Author Topic: 2014-15 NBA thread v. 2015-16 thread now playing  (Read 56512 times)

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Offline TheOutlawXanadu

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #630 on: April 29, 2015, 08:18:01 AM »
To me, people are getting way too worked up about the "principle of the matter" when discussing whether or not to change the Hack-A-Shaq rule. Those saying the rule should not be changed are saying it would be dumb to change a rule because some players can't shoot free throws, which is such a basic basketball skill.

While they are 100% right, I don't really care. I watch basketball to be entertained. Just change the rule. :lol
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Offline FlyingBIZKIT

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #631 on: April 29, 2015, 10:04:12 AM »
I believe the Blazers can turn this series around. They still won't win it, but I just hope they go down fighting. Try to make it to 6! I originally had predicted Memphis in 5, could still happen.

I mean, I'm sorry, but sending DJ to the free throw line is simply a smart move. It's not pretty or fun to watch him brick everything, but that's not the Spurs' fault. Jordan is a tremendous player, he just needs to work on his charity stripe throws. Until then, don't see why the Spurs can't use that to their advantage. No rule is being broken.

Offline Nekov

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #632 on: April 29, 2015, 10:42:40 AM »
I get both sides, it's not nice to watch the Hack-a-player strategy but as TheOutlawXanadu says, shooting free throws is part of the game, get your big men to practice more.
Aside from that, itīs hard to change the rule. If you decide to penalize intentional fouls on a player that's not handling the ball by having him shoot the free throws and then giving the team the ball back, what will prevent players from running into a screen hard so that they get a foul call? And if they do, how will the refs identify which of those are intentional and which are just part of the game? Will they have to review each of them? That would be a lot worse than the rule staying as it is right now.

What other options are there?
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Offline FlyingBIZKIT

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #633 on: April 29, 2015, 10:46:18 AM »
I get both sides, it's not nice to watch the Hack-a-player strategy but as TheOutlawXanadu says, shooting free throws is part of the game, get your big men to practice more.
Aside from that, itīs hard to change the rule. If you decide to penalize intentional fouls on a player that's not handling the ball by having him shoot the free throws and then giving the team the ball back, what will prevent players from running into a screen hard so that they get a foul call? And if they do, how will the refs identify which of those are intentional and which are just part of the game? Will they have to review each of them? That would be a lot worse than the rule staying as it is right now.

What other options are there?

I agree.


One thing I've always found a bit funny about the NBA is you see guys playing physical on the perimeter but if they drive in the lane and get tapped on the arm it's a foul.  :lol

Offline senecadawg2

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #634 on: April 29, 2015, 11:38:27 AM »
I mean, I'm sorry, but sending DJ to the free throw line is simply a smart move. It's not pretty or fun to watch him brick everything, but that's not the Spurs' fault. Jordan is a tremendous player, he just needs to work on his charity stripe throws. Until then, don't see why the Spurs can't use that to their advantage. No rule is being broken.

Smart- sure.

But rules are being broken. Fouling constitutes a break in a rule- that's why it's a foul in the first place. And fouling intentionally because you know that the other player isn't a good free throw shooter is really not so different from cheating. What is cheating if not intentionally breaking rules to get an advantage?

Obviously, it's not quite that simple though. The impetus is also on the players to be good free throw shooters because, as TOX mentioned, it's just a fundamental part of the game. A comparison that comes to mind is in soccer, when there's a shot that's very clearly about to go in and then one of the defending players grabs it out of the air with his hands (Suarez). That player is punished with a foul called against him and if it looks intentional sent off the field. But he's still won his team an advantage, by breaking the rule. Is it smart in a win-at-all-costs kind of way? Absolutely. But it's not really in the spirit of the game, in my opinion.

Nekov is right though, it's hard to imagine how to change these rules. Not only is it hard to monitor these things in live time during the game, but theres also a noticeable difference between hack-a-shaq in the 3rd quarter as a strategy to slow things down and disrupt the flow of the game and hack-a-shaq with 20 seconds left when down by a basket. As for how they might deal with this, if they were going to, I'd think maybe dealing out punishment post-game, after reviewing the tape, would make the most sense. If theres an obvious and patterned strategy of intentionally fouling a particular player in the middle of the game, as there was last night, it's not too hard to miss and punish accordingly.
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Offline Nekov

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #635 on: April 29, 2015, 02:24:25 PM »
I have to disagree. There are no rules being broken here, fouling other players is part of the game whether it's intentional or not and the punishment is sending the player to the FT. No one is cheating, they're just taking advantage of the current rules.
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #636 on: April 29, 2015, 03:08:45 PM »
I didn't see the game, but while I agree that it makes the game boring and slow, blame the clowns who can't hit a free throw.  If they didn't suck at it, teams wouldn't intentionally foul them. 

Offline j

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #637 on: April 29, 2015, 04:55:10 PM »
NBA officiating is so bad as it is, the last thing the game needs is another thing for them to try to constantly discern ("intention").  It's not a "cheating" strategy so much as it is exploiting a weakness.  At the end of a game when your'e down, you try to force the inbound pass to the team's worst free throw shooter so you can foul him.  The opposing team would be wise to not have any exploitably poor free throw shooters on the floor in these situations, by whatever means.  This is no different.

I agree to an extent with TOX: I watch basketball to be entertained.  There are a lot of bad rules and player tendencies, not to mention horrible officiating, that get in the way of that.  But part of the entertainment is in the intensity of the competition, and in the "integrity of the game," although I'm not sure I could define that if you asked me to.  I definitely side with the camp who doesn't want a rule change.  Dwight Howard and DeAndre Jordan should be doing nothing but shooting free throws between playoff games, and I daresay doing a lot more of it in practice throughout the regular season.  It ain't rocket surgery, as they say.

-J

Offline Nekov

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #638 on: April 30, 2015, 07:34:18 AM »
It ain't rocket surgery, as they say.

-J

I know a guy who tried to become a rocket surgeon but we don't have any rockets in this country and his Visa for the US was denied. Talk about killing peoples dreams....
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Offline jammindude

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #639 on: April 30, 2015, 08:33:57 PM »
Haven't followed the NBA much lately...but had to do a double take when I looked over my Mother In Law's shoulder at the score on the Bulls-Bucks game.   

She loves basketball...that's why I couldn't figure out why she had turned the channel away from the game 3 times.    When I went in to tell her the Spurs (her fav) were going to be on in a few minutes, I thought the score HAD to be a mistake.    Nope.    No wonder she kept shutting it off.    :lol
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Offline Azyiu

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #640 on: April 30, 2015, 11:26:15 PM »
What a tough series. I thought the key in game 6 was FT shootings.

While Splitter went 3 of 8, TD went 0 for 2; DJ went a surprising 7 for 15!! I mean, if only Splitter would've made a couple more, and TD just one more; while DJ gone to his usual FT percentage, the outcome of game 6 would've been totally different.

Regardless of who wins this series, the Rockets are going to play a very tired team in their game 1 at home.
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Offline Implode

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #641 on: May 01, 2015, 08:19:12 AM »
Haven't followed the NBA much lately...but had to do a double take when I looked over my Mother In Law's shoulder at the score on the Bulls-Bucks game.   

I thought the score was fake at first when I checked the final this morning. What the hell happened?

Offline Aefenwelg

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. God Lays the Pipe on OKC
« Reply #642 on: May 01, 2015, 12:27:54 PM »
3 CHI vs 6 MIL

As you can tell from my sig (which is completely outdated, I know), I'm a Chicago sports fan.
Being a Chicago sports fan, I'm quite aware that the Bulls have the potential to really suck at times for some reason.
They should still win the series, but I'm not confident enough to predict a sweep.
I do hope that this starts a neighbors-rivalry.

Yeah, I think that was pretty accurate.

Offline Azyiu

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #643 on: May 01, 2015, 08:40:09 PM »
During the Hawks / Nets game 6, Jeff Van Gundy said about suspending players for 1.5 or 1.75 game instead of one full game per unit. I think that's a good idea! How about sitting them in a penalty box near court side for the duration of the suspension? Lol!  :lol  :lol  :lol
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Offline Syzzle

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #644 on: May 02, 2015, 06:35:29 AM »
Jeff Van Gundy always has great ideas wish we could get him as Commissioner instead of Stern 2.0.

Offline Azyiu

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #645 on: May 02, 2015, 07:39:31 AM »
Could tonight's game 7 be the last time we see the Spurs as they are for the last 10 plus years?
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Offline Nekov

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #646 on: May 02, 2015, 10:57:26 AM »
Could tonight's game 7 be the last time we see the Spurs as they are for the last 10 plus years?

Could be. I don't think Manu will keep playing the game. It will be a very sad day when he announces his retirement.
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Offline black_biff_stadler

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #647 on: May 02, 2015, 11:33:32 AM »
I'll gladly take their departure. I loved 'em in the David Robinson days and still liked 'em for a good bit in the Duncan era but I've always considered Ginobili a flop-happy chickenshit and this hacking cowardice has made them a laughable shell of their once-respectable selves.
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Offline Azyiu

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #648 on: May 02, 2015, 07:26:15 PM »
I'll gladly take their departure. I loved 'em in the David Robinson days and still liked 'em for a good bit in the Duncan era but I've always considered Ginobili a flop-happy chickenshit and this hacking cowardice has made them a laughable shell of their once-respectable selves.

He might be a flopper, but I like Diaw, Mills and Leonard.

That being said, I think they look tired already, and it is only half time...  :omg:
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Offline j

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #649 on: May 02, 2015, 09:08:10 PM »
It is really too bad those two teams met in the first round.  Hell of a series.

I do feel like the Clippers kinda "stole" it though.  It looked to me like SA was clearly the more disciplined, consistent team.  And the Clips will really struggle in the next round if Paul isn't back to 100%.  But I hope they at least make it to the western conference finals.

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Offline TheOutlawXanadu

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #650 on: May 02, 2015, 09:25:13 PM »
Amazing series. Tonight's game was one of the best I've seen in a while.
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Offline black_biff_stadler

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #651 on: May 02, 2015, 10:00:02 PM »
I do feel like the Clippers kinda "stole" it though.  It looked to me like SA was clearly the more disciplined, consistent team.

It's hard to call it stealing when the Spurs had to farm extra possessions via intentional fouling to such an egregious extent. If anything, the Clippers probably would've won this in 5 or 6 if there was a rule in place to prevent that pussy shit. I know they lost one game by 27 but if the Spurs were actually good enough to do that each game I seriously doubt they'd be clinging to hacking as extensively as they did.
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Offline Azyiu

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #652 on: May 02, 2015, 10:21:01 PM »
That was a great run by the Spurs. For the most part, I thought the Clippers out played the Spurs in this series, but the Spurs' experience kept them in it until the end. I enjoyed watching them over the years, even though I am a Lakers fan.  :hat

The Dubs and the Grizzlies are about the only ones left that I like. Knowing the Grizzlies don't really stand a good chance against the Dubs, so hopefully they go for it all the way!
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Offline Syzzle

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #653 on: May 03, 2015, 03:37:00 AM »
The Spurs and Pac man both lose in the same night? Somebody put Skip Bayless on suicide watch.

Offline KevShmev

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to an O'Brien
« Reply #654 on: May 03, 2015, 08:42:33 AM »
I'll gladly take their departure. I loved 'em in the David Robinson days and still liked 'em for a good bit in the Duncan era but I've always considered Ginobili a flop-happy chickenshit and this hacking cowardice has made them a laughable shell of their once-respectable selves.

I blame the league and their refs for all of the flopping.  If they would have the balls to start 'T'ing up players who flop, like how the NHL will now penalize players for embellishment, then players wouldn't flop.  I agree that Ginobili is in that top tier of floppers, as is Chris Paul, but to me it's gamesmanship.  If the refs are gonna fall for it, you do it.

Offline orcus116

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #655 on: May 03, 2015, 09:21:57 AM »
Minimum full season ban for flopping. That should do it.

Offline Azyiu

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #656 on: May 03, 2015, 09:46:20 AM »
I think a T on the spot for floppers is enough.  :hat
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Offline jammindude

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #657 on: May 03, 2015, 10:31:08 AM »
I think that would only encourage a higher level of acting.   


Like the kind we always see in soccer.   :angel:
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Offline Azyiu

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #658 on: May 04, 2015, 07:28:52 AM »
I think that would only encourage a higher level of acting.   


Like the kind we always see in soccer.   :angel:

You mean T-ing up floppers would only encourage them? Well, not if the league also change the way technical fouls and suspensions are handled. Currently a player would automatically be suspended by a game on the 16th technical fouls in the season. How about lowering that limit to 10 or so, and specifically state that each technical fouls resulted from flopping (upon reviewed by the NBA) would be doubled and so on.
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Offline j

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #659 on: May 04, 2015, 04:48:46 PM »
I hate flopping as much or more than the next guy, but you guys seem to be forgetting that it's still on the officials to discern flopping from non-flopping.  And we all know how great and consistent they are at making judgment calls.

Honestly, I've thought for a long time that the entirety of what the rulebook has to say about offensive fouls warrants a complete overhaul.  In order to eliminate "flopping," I feel like more contact has to be allowed on both sides of the ball.

-J

Offline Accelerando

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #660 on: May 04, 2015, 05:20:07 PM »
I think the league needs to work on calling travels, carrying, and push-offs other than catering to a player who can't make a damn free throw but looks excellent dunking on ESPN's Top Ten Plays.

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #661 on: May 04, 2015, 10:55:21 PM »
No bias there.
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Offline Syzzle

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #662 on: May 05, 2015, 06:28:16 AM »
If they started T-ing up floppers James Harden would be suspended for the entire season :lol

Offline FlyingBIZKIT

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #663 on: May 05, 2015, 08:51:36 AM »
I'm seeing a Warriors vs Bulls final

Offline Azyiu

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Re: 2014-15 NBA thread v. Hacking your way to a 1st round exit
« Reply #664 on: May 05, 2015, 09:52:05 AM »
I'm seeing a Warriors vs Bulls final

The Bulls looked good last night, but are we a bit ahead of ourselves here? Just saying  :hat
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