I was considering just spitting out some real quick reviews of the remaining albums in a quick fashion to get it over with, since actual discussion was lagging, but if we can get some good discussions going here, I will do it at the normal pace.

Quote from: Kotowboy on April 08, 2015, 05:51:18 AM

The discussion for POP will be interesting

Let's hope so.

Quote from: kingshmegland on April 08, 2015, 06:25:55 AM

Zooropa was the first album that disappointed me with U2. While Lemon and Stay were fantastic songs, Numb was that bad. My favorite song on the album though was the title track and the rest of the album was fair to poor.

Hard to disagree. Songs like Bayface and Some Days Are Better Than Others are totally forgettable. And a song like The First Time isn't bad, but it's just kind of there; they have a million other slower songs that are better.

Quote from: hefdaddy42 on April 08, 2015, 07:44:51 AM

I'm about halfway through my re-listen of Zooropa. The opening track was interesting, but after that, the best thing so far is Numb.

It's not that it's bad, it's just so different that it's a little shocking to me.

Yeah. While it has stylistic similarities to Achtung Baby, it is still different enough to generate a WTF response to it.

hefdaddy42 · « **Reply #141 on:** April 09, 2015, 07:34:53 AM »

Finished my listen.

I enjoyed it, it's a good album, but for me, it's so different from their earlier stuff that it's hard to associate it with U2 and accurately quantize it.

It's weird, man.

KevShmev · « **Reply #142 on:** April 09, 2015, 04:29:23 PM »

Speaking of weird...

With my interest slightly reignited in the mid 90s thanks to finally getting into AB and then the fantastic "Hold Me, Thrill Me, Kiss Me, Kill Me" single from Batman Forever, I bought Pop shortly after it came out, once I heard "Staring at the Sun," which I thought was great and still do. I even overlooked "Discothèque" being a dog shit of a lead single. Sadly, the rest of the album did not measure up to "Staring at the Sun." I've always liked the lead guitar melody in "Do You Feel Loved," but it still sounds like they were just a tad off it making it great. I do like "Mofo" quite a bit, although the shorter live version was better, and "Gone," "Wake Up Dead Man," "Last Night on Earth" and "Please" are all good. The rest is mostly a miss, however. It sounds like an album that was rushed, which is because, well, it was. The band already their tour dates set for the PopMart tour, and ran out of time to finish the album, so they just released it as is, and it is something they have regretted since. Overall, I will say that I like the album, but it's a bit disheartening when you hear how much unrealized potential is in a lot of those songs. That aside, there is a bit of charm in it that you won't find in any other U2 album.

erwinrafael · « **Reply #143 on:** April 09, 2015, 08:07:32 PM »

Pop to me is a very misunderstood album. It was the first U2 album I was able to buy with my own money.

King Postwhore · « **Reply #144 on:** April 09, 2015, 08:43:41 PM »

If I remember Kev, they were rushed to finish the album because the tour was all set. They feel that this album was unfinished. I agree with everything in your write up. I too absolutely love Staring At The Sun.

Kotowboy · « **Reply #145 on:** April 10, 2015, 05:54:23 AM »

There are more finished versions on the 1990-2000 best of package.

I like pretty much the first half. After that it's a bit meh overall.

Also it's mostly drum loops since Larry hurt his back and was absent for most of it.

A lot of the songs were much better live and the Popmart DVD is a spectacle.

I think it still sold over 5 million copies though which is good for such a weak album.

A much better album was to come IMO...

hefdaddy42 · « **Reply #146 on:** April 10, 2015, 08:00:54 AM »

I'll give this a listen sometime this weekend, but if memory serves, I wasn't impressed with this one on release.

KevShmev · « **Reply #147 on:** April 10, 2015, 07:47:30 PM »

Listening to this today, there really is so much untapped potential in many of these songs. Like I said before, there is a certain charm about this album that does make it likable.

Kotowboy, I disagree that a much better album was coming. Not to jump ahead here, but while All That You Can't Leave Behind is good, it sounds very safe and vanilla at times, almost in the sense of "Hey, let's write songs in the classic U2 vein again." While having its clear flaws, Pop does manage to show that the band was still full of creativity; they simply ran out of time in the studio to piece it all together perfectly.

King Postwhore · « **Reply #148 on:** April 10, 2015, 08:55:34 PM »

I disagree with you Kev and I'll explain when we get to that album.

KevShmev · « **Reply #149 on:** April 10, 2015, 08:58:48 PM »

Sure you will. I'm still waiting on those high and lows from Achtung Baby...

Kotowboy · « **Reply #150 on:** April 11, 2015, 04:22:59 AM »

I liked their image during the POP cycle.

For whatever reason U2 can pull off that stuff without looking completely stupid.

If any other band wore those outfits and had that Popmart tour - they'd be laughed out of town.

I'd have LOVED to have seen Popmart at Wembley Stadium.

Just jumping ahead slightly - the first time I heard "Beautiful Day" my reaction was " oh it's about time ".

King Postwhore · « **Reply #151 on:** April 11, 2015, 04:44:23 AM »

Quote from: KevShmev on April 10, 2015, 08:58:48 PM

Sure you will. I'm still waiting on those high and lows from Achtung Baby...

Oh crap! Vi forgot! Lol. The non hits were just average songs to me. Nothing mind blowing but the single were incredibly good. Still a great album.

hefdaddy42 · « **Reply #152 on:** April 11, 2015, 05:58:39 AM »

Just started my re-listen.

KevShmev · « **Reply #153 on:** April 11, 2015, 06:58:17 AM »

Quote from: Kotowboy on April 11, 2015, 04:22:59 AM

Just jumping ahead slightly - the first time I heard "Beautiful Day" my reaction was " oh it's about time ".

I remember many having a similar reaction when the "Sweetest Thing" single came out in 1998. That was kind of a return to the pre-electronics U2 sound. Very simple, with just vocal, guitar, bass, piano and drums (and a string accompaniment at times). Sure, it was a reworking of a song from the JT sessions, but I think the timing of that release was U2 saying that they knew what sound their fans wanted them to go back to.

King Postwhore · « **Reply #154 on:** April 11, 2015, 07:59:25 AM »

The electronica was fine. The song structures were not and the hooks were less. That's what they went back to on the next album.

KevShmev · « **Reply #155 on:** April 11, 2015, 08:20:57 AM »

Perhaps.

Also, this is my favorite version of Mofo (it's a shortened version of the Phunk Force remix):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugTCo8WN__4

That song was integral for me getting into their 90s stuff again back in '09.

hefdaddy42 · « **Reply #156 on:** April 11, 2015, 08:45:56 AM »

Quote from: hefdaddy42 on April 11, 2015, 05:58:39 AM

Just started my re-listen.

I finished. Not my favorite album. Kind of like Zooropa.

KevShmev · « **Reply #157 on:** April 12, 2015, 07:13:20 AM »

The band's 10th studio album, All That You Can't Leave Behind, has long been considered a return to form following the disappointments that were Zooropa and Pop, neither of which had any long-lasting, wide-appeal classics. When you think of the many songs that are considered must-plays at most U2 concerts, those albums have none; ATCLB has three: "Beautiful Day," "Walk On" and "Elevation." I like "Beautiful Day," but it's become one of those good songs I never feel like listening to. I get why it was and is still so popular, regardless. "Walk On" is the best of the bunch. I used to hate "Stuck in a Moment That You Can't Get Out Of," but I've come around to liking it quite a bit. For my money, the best two of the best songs from this record are "Kite" and "When I Look at the World." The rest of the album is pretty forgettable. I used to kind of like "New York," but it's just kind of there for me now.

Getting back to the album as a whole, it's clear the band was trying to recapture their classic sound, and while some of the 90s elements are still very present, I'd say they were pretty successful in that regard. Bono at the time remarked that they were "reapplying for the job of the best band in the world," which is a pretty arrogant thing to say, but, well, it's Bono.

The success of this album was kind of a double-edged sword, as it was nice to see the band doing well again, but I think the success here is what resulted in them thinking, "Hey, let's write some hits," on later albums, instead of just writing and letting the chips fall where they may. And later jumping into bed with both Apple and Live Nation are two of the more disappointing things they've ever done, neither of which possibly happens without the resurgence generated by the popularity of this album. Those acts have made them less appealing as both rock musicians and people, although their bottom line ($$$) has obviously won out big time, so what do I know?

King Postwhore · « **Reply #158 on:** April 12, 2015, 07:21:24 AM »

I think you're off on this one Kev. After the last 2 albums they needed to get back to basics and write songs that their fan base could relate to and that started with hooks. While they lost that punk edge to them (and that comes with age) they got back to writing songs people could relate to and could sing to.

I personally felt they lost a bit of melody with them experimenting. Yes they still had tunes that we still liked but as a whole album something was missing on Zooropa and Pop. The stripped the sound down, concentrated on melody and hooks and they got their mojo back.

KevShmev · « **Reply #159 on:** April 12, 2015, 07:55:04 AM »

I agree with you for the most part, but I guess I look at this album as them playing it safe, almost like it was their reaction to the fans' reaction to the last two albums, and I would have liked to have seen where they would have gone next after Pop had they continued on that route, especially since they admit that Pop was rushed, but instead of staying on that path and doing it right the next time, they went the safe route. Don't get me wrong, I like the album, and five songs from it are on my U2 mp3 CD in my car, but I just wonder what could have been...

King Postwhore · « **Reply #160 on:** April 12, 2015, 07:57:41 AM »

A agree but I think they needed to play it safe. Look at every time they go experimental. We'll adress this again with "No Line"

KevShmev · « **Reply #161 on:** April 12, 2015, 08:42:42 AM »

Well, I know you aren't as big on it as most are, but they went experimental on Achtung Baby, and that was an overwhelming success.

Granted, you can't expect every experimental try to be that kind of success, but it seems like Zooropa was a "let's write and release an album in the middle of a tour" effort, and Pop was rushed for the aforementioned reasons, so they never really took the time to write another album in that vein. That is all I am saying.

King Postwhore · « **Reply #162 on:** April 12, 2015, 09:12:55 AM »

No, I liked that album a lot. For a bands success, you can do it like Achtung baby and get it right because in the end, it's the songwriting and the melody that outshines the experimental. but when the experimental outshines the melody when you are a popular band, it hurts. Now at the time 5 million sales compared to 10 million sales seems weird to say but U2 hit another level that only a few do.

Jaq · « **Reply #163 on:** April 12, 2015, 09:27:36 AM »

Personally for me as a casual fan, this was the album that made me say "Oh, good, U2 finally remembered how to be U2 again." To me, there's a difference between playing it safe and "doing what you do best." Sometimes experimentation is great, but it helps if you're experimenting in ways that you're actually good at. I never thought U2 was particularly good at being an electronic band, but they're awesome at being a straight up rock band. I think part of the problem was that they got away with it on Achtung Baby and figured the public would eat up anything they tried for a while. (And they did, since selling five million back then was pretty damned impressive.) I just think they're better working in their comfort zone myself.

Kotowboy · « **Reply #164 on:** April 12, 2015, 09:57:26 AM »

All That You Can't Leave Behind was pretty much my soundtrack to 2000 along with :

• Standing on the shoulder of giants.

• Stories from the city. Stories from the sea.

Great album. But the next album was disappointing for me.

KevShmev · « **Reply #165 on:** April 12, 2015, 10:01:25 AM »

I remember hearing Beautiful Day in 2000 and thinking it sounded like a return to form, but while I liked it, I was so awash in Scenes from Memory and getting into Transatlantic, The Flower Kings and Spock's Beard, that it was barely a blip on my radar. I was in full prog snob mode at that point

, and Beautiful Day was not that great as to pull me out of it. It probably didn't help that none of my friends at the time listened to them, so there was no one in my ear telling me to listen to this album. Hell, most friends I have still don't really listen to them.

King Postwhore · « **Reply #166 on:** April 12, 2015, 10:03:29 AM »

I think it was waaaaaay overplayed. Every time they we're on a talk show, SNL, MTV awards, ECT... they played that song. That's what made me not like it anymore.

ReaperKK · « **Reply #167 on:** April 14, 2015, 06:10:07 AM »

Alright so I was gone for the weekend I didn't really listen to much but I did check out War and the albums just keep getting better. I'm really surprised by how much I actually like U2. This album just flows perfectly and IMO there isn't really any misses, plus it has my favorite U2 song to date "40".

hefdaddy42 · « **Reply #168 on:** April 14, 2015, 06:44:18 AM »

All That You Can't Leave Behind is U2 being back, baby! What a glorious return to everything I liked about them in the first place!

ReaperKK · « **Reply #169 on:** April 14, 2015, 09:58:31 AM »

Just finished The Unforgettable Fire and really I wasn't a fan. Aside from Bad and Pride everything else was just ok. The sound also had this polished 80's feel that I wasn't digging. I'm starting to realize I'm not a fan of Brian Eno.

KevShmev · « **Reply #170 on:** April 14, 2015, 06:43:25 PM »

I love some of the songs on TUF, but I agree that the production is a bit lacking at times. It's kind of muddy, which was a stark contrast to War. I think Eno had to get used to U2, and vice versa.

Cyclopssss · « **Reply #171 on:** April 15, 2015, 05:26:56 AM »

it's too unballanced, but the good tracks (titletrack, Pride, A sort of homecoming, Bad) are so increddibly good it's ridiculous. On topic: All that you can't leave behind was good, but they dropped in quality again on the next release, unfortunately....

Kotowboy · « **Reply #172 on:** April 15, 2015, 05:27:47 AM »

Quote from: ReaperKK on April 14, 2015, 09:58:31 AM

Just finished The Unforgettable Fire and really I wasn't a fan. Aside from Bad and Pride everything else was just ok. The sound also had this polished 80's feel that I wasn't digging. I'm starting to realize I'm not a fan of Brian Eno.

I hate all his 2000s albums with the band. Eno notoriously hates distorted guitar yet he produces U2 who

are a rock band. All his albums sound horribly compressed and castrated.

Whenever there's a dirty guitar part it's nearly always panned to one side and mixed low when it should

be upfront and double tracked.

Songs of innocence might be their first album where they sound like an actual rock band.

Kotowboy · « **Reply #173 on:** April 16, 2015, 02:31:51 AM »

Elevation from Boston is a great DVD though. Some fantastic versions of songs. Such as Bullet The Blue Sky, Beautiful Day, The Fly and Streets.

.... Jumping ahead slightly - Vertigo. A great song and a pretty weak album IMO. Miracle Drug is With or Without You part 2. But Sometimes you can't make it is brilliant.

Their 2000 albums all had one really dull song on imo.

Leave Behind : Grace.
Atomic Bomb : One Step Closer
Horizon : White As Snow.

ReaperKK · « **Reply #174 on:** April 16, 2015, 09:02:00 AM »

Just got through The Joshua Tree and it was incredible, every song on the album was great. They seemed to really hit their stride.

News: Track-by-track video for Fall Into the Light: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ezfzdMpRc0

Author Topic: The history of U2 v. Discography Thread: Songs of Innocence (Read 23038 times)