Author Topic: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation  (Read 254665 times)

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Offline jammindude

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #315 on: September 02, 2013, 08:51:11 AM »
What Nibiru crap?  I never even heard of it until you mentioned it.   On Wiki it's some ancient Babylonian thingy...but are you saying there's something in the modern day that JJ's taking a jab at?
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Offline rumborak

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #316 on: September 02, 2013, 09:26:34 AM »
There's a group of people predicting the end of times because Nibiru will crash into Earth (which it won't, but that doesn't deter the kind of people believing in that stuff)
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #317 on: September 02, 2013, 09:33:39 AM »
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and suggest that JJ named Nibiru after Nibiru.

Offline Orbert

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #318 on: September 02, 2013, 01:31:43 PM »
That's crazy talk!

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #319 on: September 02, 2013, 07:32:31 PM »
Really enjoying DS9 - but man - all the political cardassian / bajoran / provisional gov stuff really does nothing for me.

I don't even give a crap about UK politics - even harder to give a crap bout the politics of a fictional alien race.

And i've only just begun Season 2. There's SEVEN seasons of this stuff ? :(
« Last Edit: September 02, 2013, 07:51:55 PM by Kotowboy »

Offline The King in Crimson

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #320 on: September 02, 2013, 07:55:49 PM »
The political stuff of bajor, cardassia and the federation is largely the focus of the first two seasons. It takes up much less time during season 3 and beyond.

The Circle trilogy and the season finale of season 1 (where Vedek Winn is introduced) are probably the sequence of episodes were they feature the most.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #321 on: September 02, 2013, 08:05:25 PM »
Good good - i'm past those episodes.

Man I hated Vedek Winn :lol - she was the typical - bossy woman in power is total bitch trope.

« Last Edit: September 04, 2013, 06:15:18 PM by Kotowboy »

Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #322 on: September 02, 2013, 08:51:57 PM »
Good good - i'm passed those episodes.

Man I hated Vedek Winn :lol - she was the typical - bossy woman in power is total bitch trope.



I hated Vedek Winn too. But you're supposed to hate her! She played that part so perfectly, with that subtle smug arrogance and condescending attitude.

They largely drop the Bajoran politics later on, and focus more on the Dominion, and the station. They mostly deal with Bajor when it relates to what else is happening, rather than for the sake of the main story itself.
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Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline The King in Crimson

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #323 on: September 02, 2013, 09:18:11 PM »
I largely enjoyed the Cardassian/Bajoran politics but I don't think there was enough meat there to support seven seasons of story material.

Offline El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #324 on: September 02, 2013, 10:02:39 PM »
Man I hated Vedek Winn :lol - she was the typical - bossy woman in power is total bitch trope.
Man, she hasn't even made Kai yet. You're really gonna hate her in a couple of seasons. Fortunately, she's actually a pretty strong character until season 7, when her story becomes a bit silly.
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Offline rumborak

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #325 on: September 02, 2013, 10:30:38 PM »
What I always liked about later DS9 is that they dealt with religion and it's perils, but always kept the metaphysical aspect in that nebulous "wormhole aliens" realm.
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Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #326 on: September 02, 2013, 10:40:26 PM »
I think they got a good balance of religion and science with the Prophets.
They weren't overanalyzed to the point of destroying or downplaying the mystical powers or making the Bajorans seem silly for having a religion based around these aliens, but they were exposed just enough so that you could fit them into the more scientific idea of being powerful aliens that exist outside of our space/time, sort of like a more benevolent Q.
And the show didn't feel the need to shatter either of those interpretations.
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline PowerSlave

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #327 on: September 03, 2013, 12:27:43 AM »
Speaking of the political map in the ST universe, have any of you ever tried to tie any of the civilizations in the shows to countries in our own time on earth? I'd be interested in seeing if any of you guys have any ideas about this. For example, are the Klingons supposed to be representative of modern day Russia ect. ect...
All of this has happened before and all of this will happen again

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #328 on: September 03, 2013, 05:40:26 AM »
Sorry for the tangent but - remember when Picard drew a smiley face in the coolant during that frozen time episode ?

I know narrative-wise that Picard was overwhelmed with the effects of the time displacement or whatever -

- but for Star Trek in general - it was a really odd little moment. I know TNG had really subtle humour but that

was something a bit different . Just drawing a :) in some frozen coolant gas.

Ok - back to DS9.


I do get a bit tired of " all religion is bad and anyone who believes them are all psycho nutcases " - but I think with Vedek Winn -

- they were perhaps trying to show that religious people with power just abuse that power and don't necessarily even believe

what they force on people - they're using it as an excuse to use gain more power.

Offline jammindude

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #329 on: September 03, 2013, 06:52:31 AM »
I really thought the TNG episode involving Wharf and Kahless to be an interesting angle on the religious aspect of the Klingons...
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Offline El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #330 on: September 03, 2013, 08:11:13 AM »
Ok - back to DS9.


I do get a bit tired of " all religion is bad and anyone who believes them are all psycho nutcases " - but I think with Vedek Winn -

- they were perhaps trying to show that religious people with power just abuse that power and don't necessarily even believe

what they force on people - they're using it as an excuse to use gain more power.
Believe me, Winn is far more complex than that. While it's true she does get off on the power she gains as Kai, it's also true that she's 100% devoted to the Prophets. Her biggest flaw isn't her designs for power, but her jealousy of the fact that the Prophets are more interested in Cisko than the Bajoran spiritual leader. Like I said, she's really a damn good character.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline rumborak

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #331 on: September 03, 2013, 11:17:45 AM »
Speaking of the political map in the ST universe, have any of you ever tried to tie any of the civilizations in the shows to countries in our own time on earth? I'd be interested in seeing if any of you guys have any ideas about this. For example, are the Klingons supposed to be representative of modern day Russia ect. ect...

Yeah, the Klingons in TOS were a Russia equivalent. But, when they redesigned them for TNG they based them much more on Japanese imperial clothes and their code of honor.
Romulans succeeded the Klingons as a symbol for Russia, but more the Cold War type of relation with them with the constant scheming and counter-scheming, and war looming over everybody's head.
Ferengi were more a symbol for capitalism than any particular nation.
The Cardassians are interesting in that they were barely different from humans really, and the more they explored them, the more human they became (that kinda holds for most races though. Even Ferengi-nar became a socialist happy-place in the end)
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Offline El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #332 on: September 03, 2013, 01:12:55 PM »
I always saw the Romulans and Klingons more in historical and mythological terms, rather than modern political. Ancient Romans and Vikings, obviously. Hell, when you think of the ultimate Romulan you think of Mark Leonard, who played his character straight out of any Shakespearean depiction of Rome. As for the Klingons, substitute Khales for Oden and Stovokor for Valhalla and they're one and the same. When TOS wanted to be symbolic of current events, they were much less subtle about it. "Fuck it, lets make an episode about Nazis, Commies, nuclear Armageddon, etc."
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline rumborak

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #333 on: September 03, 2013, 01:17:22 PM »
I should have been a bit more explicit in my post. I was talking mostly about TNG. Because the races in TNG almost had no relation to their TOS counterparts.
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Offline yorost

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #334 on: September 03, 2013, 01:19:38 PM »
Ok - back to DS9.

I do get a bit tired of " all religion is bad and anyone who believes them are all psycho nutcases " - but I think with Vedek Winn -

- they were perhaps trying to show that religious people with power just abuse that power and don't necessarily even believe

what they force on people - they're using it as an excuse to use gain more power.
DS9 put a lot of emphasis in showing the Bajoran religion as a positive through Kira and other side characters. How do you see the show presenting it so one sided? It just didn't shy away from how religion can be abused or skewed, but on a base Bajorans were presented as a peaceful people, a reflection of their unified religion, that suffered greatly. Also, Winn, as El Barto pointed out, is a lot more complex than you're giving her credit for.

Offline El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #335 on: September 03, 2013, 03:12:01 PM »
I should have been a bit more explicit in my post. I was talking mostly about TNG. Because the races in TNG almost had no relation to their TOS counterparts.
I don't see much of a difference between the Romulans in the two series. The Klingons might or might not be different, as their mythos was never explored at all in TOS. They still found honor in battle, as evidenced by Kor, but otherwise none of the Viking influence that TNG/DS9 fleshed out.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline rumborak

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #336 on: September 03, 2013, 03:47:10 PM »
Well, to be honest, they only appeared once in TOS (Balance of Terror), no? :lol
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Offline El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #337 on: September 03, 2013, 03:50:17 PM »
The Enterprise Incident, plus a couple of appearances where they were just shown as Klingon ships.  :lol
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #338 on: September 04, 2013, 06:44:38 AM »
Good good - i'm passed those episodes.




??? I was staring at this for ages - wondering whether i'd used the correct word. It's a weird one.

Offline rumborak

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #339 on: September 04, 2013, 10:03:21 AM »
A lot of people make that mistake.
"I passed the guy, and now I'm past him"
One is a verb in past tense, the other an adjective.
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Offline Orbert

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #340 on: September 04, 2013, 10:04:45 AM »
You mean "past".  "Past" is an adjective meaning that you are beyond something.  It's confusing because it means that you have "passed" it.

"Passed" is the past tense of the verb "pass" meaning to go beyond something.  Once you pass something, you
  1 have passed it
  2 are past it

Both are true.  It just depends on where you're placing the emphasis.


Ninja'd but whatever

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #341 on: September 04, 2013, 06:14:06 PM »
Yeah English is my native tongue but It just didn't look right for some reason !

Offline El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #342 on: September 04, 2013, 09:07:02 PM »
Timeless was a very good episode.  I really like the bitter and angry Kim. The hissy-fit at the end was unnecessary, though.

It's also one of the very few crossover episodes that doesn't suck ass. Most of the time characters make appearances on other series it's pretty bad.

Lastly, in the 45 seconds of screen-time Captain LaForge had, he demonstrated far more character and personality than the Lieutenant Commander did in 7 whole seasons.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
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Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #343 on: September 04, 2013, 09:13:04 PM »
Timeless is one of my favourite episodes. The crash is pretty epic.

I've always liked Georgi LaForge, so I liked that cameo. He had one of the best personalities out of the main cast on TNG (behind Riker).
And it didn't feel as forced as a lot of the cameos do. LeVar Burton also directed that one, so I guess there wasn't a need to shoehorn him in more than was necessary, because he was there anyway.
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #344 on: September 04, 2013, 09:20:22 PM »
Riker had personality. He was an exception in that regard. Geordi didn't really have any. If you ask a bunch of ST fans how they'd describe him, you'd get a whole lot of blinds and blacks, and not much else.  :lol
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
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Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #345 on: September 04, 2013, 09:24:46 PM »
I disagree. I think he definitely had personality come through, compared to the rest. That's why he was one of my favourite characters.

Mind you, his double dose of minority certainly didn't go unnoticed either. :biggrin:
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline rumborak

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #346 on: September 04, 2013, 09:40:13 PM »
I think Geordi's character was "average Star Trek fan". Nerdy with super-nerd friends, and having a hard time with the opposite sex.
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Offline El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #347 on: September 04, 2013, 11:28:16 PM »
I think Geordi's character was "average Star Trek fan". Nerdy with super-nerd friends, and having a hard time with the opposite sex.
yeah, reasonable assessment. He was also the series flackboy; every TOS redshirt rolled into one. Both of those descriptions also apply to Kim, BTW.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #348 on: September 05, 2013, 05:34:48 AM »
Geordi LaForge was a real life quadriplegic trek fan who Roddenberry honoured by naming a character after. .

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #349 on: September 05, 2013, 12:48:31 PM »
Melora : It's the 24th Century and Bashir lives & works in outer space and he's never once experienced zero gravity...???






Watching "Timeless" - drunk 7 was pretty funny.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2013, 01:02:36 PM by Kotowboy »