The Last in the Series>Dream theater #12-

[Sourcegamer101]

illumination theory is epic, but i really like the bigger picture, it has a meaningful message that is relevant to any creative person, and when i took a good listen at the bridge after the solo, that's when the song truly clicked for me

[Dublagent66]

Judging from the current amount of votes for Enigma Machine (0), I guess it just doesn't measure up to the rest of the album xD

It's a shame too because the instrumental was highly anticipated after not seeing one for 10 years (SoC - ToT).

[Another_Won]

Judging from the current amount of votes for Enigma Machine (0), I guess it just doesn't measure up to the rest of the album xD

It's a shame too because the instrumental was highly anticipated after not seeing one for 10 years (SoC - ToT).

Yes, a shame.  I think everyone (myself included) was expecting something along the lines of SoC or DoE.  What we got was quite different.  I don't dislike it, just not what I was hoping for.

[TheGreatPretender]

Judging from the current amount of votes for Enigma Machine (0), I guess it just doesn't measure up to the rest of the album xD

It's a shame too because the instrumental was highly anticipated after not seeing one for 10 years (SoC - ToT).

I'd say it's more like the rest of the album is so amazing, that even though it's their second best instrumental, it's still overshadowed by everything else.

[BlobVanDam]

Judging from the current amount of votes for Enigma Machine (0), I guess it just doesn't measure up to the rest of the album xD

It's a shame too because the instrumental was highly anticipated after not seeing one for 10 years (SoC - ToT).

I'd say it's more like the rest of the album is so amazing, that even though it's their second best instrumental, it's still overshadowed by everything else.

The only way Enigma Machine is their second best instrumental is if they only had two instrumentals.

[TheGreatPretender]

The only way Enigma Machine is their second best instrumental is if they only had two instrumentals.

The Dance of Eternity and Enigma Machine... The only two that matter. 

[BlackInk]

Enigma Machine is a very soulless and dull instrumental track.

[hefdaddy42]

Enigma Machine is a very soulless and dull instrumental track.

I disagree.  In fact, I'm not sure what so many people have against it.

[BlackInk]

It's pretty much Raw Dog 2.0 for me.

[hefdaddy42]

It's pretty much Raw Dog 2.0 for me.

I don't see that at all.  It is much more cohesive and energetic than Raw Dog, which is just a Frankenstein's Monster of leftover crap.

[TheGreatPretender]

I don't see that at all.  It is much more cohesive and energetic than Raw Dog, which is just a Frankenstein's Monster of leftover crap.

This.

And honestly, even with Raw Dog, while I don't really like it all that much, it's mostly because I don't think it consists of very good riffs and ideas, but there are still enough of them there that I can't in good conscience call it "dull".
And even more so with Enigma Machine. I can't fathom how someone can call it dull at all, let alone in comparison to songs like Hell's Kitchen or SOC which I'd say wander a lot closer to the realm of "dull". And even then, not even.

[BlackInk]

I think both Hell's Kitchen and SoC are excellent instrumental tracks. Miles and miles above Enigma Machine and Raw Dog, which both seemed so as-fast-as-possible and without-any-heart produced. They're like the McDonald's cheeseburgers of DT's music.

[TheGreatPretender]

I think both Hell's Kitchen and SoC are excellent instrumental tracks. Miles and miles above Enigma Machine and Raw Dog, which both seemed so as-fast-as-possible and without-any-heart produced. They're like the McDonald's cheeseburgers of DT's music.

Enigma Machine focuses on technicality. What's wrong with that? Are you gonna say that The Dance of Eternity has no soul either?

[BlackInk]

Enigma Machine focuses on technicality. What's wrong with that?

Well, it has to be done right. They can't just blame a failed track on technicality, I don't accept that.

Are you gonna say that The Dance of Eternity has no soul either?

The Dance of Eternity, while not at all my favorite instrumental track, shows infinitely more soul than Enigma Machine and Raw Dog. That is definetely a 'focus on technicality' instrumental done right.

[TheGreatPretender]

Well, it has to be done right. They can't just blame a failed track on technicality, I don't accept that.

And I don't accept that it's a failed track. Stop associating it with Raw Dog, lol. That's like me associating Metropolis with Light Fuse and Get Away.

[The Letter M]

Well, it has to be done right. They can't just blame a failed track on technicality, I don't accept that.

And I don't accept that it's a failed track. Stop associating it with Raw Dog, lol. That's like me associating Metropolis with Light Fuse and Get Away.

And then someone comes in and asks "What's wrong with "Light Fuse And Get Away"?

This could go on for WEEKS as everyone defends a song they like against someone who dislikes that song. Unless that song is "You Not Me".

-Marc.

[TheGreatPretender]

And then someone comes in and asks "What's wrong with "Light Fuse And Get Away"?

This could go on for WEEKS as everyone defends a song they like against someone who dislikes that song. Unless that song is "You Not Me".

-Marc.

Eh. I know Enigma Machine is amazing. Screw the nay sayers. I got a ton of enjoyment out of it, they didn't. So who's happier in the end?   

[BlackInk]

Stop associating it with Raw Dog, lol. That's like me associating Metropolis with Light Fuse and Get Away.

Well, I'm not really making the connection because they sound alike, it's more because they are both tracks I don't enjoy and they are both instrumentals.

[TheGreatPretender]

Well, I'm not really making the connection because they sound alike, it's more because they are both tracks I don't enjoy and they are both instrumentals.

Well, same for Metropolis and Light Fuse. My point is that one is amazing, the other one is among DT's worst, so they shouldn't be lumped together, lol.

Why? You think Metropolis and Light Fuse sound alike?

[BlackInk]

To be honest, I don't know LFaGA all that well. But if I remember correctly it ended up at the very bottom of all DT's tracks the last time I did my rankings. So in terms of quality of both sound and the music itself, no, Metropolis is obviously so far above it's not even comparable. But in terms of type or style of music, I suppose they aren't that different. Not more than Enigma Machina and Raw Dog.

[TheGreatPretender]

I think it's the same as saying, Metropolis has that flavor of "old DT" to it, that certain sound that early DT songs had before Awake. It certainly shares it although in a very refined way, and Raw Dog and Enigma Machine share the riffage style that JP has been doing lately, but yeah, either way, I wasn't referring to sound, I was comparing quality. So I may as well have compared Metropolis to You Not Me, as an analogy for comparing Enigma Machine to Raw Dog.

[hefdaddy42]

Yeah, maybe I need to listen to Raw Dog again to get that comparison.

Nah, I'm not doing that.

[bosk1]

Enigma Machine is a very soulless and dull instrumental track.

So is your face.

[bosk1]

Oh, and what's wrong with Light Fuse And Get Away?

[hefdaddy42]

Oh, and what's wrong with Light Fuse And Get Away?

I'm not sure that there is all that much wrong with it.

But there isn't that much right with it, either, IMHO.

But I would never compare it with Raw Dog.

[BlackInk]

Well, Raw Dog ain't good, but it's at least better than LFaGA.

[hefdaddy42]

Well, Raw Dog ain't good, but it's at least better than LFaGA.

Oh, I strongly disagree.  It's not better than anything, other than maybe cancer.

[Shadow Ninja 2.0]

Light Fuse and Get Away is a great song. Probably second best from WDADU.

[TheGreatPretender]

Enigma Machine is a very soulless and dull instrumental track.

So is your face.

Is it bad that when I read that comment originally, I actually wanted to reply with, "Your face is a very soulless and dull instrumental track"?

[SuperTaco]

I'd say it's more like the rest of the album is so amazing, it's overshadowed by everything else.

This is pretty much how I feel too. I like the song a lot, it gets stuck in my head on a regular basis, but I like a few others on the album more.. namely IT.

[The Letter M]

Light Fuse and Get Away is a great song. Probably second best from WDADU.

Probably...except according to chaossystem's definitive DTF Poll, LFAGA is the 6th best song based on DTF's votes!

-Marc.

[jonnybaxy]

Enigma Machine is a very soulless and dull instrumental track.

I completely agree, The slow bit is so incredibly forced, It's almost as if they wrote the song and added the slow bit in at the end of a random passage. I'd say the best part about it is the animation  the best instrumental for me is TDOE or Erotomania

[Moor]

Enigma Machine is a very soulless and dull instrumental track.

I completely agree, The slow bit is so incredibly forced, It's almost as if they wrote the song and added the slow bit in at the end of a random passage. I'd say the best part about it is the animation  the best instrumental for me is TDOE or Erotomania

When watched (attended) EM live, with MM's solo inserted therein, my whole perception changed and it really clicked.

[Sycsa]

Enigma Machine is a very soulless and dull instrumental track.

I disagree.  In fact, I'm not sure what so many people have against it.

This. It was my favorite song off DT12 the first time I listened to the album (I had to rewind it and listen to it again instantly) and it still holds up well.

[jonnybaxy]

Enigma Machine is a very soulless and dull instrumental track.

I completely agree, The slow bit is so incredibly forced, It's almost as if they wrote the song and added the slow bit in at the end of a random passage. I'd say the best part about it is the animation  the best instrumental for me is TDOE or Erotomania

When watched (attended) EM live, with MM's solo inserted therein, my whole perception changed and it really clicked.

I enjoyed MM's solo, but the EM still didn't click with me. I think it's just that slow bit with the guitar solo, It really doesn't fit in at all.