Your Controversial Opinions on DT

[rumborak]

Yeah, the "small band" interaction that was spearheaded by MP (and I would argue was integral the their success) has given way to corporate marketing in a lot of places.

[King Postwhore]

Yeah, the "small band" interaction that was spearheaded by MP (and I would argue was integral the their success) has given way to corporate marketing in a lot of places.

But also lead to MP to be burnt out and his departure from DT.

[TAC]

Well yeah but you know us Americans, if the tour isn't near us we don't pay attention.

True, but if a band is supposedly celebrating it's 30th anniversary, I just think we should've heard more from them. Maybe they'll surprise us with a Happy Holidays 2015 CD from this summer's tour.

[King Postwhore]

Remember, I don't recognize this celebration.  Their dates are off.

[Setlist Scotty]

Yeah, the "small band" interaction that was spearheaded by MP (and I would argue was integral the their success) has given way to corporate marketing in a lot of places.

But also lead to MP to be burnt out and his departure from DT.

But if this same amount of "small band" interaction was distributed among all 5 members of the band, there will never be the burn out that MP experienced.

[King Postwhore]

Scott, I get it but Mike needed to take care of himself, he took too much on.  That's not saying anything bad about him.  He needed to realize that, not the other members. 

Too bad for us fans. We were spoiled like no other fans but to what end?  It lead to Mike leaving.

[Setlist Scotty]

Scott, I get it but Mike needed to take care of himself, he took too much on.  That's not saying anything bad about him.  He needed to realize that, not the other members. 

Too bad for us fans. We were spoiled like no other fans but to what end?  It lead to Mike leaving.

I think you misunderstood what I meant in my post - I'm not talking about the past, I'm talking about now. Specifically that the 5 current members of the band could divide this same sort of "small band" interaction between the 5 of them, which would not prove to be a major burden (and thereby risk burn out) to any single one of them, and yet bring the band closer to the fans, keeping them interested.

[King Postwhore]

Oh yes.  I completely agree.  Mike was beyond diligent and the others have not matched his dedication to all the extras to the fans.

[ReaperKK]

He writes good non-shred solos and performs them well.  However, I don't think he is any good improvising.  You can see when he goes "off script", then pauses, and shreds his way out of the improv.  He ends a lot of solos like this, and I think it hurts his live performances.

I tend to agree with you, he is a great player with amazing chops but his improv skills aren't that great, or at least have diminished over the years.

[TheGreatPretender]

Not so much an opinion about DT, as about JLB, and I'm not sure how controversial this is, but I've been thinking. It's no secret that most of the music on his solo albums gets written by Matt Guillory, and it's all great, and he makes sure to give credit where credit is due. But honestly, I would love to hear an album where JLB takes pretty much sole musical creative control. I mean, I would just love to see what he has in him as a composer and what he could come up with. I think it'd be very interesting.

[abydos]

This has been on my mind for years but I don't think I've mentioned it here and TGP reminded me of it.

DT should hire Matt Guillory as a permanent producer with almost full control or a 6th non-touring member who helps writes the core of most songs.

[425]

Granted, I have never heard any solo JLB, but absolutely not, never ever, no. Dream Theater does not need to add any outside voice. The current method of songwriting is working just fine. Absolutely no need to mess with anything at all right now in that department.

[BlobVanDam]

This has been on my mind for years but I don't think I've mentioned it here and TGP reminded me of it.

DT should hire Matt Guillory as a permanent producer with almost full control or a 6th non-touring member who helps writes the core of most songs.

I absolutely love what Matt Guillory has done for JLB's solo music, but I don't want that at all. Keep them two separate entities. What works for one doesn't necessarily work for the other.

[Madman Shepherd]

Not so much an opinion about DT, as about JLB, and I'm not sure how controversial this is, but I've been thinking. It's no secret that most of the music on his solo albums gets written by Matt Guillory, and it's all great, and he makes sure to give credit where credit is due. But honestly, I would love to hear an album where JLB takes pretty much sole musical creative control. I mean, I would just love to see what he has in him as a composer and what he could come up with. I think it'd be very interesting.

I love JLB, he is my favorite member of the band thanks to his sense of humor, lyrics, and of course his voice, but he is not a musical composer.  He doesn't play any instruments and I doubt he would feel comfortable even writing more than half the lyrics to an album. 

With that said, if he did have a concept or idea or theme that he could run with while others composed the majority of the music with his direction guiding the mood, I would kill to hear that.  Chances of this ever happening: 0%

[Lucien]

...he is not a musical composer.  He doesn't play any instruments

voice is an instrument, and you don't have to play an instrument to compose, I'm sure JLB has plenty of musical knowledge

[Sacul]

Writing vocal lines counts as composing.

[TheCountOfNYC]

...he is not a musical composer.  He doesn't play any instruments

voice is an instrument, and you don't have to play an instrument to compose, I'm sure JLB has plenty of musical knowledge

Thank you. I've always hated it when people say that a person's voice isn't an instrument. You can still read music for it, practice to improve your skills at it, and write for it. The only difference is that a singer is born with their instrument intact.

[abydos]

This has been on my mind for years but I don't think I've mentioned it here and TGP reminded me of it.

DT should hire Matt Guillory as a permanent producer with almost full control or a 6th non-touring member who helps writes the core of most songs.

I absolutely love what Matt Guillory has done for JLB's solo music, but I don't want that at all. Keep them two separate entities. What works for one doesn't necessarily work for the other.

I agree, but personally I've felt that over the last 10 years or so, DT has progressively gotten worse and worse at composing actual songs. To me there's something lacking in the songwriting, everything seems to be about technical execution and melody and lyrics come last. That has always been part of their music, of course, but in the past they've done both and now one is almost completely missing or just there on a few occasions, burried between shreds and weird sound effects.

@Sacul, from what we've seen in videos and demos, James doesn't seem to write much vocal melodies, at least not from the ground up. He's usually presented with them from Mike or John (maybe Rudess now?) and then they work out the kinks together.

[Cable]

He writes good non-shred solos and performs them well.  However, I don't think he is any good improvising.  You can see when he goes "off script", then pauses, and shreds his way out of the improv.  He ends a lot of solos like this, and I think it hurts his live performances.

I tend to agree with you, he is a great player with amazing chops but his improv skills aren't that great, or at least have diminished over the years.

I agree. I feel he never has been a great improver, as far as a prolonged solo spots. But it's acceptable to me, as he is IMO incredible at composing solos.

[?]

I think DT should stay away from using outside writers, but it would be a great idea to bring Guillory in to help out with the vocal arrangements/production, as he seems to get the best out of JLB and knows how to play to his strengths.

@Sacul, from what we've seen in videos and demos, James doesn't seem to write much vocal melodies, at least not from the ground up. He's usually presented with them from Mike or John (maybe Rudess now?) and then they work out the kinks together.

On DT12 James has a co-writing credit for the music on all the non-instrumental songs except AFTR, and on ADTOE he contributed to BMUBMD, LNF and FFH, so he seems to have more input and influence on the vocal melodies nowadays.

[Darkstarshades]

I've always seen voice as the hardest musical instrument.
Because if it's screwed up, you have to deal with it, you just can't buy another one like you buy a guitar or a keyboard.
You're born with it and it's very fragile, has to be taken care of. And yeah, finding a proper tuning does require musical knowledge and ear, which JLB totally does.

[Darkstarshades]

The middle part of Outcry should have been taken out and worked as an instrumental.







Ok... no

[425]

On DT12 James has a co-writing credit for the music on all the non-instrumental songs except AFTR, and on ADTOE he contributed to BMUBMD, LNF and FFH, so he seems to have more input and influence on the vocal melodies nowadays.

Also, we know that during the SDOIT-BCSL period it was required that the lyricist write at least the basic outline of the vocal melodies. So JLB wrote at least the outlines of the vocal melodies to Blind Faith, Disappear, Vacant, Sacrificed Sons and Prophets of War (we know not the MP vocal parts). And he probably wrote the vocal melodies to the songs that have his lyrics outside of the time period, since JMX was probably the only one who didn't. JLB, then, probably wrote the vocal melodies for Anna Lee, One Last Time (at least in part) and Far From Heaven. Also, though I assume JP wrote most of the melodies for this one, I'm sure he at least did some on Caught In a Web.

Plus all the songs where he got a songwriting credit (where he probably helped work out the vocal melodies even when the lyricist probably created the initial structure), that's a fair number of songs on which JLB contributed to the vocal melodies.

[Cable]

The middle part of Outcry should have been taken out and worked as an instrumental.







Ok... no

Controversial- Metropolis Pt I
 TDEN, and TMOLS agrees with you. HK does not agree with you, as he was saved from that terrible fate.

[Madman Shepherd]

I've never said that the voice is not an instrument but using your voice and playing an instrument are very different.  There is little evidence to show that JLB has instigated any songs.  Sure he has been a co-writer for Anna Lee and Vacant but by all accounts he seems to be singing over what somebody else wrote. 

All I'm saying is of everyone in the band, he comes in at the very end most of the time, and then contributes.  Hard for someone to give direction or compose anything when they are the final piece of the puzzle as opposed to the first.  Granted, he is an incredibly important piece of the puzzle and to me, I listen to his voice more than most other instruments but what I was initially responding to was a desire for James to laydown the groundwork and direction.  All the other guys lay down the foundation and then he comes in and does his thing (with some interaction or suggestions here or there).  He isn't a "foundation" type of guy.  Still incredibly important and incredibly talented

[Onno]

The middle part of Outcry should have been taken out and worked as an instrumental.

I agree with you. The weakest parts of Outcry are... everything apart fromt the instrumental parts IMO. It's not a bad song... but the instrumental section is just the only section I like.

[TheCountOfNYC]

The middle part of Outcry should have been taken out and worked as an instrumental.

I agree with you. The weakest parts of Outcry are... everything apart fromt the instrumental parts IMO. It's not a bad song... but the instrumental section is just the only section I like.

For me it's the opposite. I feel like the instrumental section brings down an otherwise great song.

[Stadler]

On DT12 James has a co-writing credit for the music on all the non-instrumental songs except AFTR, and on ADTOE he contributed to BMUBMD, LNF and FFH, so he seems to have more input and influence on the vocal melodies nowadays.

Also, we know that during the SDOIT-BCSL period it was required that the lyricist write at least the basic outline of the vocal melodies. So JLB wrote at least the outlines of the vocal melodies to Blind Faith, Disappear, Vacant, Sacrificed Sons and Prophets of War (we know not the MP vocal parts). And he probably wrote the vocal melodies to the songs that have his lyrics outside of the time period, since JMX was probably the only one who didn't. JLB, then, probably wrote the vocal melodies for Anna Lee, One Last Time (at least in part) and Far From Heaven. Also, though I assume JP wrote most of the melodies for this one, I'm sure he at least did some on Caught In a Web.

Plus all the songs where he got a songwriting credit (where he probably helped work out the vocal melodies even when the lyricist probably created the initial structure), that's a fair number of songs on which JLB contributed to the vocal melodies.

I thought even JMX did, and that requirement was why there were less JMX lyrics than for the other guys?  I also thought that rule went further back?   I'm not arguing, because I don't have any info other than my "remembery", but just asking.

[hefdaddy42]

The rule didn't go further back, because the passing of the rule was what resulted in no more JM lyrics (hence 6DOIT, since he furnished lyrics for SFAM).

[MrBoom_shack-a-lack]

I hate to say this but I really can't stand JLB vocals live anymore, especially when he tries to hit high notes. I use to forgive him given his age and it's simply hard to sing stuff you sang 20 years ago but it's gotten to the point were I can't enjoy their live shows anymore. I love DT, some immense talent without a doubt and they still write good music but everytime I hear them live these days I always wonder what they would sound like with a diffrent singer, I just do and that can't be a good thing....

[rumborak]

To me, the unfortunate part is the things he did to his voice to compensate for what he can no longer do. E.g., he's taken to screeching a lot of high notes, where I wish he'd rather sit down and come up with a good, not-improvised vocal line. In his youth he used to have this buttery-smooth vibrato, but because he doesn't have it anymore but still wants the wide vibrato, he oftentimes sounds like Mrs. Miller singing "Monday Monday".
I think I would enjoy JLB a lot more live if he emphasized on his strengths, not just trying to emulate the past.

[King Postwhore]

That happens to all aging singers that push the limits though over time.

[JediKnight1969]

The middle part of Outcry should have been taken out and worked as an instrumental.

I agree with you. The weakest parts of Outcry are... everything apart fromt the instrumental parts IMO. It's not a bad song... but the instrumental section is just the only section I like.

For me it's the opposite. I feel like the instrumental section brings down an otherwise great song.

THIS. I love the song, but I feel like the instrumental part kills the song mood. It´s an emotional tune and it doesn't need that complex instrumental part. IMHO.

[TAC]

Outcry is perfect the way it is.

[hefdaddy42]

Outcry is perfect the way it is.

I think so too.

When I first heard, I much preferred the instrumental section to the rest of the song.  But it has grown on me.