DT pushing boundaries of what is musical

[erwinrafael]

DT has been pretty great in playing unconventional time signatures, transitions, progressions, etc. in their prog glory. However, these almost always play within Western conventions of musicality.

There are times, though, when they push the boundaries of what is musical, and I like it when they do it. Two examples are Misunderstood and the instrumental of Surrender to Reason. i hope they dabble more with such approaches to music in their future albums.

[Zyzzyva17]

I hear a lot about people wanting them to be more "experimental," but honestly, I would rather have a really well done but conventional album than a more risky and out-there album. That said, I like when they push their rhythmic and harmonic boundaries in songs like The Dance of Eternity and In The Presence Of Enemies. Those songs stray from "typical" Western style, but they stay close enough to home that it feels unique without feeling too estranged.

[rumborak]

You know, I actually think some well-placed dubstep elements could be interesting in their music. Not a whole song, but maybe a short break between segments.

[erwinrafael]

You know, I actually think some well-placed dubstep elements could be interesting in their music. Not a whole song, but maybe a short break between segments.

Yeah, I think it would be cool. DT is due for another SDOIT disc 1  type album.

[Skeever]

It would be great to hear Dream Theater do something really percussive, or else really ambient. I'd love for them to use elements of noise like Steven Wilson did on Insurgentes, or else more electronic influences. In short, I agree with the OP. DT are amazing musicians who write very good progressive rock, but rarely have they really pushed the boundaries of rock music. Instead, they've displayed extreme competence within the boundaries of progressive rock and metal. Musically, though, they are far less daring than the prog rock greats, i.e: Yes, King Crimson, Genesis, Pink Floyd. Same goes for Transatlantic. Dream Theater and Transatlantic may be the most skilled musicians in the genre, but there are contemporary bands and artists who are far more daring when it comes to pushing the boundaries and being "progressive" in the dictionary sense (Radiohead, Steven Wilson, Sigur Ros, Bjork, to name just a few).

Whether "more daring" = better? That's subjective, of course 

[sneakyblueberry]

You know, I actually think some well-placed dubstep elements could be interesting in their music. Not a whole song, but maybe a short break between segments.

Dream Theater ft. Skrillex.  I like it.

It would be great to hear Dream Theater do something really percussive, or else really ambient. I'd love for them to use elements of noise like Steven Wilson did on Insurgentes, or else more electronic influences. In short, I agree with the OP. DT are amazing musicians who write very good progressive rock, but rarely have they really pushed the boundaries of rock music. Instead, they've displayed extreme competence within the boundaries of progressive rock and metal. Musically, though, they are far less daring than the prog rock greats, i.e: Yes, King Crimson, Genesis, Pink Floyd. Same goes for Transatlantic. Dream Theater and Transatlantic may be the most skilled musicians in the genre, but there are contemporary bands and artists who are far more daring when it comes to pushing the boundaries and being "progressive" in the dictionary sense (Radiohead, Steven Wilson, Sigur Ros, Bjork, to name just a few).

I agree with this post. 

[Rodni Demental]

You know, I actually think some well-placed dubstep elements could be interesting in their music. Not a whole song, but maybe a short break between segments.

Dream Theater ft. Skrillex.  I like it.

You do? It's kinda giving me a gag reflex...

[TheGreatPretender]

As long as they don't go too crazy with it. I mean, there's some novelty to hearing bands like Unexpect, but it's so chaotic that after a while, it becomes borderline unlistenable.

[sneakyblueberry]

You know, I actually think some well-placed dubstep elements could be interesting in their music. Not a whole song, but maybe a short break between segments.

Dream Theater ft. Skrillex.  I like it.

You do? It's kinda giving me a gag reflex...

Jordan's halfway there with his bebot thing.  They just need some encouragement re dropping dat bass

[Rodni Demental]

Haha... You got me there. I don't even mind Bebot, in fact I kinda like it but I do struggle imagining DT with a dubstep breakdown. The song would need to have a specific mood for it to even feel slightly in place. I'm all for experimenting and trying new things, and perhaps a small section wouldn't be too bad if it weren't any longer than say the turntable section from TDS, but I still can't imagine it fitting easily.

[OsMosis2259]

I loved the electronic sounding drums during Outcry (1:31). Would love to see them do more of that kinda thing next album!

[TAC]

I don't. This is a rock band, not some godawful synth one. The Outcry thing is fine, but really any more of it would not be good IMHO.

[OsMosis2259]

I don't. This is a rock band, not some godawful synth one. The Outcry thing is fine, but really any more of it would not be good IMHO.

 
Well yeah not for a whole song/album... Just using it in a subtle way like they did with Outcry. Just experimenting more with different sounds which they didn't really do on DT12. 

[rumborak]

I always thought that break in ACOS (at around 18:30, before Derek's solo) was kind of dubsteppy in a 90s sort of way.

[erwinrafael]

Well, they don't necessarily have to do more electronic sounds to do this. For example, like I mentioned earlier, the STR instrumental is a good example. When I first heard it, I went Whoah! as it came as a pleasant surprise in the context of the song. The time signature makes you question if there is a fixed time sig at all, MM/JM are playing in sync, but not conventionally so with JP, and the melody is not in a conventional scale with some of  JP's licks so aggressive sounding that it borders on noise (ala Misunderstood guitar solo).

[Kotowboy]

Metallica's last two albums also redefined what is acceptable music

[The Trooper]

I would love to hear an acoustic album of already released songs. I think it could be great. Then blow me away with a next new  album that puts me in my place and just kicks my ass.

[sylvinception]

DT just keep on pushing boundaries of what DT is.

Quote of the year, thanks a lot. 

[sneakyblueberry]

Haha... You got me there. I don't even mind Bebot, in fact I kinda like it but I do struggle imagining DT with a dubstep breakdown. The song would need to have a specific mood for it to even feel slightly in place. I'm all for experimenting and trying new things, and perhaps a small section wouldn't be too bad if it weren't any longer than say the turntable section from TDS, but I still can't imagine it fitting easily.

For the record I was joking about the dubstep thing.  I think it would be horrible.  Especially considering dubstep is long past its use by date now. 

[Jaffa]

I think experimentation in art is great, but only when there's passion behind it.  I'm not a big fan of pushing the boundaries just for the sake of pushing the boundaries.  It usually ends up feelings really forced and out of place, in my experience.  So, for example, I really wouldn't want DT to try incorporating dubstep into their music just because they've never done it before.  If, however, they discovered that they really liked dubstep and decided they wanted to try playing around with it, I would be extremely interested in checking out the results. 

[adamack]

I'va always felt like this section in BTL...

 https://youtu.be/5vcyVDkRv3E?t=8m27s

...was very experimental. I think JR referred to the keyboard patch as being Zappa-esque, as he programmed the keyboard to trigger the key, and also its 3rd I believe, to play simultaneously.

Also, the brass-type patch he layered in the sound adds to its quality to push some boundaries.

The first time I heard it, I thought that it wasn't tonally correct, but it is of course.    It just took my ears a bit to understand what was going on.

[rumborak]

Just FYI, that section is called the "Zappa section" by DT themselves.

[adamack]

Just FYI, that section is called the "Zappa section" by DT themselves.

Ah, good to know thanks

[BlobVanDam]

I wish they'd do more wacky stuff like that. haters gonna hate.

[hefdaddy42]

I love that part too.

[rumborak]

Same here, I love that stuff.

[Infinite Cactus]

I am agree.

[Kotowboy]

Haha... You got me there. I don't even mind Bebot, in fact I kinda like it but I do struggle imagining DT with a dubstep breakdown. The song would need to have a specific mood for it to even feel slightly in place. I'm all for experimenting and trying new things, and perhaps a small section wouldn't be too bad if it weren't any longer than say the turntable section from TDS, but I still can't imagine it fitting easily.

For the record I was joking about the dubstep thing.  I think it would be horrible.  Especially considering dubstep is long past its use by date now.

Dubstep definitely Wub Wub's me up the wrong way

[rumborak]

It's funny how it still rubs a lot of people the wrong way, where it has become standard musical accompaniment to every action scene in a movie these days.

[King Postwhore]

It's funny how it still rubs a lot of people the wrong way, where it has become standard musical accompaniment to every action scene in a movie these days.

You ever see a fashion critic and how they dress and you wonder how they can call someone else gaudy?     

[Ħ]

Dubstep can definitely be cheap and formulaic, but so can any genre. in some situations, dubstep is awesome.

[hefdaddy42]

I have definitely heard some dubstep that I liked.  And the more I think of it, the more I am intrigued at the possibility of DT incorporating it somehow.

[King Postwhore]

I have definitely heard some dubstep that I liked.  And the more I think of it, the more I am intrigued at the possibility of DT incorporating it somehow.

Muse is a good example for me that I like.

[erwinrafael]

I'va always felt like this section in BTL...

 https://youtu.be/5vcyVDkRv3E?t=8m27s

...was very experimental. I think JR referred to the keyboard patch as being Zappa-esque, as he programmed the keyboard to trigger the key, and also its 3rd I believe, to play simultaneously.

Also, the brass-type patch he layered in the sound adds to its quality to push some boundaries.

The first time I heard it, I thought that it wasn't tonally correct, but it is of course.    It just took my ears a bit to understand what was going on.

Yay, one of my favorites as well.

[rumborak]

I have definitely heard some dubstep that I liked.  And the more I think of it, the more I am intrigued at the possibility of DT incorporating it somehow.

Muse is a good example for me that I like.

Yeah, those moments were awesome, and they really meshed well.