Poll

What grade do you give the Score set list, given that it was a 20th anniversary one?

A
44 (30.1%)
B
68 (46.6%)
C
25 (17.1%)
D
8 (5.5%)
F
1 (0.7%)

Total Members Voted: 145

Voting closes: March 09, 2035, 05:49:26 PM

Author Topic: What grade do you give the Score set list?  (Read 3270 times)

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Offline KevShmev

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What grade do you give the Score set list?
« on: April 27, 2014, 06:49:26 PM »
I finally bought this on DVD, after avoiding it for so long because of what I always considered a pretty mediocre-looking set list.  After watching it, though, I think a little more of it, thanks to Set 1 coming off better than it looks on paper.  The performances of Afterlife, Raise the Knife, Under a Glass Moon and Innocence Faded are all dynamite, and that is a nice rendition of Another Won.  And ending a set with The Spirit Carries On is always good.

On the flip side, Set 2 is largely unimpressive, for me.  I don't care for 6DOIT as a single piece, and having it as one track on the DVD is really annoying.  I like Vacant, but with the orchestra, no thanks. The Answer Lies Within and Sacrificed Sons were both snoozers.  However, the performance of Octavarium was pretty spectacular.  I mainly bought the DVD because I wanted that to be on at least one of the live DT DVDs I own.  Metropolis as the encore is obviously great. 

Ultimately, I think having the orchestra restricted them, as they obviously felt like they had to do songs that heavily featured strings, like 6DOIT (thanks to the overture) and The Answer Lies Within.  But it severely lessened the set list.

Overall, I'll give the set list a B-, but considering it was an anniversary show and set list, it only gets a C from me.

Offline TheGreatPretender

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2014, 06:55:13 PM »
I really love this setlist. I give it a B, but mainly because the setlist for LSFNY and the newest one have been so damn perfect.

But all in all, there isn't a single song on Score that I would change. The only songs on it that I wouldn't call my favorites, are probably the ones that weren't available in live format before, so they're still more than welcome. But Another Won, Raise The Knife, SDOIT and 8VM really give this setlist one amazing edge for both sets.

And I really enjoyed seeing IWBY and TALW live.

Offline black_biff_stadler

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2014, 07:12:04 PM »
D

Octavarium is my least favorite DT album and this setlist is loaded with it. I realize they were touring for it with it being the current album and all so I completely cut them slack for having that much of it on there. Where I don't cut them slack is leaving out two of the three songs I can most tolerate from it (TW and PA.) Beyond that, Innocence Faded, The Spirit Carries on, SDOIT, and Vacant are all close to being my least favorite songs from their albums. Having Metropolis and Afterlife were huge bonuses for it though and Anther Won was a nice song for me to discover. All in all, however, I've watched this thing like maybe 3 or 4 times ever and haven't watched it in like 5 years at least. It's just too tedious to sit through all the stuff I, at best, only slightly dislike.
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Offline KevShmev

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2014, 07:20:23 PM »
Same here, regarding Octavarium.  I don't dislike The Answer Lies Within - it's an enjoyable song, albeit very vanilla -  but how is that good enough to make it on to a set list celebrating 20 years of Dream Theater?  And again, Sacrificed Sons really sticks out like a sore thumb in that 2nd to last spot of the 2nd set (which is normally reserved for something really great). 

Offline Rodni Demental

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2014, 07:23:33 PM »
It's great! I always viewed it as the 'family friendly' setlist. And I couldn't agree more that set 1 comes off a lot better than you'd expect. It helped me gain appreciation for 3 songs that I otherwise wasn't into. (Another Won, Raise The Knife, Innocence Faded). I think it has an excellent flow to it, dynamically and chronologically, it's very cool how the first set just chooses one song from each album to represent it (after new material for the introduction). And despite the choices seeming somewhat strange at first, I think they're all great choices to represent each time period.

There's also a lot of contributions from all the current and previous members. I think JM is the only one that doesn't have a song in the set with lyric contributions. And then there's the Orchestra which adds another dimension to all of the songs they play on. I've heard a few complaints about the tuning/timing of the Orchestra but I think these are pretty minor considerations and don't take away from the experience unless you deliberately focus on that sort of thing.

Not to mention Six Degrees and Octavarium at the same show? Total win. I doubt something like that will ever happen again. Regarding the Octarium album choices (seeing as half the album is actually on here), I think they intentionally chose the ones that would benefit more from the orchestra. Making SS and TALW more obvious choices. Although admittedly, I could imagine These Walls might benefit a fair bit from real strings.

Then again, LSFNY and Budakan give Score's setlist a run for it's money. And Chaos in Motion actually has a decent variety of songs too even if it wasn't an official setlist in of itself and just a collection. And Luna Park was a great set of songs that worked perfectly with the new band lineup, it was a lot of the stuff we would have wanted them to still play imo. So in the end, I was never gonna complain about Score's set because I really like how each release has it's own unique flavour of songs. When each live release has a 'greatest hitz' feel to it is the only time I'll complain, otherwise I think DT has always been good at mixing up their setlists, and Score is a great example of this.
« Last Edit: April 27, 2014, 07:29:50 PM by Rodni Demental »

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #5 on: April 27, 2014, 07:23:56 PM »
I dunno about the setlist but I score the amp that John was using a C+

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Offline KevShmev

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #6 on: April 27, 2014, 07:28:13 PM »
  I think DT has always been good at mixing up their setlists, and Score is a great example of this.

Agreed.  If you have every DT officially released live DVD, you have a ton of DT songs, and Score has 10 songs that you won't find as a whole on any other. 

I just that, in a vacuum, it is an average set list, especially by anniversary set list standards.

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2014, 07:33:04 PM »
Well it wasn't their 20th Anniversary anyway, remember?

Offline KevShmev

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2014, 07:38:16 PM »
Well it wasn't their 20th Anniversary anyway, remember?


Offline orcus116

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2014, 09:12:24 PM »
C. I remember distinctly when they burst into I Walk Beside You after The Root Of All Evil the crowd energy died completely.

Offline jammindude

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2014, 09:25:12 PM »
C. I remember distinctly when they burst into I Walk Beside You after The Root Of All Evil the crowd energy died completely.

You were at a different Radio City Music Hall than I was. I remember the entire theater going crazy and every person clapping with their hands in the air.
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Offline Madman Shepherd

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #11 on: April 27, 2014, 10:14:55 PM »
I was going to give it a C because I like the anthology *idea* but I think it was executed pretty poorly.  Song choices were kind of weak overall.  I also don't think it flowed well from two new cuts, a song even diehards don't know that well, to a song most diehard are somewhat familiar but most others aren't, to a well known song with stupid circus music ruining the flow, to a mediocre song from Awake, to a good song that most people don't know, even a lot of diehards, to a singalong song that is kind of overrated....you get the idea. 

To give you an idea of how underwhelming it is, for the current Along for the Ride tour I was not too impressed with the setlist but absolutely LOVED half of it.  After seeing it live, I really don't know if I would change anything INCLUDING the songs I didn't care for like LSOAD and Scarred.  It just flowed pretty great.

Offline DarkLord_Lalinc

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #12 on: April 27, 2014, 10:21:11 PM »
C.
I feel the setlist choices made the show feel somewhat "unique", but their other 20th Anniversary setlists were better. I totally get how the whole second set was very orchestra-oriented, but they played some songs that feel "weird" as standards to a show that was, in purpose, the culmination of a chapter. The Answer Lies Within? Vacant? Also, as much as I like Metropolis with the orchestra, I find it very sad Learning to Live wasn't played on that show. Some of the very best Learning to Live live performances ever by JLB were on that tour, and I would have loved to have a definitive live version on that recorded properly.
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Offline ?

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #13 on: April 28, 2014, 12:32:31 AM »
D.

Root is an awesome opener, Another Won is pretty cool and the performances of Afterlife, UAGM and Innocence Faded are all great, but apart from those I find the setlist really meh. These Walls would've been a way better song to follow up TROAE, I'm not crazy about Raise the Knife and TSCO has that overlong intro that makes it even less interesting to listen to. I understand that they wanted to play orchestra-friendly stuff in the second set, but it made the selection of songs underwhelming and lacking in variety. Seriously, who wants to hear The Answer Lies Within at a 20th anniversary show? I've never cared about Six Degrees and Octavarium that much, so the fact that they eat up over an hour of the setlist bothers me as well.

The band's performance is really good and I appreciate that there's something from each era, but the song picks could've been way better. Besides, the albums are represented quite unevenly: a 42-minute piece from Six Degrees is followed by a 3-minute song from TOT and the only FII-era song isn't even from the album itself.

Offline robwebster

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #14 on: April 28, 2014, 01:22:15 AM »
I think it was completionism over quality. They picked well to get tracks that hadn't been on DVDs before, but there's very few A-listers and quite a few B-listers.

The Root of All Evil is just about the heaviest song they've got in there. This gives the show, itself, cohesion - everything feels relatively compatible, everything sits nicely together, so it's not a chore to watch - but it feels like a very narrow view of what DT's about.

I'm enjoying it more, with time. It's got a distinct flavour, and that's good; I pick up Score for a certain type of experience that I can't get from any of the other DVDs, and it's sort of an antidote to Live at Budokan, which showcased the heavier side a lot more. I just wish there were more excellent songs. Vacant into The Answer Lies Within remains one of the weirdest bait-'n'-switches of the band's career. There's a bloody superb version of Stream of Consciousness waiting to be played with an orchestra, something about it just sounds symphonic.

Offline Daso

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #15 on: April 28, 2014, 01:53:09 AM »
I enjoy it a lot, but it could've been better. They should've played Blind Faith insted of SDOIT (I understand it was for the orchestra so it makes sense, at least), then Vacant + Stream of Consciousness and then do the next part. I'd give it something between a high B and a low A.

Offline mirko_metal_88

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #16 on: April 28, 2014, 01:57:40 AM »
Almost perfect, it would have been the absolute perfection with 1 more song from ToT (maybe Endless Sacrifice) and onw less song from 8vm (TALW or Sacrified Sons)

and it would have been I N C R E D I B L E with ACOS in it....best setlist EVER

Offline The Curious Orange

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #17 on: April 28, 2014, 02:13:20 AM »
I gave it a C. I'm in 2 minds about the setlist. Sometimes I think it's a shame that they didn't release something more representative of the tour - Panic Attack, A Fortune In Lies, Peruvian Skies, As I Am, Endless Sacrifice - and that it's a huge missed opportunity. Other times I think it's good that they included some lesser-played songs - Afterlife, Innocence Faded, Raise the Knife - and I've kind of warmed to it with time.

I never listen to 6DOIT any more. Bits of it are good, but it just goes on too long, and I'm sick and tired of that main refrain (that still sounds like the "lark that is learning to fly" bit of The Sound of Music to me).

That said, Sacrificed Sons and Octavarium sound fantastic with an orchestra.

It's a great show, and really well shot. The sound on the DVD is fine, but the CD is a bit muddy. The setlist remains the one weak link.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2014, 08:18:13 AM by The Curious Orange »
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Offline MirzekDT

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #18 on: April 28, 2014, 02:30:21 AM »
Seriously, who wants to hear The Answer Lies Within at a 20th anniversary show?

I do, you are asking like it's well known fact that the song is not good for 20th anniversary show. It was obvious choice because of orchestra and I really enjoy the live version of TALW.

Offline Setlist Scotty

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #19 on: April 28, 2014, 03:30:43 AM »
Altho I was there and this particular show is one of the best I've seen in general, I'm giving the setlist a C. Personally, I don't have much of a problem with the second set, tho I do agree that it might drag a little. But I take more issue with some of the alternatives that could've been included for set 1 and the encore.

I'd rather have seen them not include IWBY in the first set, which would've allowed the extra space for them to include Peruvian Skies with the excerpts of Wish You Were Here and Wherever I May Roam, and instead of ending the first set with TSCO (which I find boring and waaaaayyyy overplayed), play Home (perhaps with the Tool-inspired edited intro). And instead of Metropolis for the encore (sorry guys, it's OK song, but overrated, IMO), go with LtL which I think would've worked much better with the orchestra. Perhaps swapping in IWBY for TALW in the second set to keep things a little bit more alive in the second set.
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Offline krands85

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #20 on: April 28, 2014, 04:26:32 AM »
I'd give it a B probably, though it would be hard to give any set that culminates in Octavarium and Metropolis anything less  :lol I think it works pretty well for what they were trying to achieve and the restrictions they had, though there could have been a few better choices here and there. I've never been a big fan of 6DOIT, but I like the idea of having it as a full piece on a live release, especially with the orchestra.

The set can't really compete with LSFNY of course, which is easily their best from a live release. I think Score is a way better set than the one on the current tour, though I'm probably in the minority on that, everyone else seems to love it!
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Offline adastra

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #21 on: April 28, 2014, 06:10:53 AM »
I think that setlist is pretty great! 
I'd only change one thing,  IMO Vacant can't be played without SOC !!!!
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Offline emtee

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #22 on: April 28, 2014, 06:40:00 AM »
I love disc 1 and play it often but it's rare for me to play the other 2. Little nitpicky things keep me from spinning them. Not
separating SDoIT into sections because I always skip the Overture and I don't like the overly long intro on 8V. These are minor
things though, it's just that I like disc 1 best.

Offline mikeyd23

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #23 on: April 28, 2014, 07:07:09 AM »
I gave it a B.  The songs themselves are hit or miss for me but the performances of the songs are pretty convincing throughout.

Offline ZKX-2099

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #24 on: April 28, 2014, 07:20:20 AM »
Set list: B
Performance: A

Didn't care for Vacant being thrown in there. Would have liked an actual song off FII. Or The Way It Used To Be instead. :metal

Offline snapple

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #25 on: April 28, 2014, 07:38:15 AM »
B

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Offline KevShmev

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #26 on: April 28, 2014, 07:49:16 AM »
I was going to give it a C because I like the anthology *idea* but I think it was executed pretty poorly.  Song choices were kind of weak overall.  I also don't think it flowed well from two new cuts, a song even diehards don't know that well, to a song most diehard are somewhat familiar but most others aren't, to a well known song with stupid circus music ruining the flow, to a mediocre song from Awake, to a good song that most people don't know, even a lot of diehards, to a singalong song that is kind of overrated....you get the idea. 

 

Well, when you put it that way...:lol

  I'm not crazy about Raise the Knife and TSCO has that overlong intro that makes it even less interesting to listen to. I understand that they wanted to play orchestra-friendly stuff in the second set, but it made the selection of songs underwhelming and lacking in variety. Seriously, who wants to hear The Answer Lies Within at a 20th anniversary show?

Exactly (regarding your last two points).

As for The Spirit Carries On, that song always goes over HUGE with live crowds, so they could play it at every show and I'd be fine with it.  I think adding a long intro to it every time is definitely unnecessary, however.

I'd rather have seen them not include IWBY in the first set, which would've allowed the extra space for them to include Peruvian Skies with the excerpts of Wish You Were Here and Wherever I May Roam, and instead of ending the first set with TSCO (which I find boring and waaaaayyyy overplayed), play Home (perhaps with the Tool-inspired edited intro). And instead of Metropolis for the encore (sorry guys, it's OK song, but overrated, IMO), go with LtL which I think would've worked much better with the orchestra. Perhaps swapping in IWBY for TALW in the second set to keep things a little bit more alive in the second set.

To me, Metropolis or Learning to Live were obvious choices as the encore for this show, and you can't argue with going for either, given the iconic status both songs hold.  If Metropolis got the nod because it hadn't been played from start to finish on a previous DVD (5YIAL doesn't count since it inexplicably cuts off before the ending), so be it. :biggrin:

I think it works pretty well for what they were trying to achieve and the restrictions they had, though there could have been a few better choices here and there. I've never been a big fan of 6DOIT, but I like the idea of having it as a full piece on a live release, especially with the orchestra.
 

Let's remember that these restrictions were self-imposed.  It didn't have to be that way.

Really, it's too bad that there wasn't a live DVD release from the 6DOIT tour, since the set lists on that tour were mostly awesome (not counting the cover shows ;) :lol), and they could have gotten their "6DOIT on a DVD" fix over with then.  The Bucharest ytsejam release sort of took care of this, but that is considered an unofficial release.

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #27 on: April 28, 2014, 08:02:19 AM »
I think for the occasion of an 8V and 20th anniversary DVD, the setlist was great. Not all my own preferences, but well thought out for the occasion.
It showed off JLB's killer vocals on UAGM, Innocence Faded, and a superior vocal performance for TSCO. And this tour is what made me a fan of Afterlife, and this is the best recording we have of that.
Plus finally the long overdue live recording of SDOIT, and with the added bonus of an orchestra (it's a shame the orchestra wasn't great, and I'll never listen to it over the perfection of the studio version). And it had the definitive live versions of the Octavarium tracks that featured the orchestra (could that live version of the title track be any better?), and we got a fantastic and complete video recording of Metropolis.


B

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Offline ZirconBlue

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #28 on: April 28, 2014, 08:19:07 AM »
B- or C+.  I think the orchestra was something of a missed opportunity.  They mostly stuck to songs that originally had strings/orchestra on them in the studio, which makes sense, I guess.  But, I think the one song really enhanced by having the orchestra was Metropolis, where they added something new to the song.  Now, when I'm listening to other versions of Metropolis, I miss that french horn part.

Offline The Curious Orange

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #29 on: April 28, 2014, 08:25:16 AM »
The Bucharest ytsejam release sort of took care of this, but that is considered an unofficial release.

That Bucharest show is fantastic - Glass Prison, Killing Hand, Scarred, Lines In the Sand, Home, Learning to Live - what more could you want??? And I love the way they shake up the arrangements - I wish they still did that.


I'm not a great fan of the LALP setlist either - too many ADTOE songs, and the choice of older songs is somewhat underwhelming.
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Offline son_ov_hades

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #30 on: April 28, 2014, 08:52:49 AM »
I give it a B. Another Won, Afterlife, Under A Glass Moon, and Raise The Knife make for a pretty great first set. It is dragged down by I Walk Beside You though, that song just seems really out of place in the set. The second set is really unbalanced and it suffers from that. Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence with the orchestra is the definitive version, even better than the studio. But then Vacant played without Stream Of Consciousness really really weird, The Answer Lies Within and Sacrificed Sons are fine but kind boring, Octavarium is phenomenal, Metropolis is my favorite Dream Theater song but this performance of it is far from the best. Overall the setlist is not the best, but still pretty good.
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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #31 on: April 28, 2014, 08:55:16 AM »
D

Octavarium is my least favorite DT album and this setlist is loaded with it. I realize they were touring for it with it being the current album and all so I completely cut them slack for having that much of it on there. Where I don't cut them slack is leaving out two of the three songs I can most tolerate from it (TW and PA.) Beyond that, Innocence Faded, The Spirit Carries on, SDOIT, and Vacant are all close to being my least favorite songs from their albums. Having Metropolis and Afterlife were huge bonuses for it though and Anther Won was a nice song for me to discover. All in all, however, I've watched this thing like maybe 3 or 4 times ever and haven't watched it in like 5 years at least. It's just too tedious to sit through all the stuff I, at best, only slightly dislike.


I feel similarly about Octavarium.    Score is not a DVD I watch too often either.  Dream Theater doing impressions of U2 and Muse....didn't really connect with me.  This all happened during that "Inspiration Corner" era. 



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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #32 on: April 28, 2014, 08:57:33 AM »
D

Octavarium is my least favorite DT album and this setlist is loaded with it. I realize they were touring for it with it being the current album and all so I completely cut them slack for having that much of it on there. Where I don't cut them slack is leaving out two of the three songs I can most tolerate from it (TW and PA.) Beyond that, Innocence Faded, The Spirit Carries on, SDOIT, and Vacant are all close to being my least favorite songs from their albums. Having Metropolis and Afterlife were huge bonuses for it though and Anther Won was a nice song for me to discover. All in all, however, I've watched this thing like maybe 3 or 4 times ever and haven't watched it in like 5 years at least. It's just too tedious to sit through all the stuff I, at best, only slightly dislike.


I feel similarly about Octavarium.    Score is not a DVD I watch too often either.  Dream Theater doing impressions of U2 and Muse....didn't really connect with me.  This all happened during that "Inspiration Corner" era. 




They've been doing U2 impressions almost since day 1.
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline snapple

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #33 on: April 28, 2014, 09:03:44 AM »
B
Another Won and Afterlife save the first disc. Disc 2 is unsalvageable.

LOOOOOOOOL


I didn't mock your opinions.
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Online BlobVanDam

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Re: What grade do you give the Score set list?
« Reply #34 on: April 28, 2014, 09:11:50 AM »
B
Another Won and Afterlife save the first disc. Disc 2 is unsalvageable.

LOOOOOOOOL


I didn't mock your opinions.

To be fair, I didn't give an opinion in this thread before your post. :biggrin:
But sorry anyway. Your comment was so extreme that I couldn't formulate any better response.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2014, 09:23:34 AM by BlobVanDam »
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.