Author Topic: Native Americans?  (Read 6508 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 7309
  • Gender: Male
  • Do a nice one for grandma
I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man

I Love You...Poppin Fresh

Offline Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 7309
  • Gender: Male
  • Do a nice one for grandma
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #141 on: November 23, 2016, 11:16:05 AM »
I'm sorry but this situation is getting insane.
I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man

I Love You...Poppin Fresh

Offline 7th

  • Posts: 367
  • Gender: Male
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #142 on: November 23, 2016, 09:03:36 PM »
Modern western society could learn a lot from the Hopi.  For example, the Hopi at one point could exist in balance with nature *entirely*.  Think about that for a minute.  Western society is all enamored with itself with our green initiatives, "organic" foods, erection pills, and smart cars, but when I look at certain native cultures I view them as superior in their ability to survive and thrive in the natural world without much, if any, negative impact on the natural environment.  Want to go off the grid?  Take a look at how in rhythm with nature the pueblo tribes existed for millennia. 
"Political correctness is fascism pretending to be manners" - George Carlin

Offline Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 7309
  • Gender: Male
  • Do a nice one for grandma
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #143 on: November 25, 2016, 09:10:23 PM »
See....

I made this thread to see how people view us and nobody gives a Fuck.

I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man

I Love You...Poppin Fresh

Offline 73109

  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4957
  • Gender: Male
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #144 on: November 25, 2016, 09:12:41 PM »
That's decidedly not true, dude.

I certainly care. I just can't comment on everything all the time. I contributed to this post earlier as have a bunch of other people.

One reason for, say, a lack of popularity relative to other threads is that this is just one issue (at the moment anyway) where the presidential election thread encompasses far more than just one issue.

Offline Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 7309
  • Gender: Male
  • Do a nice one for grandma
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #145 on: November 25, 2016, 09:25:26 PM »
Exactly...


Look what happened, a lady got her arm blown off. And elderly lady got injured.

I know people whom have went there and are there. And everything the govt says isn't true. That's what makes me upset, how people can keep a blind eye.
I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man

I Love You...Poppin Fresh

Offline 73109

  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4957
  • Gender: Male
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #146 on: November 25, 2016, 09:33:49 PM »
Couple of things:

1) The girl who got her arm blown off is actually a friend of an acquaintance of mine. Not saying that to get any sort of cred. Just a small world.

2) What do you mean by what the government says not being true?

3) I don't think people are keeping a blind eye. Maybe it's my liberal college echo-chamber talking but almost everyone I know or see on social media has mentioned Standing Rock on a number of occasions. I also don't think it is receiving a media blackout by any stretch. People certainly know what's going on. Many people do or don't want to act for various political, ethical, and monetary reasons—some good, some not so good—but that doesn't mean people don't know.

Offline Cool Chris

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 4637
  • Gender: Male
  • Rest in Peace
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #147 on: November 25, 2016, 09:46:48 PM »
I made this thread to see how people view us and nobody gives a Fuck.

I do appreciate you making this thread, and your inquiry. I didn't reply to that question because I don't view "you" as an "us." Meaning, I try (yet often fail) to view people as individuals. I don't see you on here and think "they Native American posted something...." I hope my meaning is coming across.

And I as well see this regularly on the news outlets I frequent. It isn't something that comes up in every day conversation, but that doesn't mean we are all either being kept in the dark, or are willingly ignorant.

And for most of us I think this is not a cause we necessarily want to throw our chips in with. It isn't a slight on you or the tribes. If you feel that way, that is your right, but I think it is wrong to feel that way.
"Nostalgia is just the ability to forget the things that sucked" - Nelson DeMille, 'Up Country'

Offline Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 7309
  • Gender: Male
  • Do a nice one for grandma
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #148 on: November 25, 2016, 11:53:53 PM »
Yeah. I understand. It's just an odd feeling.

I'm glad you are all concerned too. That's all I wanted to know. You know, what others think. And what others in the world know.
I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man

I Love You...Poppin Fresh

Offline Stadler

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 8169
  • Gender: Male
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #149 on: November 28, 2016, 08:17:51 AM »
See....

I made this thread to see how people view us and nobody gives a Fuck.

What are you expecting?   Not everyone sees it like you do.  I know for me, it's hardly "not giving a fuck", but rather a modicum of respect.  Would you rather everyone that doesn't see it like you come in here and hand it to you every day? 

I don't buy into that idea that "THE GOVERNMENT IS LYING TO US!" and that just because there is emotion involved on one side that that side is automatically in the right.  And while I firmly believe that one should only resort to out-and-out violence in the rarest of cases to support their ideas (if their ideas are strong enough, they'll stand on their own), there is a degree to which if there is no arm there, it doesn't get blown off.  Again, not saying that either side is right, just that it takes two to tango. 

I feel bad for you in one sense - in terms of the feelings of helplessness you feel - but that doesn't mean I necessarily agree with you.

Offline orcus116

  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 9269
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #150 on: November 28, 2016, 10:29:49 AM »
I feel similarly as far as being a little apprehensive to immediately jump to one side just because there's emotion involved. I often wonder how many of the people posting things on Facebook drew their conclusions based on anything more than clickbait headlines and images. Now I'm not trying to downplay or deny anything that happened but I'm familiar with the tribal process through work and while most relations are fine I do know that the tribes are aware that they have the power to shut down an entire operation out of pure spite if they wanted to.

Offline orcus116

  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 9269
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #151 on: December 04, 2016, 06:56:04 PM »
Seems they're relocating the pipeline easement although I just caught the headlines on a few articles and haven't read anything on it. Not sure if there were legitimate reasons or if the ACOE succumbed to PR pressure.

Offline Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 7309
  • Gender: Male
  • Do a nice one for grandma
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #152 on: December 07, 2016, 12:08:24 PM »
I believe because the Vets went in. And they went in large groups.

I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man

I Love You...Poppin Fresh

Offline Chino

  • Be excellent to each other.
  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 18703
  • Gender: Male
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #153 on: January 24, 2017, 08:19:08 AM »
Trump Advancing Keystone, Dakota Oil Pipelines Today, Source Says

https://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2017-01-24/trump-said-to-plan-orders-approving-keystone-dakota-pipelines?cmpid=socialflow-twitter-business&utm_content=business&utm_campaign=socialflow-organic&utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social

The moves, taken on Trump’s fourth full day in office, illustrate his plan to fulfill his campaign pledge to give the oil industry more freedom to expand infrastructure, create jobs and ease transportation bottlenecks.

TransCanada climbed as much as 1.1 percent to C$63.25 at 9:33 a.m. in New York. Energy Transfer Equity LP and Energy Transfer Partners LP climbed as much as 3.3 percent and 1.7 percent, respectively.



Trump owned/owns stock in Energy Transfer Partners, the company building the pipelines. Trump said late last year that he sold his shares of this stock, but since he hasn't released any of his financial records, we have no way of knowing for sure.

Offline hefdaddy42

  • Whiskey Bent and Hell Bound
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 40221
  • Gender: Male
  • RIP Dad 1943-2010
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #154 on: January 24, 2017, 08:47:02 AM »
Well, I'm sure everything is on the up and up.

Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline lonestar

  • DTF Executive Head Chef
  • Official DTF Tour Guide
  • ****
  • Posts: 15059
  • Gender: Male
  • First Follower
    • Lady Obscure Music Magazine
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #155 on: January 24, 2017, 10:11:42 AM »
Well, I'm sure everything is on the up and up.

 :tup
Quote from: nightmare_cinema
So should lonestar and I have babies or something now, is that how this works?
Dang, you're easily the coolest fogey I know of

Offline orcus116

  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 9269
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #156 on: January 24, 2017, 08:29:44 PM »
I saw a clip where he signed the paper, held it up, and just went "You see this? This is jobs." and just kinda made that Trump face. It was hilarious because that's essentially what it's gonna be like.

Offline El Barto

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 18242
  • Bad Craziness
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #157 on: January 25, 2017, 11:06:22 AM »
I'm curious to see if he has the guard clear out protestors. It'll be interesting to hear the mental gymnastics by the same people who defend Bundy and accused Slick Willy of having Koresh and bunch of kiddos, and Peggy Weaver murdered.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 7309
  • Gender: Male
  • Do a nice one for grandma
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #158 on: February 13, 2017, 03:08:08 PM »
And of course this happens.

http://lastrealindians.com/breaking-judge-denies-request-to-stop-construction-of-the-dakota-access-pipeline/


It's despicable how they don't care about the land at all. They only see through dollar sign eyes.

"the harm to the tribe apparently would come from the pipeline being turned on and the oil flowing through it, not from the pipeline’s mere presence.”


That's what we are trying to prevent. So unless it actually happens, no need to worry? Umm...duh.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2017, 03:13:09 PM by Ben_Jamin »
I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man

I Love You...Poppin Fresh

Offline bosk1

  • Bow down to Boskaryus
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 1752
  • Hard-hearted harbinger of haggis
Re: Native Americans?
« Reply #159 on: June 06, 2017, 08:03:04 AM »
Just spent the last few days with my wife and boys up at Lava Beds national monument.  Because that was traditional Modoc land and the site of the "Modoc War," I've been learning about the Modoc and Klamath peoples recently.  Some really fascinating stuff.  The Modoc War really was a microcosm of the larger cultural clash between the U.S. government (or "White" settlers in general) and the various Indian peoples in this country.  Looking back, it is easy to see in the rearview mirror how that specific conflict could easily have been avoided.  But to me, it highlights the larger irreconcileability between two cultures trying to occupy the same space that had vastly different and conflicting views on how to exist with the land. 

For anyone interested, I recommend the book Modoc: The Tribe That Wouldn't Die, by Cheewa James.  She is a bit biased in her reporting, but her biases are easy to spot, and I feel she really does try to be fair.  But she does a good job of putting together a pretty solid narrative from a pretty varied pool of sources.  And, again, while it focuses on a specific (and fascinating) American/Indian conflict, it provides some really interesting insight into similar conflicts throughout the country.

I like this description:
Quote
Were it not for Custer s Little Bighorn Battle, the Modoc War would probably be remembered as America s most significant Indian confrontation. Lt. Col. Frank Wheaton, who commanded the military, said in an 1873 comment: I have never before encountered an enemy, civilized or savage, occupying a position of such great natural strength as the Modoc Stronghold. Nor have I ever seen a better armed or more skillful foe.
"The Supreme Court of the United States has descended from the disciplined legal reasoning of John Marshall and Joseph Story to the mystical aphorisms of the fortune cookie."