Author Topic: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded  (Read 379717 times)

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Offline black_biff_stadler

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #525 on: November 25, 2013, 08:50:26 PM »
As for melody? The golden three were their best era for melody almost unquestionably. Each album starts off with better-written melodic sections than anything you'll find on the Loads and that's just the start.

LOL no way. The thrash era albums are great, with the riffs, and the melodic guitar sections by Hetfield, but 90% of it is just Hetfield grunting the same note over a thrashed E. The vocal sections have very little variation.

On Reload and Load especially, he actually SINGS, and there are a lot of good harmonies, and melodic riffs, instead of just thrashing E as fast as possible. The Black albums also leaves the first 4 albums for dead in that regard.

I'm not saying that makes Load/Reload better, because I still think they're overall weakly written albums, but there's no way they're not more melodic then the repetitive formula of the first 4 albums.

So an abundance of half-hearted, rednecky vocal melodies/harmonies over Eb m pentatonic fills makes something more melodic than what I cited above? Also, it's amusing how you completely ignored my laundry list of why the golden three win. Bottom line? Quantity is not automatically better than quantity.
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Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #526 on: November 25, 2013, 09:05:29 PM »
As for melody? The golden three were their best era for melody almost unquestionably. Each album starts off with better-written melodic sections than anything you'll find on the Loads and that's just the start.

LOL no way. The thrash era albums are great, with the riffs, and the melodic guitar sections by Hetfield, but 90% of it is just Hetfield grunting the same note over a thrashed E. The vocal sections have very little variation.

On Reload and Load especially, he actually SINGS, and there are a lot of good harmonies, and melodic riffs, instead of just thrashing E as fast as possible. The Black albums also leaves the first 4 albums for dead in that regard.

I'm not saying that makes Load/Reload better, because I still think they're overall weakly written albums, but there's no way they're not more melodic then the repetitive formula of the first 4 albums.

So an abundance of half-hearted, rednecky vocal melodies/harmonies over Eb m pentatonic fills makes something more melodic than what I cited above? Also, it's amusing how you completely ignored my laundry list of why the golden three win. Bottom line? Quantity is not automatically better than quantity.

We get it, you hate Load/Reload! I didn't ignore you list, but making a list doesn't prove they're more melodic. It just proves they have melody. I could easily do the same for Load, but all I'd get is a response like this anyway, where you'd ignore my laundry list. We'd just go around in circles. Ain't nobody got time fo dat!

As I said, I don't think Load/Reload are strong albums overall, but that doesn't mean they're complete write offs in every regard. I'd probably even take my least favourite of the first 4 albums over Reload. But by the very definition thrash, melody is often the exception, not the rule. The fact Metallica managed to include as much melody as they did on those albums is probably what set them apart from the other thrash bands. And when they did it, it was excellent.
But the songs still largely follow the same formula of "sing E over an E riff for verse, sing F# over an F# riff for the prechorus, back to E for the chorus". Hetfield has a total range of maybe 4 notes across those albums. As great as the songs were, it was overall very primitive compared to TBA and Load/Reload.
I'm not talking about quality here, or quantity. I'm just talking about melody.
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Offline Jaffa

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #527 on: November 25, 2013, 09:57:03 PM »
Also, it's amusing how you completely ignored my laundry list of why the golden three win.

Personally, I think it's amusing how you think having a laundry list means you're right. 
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Offline Anguyen92

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #528 on: November 26, 2013, 12:48:00 AM »
I'm really late to give my fave five on the Load/Reload albums but here's mine.

1. Ronnie
2. Wasting My Hate
3. The Memory Remains (Every time I see the words, "that's the cage's music," I will think back to Wrestlemania 28 where that song was the Hell in a Cell's actual entrance theme).
4. Until It Sleeps
5. Unforgiven II

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #529 on: November 26, 2013, 09:53:34 AM »
www.metallica.com

Metallica are playing a Brand New Song on tour next summer and fans get to vote on the remaining 17 songs for the gig they go to.

This is your chance to vote for Frayed Ends of Sanity.

Plus the first kinda "in print" official news that they will indeed be in the studio in 2014.


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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #530 on: November 26, 2013, 09:56:45 AM »
www.metallica.com

Metallica are playing a Brand New Song on tour next summer and fans get to vote on the remaining 17 songs for the gig they go to.

This is your chance to vote for Frayed Ends of Sanity.

If that was me, I'd rather vote for a song I'd actually want to hear.
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Offline Onno

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #531 on: November 26, 2013, 10:03:45 AM »
That's actually pretty cool.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #532 on: November 26, 2013, 10:07:26 AM »

If that was me, I'd rather vote for a song I'd actually want to hear.

Cool Story Bro.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #533 on: November 26, 2013, 10:09:39 AM »
If we go by the Death Magnetic timeline - "Death Is Not The End" was debuted on 06/06/2006 in Germany and the album was out in September 2008.

This means the album is on course for September 2016. But if they will be in the studio for most of 2014 - then late 2015 is not out of the question...

Offline Onno

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #534 on: November 26, 2013, 10:13:50 AM »
Eight fucking years. That's a new record (pun intended).

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #535 on: November 26, 2013, 10:15:15 AM »
Eight fucking years. That's a new record (pun intended).

Yeah and we all know why ( who ) that is.

Offline Ruba

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #536 on: November 26, 2013, 11:11:43 AM »
www.metallica.com

Metallica are playing a Brand New Song on tour next summer and fans get to vote on the remaining 17 songs for the gig they go to.

Oh yeah, Astronomy baby!

Aww shucks. Only ticket holders can vote, and I'm not bothering to go to Helsinki just for Metallica.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #537 on: November 26, 2013, 11:31:37 AM »
It will still be fun / interesting to see what gets voted for at each gig.

As long as The Black Album fans don't all vote for Sandman and Sad But True :p

Offline black_biff_stadler

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #538 on: November 26, 2013, 12:29:16 PM »
Also, it's amusing how you completely ignored my laundry list of why the golden three win.

Personally, I think it's amusing how you think having a laundry list means you're right.

I never said that so I have no idea where you're coming from with that unless you're just jumping the gun because I didn't qualify it with the needless "imo" that everyone should know isn't necessary when you're stating something that is obviously subjective in the first place.
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #539 on: November 26, 2013, 12:47:37 PM »
I didn't qualify it with the needless "imo" that everyone should know isn't necessary when you're stating something that is obviously subjective in the first place.

IN YOUR OPINION









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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #540 on: November 26, 2013, 12:48:30 PM »
:getoffmylawn:
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Offline Jaffa

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #541 on: November 26, 2013, 01:05:06 PM »
Also, it's amusing how you completely ignored my laundry list of why the golden three win.

Personally, I think it's amusing how you think having a laundry list means you're right.

I never said that so I have no idea where you're coming from with that unless you're just jumping the gun because I didn't qualify it with the needless "imo" that everyone should know isn't necessary when you're stating something that is obviously subjective in the first place.

Oh, no, that's not what I was going for at all.  Sorry for being unclear.  It's just that listing the melodic sections from those albums doesn't really mean anything, because nobody said that those albums didn't have melodic sections.  If someone did say that, your list would be an effective response, but, again, nobody said that.  Nobody's denying that RtL, MoP, and AJFA have some great melodic sections.  What they did say was that Load and Reload are more melodic, which your list does nothing to address.

And personally, I do agree.  While the thrash albums definitely do have some outstanding melodic sections, Load and Reload tend to be more melodic overall.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #542 on: November 26, 2013, 01:24:38 PM »
Alrighty y'all, what's everyone's Load/Reload top 5? Ties within the top 5 are fine but just keep the list to exactly 5 songs. If you have some ties that would make the list longer than 5, just put those other songs in a brief paragraph below the list.

To be completely honest, I can't remember 5 songs on those albums.  I never really cared for them that much and lost interest very quickly.  That isn't to say there aren't 5 (or more) good songs.  I just don't have those albums and don't remember much of what was on them.  But Metallica was a very hit and miss band for me.  I consider 4 albums to be "must have" material:  Ride the Lightning, Master of Puppets, And Justice For All, and the black album.  I love almost every single song on those four.  But outside those 4, there isnt' a single album from them that I have or want to have. 
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Offline El Barto

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #543 on: November 26, 2013, 01:31:20 PM »
www.metallica.com

Metallica are playing a Brand New Song on tour next summer and fans get to vote on the remaining 17 songs for the gig they go to.

Oh yeah, Astronomy baby!

Aww shucks. Only ticket holders can vote, and I'm not bothering to go to Helsinki just for Metallica.
The thing about voting on setlists is that you never actually see the votes, and you can just assume that they'll be greatest hits. If they do play Sandman and S&D for the 1 billionth time, could you really say "there's no way those songs won!"? My guess is that you get a rudimentary greatest hits set leaning more towards the early years. You'll still get Fuel and probably Cyanide, as well.
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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #544 on: November 26, 2013, 01:31:55 PM »
Oh, no, that's not what I was going for at all.  Sorry for being unclear.  It's just that listing the melodic sections from those albums doesn't really mean anything, because nobody said that those albums didn't have melodic sections.  If someone did say that, your list would be an effective response, but, again, nobody said that.  Nobody's denying that RtL, MoP, and AJFA have some great melodic sections.  What they did say was that Load and Reload are more melodic, which your list does nothing to address.

And personally, I do agree.  While the thrash albums definitely do have some outstanding melodic sections, Load and Reload tend to be more melodic overall.

No worries dude. Actually though, that's exactly what I was addressing in my list. Basically, my take is that regardless of how much some folks may wanna criticize the (by their assertions, not mine) one-dimensional vocals and reliance on fast open-string riffs, that still doesn't compromise the thrash era's overall melodic value enough to make the lazy, bluesier sound of the Loads more melodic than the gorgeous melodic sections found on the golden three. They have some pretty moments like Until it Sleeps, Bleeding Me, Where the Wild Things Are, and Low Man's Lyric, but as far as I'm concerned just about everything else on the Loads is less melodically awesome than any of what I cited in the laundry list. I base this on comments I've read here and at other sites coupled with the fact that I can't even recall one person irl talking about the melodic virtue of the Loads.

Essentially, it seems to me like I may be arguing the melodic value of the golden three while y'all are arguing the melodic quantity of the Loads. Is this so? If so, then we haven't even been debating the same subject.
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #545 on: November 26, 2013, 01:41:13 PM »
www.metallica.com

Metallica are playing a Brand New Song on tour next summer and fans get to vote on the remaining 17 songs for the gig they go to.

Oh yeah, Astronomy baby!

Aww shucks. Only ticket holders can vote, and I'm not bothering to go to Helsinki just for Metallica.
The thing about voting on setlists is that you never actually see the votes, and you can just assume that they'll be greatest hits. If they do play Sandman and S&D for the 1 billionth time, could you really say "there's no way those songs won!"? My guess is that you get a rudimentary greatest hits set leaning more towards the early years. You'll still get Fuel and probably Cyanide, as well.


It says on the site that you'll be able to see the results as they happen . . . so we'll see what that means.

Offline Jaffa

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #546 on: November 26, 2013, 01:47:42 PM »
Essentially, it seems to me like I may be arguing the melodic value of the golden three while y'all are arguing the melodic quantity of the Loads. Is this so?

... Sort of, but not really.  To me, this really isn't a question of quality or quantity; instead, it's a question of focus.  I feel like on the Loads, melody is the focus.  Whereas on the thrash albums, yes, there are melodic sections, but there are other priorities that tend to take precedence over melody.  I guess you could call this an issue of quantity. 
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #547 on: November 26, 2013, 02:08:35 PM »
Well in MY opinion ( ;D ) -

- i think that Saint Anger is the most melodic.



And by "Saint Anger" - I mean " Death Magnetic"


And by "melodic" - I mean " Distorted".

Offline Jaffa

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #548 on: November 26, 2013, 02:11:18 PM »
 :lol
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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #549 on: November 28, 2013, 08:31:45 AM »
I'm late as well to the Load/Reload list:

Fixxxer
The Memory Remains
The Unforgiven II
Bleeding Me
Carpe Diem Baby

I like Load, but have always preferred Reload to it.
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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #550 on: November 28, 2013, 08:37:08 AM »
www.metallica.com

Metallica are playing a Brand New Song on tour next summer and fans get to vote on the remaining 17 songs for the gig they go to.

Oh yeah, Astronomy baby!

Aww shucks. Only ticket holders can vote, and I'm not bothering to go to Helsinki just for Metallica.
The thing about voting on setlists is that you never actually see the votes, and you can just assume that they'll be greatest hits. If they do play Sandman and S&D for the 1 billionth time, could you really say "there's no way those songs won!"? My guess is that you get a rudimentary greatest hits set leaning more towards the early years. You'll still get Fuel and probably Cyanide, as well.
I liked what Anthrax did for The Greater Of Two a Evils. IIR, they kept the results up to date. They ended up sticking some songs on there that didn't rate, but it was pretty consistent with the voting I think.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #551 on: December 02, 2013, 03:52:47 PM »
https://www.metallicabyrequest.com/results.php?s=61

Very predictable. Frayed Ends WAS #10 but now it's slipping down rapidly and surprise surprise - Sad and Sandman are both there.

sigh...


Take Frayed Ends out of that poll and you have a very ordinary Metallica setlist. Well done everyone. :slowclap:

You have the opportunity to hear ANY Metallica song you want and you vote for the ones they play most frequently.

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #552 on: December 02, 2013, 05:23:17 PM »
Well, in fairness, I want to point out that first-timers are likely going to want to hear the live favorites.  Don't get me wrong, I understand the appeal of varied setlists, and I get that people who have seen a band multiple times are going to get tired of hearing the same songs again and again.  But you have to keep the newbies in mind, too.  I know that I would have been severely disappointed if they hadn't played Enter Sandman at my first Metallica show. 
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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #553 on: December 02, 2013, 05:40:48 PM »
I'm surprised Whiskey is so high.
Everyone else, except Wolfking is wrong.

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #554 on: December 02, 2013, 06:45:07 PM »
I've never seen Metallica live but If they didn't play Sad, Sandman or Nothing - i'd actually Prefer that.

I'd like instead : Mama Said or Carpe Diem Baby instead of Nothing. King Nothing Instead of Sandman and Devil's Dance instead of Sad But True.

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #555 on: December 02, 2013, 06:48:48 PM »
I never got the hype for Sad But True.
Everyone else, except Wolfking is wrong.

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #556 on: December 02, 2013, 06:53:00 PM »
I would've picked something like Disposable Heroes - deep cuts off the classics.
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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #557 on: December 02, 2013, 07:17:02 PM »
I would've picked something like Disposable Heroes - deep cuts off the classics.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsBPln1a2dk

This is an awesome version of that song.  :metal  Enjoy !

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #558 on: December 02, 2013, 07:18:24 PM »
I never got the hype for Sad But True.

It's good on the album but it's never good live.

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Re: The Metallica Thread v. Reloaded
« Reply #559 on: December 02, 2013, 07:28:20 PM »
Here's a random set I'd like;

Blackened
Frayed Ends of Sanity
Master of Puppets
Whiplash
Thorn Within
The Struggle Within
Invisible Kid (yeah, that's right)
The Thing That Should Not Be
The Shortest Straw
Ain't My Bitch
Astronomy
Creeping Death
Sanitarium
Unforgiven II
Bleeding Me
The Call of Ktulu
Damage Inc.

Fight Fire With Fire
One
Fade to Black
Battery
Everyone else, except Wolfking is wrong.