Author Topic: 2016 vote 3rd party  (Read 2785 times)

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Offline TempusVox

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Re: 2016 vote 3rd party
« Reply #35 on: January 11, 2015, 11:35:34 PM »
Mrs Vox, as many of you know, had been for many years an LD and Chief of Staff for several members of the House and Senate. She also worked as a K Street Lobbyist; and today owns her own political election consulting group. Having seen the machinations firsthand from my view, I can share with you with absolute certainty, that without campaign finance reform not only will things not improve but they will continue to deteriorate.

And the ONLY way that will happen is if we have a Presidential candidate who can so polarize the entire nation that he/she makes that the central focus of their campaign. I mean someone who is not afraid to take on even their own party. Someone as honest as Abe Lincoln, with the wisdom of Solomon, the patience of Ghandi, the charisma of Sean Connery, the grit of John Wayne, and the ability to lead us all like Jesus Christ. Basically, we need a miracle. I mean someone who can so rile the American populace that we're ready to follow the President down 14th street, pitchforks and torches in hand, ready to throw the bums out and burn the Capitol to the ground if need be. Otherwise, it ain't getting any better.

And as for Limbaugh and his ilk, they terrify me. They spew their acidic Tea Party bullshit to their loyal worshippers and rile them up to a fever pitch. I've been a republican all my life, and the Tea Party scares the shit out of me. Seriously. I haven't heard hate speak like that since Al-Queda, Isis, and the Nazi Party.
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Offline Stadler

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Re: 2016 vote 3rd party
« Reply #36 on: January 12, 2015, 12:00:42 PM »
And as for Limbaugh and his ilk, they terrify me. They spew their acidic Tea Party bullshit to their loyal worshippers and rile them up to a fever pitch. I've been a republican all my life, and the Tea Party scares the shit out of me. Seriously. I haven't heard hate speak like that since Al-Queda, Isis, and the Nazi Party.

I get why you say that, and in concept I agree (meaning, I believe the Tea Party will be the end of the Republican Party if we're not careful, and given the two party system - specifically the other party - that will spell the end of the republic) but the hyperbole is a little much.  There is hate and acid and bile in more places than just the Tea Party, and in some - albeit few - instances, the "acid" of the right serves to temper and negate the "base" of the left.   The only difference between the far left and the far right is that, lately, the far right has been too often taken the unfortunate strategy that "the best defense is a good offense", and as such have continually offer up some pretty ridiculous sound bites. 

Offline TempusVox

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Re: 2016 vote 3rd party
« Reply #37 on: January 12, 2015, 01:06:00 PM »
I'm not so sure Stadler it's hyperbole. I've lived and traveled all over the world. But SW Ohio has always been "home" to me. It also happens to be one of the most conservative places in the U.S.

I have several friends from high school, most of whom are properly and formerly educated, who through the years have been served the Tea Party Kool-Aid who regularly spew the most vitriolic, hateful, paranoid bullshit. I mean people who are convinced Obama is the anti-Christ (funny 5 years ago you swore it was Hillary); think all foreigners are not to be trusted, and should be deported; believe mosques should all be shuttered closed; and that all queers and homos just aren't praying hard enough. It's all the same far right, sky is fallng Tea Party paranoid, delusional bullshit. It's hate speech really. Most of them listen to far right conservative talk radio (which is HUGE in this market), and they get all riled up and regurgitate like the sheeple...sorry, "Dittoheads", they've become.

And these are people I grew up with, most of whom would NEVER have believed that way, but without the Tea Party hate being tossed their way.

My wife is a Democrat (actually she's probably far too conservative to some of her friends on the extreme left), and the democrats have their own issues as well; but nothing like what the Tea Party gets fired up when their machine gets stoked and started.

Anymore it seems you're demanded to be extremely red, or extremely blue; when the reality is most of us are very purple. We have too much extremism in this world today, and not enough tolerance, respect, and   cooperation.

It's pathetic and scary. And to me, its reminiscent of what's been described as the early beginnings of Nazi Germany.  And the absolute irony if that statement is that many Tea Party devotees cry that refrain over the current state of our government, when it's they who sound like they'll be duckwalking down tbe strasse next.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2015, 01:11:07 PM by TempusVox »
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Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: 2016 vote 3rd party
« Reply #38 on: January 12, 2015, 01:26:49 PM »
Someone as honest as Abe Lincoln, with the wisdom of Solomon, the patience of Ghandi, the charisma of Sean Connery, the grit of John Wayne, and the ability to lead us all like Jesus Christ.

FINE.....I'll do it!  :biggrin: :lol    :loser:
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Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: 2016 vote 3rd party
« Reply #39 on: January 13, 2015, 06:22:30 AM »
I'm not so sure Stadler it's hyperbole. I've lived and traveled all over the world. But SW Ohio has always been "home" to me. It also happens to be one of the most conservative places in the U.S.

I have several friends from high school, most of whom are properly and formerly educated, who through the years have been served the Tea Party Kool-Aid who regularly spew the most vitriolic, hateful, paranoid bullshit. I mean people who are convinced Obama is the anti-Christ (funny 5 years ago you swore it was Hillary); think all foreigners are not to be trusted, and should be deported; believe mosques should all be shuttered closed; and that all queers and homos just aren't praying hard enough. It's all the same far right, sky is fallng Tea Party paranoid, delusional bullshit. It's hate speech really. Most of them listen to far right conservative talk radio (which is HUGE in this market), and they get all riled up and regurgitate like the sheeple...sorry, "Dittoheads", they've become.

And these are people I grew up with, most of whom would NEVER have believed that way, but without the Tea Party hate being tossed their way.

My wife is a Democrat (actually she's probably far too conservative to some of her friends on the extreme left), and the democrats have their own issues as well; but nothing like what the Tea Party gets fired up when their machine gets stoked and started.

Anymore it seems you're demanded to be extremely red, or extremely blue; when the reality is most of us are very purple. We have too much extremism in this world today, and not enough tolerance, respect, and   cooperation.

It's pathetic and scary. And to me, its reminiscent of what's been described as the early beginnings of Nazi Germany.  And the absolute irony if that statement is that many Tea Party devotees cry that refrain over the current state of our government, when it's they who sound like they'll be duckwalking down tbe strasse next.
I live in NW North Carolina, and it's almost the same here.
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Offline Stadler

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Re: 2016 vote 3rd party
« Reply #40 on: January 13, 2015, 09:43:00 AM »
I'm not so sure Stadler it's hyperbole. I've lived and traveled all over the world. But SW Ohio has always been "home" to me. It also happens to be one of the most conservative places in the U.S.

I have several friends from high school, most of whom are properly and formerly educated, who through the years have been served the Tea Party Kool-Aid who regularly spew the most vitriolic, hateful, paranoid bullshit. I mean people who are convinced Obama is the anti-Christ (funny 5 years ago you swore it was Hillary); think all foreigners are not to be trusted, and should be deported; believe mosques should all be shuttered closed; and that all queers and homos just aren't praying hard enough. It's all the same far right, sky is fallng Tea Party paranoid, delusional bullshit. It's hate speech really. Most of them listen to far right conservative talk radio (which is HUGE in this market), and they get all riled up and regurgitate like the sheeple...sorry, "Dittoheads", they've become.

And these are people I grew up with, most of whom would NEVER have believed that way, but without the Tea Party hate being tossed their way.

Piggy-backing what Hef said, I lived just south of Charlotte for about two years and I'm not surprised, but having said that, I lived in Philly for a couple years, and there is exactly the opposite.   So how do we reconcile that?  I can recall being at Oscar's Bar (an EXCELLENT dive bar on Sansom in Philly) and having some bearded douche with the Rivers Cuomo glasses, the man-bag and a fatigue jacket get all in my face wanting to fight me because of all the opposite things.  All the names in the book; Nazi, corporate lackey, etc., and all for merely suggesting that perhaps Obama was being a little optimistic in his belief that "change" was both needed and so easily accomplished.   He literally took a swing at me for no reason other than I didn't show allegiance to his world view (and honestly, while I didn't exactly back down, I didn't say anything radical, and certainly nothing offensive).   maybe not the "hate" you are talking about, but how is the alienation, and the refusal to tolerate anything that isn't in lock-step with your world view any different?   

And I say this for two reasons, not just to point fingers:  one, isn't the other extreme necessary to counter the first extreme?  Meaning, is it enough to be a moderate when faced with one side that is tilting too far in one direction?   I don't think so.    Second, I bristle at the notion that "they never would have thought that way".  How come I can listen to Rush and not be "brainwashed"?  Or you?  Are we special?  I think not.  I read Rolling Stone religiously (there's a pun for you) and to say I disagree with their politics is being exceedingly polite.  Why have I not been infected with the disease called liberalism?  Am I smarter than most?  Dumber?   I think not.  I think people think how they are going to think, and while ideas can be honed, the notion that I would be a communist but for my listening to Rush Limbaugh is not accurate.

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Anymore it seems you're demanded to be extremely red, or extremely blue; when the reality is most of us are very purple. We have too much extremism in this world today, and not enough tolerance, respect, and   cooperation.

That is a good point, and that is something I think you can attribute to the Tea Party.   They do have this mentality that equates one's political bona fides with how zealous one is.  She didn't start it, but Sarah Palin certainly used that tactic to her advantage with the whole "go rogue" nonsense.  I don't know if it is part of the societal trend for "bigger" (ever notice that on TV to really express yourself you have to put "super" in front of everything for emphasis? This is SUPER tasty, or I'm SUPER excited to be on Big Brother!) or something more practical, like the squeaky wheel gets the grease, but it is disturbing that what you call "purple" is increasingly being equated with "lazy" or "unpassionate" or "wishy washy", when that is ultimately from where most of our country's historic greatness has arisen.

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It's pathetic and scary. And to me, its reminiscent of what's been described as the early beginnings of Nazi Germany.  And the absolute irony if that statement is that many Tea Party devotees cry that refrain over the current state of our government, when it's they who sound like they'll be duckwalking down tbe strasse next.

Respectfully, I'm sticking with hyperbole (and I don't mean that as an insult), simply because much of the Tea Party platform is not conducive to that sort of broad-based appeal, and we don't have the sort of coalitions that Germany did (remember, Germany circa 1932, before Hitler took power and effectively removed all opposing parties, had something like six or seven parties represented in Parliament).   Look, I say this every time this comes up (and so, yes, I can anticipate the response), but the delusional paranoid bullshit is exactly that.   I had a great conversation - calm reasonable - with a woman once (also in a bar in Philly; go figure...). She was all up on Obama, and down on McCain, and I asked her what her one hot button issue was, and she said "women's reproductive rights".  Abortion, basically.  And I asked her if abortion was legal. She said "no".  I said what about "Roe V. Wade", and explained that since 1973, abortion was legal, but was regulated by the States (though the States couldn't make it ILLEGAL in their State).   And I pointed out to her that at that time (2008) Republicans had been in power for about 24 years, and Democrats about 12, and yet... abortion was still legal.  The court that passed Roe was made up of 6 judges appointed by Republicans, and 3 by Democrats.   The only time it was even close to being overturned (in 1992) it was a court of eight Republican-nominated judges and one Democrat-nominated judge that upheld the law.   So I asked her if abortion wasn't an issue, if it was legal, what would be her SECOND pet issue, and perhaps she should consider that issue when she goes in the voting booth. 

Point being, you hear noise from a distinct minority wanting to be heard, but the realities are that there are too many people on either side of the aisle that have a human conscience when it comes to human issues that touch us all, and quell much of the hate while it is still propaganda and before it is actionable.