The "concept" behind DT12 - was it new?

[johnpetruccisbiceps]

The band emphasised that their "mission" for DT12 was that the album be a real true representation of all the elements of the band and that they incorporated all their facets into one album. I've seen/read numerous interviews with JP, and to a lesser extent JLB and JR where they talk about the album spanning everything they do -  the orchestral, cinematic, metal, prog, ballad, melodic etc. aspects so that you could give this to a new fan and they would understand what the band was about.

They also cited this as the reason for self-titling the album.

But what I've thought ever since I heard these explanations was: haven't they done that before? I remember on the historic documentary that came with Score, JLB and JR saying, almost verbatim, the same things about Octavarium. Before ADTOE came out, JP and JR both said in various interviews how they worked really hard to make an album that would reassure fans that even without MP, DT would remain the same  - and that they made sure the album had a good balance of ballads, metal, and prog - in a nutshell, a mix of all of DT's styles...

So really, they've kinda done this "comprehensive, classic DT" approach quite a few times already, right? Having said that, I think they did a marvellous job honing their songwriting on this album and stripping away some of the excesses of the past.

Still, anyone else hoping for something new and truly "progressive" on the next album rather than the "DT formula"?

[sneakyblueberry]

Still, anyone else hoping for something new and truly "progressive" on the next album rather than the "DT formula"?

Yes!  But using 'progressive' in that context in this part of the forum generally goes down as well as a porkchop in a synagogue.  'Prog' and 'progressive music' are not seen as mutually inclusive concepts. 

I totally agree with you though, and its part of the reason I haven't really been into DT's past few releases. 

[Kotowboy]

ADTOE was my favourite album since Octavarium.

DT12 got old really fast .

[Rodni Demental]

So really, they've kinda done this "comprehensive, classic DT" approach quite a few times already, right? Having said that, I think they did a marvellous job honing their songwriting on this album and stripping away some of the excesses of the past.

Still, anyone else hoping for something new and truly "progressive" on the next album rather than the "DT formula"?

I think the point this time around was stripping away the excess as you put it, making catchy memorable songs that are still true to their style. They were also probably trying to eliminate the perspective that they get too carried away with the instrumental sections. I think the grammy from the previous album might have influenced them to a particular extent or nudged them to try be a bit more concise for a larger audience too.

Anyway, I agree with your point though, they have often done the 'classic DT formula'. Ovtavarium and ADTOE are good examples of that, and I'd argue that even BC&SL was an attempt at a 'classic' DT album, even if a lot the modern DT styles bled through into the song writing. Also MP referenced that it was A Change of Seasons, Octavarium, Learning to Live, Pull Me Under and The Glass Prison all on on album. Kinda makes sense I guess. https://www.mikeportnoy.com/forum/tm.aspx?m=2190508&mpage=1&key=&#2190508

I think most of us want DT to experiment a bit more though, as they've always had that aspect where they're exploring new territories; although ironically enough you won't please some people cause some of the best examples of experimentation in recent DT get written off as ripoffs or get bashed for being "unlike DT". - See how people feel about Bebot, or reactions to songs like Profits of War. The whole damned if you do, damned if you don't thing could even be a reason why they've been 'playing it safe' the last 2(+) albums, but that's just a theory. 

Regardless, either we'll get one more album in the concise nature that we had in DT12 while they're still on a role, or they're gonna try something a bit different. Either way, I think that even if it's not the next album, DT will always be pushing the boundaries a little, so hopefully next one can strike a balance of exploring new ground, without loosing what makes it DT.

[RoeDent]

For the next album promo cycle, we should make a bingo game with lines that the band are likely to say in interviews. They always say the same kind of things, like "I feel that this is our strongest collection of songs", or "This goes back to the classic DT sound".

[Kotowboy]

Winner gets to have cream tea with Rob Webster.

[tiagodon]

All the speech about the concept of the album (repeatedly, of course!), the reason it is self-titled and bla bla bla has one and only objective: legitimize MM in the band.

[SjundeInseglet]

All the speech about the concept of the album (repeatedly, of course!), the reason it is self-titled and bla bla bla has one and only objective: legitimize MM in the band.

He was "legitimized" by many, many of the fans long before DT even started writing and recording the album.  It's easy to turn a blind eye to it now but MM was welcomed into the band with open arms by a large portion of the fanbase back in 2011/2012. You'd often hear the crowds chanting his name during the 2011 European Summer tour and that was also a main fixture at most gigs during the ADTOE 2011-2012 World Tour.

[bosk1]

All the speech about the concept of the album (repeatedly, of course!), the reason it is self-titled and bla bla bla has one and only objective: legitimize MM in the band.

Once again, you have no idea what you are talking about.

[tiagodon]

I don´t mean it in a "bad" way. It is a very simple and technical issue actually.

There was a huge change of the sound of the band after MP left. I´m not talking about production, mixing or any formal thing. I´m talking about the music itself, its essence.
MP added melodic phrases to the songs. The drums were an additional layer. Take, for example, Under a Glass Moon (0:26-0:40), Metropolis pt. 1 (0:40-1:00), 6:00 (0:00-0:10), Innocence Faded (0:22-0:50), The Dark Eternal Night (0:09-0:25) and so on...
Drum phrases are there adding to the melodic main line; lines over lines given by the other instruments!

MM does not do that. There´s nothing close to those examples I gave in the whole DT12 album. Is it good or bad? It´s just a different approach. It´s just a different drummer! But the fact is that it changed the sound of the band for sure, significantly! When I listen to DT12, I feel something is missing.

MP was creating and adding in spite of the other instruments. He added a whole new dynamic to the songs. So DT, for me, was this complex system where every instrument was adding melody to the songs! Even the goddamn drummer!!!

That´s why I started to take drumming lessons. I said “OMG, this guy is doing what a second guitar would be doing”!

MM, on the other hand, just follows the other instruments. It´s a very different approach. But this is not DT to me. And that´s why I think it was a really bad decision to selftitle the last album. The sound became more “common”, allow me to put it this way.
I understand it is a very personal position. But that´s how I feel.

So I don´t know how it is working in the minds of the members. Inside a studio room, they know for sure something has changed! Probably they are happy with the "new DT"and selftitled the album to show the world they are ok with the new approach. Maybe all that speech on the album is an attempt to legitimize this new sound to themselves. I´m not really talking about the fans.

[Podaar]

[johnpetruccisbiceps]

Sorry, are you referring to my initial post?

[Podaar]

No sir. The OP is just fine and even thought provoking.