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Offline bosk1

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And in today's headlines...
« on: July 19, 2018, 08:18:36 AM »
Just glancing through my newsfeed and saw a couple of headlines that just kinda got to me. 

The first:  "Girl With Disability Gang-Raped By 22 Men For 7 Months In India, Police Say"

Then, just three headlines below that:  "You Need to See The Insane Crib Cardi B Got for Her Baby's Nursery"

The first one made me simultaneously angry and sad.  What kind of world to we live in where anyone, much less 22 people in the same place, can convince themselves that doing what they did to that girl is okay?  Under what standard is that remotely something that someone--much less 22 people--could bring themselves to do?

And then the second one made me simultaneously angry and sad, but for different reasons.  In what kind of world to we even care what kind of crib Cardi B got for her baby?  Who are the people clicking on that link that actually want to know?  I dunno.  Maybe I take it too personally.  But "celebrity news" just ticks me off.  Yes, I sometimes enjoy reading something about my musical, sports, and entertainment heroes.  But it really concerns me that we idolize these folks and put them up on a pedestal and give them a platform to spout whatever nonsense comes into their heads as if it somehow carries any more weight than your opinion or mine.  Maybe it bothers me because their opinions really should carry far, far less weight, IMO, because they have led very sheltered and very different, abnormal lives that are out of touch with reality, at least in many cases.  But I can deal with that.   I see it every day.  I guess what just set me off about it this morning is that the juxtaposition with story #1 made it seem all the more ridiculous and highlighted to me the vast chasm between celebrities whose biggest problem is how to blow their money vs. the personal tragedies and real world problems of people like that girl in India.  AND the problems of those 22 men who obviously have something very wrong with them if they could do such a thing.

Anyhow, I'm not really raging about it nearly as much as this post might imply.  Just some thoughts that were bouncing around in my mind as I sat here on a beautiful Thursday morning enjoying my breakfast and getting ready to start my work day. 

Feel free to comment on these stories or others.  I guess this is just my own lame version of "webpoet385893298489453#$*& says..."
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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2018, 08:26:00 AM »
They're both horrible in their own way, even though obviously the gang rape is a disturbing kind of horrible.

The herd mentality can arise in a single occasion - some bros go out for strip dancing and end up paying prostitutes or whatever. But to commit to a seventh month abusing of a disabled girl is quite a disturbed thing to do, and they all deserve a criminal jail.

And celebrity silly gossip is spread everywhere. What I find hilarous is how supermodels posting sexy photos make headlines. "Em Rata shows a bit of side boob, the followers go CRAZY!!!" is an actual headline.

Also, people giving these "news", they assume that whoever see this or that hot girl barely naked stops for some seconds to breathe, has his eyes popping out of his face and calls all his friends about it.

What happens actually is:

*scrolling on Instagram*

*scrolling on Instagram*

*boobs*

"oh, cool" *double tap*

*scrollng onto the next picture*

Yet people make headlines about it, only because the followers are big enough in number  :D
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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2018, 08:39:12 AM »
Right there with you Bosk about the celebrity worship. Itís out of control. There is nothing Ďspecialí about those people.....and itís my opinion that we....the Ďnormalí people.....could do their jobs just as well as them. Especially actors. Everyone can do that. Musicians maybe not everyone but Iíve heard local bands that blow these popular mainstream bands out of the water. Heck, back in the day I was in one of them.

As far as the first headline.....things like that are infuriating. I saw one yesterday where a Kansas City mother pimped out her two year old daughter for a couple thousand bucks. The little girl then gets an STD....on top of assuredly physical and mental trauma. People like that donít deserve to breathe any longer IMO....both the mom and the waste of life who raped that kid. 
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Offline bosk1

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2018, 08:50:28 AM »
They're both horrible in their own way, even though obviously the gang rape is a disturbing kind of horrible.

Yeah, that's a good way of putting it.
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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2018, 08:57:03 AM »
Right there with you Bosk about the celebrity worship. Itís out of control. There is nothing Ďspecialí about those people.....and itís my opinion that we....the Ďnormalí people.....could do their jobs just as well as them. Especially actors. Everyone can do that. Musicians maybe not everyone but Iíve heard local bands that blow these popular mainstream bands out of the water. Heck, back in the day I was in one of them.

No way. Acting is insanely hard. I don't agree with the worship they receive, but acting is no cake walk.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2018, 09:07:05 AM by Chino »

Offline Stadler

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2018, 09:24:17 AM »
I agree with Bosk, but I just want to add that I also despise how the level of journalism has slipped.  We used to have Walter Cronkite, and even in the "celebrity gossip" area, Rona Barrett, who was a JOURNALIST, even if her stories were light weight.

Now we have regular Joes, comedians, out-of-work waitresses, housewives, etc. who "blog" and think that they are now trained, skilled purveyors of fact.    It doesn't work that way.  I think the best example of this is the plethora of headlines that read "[So-and-so] did [this] and the Internet is [extreme emotion]".   

I watched a Dr. Phil last night - don't laugh, I love that guy - and it was about a woman who live-streams her entire life on YouTube.   The woman is clearly deeply troubled - Dr. Phil offered to put her in a facility for 90 days, which is relatively long for the kind of problems he sees on the show - but it touched on the point that "easy" is not always "better", especially when "easy" is meant to cut out the IMPORTANT steps, not just the inefficient ones.   The reporting of facts HAS important steps that can't be cut out.

I'm even at the point that I want to go back and read that article about the girl.   We have become so sensationalist that I don't even take that at face value, that somehow 22 men just completely and over time disregarded their morals, their conscience and their context to sexually assault someone that they KNEW and could adjudge was disabled.   Pseudo-journalists have become very lax and careless with how they assemble facts these days.   ANY sexual abuse is inexcusable, but the order of the facts is important. 

Offline bosk1

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2018, 09:28:51 AM »
Yeah, I hear you and agree 100% regarding "journalistic integrity."  But here's the link in case you really DO want to read it:  https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/disabled-girl-repeatedly-gang-raped-by-22-men-in-india_us_5b4f33b6e4b0b15aba8a483d  The source aside, it looks legit and not overly sensationalized.
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Offline Kattelox

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2018, 09:38:58 AM »
One of my biggest pet peeves is when people take op-eds as 'news.' No, it's an op-ed, and it seems like more and more people (especially younger crowds) take it all in as news, as if spouting opinions and publishing it in an article on a blog makes it fact. Combined with "who GAF?" celebrity news and clickbait and it's all one giant mess.
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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2018, 09:56:11 AM »
Right there with you Bosk about the celebrity worship. Itís out of control. There is nothing Ďspecialí about those people.....and itís my opinion that we....the Ďnormalí people.....could do their jobs just as well as them. Especially actors. Everyone can do that. Musicians maybe not everyone but Iíve heard local bands that blow these popular mainstream bands out of the water. Heck, back in the day I was in one of them.

No way. Acting is insanely hard. I don't agree with the worship they receive, but acting is no cake walk.

I donít know man. I think there are a ton of people out there that act every day as a natural instinct. I donít think itís a skill that takes all that much to hone and perform well. It certainly isnít a career that deserves to be idolized the way it is.
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Offline Stadler

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #9 on: July 19, 2018, 09:56:28 AM »
I DID Google that story.  Its actually WORSE than I thought.

As I suspected, the "disability" isn't germane to the story.  Apparently her hearing isn't up to snuff, but there is no indication whatsoever that her ability to consent or her ability to understand what was happening to her was compromised.  So while I am sensitive to the hearing-impaired among us (my wife would claim that I'm in that category, by the way, and my dad certainly is). So that's bad journalism, right there.

So why is it worse?  SHE WAS 11 YEARS OLD.   It started when the 65-year-old man that operates the elevator in her building assaulted her, then he invited two other men to join in, and over time continued to invite additional men to participate.  On many of the occasions they would drug her with injected and oral sedatives.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/disabled-girl-repeatedly-gang-raped-by-22-men-in-india_us_5b4f33b6e4b0b15aba8a483d

(I would also question why most of the sources are "HuffPost", but that's my personal bias coming in.)

Offline Ben_Jamin

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #10 on: July 19, 2018, 10:22:24 AM »
One of my biggest pet peeves is when people take op-eds as 'news.' No, it's an op-ed, and it seems like more and more people (especially younger crowds) take it all in as news, as if spouting opinions and publishing it in an article on a blog makes it fact. Combined with "who GAF?" celebrity news and clickbait and it's all one giant mess.

Do they even know what an Op-Ed is? I don't think many know the difference anymore because they probably have never read a newspaper.
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Offline Cool Chris

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #11 on: July 19, 2018, 10:48:29 AM »
I can honestly say I have no idea who Cardi B is. I am sure I have read the name, likely in some headline similar to the above. But beyond that, I can't say I know one fact about her (other than that she apparently just had a kid).
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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #12 on: July 19, 2018, 11:07:58 AM »
One of my biggest pet peeves is when people take op-eds as 'news.' No, it's an op-ed, and it seems like more and more people (especially younger crowds) take it all in as news, as if spouting opinions and publishing it in an article on a blog makes it fact. Combined with "who GAF?" celebrity news and clickbait and it's all one giant mess.

Do they even know what an Op-Ed is? I don't think many know the difference anymore because they probably have never read a newspaper.

Well, because "news" is less today about "hey, wow, I didn't know that!" than it is "See! I was RIGHT!   Jon Stewart said so!"

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #13 on: July 19, 2018, 11:16:50 AM »
Right there with you Bosk about the celebrity worship. Itís out of control. There is nothing Ďspecialí about those people.....and itís my opinion that we....the Ďnormalí people.....could do their jobs just as well as them. Especially actors. Everyone can do that. Musicians maybe not everyone but Iíve heard local bands that blow these popular mainstream bands out of the water. Heck, back in the day I was in one of them.

No way. Acting is insanely hard. I don't agree with the worship they receive, but acting is no cake walk.

I donít know man. I think there are a ton of people out there that act every day as a natural instinct. I donít think itís a skill that takes all that much to hone and perform well. It certainly isnít a career that deserves to be idolized the way it is.

True, I act every day. It's the only reason I'm still employed where I am. I'm 3.5 years into this job and I'm still not entirely sure what my department even does. Being able to bullshit your way through something, or convince someone you're smarter than you are is one thing. But I don't think "acting" in the celebrity sense is easy at all. Memorizing those scripts, performing on set and in costume, with lights beating down on you while surrounded by dozens (or hundreds) of people, getting take after take wrong... Can't be easy, man. Even the stupid roles require a level of art that I don't think many people could do willy nilly. As stupid as it is, how many people could have pulled off Fletcher in Liar Liar, or Billy in Billy Madison?


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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #14 on: July 19, 2018, 11:41:43 AM »
Right there with you Bosk about the celebrity worship. Itís out of control. There is nothing Ďspecialí about those people.....and itís my opinion that we....the Ďnormalí people.....could do their jobs just as well as them. Especially actors. Everyone can do that. Musicians maybe not everyone but Iíve heard local bands that blow these popular mainstream bands out of the water. Heck, back in the day I was in one of them.

No way. Acting is insanely hard. I don't agree with the worship they receive, but acting is no cake walk.

I donít know man. I think there are a ton of people out there that act every day as a natural instinct. I donít think itís a skill that takes all that much to hone and perform well. It certainly isnít a career that deserves to be idolized the way it is.

True, I act every day. It's the only reason I'm still employed where I am. I'm 3.5 years into this job and I'm still not entirely sure what my department even does. Being able to bullshit your way through something, or convince someone you're smarter than you are is one thing. But I don't think "acting" in the celebrity sense is easy at all. Memorizing those scripts, performing on set and in costume, with lights beating down on you while surrounded by dozens (or hundreds) of people, getting take after take wrong... Can't be easy, man. Even the stupid roles require a level of art that I don't think many people could do willy nilly. As stupid as it is, how many people could have pulled off Fletcher in Liar Liar, or Billy in Billy Madison?

We're also talking about EXTREME levels of emotion.   I can fake being interested in what people have to say, I can be civil to people that I want to rip their lungs out, but those are masks.  it's another thing entirely to COMMUNICATE (sometimes with subtlety) emotions with nothing but an eyebrow, a tear, or a twitch.   I negotiate for a living so I'm good with hiding emotions.  I can even send (broadly) false emotions across the table.   But I'm a zero when it comes to anything beyond the basic palate, and I'm also never in a situation I've never been in before.   

I also don't have to embody traits of people that I don't think anything like.  Hitler?  How do I emulate that level of chronic, systemic disregard for human life when I, personally, have cried after hitting a bird in my car?    I don't begrudge actors anything, including their salaries, since I also understand that they aren't being paid to fake being happy.  They are paid because they generate ticket sales. 

Offline Adami

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #15 on: July 19, 2018, 12:21:04 PM »
Hitler?  How do I emulate that level of chronic, systemic disregard for human life when I, personally, have cried after hitting a bird in my car?   

Just imagine they're John Stewart fans.
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Offline ZKX-2099

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #16 on: July 19, 2018, 12:21:55 PM »
I stopped keeping up on the news as much a few years back.

Much more happy now. Haven't looked back.

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #17 on: July 19, 2018, 12:40:27 PM »
Right there with you Bosk about the celebrity worship. Itís out of control. There is nothing Ďspecialí about those people.....and itís my opinion that we....the Ďnormalí people.....could do their jobs just as well as them. Especially actors. Everyone can do that. Musicians maybe not everyone but Iíve heard local bands that blow these popular mainstream bands out of the water. Heck, back in the day I was in one of them.

No way. Acting is insanely hard. I don't agree with the worship they receive, but acting is no cake walk.

I donít know man. I think there are a ton of people out there that act every day as a natural instinct. I donít think itís a skill that takes all that much to hone and perform well. It certainly isnít a career that deserves to be idolized the way it is.

As with most things that are, it perhaps shouldn't be idolized, but trivializing the talent is silly. I and many others have the skills to play hockey. I mean strapping on skates and holding a stick isn't all that hard. But the people we tend to idolize are the NHL players of actors, and usually the star NHL players at that. No one is going to a local improv club, finding the newest member, and fawning all over them because they're an actor.
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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #18 on: July 19, 2018, 12:42:04 PM »
Right there with you Bosk about the celebrity worship. Itís out of control. There is nothing Ďspecialí about those people.....and itís my opinion that we....the Ďnormalí people.....could do their jobs just as well as them. Especially actors. Everyone can do that. Musicians maybe not everyone but Iíve heard local bands that blow these popular mainstream bands out of the water. Heck, back in the day I was in one of them.

No way. Acting is insanely hard. I don't agree with the worship they receive, but acting is no cake walk.

I donít know man. I think there are a ton of people out there that act every day as a natural instinct. I donít think itís a skill that takes all that much to hone and perform well. It certainly isnít a career that deserves to be idolized the way it is.

True, I act every day. It's the only reason I'm still employed where I am. I'm 3.5 years into this job and I'm still not entirely sure what my department even does. Being able to bullshit your way through something, or convince someone you're smarter than you are is one thing. But I don't think "acting" in the celebrity sense is easy at all. Memorizing those scripts, performing on set and in costume, with lights beating down on you while surrounded by dozens (or hundreds) of people, getting take after take wrong... Can't be easy, man. Even the stupid roles require a level of art that I don't think many people could do willy nilly. As stupid as it is, how many people could have pulled off Fletcher in Liar Liar, or Billy in Billy Madison?

We're also talking about EXTREME levels of emotion.   I can fake being interested in what people have to say, I can be civil to people that I want to rip their lungs out, but those are masks.  it's another thing entirely to COMMUNICATE (sometimes with subtlety) emotions with nothing but an eyebrow, a tear, or a twitch.   I negotiate for a living so I'm good with hiding emotions.  I can even send (broadly) false emotions across the table.   But I'm a zero when it comes to anything beyond the basic palate, and I'm also never in a situation I've never been in before.   

I also don't have to embody traits of people that I don't think anything like.  Hitler?  How do I emulate that level of chronic, systemic disregard for human life when I, personally, have cried after hitting a bird in my car?    I don't begrudge actors anything, including their salaries, since I also understand that they aren't being paid to fake being happy.  They are paid because they generate ticket sales.

I mean, think of Heath Ledger playing the joker. I thought the movie itself was relatively lame, but that character. Holy shit. His performance makes me watch that movie despite how little I like it. And like you alluded to, there's the actors that have to mimick a real person, not just in how they speak, but all of their mannerisms. Look at the guys who played Mantle and Maris in 61*, or the coach from the movie Miracle. It's nothing short of Amazing.

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #19 on: July 19, 2018, 12:42:30 PM »
Somewhat more on point, celebrity "news" is the bane of my existence. I can't stand it. I can barely spew words to describe how I feel about Nicki Minaj "headlines" sharing space in areas with actual important news.
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Offline gmillerdrake

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #20 on: July 19, 2018, 12:46:39 PM »
Right there with you Bosk about the celebrity worship. Itís out of control. There is nothing Ďspecialí about those people.....and itís my opinion that we....the Ďnormalí people.....could do their jobs just as well as them. Especially actors. Everyone can do that. Musicians maybe not everyone but Iíve heard local bands that blow these popular mainstream bands out of the water. Heck, back in the day I was in one of them.

No way. Acting is insanely hard. I don't agree with the worship they receive, but acting is no cake walk.

I donít know man. I think there are a ton of people out there that act every day as a natural instinct. I donít think itís a skill that takes all that much to hone and perform well. It certainly isnít a career that deserves to be idolized the way it is.

True, I act every day. It's the only reason I'm still employed where I am. I'm 3.5 years into this job and I'm still not entirely sure what my department even does. Being able to bullshit your way through something, or convince someone you're smarter than you are is one thing. But I don't think "acting" in the celebrity sense is easy at all. Memorizing those scripts, performing on set and in costume, with lights beating down on you while surrounded by dozens (or hundreds) of people, getting take after take wrong... Can't be easy, man. Even the stupid roles require a level of art that I don't think many people could do willy nilly. As stupid as it is, how many people could have pulled off Fletcher in Liar Liar, or Billy in Billy Madison?

We're also talking about EXTREME levels of emotion.   I can fake being interested in what people have to say, I can be civil to people that I want to rip their lungs out, but those are masks.  it's another thing entirely to COMMUNICATE (sometimes with subtlety) emotions with nothing but an eyebrow, a tear, or a twitch.   I negotiate for a living so I'm good with hiding emotions.  I can even send (broadly) false emotions across the table.   But I'm a zero when it comes to anything beyond the basic palate, and I'm also never in a situation I've never been in before.   

I also don't have to embody traits of people that I don't think anything like.  Hitler?  How do I emulate that level of chronic, systemic disregard for human life when I, personally, have cried after hitting a bird in my car?    I don't begrudge actors anything, including their salaries, since I also understand that they aren't being paid to fake being happy.  They are paid because they generate ticket sales.

I mean, think of Heath Ledger playing the joker. I thought the movie itself was relatively lame, but that character. Holy shit. His performance makes me watch that movie despite how little I like it. And like you alluded to, there's the actors that have to mimick a real person, not just in how they speak, but all of their mannerisms. Look at the guys who played Mantle and Maris in 61*, or the coach from the movie Miracle. It's nothing short of Amazing.

To use Nickís word I donít mean to trivialize the true talents out there. Like you mentioned, Ledger....Cumberbatch....Denzel.....I Ďgetí that there is a level you reach where summoning those performances and emotions is really a talent. But itís just like any other job or sport. Practice and dedication. Thatís all those guys have to do is Ďteachí themselves how to conjur those emotions. I just happen to think itís one of the more learnable industries and careers.
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Offline eric42434224

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #21 on: July 19, 2018, 03:28:11 PM »
I disagree.  It takes immense training and a big chunk of natural talent.  More that at least 90% of careers  I would say off hand.
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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #22 on: July 19, 2018, 03:44:39 PM »
I don't pay much attention to that sort of thing.  Most of it isn't really news worthy imo.  It's just the media preying on the public's morbid curiosities and I couldn't care less about celebrity news.  It's all just a bunch of BMU BMD bullshit anyway.  :lol
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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #23 on: July 19, 2018, 04:20:43 PM »
I disagree.  It takes immense training and a big chunk of natural talent.  More that at least 90% of careers  I would say off hand.

Yes, and sacrifice and dedication. Also, there is a point where being an actor/artist and being a celebrity become two different jobs.

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #24 on: July 19, 2018, 05:50:06 PM »
I stay away from these stories because I feel helpless to stop them so out of sight, out of mind.

Sad to say.
ďI don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down'.Ē - Bob Newhart

So wait, we're spelling it wrong and king is spelling it right? What is going on here? :lol -- BlobVanDam

Offline ReaperKK

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #25 on: July 20, 2018, 08:45:41 PM »
They're both horrible in their own way, even though obviously the gang rape is a disturbing kind of horrible.

Yeah, that's a good way of putting it.

Well said, there is some truly disgusting shit that happens around the world with some truly disgusting people.

Offline jasc15

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #26 on: August 21, 2018, 08:53:11 AM »

The first one made me simultaneously angry and sad.  What kind of world to we live in where anyone, much less 22 people in the same place, can convince themselves that doing what they did to that girl is okay?  Under what standard is that remotely something that someone--much less 22 people--could bring themselves to do?

When I read this sort of thing, I have some of the same reactions you described.  I empathize with the victim and their family, and it twists my guts to imagine such a thing happen to anyone I know personally.  However, where I differ is with the "What kind of world to we live in " reaction.  I think this is well within the norm of human behavior on a historical level (there are some publications that elaborate here).  I think any group of people anywhere in the world is capable of such a thing, but the circumstances of those people are quite different.

I was watching an episode of the Ken Burns Vietnam documentary, and one veteran commented on the idea that military training and combat turns humans into ruthless unfeeling killing machines.  He argued that it is just "finishing school", implying that we are all capable of these things on one level or another given the right circumstances.

Please don't misconstrue my comment as excusing these abusers as being victims of circumstance who aren't responsible for their actions.  They are personally responsible and should face any and all consequences.  I'm simply saying that this isn't the manifestation of some unique type of monstrous human being that is so unlike "normal" people like us (there were, after all, 22 such people allegedly involved).  That allows us to compartmentalize this behavior and not recognize the brutal capability of all humans.

Quote
But "celebrity news" just ticks me off.  Yes, I sometimes enjoy reading something about my musical, sports, and entertainment heroes.  But it really concerns me that we idolize these folks and put them up on a pedestal and give them a platform to spout whatever nonsense comes into their heads as if it somehow carries any more weight than your opinion or mine.  Maybe it bothers me because their opinions really should carry far, far less weight, IMO, because they have led very sheltered and very different, abnormal lives that are out of touch with reality, at least in many cases.  But I can deal with that.

I get annoyed too, especially about people's fascination with such mundane details of annoying celebrities lives.  I do recall, however, more than one thread on these forums discussing JP's beard.  It was of course all in good fun, but how is that different (other than how many people are interested) than people reading and talking about Cardi B's crib purchase.

Also, regarding celebrities' platforms to voice their opinions: we all have opinions.  Some us have strong opinions that we like to voice to anyone who will hear us.  And some of us would use a platform to amplify our opinion, given the opportunity.  So I've softened on my "shut up and sing" attitude regarding celebrity opinions.

Offline Stadler

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #27 on: August 21, 2018, 10:40:21 AM »

Also, regarding celebrities' platforms to voice their opinions: we all have opinions.  Some us have strong opinions that we like to voice to anyone who will hear us.  And some of us would use a platform to amplify our opinion, given the opportunity.  So I've softened on my "shut up and sing" attitude regarding celebrity opinions.

True, but not all of us get to spew our opinions to a captive audience of anywhere from 10,000 to 10 million people, many of whom are predisposed to giving you the benefit of the doubt, because you wrote that song that touched their very soul, or were the main character in that movie that touched their life.   

Online Architeuthis

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #28 on: August 21, 2018, 10:57:22 AM »
Right there with you Bosk about the celebrity worship. Itís out of control. There is nothing Ďspecialí about those people.....and itís my opinion that we....the Ďnormalí people.....could do their jobs just as well as them. Especially actors. Everyone can do that. Musicians maybe not everyone but Iíve heard local bands that blow these popular mainstream bands out of the water. Heck, back in the day I was in one of them.

No way. Acting is insanely hard. I don't agree with the worship they receive, but acting is no cake walk.

I donít know man. I think there are a ton of people out there that act every day as a natural instinct. I donít think itís a skill that takes all that much to hone and perform well. It certainly isnít a career that deserves to be idolized the way it is.
"Hero, not the handsome actor who plays the hero's role,  Hero, not the glamour girl who loves to sell her soul, everybody's buying nobody's hero" 🎶
You can do a lot in a lifetime if you don't burn out too fast, you can make the most of the distance, first you need endurance first you've got to last....... NP

Offline TempusVox

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #29 on: August 25, 2018, 09:54:32 AM »
Well...The whole celebrity hero worship thing over many decades now has become a cottage industry. And most of the time the celebrities have very little, if anything to do with it.

I have (used to be even more) contractual obligations to my publisher for a number of appearances. All of my actor, and most of my musician friends have far more. The problem with is for them they usually aren't even aware of half of the crap said about them. But the masses gobble it all up like Kool-Aid. It is the media that bestows an actor with an image. This image is formed in the minds of the masses and the audience is responsible for this. Hero worship is based on the unreality of the image and not the person who has created that image. The "hero" is worshipped for the heroic acts he does on screen and not for the actual person he is in real life. A star becomes a hero for his fans. But this hero worship is a burden stars and actors find it very difficult to carry and even more difficult to live up to most of the time. I know an actor who was in major well known film, and in one particularly famous scene more than a few decades ago, who says he hardly remembers even filming the movie anymore. But that scene has been forever immortalized and people think they know him because of it. Don't get me wrong, that scrutiny or notoriety is the trade off for that kind of success. But the media machine monetized "celebrity" long ago. And their really good at keeping people hooked and fed on it all the time.

Kinda like big tobacco and nicotine if you ask me. I loathe every reality, entertainment, or celebrity programming or celebrity news out there. But there are plenty of people who love it. Therein lies the problem.
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Offline Stadler

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #30 on: August 25, 2018, 08:29:08 PM »
Well...The whole celebrity hero worship thing over many decades now has become a cottage industry. And most of the time the celebrities have very little, if anything to do with it.

I have (used to be even more) contractual obligations to my publisher for a number of appearances. All of my actor, and most of my musician friends have far more. The problem with is for them they usually aren't even aware of half of the crap said about them. But the masses gobble it all up like Kool-Aid. It is the media that bestows an actor with an image. This image is formed in the minds of the masses and the audience is responsible for this. Hero worship is based on the unreality of the image and not the person who has created that image. The "hero" is worshipped for the heroic acts he does on screen and not for the actual person he is in real life. A star becomes a hero for his fans. But this hero worship is a burden stars and actors find it very difficult to carry and even more difficult to live up to most of the time. I know an actor who was in major well known film, and in one particularly famous scene more than a few decades ago, who says he hardly remembers even filming the movie anymore. But that scene has been forever immortalized and people think they know him because of it. Don't get me wrong, that scrutiny or notoriety is the trade off for that kind of success. But the media machine monetized "celebrity" long ago. And their really good at keeping people hooked and fed on it all the time.

Kinda like big tobacco and nicotine if you ask me. I loathe every reality, entertainment, or celebrity programming or celebrity news out there. But there are plenty of people who love it. Therein lies the problem.

I sort of get that; I don't think it's up for debate that I don't have nearly the roster of celebrity friends you do, but in my limited experience that sounds right.   It strikes me, though, that times are a-changin'.    I'm fifty; when I was listening to Kiss records in the 70's, all I knew about Gene Simmons was that little note in the centerfold of Alive! and the picture on Alive II with the blood and sweat.   Later, we got pictures of him with a kerchief on standing next to Cher.   Ozzy.  LITERALLY all I knew was that he was a bad dresser (the cover of Sabotage) and either he or one of his friends liked the cocaine (Vol. 4).

While I'm not arguing with you or disagreeing with you, given "Family Jewels" and "The Osbournes", and all the social media and whatnot, I feel like whatever image I get isn't all of my own making.   Gene isn't God of Thunder anymore; he's also the nice Jewish boy/family man (and that's not anti-Semitic; I'm referring to the episode where the 7-foot tall demon who pillaged his way through over 5,000 women on tour was dressed in a red onesie with buttons on the ass like a cartoon character getting tucked into bed by his mommy.   Ozzy isn't the Prince of Darkness anymore; he's an incompetent boob that can't find a can opener without Sharon.    These personas are not on the fans.  Now, I get that that doesn't prevent the over-estimation of what that means; the guy that showed up at Mike Portnoy's door.   But when Bruce Springsteen gets on stage in Hartford and goes on a 4-minute rampage against Dick Cheney, as a freedom fighter for the people, that's on him and him alone, not the audience (and the boos he got reinforce that).  When Michael Stipe does his mid-set rap to give the guys behind him a little breather, and calls that week the "darkest week of his entire life" - oh, by the way, this was Friday and George Bush was re-elected on Tuesday, go figure - that again is on him, not the audience (and the boos THERE reflect that). 

The point isn't to rag on celebrities; I love REM, and really like Bruce, so the politics don't interfere for me, but it takes a hubris to assume you speak for thousands and thousands (if not more) people on matters as personal as politics, and when it's done with authority, it has resonance.  But I don't think it's because of the fan alone.  The message has to be there; plenty of celebrities take the approach of "I'll leave my politics out of it" (Paul Stanley for one; Mike Portnoy for another). 

Offline TempusVox

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Re: And in today's headlines...
« Reply #31 on: August 26, 2018, 12:22:37 AM »
Every popular musician friend I know absolutely LOVES being in front of the audience. But each performance is just one night or concert in their lives. But for us, it's a spectacular event; worthy of storing away as a special memory. So, while we share the same space during the time together, it's obviously an entirely different experience than the ones our heroes experience, and not just because they're on the stage.

"Cause when that morning sun comes beatin' down
You're going to wake up in your town.
But we'll be scheduled to appear...
A thousand miles away from here..."
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"I came here to drink milk and kick ass; and I just finished my milk."