Biggest DT-related disappointment

[?]

MP's departure was a shock at first, but I quickly realized that it's a fresh start for DT, so I was only excited to see who would join the band and what the next album would sound like.

DT12, on the other hand, was (and still is) a disappointment...

[Mladen]

Probably the fact that the combo tour with Iron Maiden was happening only in USA. I would have killed to see a tour like that in Europe.

Well, a couple of years ago (2011 maybe) Maiden played together with DT (and twisted sister, hammerfall, uriah heep...) in Spain

I remember this, and I was extremely jealous. 

[emtee]

1A) Portnoy Quitting
1B) Sonic qualities of the last 2 albums. I was crushed when I first spun ADToE. I thought I had a bad disc.

2) Skipping the Detroit show prior to Score. I understood why but was bummed.

3) Kevin Moore's departure

[ThatOneGuy2112]

I'm surprised how much people in here dislike DT12.  I don't remember reading so many negative views on it after its initial release.  I could easily be wrong though.

Well for me personally, it just hasn't aged very well at all. I wasn't ever head over heels for it, but I was definitely more favourable towards it initially, than I am now.

I guess this general view could explain a lot.

Yeah, I think the general consensus, for the forum at least, went from "oh, it's meh" on release to "hey, it's actually good" given a little bit of time, and now it's back to "it's meh".

Personally, I think the album has aged wonderfully. I like it more than I did on release.

[As I Am]

MP leaving. DT just hasn't been the same since

[bosk1]

I'm surprised how much people in here dislike DT12.  I don't remember reading so many negative views on it after its initial release.  I could easily be wrong though.

Well for me personally, it just hasn't aged very well at all. I wasn't ever head over heels for it, but I was definitely more favourable towards it initially, than I am now.

I guess this general view could explain a lot.

Yeah, I think the general consensus, for the forum at least, went from "oh, it's meh" on release to "hey, it's actually good" given a little bit of time, and now it's back to "it's meh".

Personally, I think the album has aged wonderfully. I like it more than I did on release.

I don't think it is a "general consensus" at all.  I think there are maybe a dozen or so on the forums who are just vocal and repeat that they do not like it, and that there is still a VERY large majority that considers it a good, very good, or great album.

[Sir Walrus Cauliflower]

Put me down as one of those who consider it a great album. I still listen to it all the way through at least once or twice a week.

As far a disappoinments go, the lack of in studio footage for the last two albums.

[ToT-147]

For sure.. As I do..

Anyway, I hope more for the next album.. MM and JLB are already focused and very certain about their contribution to the band in its new stage.. They really surprised me with the latest album, but I know that mostly because I wasn't expecting something as good as ended up being to me..

Now the next album, if is not at least a little better than DT12, then I think that would be a sort of disappointment, though the expression sounds a bit exaggerated IMO..

[rumborak]

I don't think it is a "general consensus" at all.  I think there are maybe a dozen or so on the forums who are just vocal and repeat that they do not like it, and that there is still a VERY large majority that considers it a good, very good, or great album.

While I would agree that DTF can sometimes end up with distorted views, at least regarding DT12 it seems in line with the rest of the greater fan base:

https://www.sputnikmusic.com/bands/Dream-Theater/49/

According to that list, DT12 is on place 9.

EDIT: This place puts it at place 6: https://rateyourmusic.com/artist/dream_theater

[KevShmev]

Middle of the pack sounds about right.  It's not as great as their consensus best albums, but it's certainly better than the debut and the majority of their less than great efforts from the 00s.

[Sycsa]

I don't think it is a "general consensus" at all.  I think there are maybe a dozen or so on the forums who are just vocal and repeat that they do not like it, and that there is still a VERY large majority that considers it a good, very good, or great album.

This, easily. The same names keep popping up with negative opinions regarding DT12. I'm fairly confident that way over 75% of the forum would put it in the "good-great-excellent" category. Not that it really amounts to anything, but since we're talking consensus...

[rumborak]

I think you guys confuse the "worn-off new car smell" proclamations that appeared of late with genuine "this album is bottom of the barrel", of which there aren't all that many. I would say DTF is pretty much in line with those online rankings. A good effort, certainly better than their weakest albums, but also in no real contention for the top 5.

[King Postwhore]

I think you guys confuse the "worn-off new car smell" proclamations that appeared of late with genuine "this album is bottom of the barrel", of which there aren't all that many. I would say DTF is pretty much in line with those online rankings. A good effort, certainly better than their weakest albums, but also in no real contention for the top 5.

That's how I look at it.  I still play it a lot but it's in the middle of the pack for DT albums.

[kirksnosehair]

I think you guys confuse the "worn-off new car smell" proclamations that appeared of late with genuine "this album is bottom of the barrel", of which there aren't all that many. I would say DTF is pretty much in line with those online rankings. A good effort, certainly better than their weakest albums, but also in no real contention for the top 5.

[JayOctavarium]

I was a bit disappointed by the fact that DT cut their touring schedule a bit short and never really did a proper U.S. headline tour for Black Clouds. 

This. I didn't like the Progressive Nation concept as a whole. I wanted way more DT on those tours!

Mike told us all in LA that they'd see us again in the spring.

That never happened

[Skeever]

The sputnik records are around what mine would be, though I'd place FII way higher.

[YtseJamittaja]

For me, the biggest DT-related disappointment is the DT12 artwork. Poor Hugh Syme. Nice pictures but really if he could have bothered to remove the stock image watermarks...

Another little disappointment could be Live @ Luna Park. The setlist sonded promising and everything got me very excited but when it came out I watched it once and now it's in my book shelf collecting dust.

[thedrumanimal]

My biggest DT-related disappointment was the release of FII. I became aware of the band in 1995, so this was the first album which was released with me being a fan. And I was so disappointed... I liked NM, HK, LitS, ToT, but the rest was so mediocre for me at that time. A huge letdown compared to Awake and IaW, those albums really changed my life at that time.

What followed was the biggest positive surprise... the release of Scenes... 

[Onno]

For me, the biggest DT-related disappointment is the DT12 artwork. Poor Hugh Syme. Nice pictures but really if he could have bothered to remove the stock image watermarks...

Another little disappointment could be Live @ Luna Park. The setlist sonded promising and everything got me very excited but when it came out I watched it once and now it's in my book shelf collecting dust.

Agreed to those two.

Another disappointment was MM's playing on the outro of Finally Free live. He didn't play it anywhere near as well as Portnoy did.

[RaiseTheKnife]

For me, the biggest DT-related disappointment is the DT12 artwork..

I agree with this.  The artwork and lack of a clever album name seemed rather lackluster to me. 

But my personal biggest disappointment was when Kevin Moore left.  It was hard to fathom at the time.  Guess you had to be there.

[BlobVanDam]

For me, the biggest DT-related disappointment is the DT12 artwork. Poor Hugh Syme. Nice pictures but really if he could have bothered to remove the stock image watermarks...

Another little disappointment could be Live @ Luna Park. The setlist sonded promising and everything got me very excited but when it came out I watched it once and now it's in my book shelf collecting dust.

Agreed to those two.

Another disappointment was MM's playing on the outro of Finally Free live. He didn't play it anywhere near as well as Portnoy did.

There were a few little tempo/drum related disappointments for me on LALP too, including that one, although nothing that I'd consider huge.
I didn't find the mix to be that bad, although the guitars were a bit loud. I could hear the keyboards just fine for the most part, which is one of the major complaints. The Christmas release had a much better mix though.

[KevShmev]

But my personal biggest disappointment was when Kevin Moore left.  It was hard to fathom at the time.  Guess you had to be there.

Yep, it was a definite kick in the gut at the time.  I have told this story before, but we found about it literally minutes before buying tickets to out first DT show ever.  We were still awash in the greatness of Awake, which had just been released, and couldn't wait to get tickets bought, and then it was me who was flipping through a music magazine at Schnucks (where it was easy to get good seats at their ticket outlet back then) that read about his departure.  I was like, "NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!" 

[Lucien]

My only real disappointment was how old DT12 started getting to me. I still listen to Illumination Theory pretty often, but I listen to the others rarely now. 

[YtseJamittaja]

For me, the biggest DT-related disappointment is the DT12 artwork. Poor Hugh Syme. Nice pictures but really if he could have bothered to remove the stock image watermarks...

Another little disappointment could be Live @ Luna Park. The setlist sonded promising and everything got me very excited but when it came out I watched it once and now it's in my book shelf collecting dust.

Agreed to those two.

Another disappointment was MM's playing on the outro of Finally Free live. He didn't play it anywhere near as well as Portnoy did.

There were a few little tempo/drum related disappointments for me on LALP too, including that one, although nothing that I'd consider huge.
I didn't find the mix to be that bad, although the guitars were a bit loud. I could hear the keyboards just fine for the most part, which is one of the major complaints. The Christmas release had a much better mix though.

Agreed. MM's playing is a bit uninteresting at the times.

[OpenYourEyes311]

My biggest disappointment with DT came in 2007. I went to five shows that year, culminating in the show at Jones Beach. Before the show the band was appearing at Looney Tunes Records somewhere on LI. They were gonna be there from 2-4pm. I showed up at 3:30 (because I had to wait for a friend to meet up with me who was coming from Mass, not because I just show up places late). Anyway, walked in ready to get my 20th Anniversary Poster all signed, and the band wasn't there. I don't know when they left, but I know it wasn't 4 o'clock! I was so crushed. That was the last time I had the chance to meet them (other than spending $$$ on Plat tix).

[BelichickFan]

I love the last two CDs so I'm definitely not in the group that has those as disappointments.

A few for me :

- FII.  Although I removed the tracks I don't like and added ACoS and now it's a really good CD.

- SDoIT, Disc 1.  I know I'm in the distinct minority but I still don't like it.

- Static Setlists.  I get it, but I can't say I like it.

- Portnoy leaving, obviously but it's all good now.

- Time will tell on this but I think Along for the Ride is replacing TSCO long term in concert, this is a Speculative Disappointment, I like AFTR but not as much as TSCO and hope I'm wrong about this.

I can't really think of anything else.

[Sir Walrus Cauliflower]

I agree about AFTR. I think it is to DT12 what Another Day is to I&W, meaning I think it's by far the worst track.

That was a huge disappointment for me. When AFTR was released as a single I was pretty worried. It's the only song on DT12 I get the urge to skip, plus it's sandwiched right between STR and IT, and I'm a big fan of those two.

[ThatOneGuy2112]

While they're both certainly ballads, I just adore Another Day. while Along for the Ride, while good, isn't that special. I agree, it's definitely my least favorite song on DT12 and if there were any song that I might have the urge to skip on the album, it's probably that. On its own though, it's a very solid track.

[Sir Walrus Cauliflower]

Oddly enough, Another Day is one of the songs that really struck me when I first heard it on Last.FM without really knowing about DT... I was really impressed, but then when compared to the rest of I&W it's seemed pretty weak to me. I still wouldn't ever call it a bad song, just not on par with the rest of the album, or a good bit of DT songs IMO.

Also, I can't unhear "Throw them a rag, better to save the menstruate. That you want me tuna sea crap. WHALE." at the end

[Stadler]

They both operate "under the radar" of the music business,

Not being critical, just making a comment, but I'd be curious on what criteria you base the idea that PJ flies under the radar of the music business?   They are the alternative Bruce Springsteen.  I'm not sure I could name something that Jann Wenner wouldn't do to, for, or at Eddie Vedder if asked (if you can't tell, I'm no fan of Mr. Wenner or either of his organizations). 

Didn't the band say they would have to up their interaction with the fans following MP's departure? They didn't. Factor in the higher ticket prices and lack of setlist rotation, and being a DT fan these days feels less like being a member of a fan community and more like being a consumer of a product. Perhaps the most disappointing thing of all.

My biggest disappointment is/was Mike leaving.  I make no apologies for being a Portnoy fan, though I like all the other members and have nothing against Mike Mangini.   But I think the reason it has stayed the biggest disappointment instead of me moving on (I got over Blackmore, my favorite musician of all time, leaving Purple) is the above paragraph.   It was supposed to be no big deal, we'll do this and we'll do that, and yadda yadda and none of it happened.   I'm not usually one to care about the culture of the fanbase, but I did with DT, and it has noticeably changed and not for the better. 

[KevShmev]

Didn't the band say they would have to up their interaction with the fans following MP's departure? They didn't. Factor in the higher ticket prices and lack of setlist rotation, and being a DT fan these days feels less like being a member of a fan community and more like being a consumer of a product. Perhaps the most disappointing thing of all.

My biggest disappointment is/was Mike leaving.  I make no apologies for being a Portnoy fan, though I like all the other members and have nothing against Mike Mangini.   But I think the reason it has stayed the biggest disappointment instead of me moving on (I got over Blackmore, my favorite musician of all time, leaving Purple) is the above paragraph.   It was supposed to be no big deal, we'll do this and we'll do that, and yadda yadda and none of it happened.   I'm not usually one to care about the culture of the fanbase, but I did with DT, and it has noticeably changed and not for the better.

None of it happened? 

Did we imagine that bonus live CD that gave us all last Christmas?

Did we imagine the acoustic parts of the set lists on the ADTOE tour, something they hadn't done in forever or ever?

Did we imagine them playing songs on the last two tours that hadn't been played in a long time (Lifting Shadows, Trail of Tears, Wait for Sleep)  or ever (Space Dye Vest, The Shattered Fortress)? 

[GentlemanofDread]

Actually, when was the last time they release a free live CD for ALL Dream Theater fans?

[badger]

Sound at the KC concert

Learning that MM plays to a click track  (all of them do I think)   

[Sir Walrus Cauliflower]

Wow, I'm surprised at how may people have been to the KC show.

As far as I know Mangini plays to a click with the song behind it, but the rest of the band can't hear that.

[Grizz]

Didn't the band say they would have to up their interaction with the fans following MP's departure? They didn't. Factor in the higher ticket prices and lack of setlist rotation, and being a DT fan these days feels less like being a member of a fan community and more like being a consumer of a product. Perhaps the most disappointing thing of all.

My biggest disappointment is/was Mike leaving.  I make no apologies for being a Portnoy fan, though I like all the other members and have nothing against Mike Mangini.   But I think the reason it has stayed the biggest disappointment instead of me moving on (I got over Blackmore, my favorite musician of all time, leaving Purple) is the above paragraph.   It was supposed to be no big deal, we'll do this and we'll do that, and yadda yadda and none of it happened.   I'm not usually one to care about the culture of the fanbase, but I did with DT, and it has noticeably changed and not for the better.

None of it happened? 

Did we imagine that bonus live CD that gave us all last Christmas?

Did we imagine the acoustic parts of the set lists on the ADTOE tour, something they hadn't done in forever or ever?

Did we imagine them playing songs on the last two tours that hadn't been played in a long time (Lifting Shadows, Trail of Tears, Wait for Sleep)  or ever (Space Dye Vest, The Shattered Fortress)?

There's still quite a bit to be desired in the communications department.