The Most Universally Beloved DT Song?

[Jaffa]

Yeah, it's not ACOS.  That's a waste of 25 minutes (or whatever, it's been so long since I've listened to it, I no longer own it, I don't remember how long it is honestly.)

Surely someone could tabulate all the DT top 50 songs threads and find out which song shows up in the top 10 most often, or pick some other criteria by which to judge "beloved".  (could be least hated...)

Well, we could do a thread in which every participant rated every song and then we figured out the average rating for each and every song and ranked them based on that.  Of course, we did that in 2011, and the winner was ACOS. 

[Kotowboy]

I wanna say Metropolis Pt. 1, but like any song, I'm sure there are still a pretty good number of fans who don't like it as much as they should others.

Learning to Live perhaps. Haven't seen too much hate towards it.

I'm not huge on either of those two.

[sylvinception]

Well, we could do a thread in which every participant rated every song and then we figured out the average rating for each and every song and ranked them based on that.  Of course, we did that in 2011, and the winner was ACOS.

So why change when it's so obvious ??

[Kotowboy]

Because ACOS is a massive turd of a song ?

[Another_Won]

Yeah, it's not ACOS.  That's a waste of 25 minutes (or whatever, it's been so long since I've listened to it, I no longer own it, I don't remember how long it is honestly.)

Surely someone could tabulate all the DT top 50 songs threads and find out which song shows up in the top 10 most often, or pick some other criteria by which to judge "beloved".  (could be least hated...)

Well, we could do a thread in which every participant rated every song and then we figured out the average rating for each and every song and ranked them based on that.  Of course, we did that in 2011, and the winner was ACOS.

Hey, we forgot to do one in 2013.  We have two more albums of material to rate!

I only bring this up because I recently did a rough draft of my rankings and I'm ready to vote

Oh and for this thread I think Metropolis.  I think it also was the consensus for DT's magnum opus.

[hefdaddy42]

Well, get to it.  Start the thread.

[mikeyd23]

Yeah, I'd probably say Metropolis if we are talking most universally loved DT song. It seems to consistently be considered one of the best, if not the best DT song by a lot of people.

Tough call though, an argument could certainly be made for Octavarium or ACOS.  Take the Time and The Spirit Carries On were also good suggestions.

[nicmos]

Yeah, it's not ACOS.  That's a waste of 25 minutes (or whatever, it's been so long since I've listened to it, I no longer own it, I don't remember how long it is honestly.)

Surely someone could tabulate all the DT top 50 songs threads and find out which song shows up in the top 10 most often, or pick some other criteria by which to judge "beloved".  (could be least hated...)

Well, we could do a thread in which every participant rated every song and then we figured out the average rating for each and every song and ranked them based on that.  Of course, we did that in 2011, and the winner was ACOS.

yes, your sample size of 85 clearly indicates the preference of the whole forum, where there are over 300 members only counting people who have posted over 1000 times, and over 400 who have posted over 500 times. [/s]  all it would take is 5 people to give it a rating of 5 and it's down to 4th place.  I would probably give it a 2.  if there's 5 people like me (and no more voted beyond that), and it's 0.4 points down.  I realize it would probably not be this exaggerated for exactly the sampling reason I am using to suggest that the existing sample missed important parts of the forum's constituency.  but that's how sensitive these polls can be.  I would be willing to wager the fraction of people who think ACOS deserves a low rating is higher than those who think LTL, 8VM, or M Pt. 1 deserve that low a rating, which is why I'm confident a more comprehensive poll would show ACOS is not the most beloved song.  still a different way to do it would be to have people rank the songs 1-120 or however many it is now, and total those ranking points, with the song with the aggregate lowest number of ranking points being declared the most beloved.  in this version, I think ACOS would be even more disadvantaged due to people not wanting to listen to it and ranking it somewhere over 100 like I would.  in one swoop that would virtually kill its chances.

[TheGreatPretender]

yes, your sample size of 85 clearly indicates the preference of the whole forum, where there are over 300 members only counting people who have posted over 1000 times, and over 400 who have posted over 500 times.

Well, considering that there are people on this forum who don't even like Dream Theater, I wouldn't count on THAT much participation.

[nicmos]

but the question is not "what result would you get if you conducted a poll of volunteers among members of this website" but "if you hypothetically could get the opinion of all people who actively use this website or even the larger DT fan community, how would their opinions look".

[TheGreatPretender]

Well, if you ask me, 85 people is still a good enough number to get the average estimate of the general opinion of the forum. I personally don't think having a larger number would sway the votes too much one way or another.

[erwinrafael]

Given how active posts almost always make it appear that post MP DT songs are bad, especially DT 12, and how these negative posts almost always seem to appear a polar opposite of poll results wjere there are a lot of silent voters, I would not be so sure that such types of rankings are representative.

[Outcrier]

Easily Metropolis.

[Jaffa]

yes, your sample size of 85 clearly indicates the preference of the whole forum, where there are over 300 members only counting people who have posted over 1000 times, and over 400 who have posted over 500 times. [/s] 

Of course not.  But you're not going to get a much bigger sample size than that. 

All I'm really trying to indicate is that while ACOS might not actually be the most beloved song, you definitely shouldn't write it off as a contender.  Whenever we try to do a big comprehensive poll to determine DTF's song rankings, ACOS is consistently near the top of the list. 

If you look at the DT League in polls and survivors, ACOS won in 2013 and came in second in 2014.  If you look at this thread, which compiled the results of a few years worth of DT survivors, you'll see that ACOS consistently finished in the top three. 

Yes, ACOS has its haters (every song does), but it's definitely one of the most popular songs on DTF. 

[Shadow Ninja 2.0]

^ Yeah, that. I mean, Six Degrees is my favorite DT song, but I'm not gonna claim it's the most universally beloved, because it's kind of clearly not.

Similarly, I think even people who don't care for ACOS would have to agree that it's one of the most consistently high-rated songs DT have.

[Destiny Of Chaos]

BAI is the first (hopefully not the last) Mangini-era song to break into the top tier of DT songs. Its 4th-place finish in DT The League 2014 testifies to this.

I think it's probably Metropolis or Learning to Live. ACOS and 8VM have their few critics.

Wow I never knew about DT The League! I Googled it, and found the link to the thread on this forum.

Looking through the brackets now, awesome idea. Sucks that I missed the voting

Don't worry, there's always next year (next month)....

https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=42658.0

[hefdaddy42]

There you go.

[RoeDent]

Exhibit A: Learning to Live WON the last DT Survivor that was run, in 2011-12

Exhibit B: A Change of Seasons has won TWO of the four seasons of DT The League that have run (2007 and 2013). Octavarium is the defending League Champion going into the new season.

And I have rarely, if ever, seen a bad word said about Metropolis.

So haters of these songs are certainly in a minority.

[bosk1]

I agree that the majority likes it.  And that's cool.  But there is a small minority that agrees with me, and we're pretty adamant about it.  Not trying to be a dick.  Just pretty sure it's not ACOS.

Honestly, in all the years I have been a member of the various iterations of the forums here and at MP.com (since 2001), I think I have seen maybe half a dozen people express even mild dislike of ACOS.  The number is not only low, but extraordinarily low.

[Dublagent66]

Exhibit A: Learning to Live WON the last DT Survivor that was run, in 2011-12

Exhibit B: A Change of Seasons has won TWO of the four seasons of DT The League that have run (2007 and 2013). Octavarium is the defending League Champion going into the new season.

And I have rarely, if ever, seen a bad word said about Metropolis.

So haters of these songs are certainly in a minority.

The extreme minority I would say.  Nothing to hate about those songs whatsoever.  However, I wouldn't say that DT the league championship results fully represent the fanbase universally.  Based on the thread title, I would say PMU from a universial standpoint, but that's probably not the case so much anymore.  Or, does "universally" in the title mean just DTF?

[Outcrier]

Easily Metropolis.

Easily Metropolis if universally means any fan of music in general rating Dream Theater songs, not only the DT fans.

Also, Home ranks pretty high in every DT top songs lists i ever saw.

[nicmos]

Yes, ACOS has its haters (every song does), but it's definitely one of the most popular songs on DTF.

Fair enough Jaffa.  I know I'm being an ass about it, but I'm not really an ass, just trying to represent for the regular-ish DTFers besides me who I know have posted about how the song does nothing for them, but might not have seen this thread.

Okay, I'll stop being a hardass now.

[RoeDent]

The extreme minority I would say.  Nothing to hate about those songs whatsoever.  However, I wouldn't say that DT the league championship results fully represent the fanbase universally.  Based on the thread title, I would say PMU from a universial standpoint, but that's probably not the case so much anymore.  Or, does "universally" in the title mean just DTF?

If people liked Pull Me Under but didn't go on to explore DT's catalogue further, you can't exactly call them fans, can you? Also, it goes without saying that DTF doesn't represent the entire fanbase, but it certainly represents a sizable chunk of it.

[TheGreatPretender]

The extreme minority I would say.  Nothing to hate about those songs whatsoever.  However, I wouldn't say that DT the league championship results fully represent the fanbase universally.  Based on the thread title, I would say PMU from a universial standpoint, but that's probably not the case so much anymore.  Or, does "universally" in the title mean just DTF?

If people liked Pull Me Under but didn't go on to explore DT's catalogue further, you can't exactly call them fans, can you? Also, it goes without saying that DTF doesn't represent the entire fanbase, but it certainly represents a sizable chunk of it.

Not to mention the most devoted chunk of the fanbase. Yeah, I have a friend who listened to DT before I did, but that equated to maybe 4 songs or so. I'm not sure if he's ever even heard of A Change of Seasons. So while he does like to listen to them, and whenever I go to his place, I always put on something he enjoys, I wouldn't call him a true DT fan. Casual fan at best.

[Dublagent66]

RoeDent, I wasn't talking about people who "only" like PMU and never bothered to hear the rest of DT's catalogue.  I meant a worldwide fanbase of DT's music in general.  I still like PMU a lot even though I might like other DT's songs more.  Universally, I'd say PMU goes without saying. 

[Another_Won]

Didn't ACoS get released because of fan demand?  I thought I read that somewhere.  That would seem to indicate a lot of people liked it.  At least back in '95.

[TheGreatPretender]

Didn't ACoS get released because of fan demand?  I thought I read that somewhere.  That would seem to indicate a lot of people liked it.  At least back in '95.

Yeah, I believe it was given a green light due to an online petition, which was pretty impressive, for mid-90s. The band always wanted to release it, but it was the fan demand that pursued the record company. At least according to Lifting Shadows.

[wolfking]

Definitely Metropolis.

[The Stray Seed]

Personally, I would distinguish from what is universally beloved by fans, and what is universally beloved by the general music public.

As for the first, I would definitely say Metropolis (I've heard the crowd cry "Metropolis - Metropolis" during most DT concerts I've been to. That song summarizes most of the aspects for which DT is loved by fans, but also disliked by the general public) - concerning the latter, I would say Pull Me Under (it is DT's radio hit and it was also included as a playable song in Guitar Hero World Tour) =D

EDIT: re-reading the OP, I guess the first answer is the one Adamack was asking for.

[adamack]

Personally, I would distinguish from what is universally beloved by fans, and what is universally beloved by the general music public.

As for the first, I would definitely say Metropolis (I've heard the crowd cry "Metropolis - Metropolis" during most DT concerts I've been to. That song summarizes most of the aspects for which DT is loved by fans, but also disliked by the general public) - concerning the latter, I would say Pull Me Under (it is DT's radio hit and it was also included as a playable song in Guitar Hero World Tour) =D

EDIT: re-reading the OP, I guess the first answer is the one Adamack was asking for.

Yes you're right, my intention was to find out which DT song is most universally beloved by DT fans. Apologies for not being more specific, or for causing any confusion.

The confusion is only magnified, because the question then becomes: What constitutes a "DT fan"?

I guess the most fair way to determine this is to simply use the definition of a fan: "Someone who is enthusiastically devoted to (a band)."

So, I guess we can use our best discretion with this.

[Outcrier]

Personally, I would distinguish from what is universally beloved by fans, and what is universally beloved by the general music public.

As for the first, I would definitely say Metropolis (I've heard the crowd cry "Metropolis - Metropolis" during most DT concerts I've been to. That song summarizes most of the aspects for which DT is loved by fans, but also disliked by the general public) - concerning the latter, I would say Pull Me Under (it is DT's radio hit and it was also included as a playable song in Guitar Hero World Tour) =D

EDIT: re-reading the OP, I guess the first answer is the one Adamack was asking for.

Pull Me Under is their most popular song but general music fans (not the public) often view Metropolis as their best song.

[adamack]

I've tallied up the responses in this thread to this point. I know a poll would have been easier, but hey. I guess I'm old fashioned.

I understand that this thread is such a small sample size, and we will never truly know the real answer unless extensive research is done.

However, using the results of the DT League, the results of this thread, and any other outside info provided, we can at least come up with some good ballpark guesses as to what the most universally beloved DT song is by the fans.

Metropolis: 16
A Change Of Seasons: 6
Octavarium: 6
Learning To Live: 6
Take The Time: 4
The Spirit Carries On: 3
Breaking All Illusions: 2
Home: 2
The Glass Prison: 2
Lines In The Sand: 1

So based on this thread alone, we've got some good evidence to indicate that Metropolis MAY be the closest answer. Though, as Tootsie Pop would say, the world may never know.

[nicmos]

So based on this thread alone, we've got some good evidence to indicate that Metropolis MAY be the closest answer. Though, as Tootsie Pop would say, the world may never know.

love the tootsie pop reference!

[adamack]

So based on this thread alone, we've got some good evidence to indicate that Metropolis MAY be the closest answer. Though, as Tootsie Pop would say, the world may never know.

love the tootsie pop reference!

A oneeeeee, a twoo-hooooo, a threeeeeeee

(crunch)