New DT album 2015?

[Dream Team]

Yeah i guess it's more a production issue, and maybe it has to do with the positioning of the cymbals and how they are recorded, let's not forget the uniqueness of Mike's kit, some cymbals are very near to each other so it might be a problem to record them clearly.

The worst part in my opinion are the china cymbals and hihats, although the new live album seems to have improved the hihats, as it is evident on the solo section of The Looking Glass. Still, i don't think they have enough clarity and power compared to MP's sound, especially the closed hihat and how defined it is.

To be honest i was hoping someone would co-produce along with JP, since he doesn't seem to have a great taste in sound, as it is evident from all the productions since Mike left.

The way that MM and MP hit the drums is totally different too. I guess you can compare it to a guitarist's tone being in his/her fingers as much as it is in the equipment. MM's hits are very calculated, concise and even (which is a technical explanation for why some consider him to be robotic with little groove or feel... me not included). MP's feel is loose and he has more fluid dynamics (range of soft to hard hits). The attack and tooone of the drumheads and cymbals can sound totally different from drummer to drummer even with the same equipment. Another difference is that MM sits on the beat (or slightly behind) and MP is in your face ahead of the beat. Its cool how their playing styles translate to their personalities too.

-Tof

Also, MP holds the stick much closer to the butt and because of that I feel (and see) that he gets a harder hit out of it, or maybe he uses heavier sticks. MM seems to almost hold them in the middle at times.

[Kotowboy]

I just looked at the Seaboard. Man, unless they're drastically bringing down the price, I doubt they will sell the device a lot. A 3-octave version costs two thousand dollars,  and a full-size one sets you back nine thousand.

  Holy fuck.

If I was going to spend £9,000 on musical gear - I could get THREE Gibson Les Paul Customs.

[Sycsa]

I just looked at the Seaboard. Man, unless they're drastically bringing down the price, I doubt they will sell the device a lot. A 3-octave version costs two thousand dollars,  and a full-size one sets you back nine thousand.

  Holy fuck.

If I was going to spend £9,000 on musical gear - I could get THREE Gibson Les Paul Customs.

Guitars and keyboards are not in the same ballpark, so it's not a fair comparison. Many of the high-end keyboards will easily run you around €3000-5000, that's roughly the price range of the popular workstations (Yamaha Motif, Korg Kronos, Kurzweil PC3), of the Moog Voyagers and if you're a real aficionado, you can spend up to €10k for a Hammond B3 with a Leslie speaker (which I consider to be the pinnacle of all keyboards, the Les Paul custom of keyboards if you will), and you kinda have to if that's your thing, because no modern digital emulation can sound nearly as good as a tonewheel Hammond. And let's not even get into grand pianos or even digital pianos. So the price of the Seabord doesn't really surprise me, but it'll definitely be adjusted if the instrument is here to stay.

I always envied guitar players, I think they got the best price-value ratio on just about every level. I play drums and keyboards. If you want your keys to sound anything like the '70s prog you grew up on, you really got to dig deep in your wallet. If you want to get a decent Hammond and Minimoog sound (talking ELP here), you gotta buy a Hammond clone with a Leslie and a Moog clone and that's around €5k already, and you still don't have the Rhodes, Wurlitzer piano, Mellotron, ARP etc. Forget about the all-around synths and workstations, they sound like hell for this type of music (like Jordan's organ patches, no surprise he went on and used a real Moog for Octavarium). Drums are a bit better, but with the price of a high end cymbal, I could still get a decent guitar rig.

[As I Am]

I'd love DT to challenge themselves and write an album consisting of 10-12 songs , in the vein of FII (without the outside interference of course).

[mike099]

I'd love DT to challenge themselves and write an album consisting of 10-12 songs , in the vein of FII (without the outside interference of course).

And the same producer as FII would be nice.  Love the sound of that cd.

[Enigmachine]

I'd love DT to challenge themselves and write an album consisting of 10-12 songs , in the vein of FII (without the outside interference of course).

I think that would be quite likely for the next album. That is, if they don't go back to having at least three songs around ten minutes like Outcry, BitS or BAI or a twenty minute epic like IT. I think that what many of us forget about DT is that the average song length is REALLY LONG as most people would consider songs around 6 to eight minutes to be epic while for DT, that's them cutting it down! Obviously, it isn't a bad thing, but I feel that if the next album has a balance of song lengths similar to Images and Words with a few more songs to reach about seventy minutes, it would feel much more natural. Because they've spoiled us with epics in recent times, they don't really give off a similar feeling to ACoS, SDoIT or Octavarium as it's now expected of them. Just look at the dates of them:

ACoS - 1995

SDoIT - 2002

Octavarium - 2005

ItPoE - 2007

TCoT - 2009

IT - 2013

Two thirds of them have been in the last ten years! Sure, they've all recieved heaps of praise, but the excitement for each diminishes. I can understand why they do this and I won't be against them giving us some more but I think because DT see that ACoS is considered the best song they ever made by many people, they assume that people want a lot of epics and give the fans that. The problem with this as it sets too much emphasis on the epic and then making other songs feel much less important and therefore making the albums feel very unbalanced and inconsistent. This wasn't really an issue before Octavarium as ACoS had its own EP and SDoIT had its own disc, but after that, the epics were the obvious main point of interest on the album and at least twice as popular as the other tracks.

I'd love to see them abandon this crutch and create songs with a more natural form like we saw from IaW and SfaM where the standout song is less obvious and the focus is more on consistency and overall quality. It seems like these albums also are generally seen as two of their best albums, which may encourage them to try that approach again instead of 'An Epic (...and Eight Other Pretty Cool Songs)'. I didn't mind their latest album though, but IT overshadowed everything else.

[goo-goo]

I don't want an epic just because DT is expected to have an epic.

An album in the vein of Awake or FII (song structure wise) would be awesome. I don't mind their current sound and mindset (as seen in DT 12 and ADTOE) but I would like no epics for the next.

[ronrule]

I'd love to see an outside producer, but I'm pretty sure that's like asking JP to take a demotion and associated pay cut

[sylvinception]

Even if I'm not a big fan of "concept albums", I think that maybe there's a good chance for the next album for being one.
JLB has already said that they always keep this idea in mind.

But the most important thing of course == >> a better drum mixing ??   

[lucky7]

How would I want it to be?

Out!

^^^I read this on page 1 and after 8 pages it is still perfect! 

As Scenes is one of my fave albums I would love a new concept album.

SDOIT is perfect Disc 2 especially I would love something like this.

The Epics mentioned on previous pages are a staple for DT and I would love another one...they never get old.

Something I would especially love to see would be an acoustic with just JP and JLB, JP could even backup on vocals.

[Grizz]

I don't want another epic. Maybe a Learning to Live/The Glass Prison/A Nightmare to Remember/Breaking All Illusions-length song, but I want to hear A Change of Seasons live next tour. Plus I didn't love Illumination Theory as much as the other three 19-24 minute songs

[sylvinception]

I want to hear A Change of Seasons live next tour.

Fuck YEAH, me too!! 
It's been too long since the last time they played ACOS live!!

[TheLordOfTheStrings]

I WANT A NEW ALBUM NAO!

[Zydar]

I don't think they can make Illumination Theory any better than they did on this tour, especially in Boston with the choir and orchestra, so they can put that one on hold for a few tours

I still haven't gotten to see Learning To Live yet, my favourite DT song, so they better play that one on the next tour

[Kotowboy]

Realised today we're probably 9 - 10 months away from a new DT album.

[rumborak]

It's definitely going to be a long stretch with little to no news from them. Probably *the* biggest loss that came along with MP's departure.

[TAC]

Well, would it be wrong to expect another Happy Holidays release? Has a precedent been set?

[Rodni Demental]

Realised today we're probably 9 - 10 months away from a new DT album.

Hopefully we'll see a bit of activity from them a few months prior and it'd be cool to see some studio teasers or vids of the work in progress like we did last time.

Well, would it be wrong to expect another Happy Holidays release? Has a precedent been set?

Well, it's enough to put people expectations up. I'd like to remain hopeful but ultimately shouldn't set myself up for disappointment. They wouldn't be able to do the same thing as last time, because there's no extra songs to show from the tour. But we all know they've got secrets archived away that we'd still eat up. 

[rumborak]

Given how they just released a DVD, I doubt they'll release another concert cut. What they could/should do is maybe sit down in a room, with a piano, acoustic guitar and a microphone, and play a personal, low key, rendition of songs.
That won't happen though.

[BlobVanDam]

Well, would it be wrong to expect another Happy Holidays release? Has a precedent been set?

One purpose of that release was to "fill in the blanks" for the songs they played live, but weren't featured on LALP. Since there's basically nothing they played live that wasn't on BTFW (with maybe one exception), I don't think there's as much reason to, and it may take away from BTFW due to overlap.
I'd love them to release something, but if they do, I wouldn't expect it to be like last year.

[Rodni Demental]

Given how they just released a DVD, I doubt they'll release another concert cut. What they could/should do is maybe sit down in a room, with a piano, acoustic guitar and a microphone, and play a personal, low key, rendition of songs.
That won't happen though.

Thing is, Luna Park had only just come out when they released more 'concert cuts' as you put it. Then again, as the above poster mentioned that was more a compliment to Luna Park if anything. I like the idea of some acoustic versions of already existing songs. Never say never, it could happen one day!

[RaiseTheKnife]

Given how they just released a DVD, I doubt they'll release another concert cut. What they could/should do is maybe sit down in a room, with a piano, acoustic guitar and a microphone, and play a personal, low key, rendition of songs.
That won't happen though.

It is possible Jordan might do that.  He did three intimate piano concerts in recent memory with his Pledge drives. So I wouldn't rule it out.

[rumborak]

No offense to Jordan, but I personally don't find his solo piano stuff very appealing. He did a cover of Steven Wilson's "The Raven" the other day, and it was essentially a finger exercise.
No, it would have to be the full band, in a small setting. That would be interesting.

[bl5150]

Raw Dog - Unplugged

[mikeyd23]

Given how they just released a DVD, I doubt they'll release another concert cut. What they could/should do is maybe sit down in a room, with a piano, acoustic guitar and a microphone, and play a personal, low key, rendition of songs.
That won't happen though.

YES! That would be great! I tend to agree with you, that likely won't happen, but I'd still love to see it.

[Kotowboy]

Listened to Octavarium again yesterday.

Ehhh - still my favourite DT album. I see it as the last of that "era" - and not just because they signed to RoadRunner after that.

[RoeDent]

In terms of their epics, they absolutely peaked with Octavarium. ITPoE is a drop right down, with the other two climbing back up, each better than the last, but neither have reached the triplet peaks of the first three.

[Dublagent66]

I think SDOIT was their peak but 8VM wasn't too far off after that.  ITPOE was a drop off but still a great piece.  TCOT was a step up.  BAI is the peak since SDOIT and IT drops right into the abyss.

Also, for the next album, please no more songs about angels.  I've had just about enough of 

[Kotowboy]

I like In The Presence of Enemies part 1 and part 2 barely at all. They made the right decision separating them !

I like The Count Of Tuscany as a whole a lot more than In The Presence Of Enemies as a whole.

Octavarium is their highest point for me. Not even Six Degrees can topple it - but it gets pretty close.




EDIT - does anyone have any reason/theory why Octavarium the song is Exactly 24 minutes ?

To tie in with the theme of 8 - 24 is 8 x 3 but that seems really arbitrary.

2+4 = 6 ? Still nothing.

Do you think they wrote roughly 23 minutes of music and thought "lets just make it 24 minutes on the dot because it's a multiple of 8 " ?

[hefdaddy42]

Do you think they wrote roughly 23 minutes of music and thought "lets just make it 24 minutes on the dot because it's a multiple of 8 " ?

Yes.

[Kotowboy]

Do you think they wrote roughly 23 minutes of music and thought "lets just make it 24 minutes on the dot because it's a multiple of 8 " ?

Yes.

k

[Rodni Demental]

Well, the themes relate to the idea of cycles within cycles. You could say 24 is a familiar number that represents the cycle of a day, but that's probably too basic and boring to be the real reason.

Perhaps a better reason is because Octavarium is the beginning of the second octave of the "Octavarium cycle", returning to the key of F, which is what the first song starts in and what Octavarium starts and ends in. Two octaves contains exactly 24 notes?

I see it as the last of that "era" - and not just because they signed to RoadRunner after that.

Well DT saw it as the end of an era too, and the end of the meta-album cycle that they'd dug themselves into. It's quite possible with SC they were very deliberately trying to do something a bit new and different (for the band).

[Kotowboy]

Well, the themes relate to the idea of cycles within cycles. You could say 24 is a familiar number that represents the cycle of a day, but that's probably too basic and boring to be the real reason.

Perhaps a better reason is because Octavarium is the beginning of the second octave of the "Octavarium cycle", returning to the key of F, which is what the first song starts in and what Octavarium starts and ends in. Two octaves contains exactly 24 notes?

I see it as the last of that "era" - and not just because they signed to RoadRunner after that.

Well DT saw it as the end of an era too, and the end of the meta-album cycle that they'd dug themselves into. It's quite possible with SC they were very deliberately trying to do something a bit new and different (for the band).

I think structurally at least - SC is very similar to Octavarium.

[Grizz]

24 [...] represents the cycle of a day.

This is the most widely accepted theory.

Well DT saw it as the end of an era too, and the end of the meta-album cycle that they'd dug themselves into. It's quite possible with SC they were very deliberately trying to do something a bit new and different (for the band).

They were but ending the meta-album was already part of the plan, hence why Octavarium is cyclical. The cycle is the terminus.

[fadetoblackdude7]

ITPOE as a whole is extremely underrated. With the exception of V. The Reckoning (which is forced), it's an excellent piece. What with the dark lyrical content and the atmosphere of the whole thing, it really sets it apart from the others.