Author Topic: What's the point of testing for THC?  (Read 5588 times)

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Online El Barto

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #35 on: August 17, 2012, 09:49:14 AM »
From a safety standpoint, I'm glad my company tests.  I work in a very dangerous environment (Oil Refinery), last thing I want is someone fucked up.  Whether it's booze, pot, whatever.  We test upon hiring, randomly, and anytime someone has any type of motor vehicle accident in the yard you instantly get tested and sent home till the results come back.  That's my opinion, the companies are thinking liability for sure, plus overall safety of workers, the community, and the environment.  (I hope)
Which isn't an unreasonable position to take.  However, back to Metty's point, testing positive for THC doesn't really mean dick, unless you're opposed to people smoking on their own time.  Out of curiosity, in your high stress and dangerous environment, do you have any problem with people unwinding with a bowl and a cocktail once they go home?  Seems to me that might be a benefit, not a liability. 
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Offline Tick

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #36 on: August 17, 2012, 12:00:03 PM »
 The guy who is a hungover is probably less efficient than the pot smoker following a night of indulging in one or the other.

I do think an everyday pot smoker is more sluggish and less sharp than a non pot smoker would be.

Bottom line. If you want to work for a company who drug tests, stay clean or don't complain if you get caught and lose your job.

I work for a company where one of my boss's smokes weed and drinks, and the other boss likes his cocktails. They are not drug testing me anytime soon.
When I worked at Lowe's I was drug tested before being hired but never again the 2 years I worked for them.
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Offline Orbert

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #37 on: August 17, 2012, 12:09:17 PM »
The guy who is a hungover is probably less efficient than the pot smoker following a night of indulging in one or the other.

I do think an everyday pot smoker is more sluggish and less sharp than a non pot smoker would be.

Bottom line. If you want to work for a company who drug tests, stay clean or don't complain if you get caught and lose your job.

That's all true; no argument there.

But the question was why test in the first place?  Being high at work is definitely a problem, just as being drunk at work would be.  But while a breathalyzer can determine on the spot whether or not you're drunk, there's no equivalent way to test if you're high.  So the best they can do is see if you've indulged any time in the last 30 days.  If I got high two weeks ago, it has absolutely nothing to do with my work today and is furthermore none of their business.

Offline Scheavo

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #38 on: August 17, 2012, 12:54:50 PM »
Hm?  I don't understand.

Correlation does not equal causation. Ya, we can all think of some people who are immature around 25, but to say that it's because they smoke weed or drink doesn't follow. For all you know, they could be even less mature without smoking weed, etc, or that their immaturity is the reason why they smoke and drink so much.

From personal experience, and people I know as well, it seems to me to be more the case that unrelated issues cause heavy drinking and smoking, and those unrelated issues are more important.



Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #39 on: August 17, 2012, 01:08:15 PM »
Some employers just don't know anything about weed. The guy who owns my company ranks it just as bad and harmful as meth, heroin, and cocaine.


 :lol   Yeah, that's pretty typical, though.




I think there are a number of various reasons why companies test as a precondition to employment:


1. It IS still illegal to smoke dope.  Yeah, most places it's decriminalized, but that doesn't mean legal.  It's against the law.
2. Liability (etc, etc, etc)
3. I think in the mind of some people, like the owner of Chino's company for example, there is a perception that if you smoke some mother nature from time to time, you might be doing other things too.




What I think is going to be interesting is if it ever becomes legal, then what?  Will they stop testing for it? And if not, would they still not hire people who test positive? How would they rationalize not hiring someone because of a positive urine test for a substance that was perfectly legal?


I wonder how they handle this in Amsterdam?

Offline Scheavo

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #40 on: August 17, 2012, 01:50:24 PM »
Yeah, most places it's decriminalized

Huh?

Online El Barto

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #41 on: August 17, 2012, 02:18:38 PM »
Yeah, it's only starting to become decriminalized.  There are plenty of places like Dallas where they're more likely to write you a ticket than take you to jail (or just as often confiscate it  :hat).  There are also still plenty of places that'll throw your stoner ass in jail for a few months for having a roach in your ashtray. 
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Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #42 on: August 17, 2012, 02:25:27 PM »
Yeah, most places it's decriminalized

Huh?


Huh?


Maybe "most" was a poor word choice.  How about "a lot"  ;D   And the list grows bigger each year.

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #43 on: August 17, 2012, 03:01:33 PM »
Yep, you can literally get buzzed just walking through downtown Berkeley.

Online El Barto

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #44 on: August 17, 2012, 03:09:30 PM »
Cali doesn't count.  It actually is legitimate out there.  There's something whacky about a place where you can't smoke a Marlboro on a restaurant patio, but you can fire up a joint.   :lol
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Offline Progmetty

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #45 on: August 17, 2012, 03:13:03 PM »
Some employers just don't know anything about weed. The guy who owns my company ranks it just as bad and harmful as meth, heroin, and cocaine.

To answer the OP, I think the point of testing for it is due to the unfortunate stigma that society associates with people who use marijuana.

Though simplistic; these points are more in ball park of what I think the main motives behind the testing are, a deliberately misguided and generalized image of the recreational smoker. One that unfortunately the smoker himself embraces as a comedic entertaining take and has further embedded it in the pop culture. While sometimes it's enjoyably funny indeed, I think it plays a role as damaging as the illegality itself in the minds of non-smokers, especially the older generation (aka most current CEO's). We're all Tommy Chong and Otto in their mind.
I said deliberately misguided but that's an uncertain opinion, I know there must be a bunch of big shot corporations that will lose money over the legalization and would want nothing more than to keep the bad image the only image, unless all that talk about Hymp and the products it can be used to manufacture is exaggerated.

But the question was why test in the first place?  Being high at work is definitely a problem, just as being drunk at work would be

Then why aren't these companies testing as far as 3 month back to see if I had a drink at any point? Frankly my point is that I wouldn't be half as bugged if the drinker and the smoker were treated exactly the same in every aspect, the injustice and the hypocrisy of it is what ticks me, I'm not even asking for it to be seen as it is, that the smoker is heavens less dangerous than the drinker, I'm just asking you to see them as the same threat if you're gonna hold that standard.

So the best they can do is see if you've indulged any time in the last 30 days.  If I got high two weeks ago, it has absolutely nothing to do with my work today and is furthermore none of their business.

Exactamondo. And even worse, cause even if you've been a very infrequent occasional indulger the hair test goes 90 days back! Three freakin month! You can get fired or not hired cause you got high at some point in the last three month. I'd put a sock in it and suck it up if it was just two weeks, that's how far I'm willing to submit to the system, but this intolerable IMO.


What I think is going to be interesting is if it ever becomes legal, then what?  Will they stop testing for it? And if not, would they still not hire people who test positive? How would they rationalize not hiring someone because of a positive urine test for a substance that was perfectly legal?

it's possible that the drug testing mandate will continue even if national legalization took place for recreational Marijuana, if being illegal had little to nothing to do with it in the first place.
Which could also mean that the legalization would be meaningless -at least for the responsible recreational adult users- unless it's accompanied by an act that forbids mandatory testing, that's probably fictional.

^ I had the same thought and concern earlier, in my head I see the legalization working only if the test gets banned, just for THC not all drugs, as crazy as it sounds I want the demand for the THC test to be treated like a demand to know your sexual orientation before you get hired, a bluntly prejudice act. If it's not illegal to fuck guys then you have no business asking me if I do and if it's not illegal to smoke pot then you have no business testing me for it. Again, I know it's a fictional "out there" thought for the right leaning society.

I wonder how they handle this in Amsterdam?

I was just thinking that, maybe TheVoxyn would give us an insight.
I wouldn't want somebody with 18 kids to mow my damn lawn, based on a longstanding bias I have against crazy fucks.

Offline Scheavo

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #46 on: August 17, 2012, 03:15:15 PM »
Yeah, most places it's decriminalized

Huh?


Huh?


It might be interesting to see a total tally for population counts, but as you corrected yourself, geographically, it's false to say most. That's what I objected to.

Offline TheVoxyn

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #47 on: August 17, 2012, 03:52:32 PM »
I wonder how they handle this in Amsterdam?

I was just thinking that, maybe TheVoxyn would give us an insight.
If by Amsterdam you mean the Netherlands, I could give some insight. First of all, because weed is legal here (or actually not-illegal, it's not legal either) - it is used less. The % of people who smoke it here is fairly low compared to some other countries and to the US in particular. Second, I have never heard of an employer asking for a drugs test (also because I haven't been on the serious job market). A quick google search confirmed that it doesn't happen (much) over here.

Seriously guys, Dutch people aren't stoned 24/7  :lol.

Offline Progmetty

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #48 on: August 17, 2012, 04:00:43 PM »
:lol Seriously Vox we know, it's just you  :P
So there are drug tests in Holland but not much, So if an employer in the Netherlands asked for a drug test for THC, can you legally refuse to take the test?
I wouldn't want somebody with 18 kids to mow my damn lawn, based on a longstanding bias I have against crazy fucks.

Offline TheVoxyn

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #49 on: August 17, 2012, 04:09:44 PM »
Yes, you can refuse it. They can only make you do it under special circumstances (like the army or if the job involves dangerous machinery).

Online El Barto

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #50 on: August 17, 2012, 04:29:51 PM »
Yeah, I kinda figured that was the case with Amsterdam.  All the dopers there are from Germany, the UK and USA.  That's actually why I skipped it when I was in the neighborhood. 
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Offline TheVoxyn

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #51 on: August 17, 2012, 04:39:23 PM »
You shouldn't have, the city itself is quite nice and has more to offer than just drugs and prostitutes!

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #52 on: August 17, 2012, 05:17:02 PM »
You shouldn't have, the city itself is quite nice and has more to offer than just drugs and prostitutes!

I was REALLY disappointed with Holland. I was there for two days, and walked all over Amsterdam. And all I saw awesome architecture, a bunch of meh hookers, people from other countries getting high and lovely scenery.

However I saw no Anneke Van Geirsburgen, no Floor Jansen, no Simone Simmons, no Arjen Lucasson or anything.


Let down.
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Offline Ryzee

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #53 on: August 17, 2012, 05:30:54 PM »
I don't know I thought it was p cool, what with the weed and all.

Offline LieLowTheWantedMan

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #54 on: August 17, 2012, 05:53:31 PM »
I smoke weed. I wouldn't call myself a lazy person. I have my days, but I'm decently active overall. Still, I understand the rationale there.

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #55 on: August 17, 2012, 05:55:01 PM »
I have never smoked weed in my life and I am insanely lazy.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #56 on: August 17, 2012, 07:01:55 PM »
People who correlate weed smoking with lazyness watch too many stoner movies.  All the stoners I know are very active.  Sure when you ate high you may be lazy but that doesn't mean you are lazy in general.

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #57 on: August 17, 2012, 07:03:53 PM »
People who correlate weed smoking with lazyness watch too many stoner movies.  All the stoners I know are very active.  Sure when you ate high you may be lazy but that doesn't mean you are lazy in general.

Meh. I've known a ton of pot smokers in my day. Some were lazy, some were very active. Usually it didn't bother me.

However I remember once being in a band and the singer and guitarist (who were dating) smoked a TON of pot. So they used to show up to practice on time, but then sit in their car for 45 minutes and smoke pot while myself and the bassist usually just sat around waiting.
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Offline Weymolith

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #58 on: August 17, 2012, 08:40:05 PM »
https://www.passyourdrugtest.com/timetable.htm

Pot stays in your system longer than any other drug.

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #59 on: August 17, 2012, 11:18:42 PM »
You shouldn't have, the city itself is quite nice and has more to offer than just drugs and prostitutes!
Yeah, I'm sure you're right, and I certainly considered heading up there for a bit.  The thing is, I saw tons of cities that were quite nice with tons to offer, so Amsterdam's only real distinction was the drugs and prostitutes.  When I decided that neither would be particularly interesting, it just didn't jump out at me enough to warrant the detour. 

Interestingly, I might wind up quite a bit closer early next year, but I understand they've really screwed all that up for us foreigners, so it's probably still downgraded. 
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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #60 on: August 18, 2012, 01:13:29 AM »
Cali doesn't count.  It actually is legitimate out there.  There's something whacky about a place where you can't smoke a Marlboro on a restaurant patio, but you can fire up a joint.   :lol

So true. When I went to see DT last month, half the crowd was firing up with impunity, but I had to huddle my ass outside to have a cig.  There is one spot in Berkeley on Telegraph ave. where it is technically illegal to smoke a cig on the sidewalks, but there are two medical weed places and five head shops within a two block radius. :lol

Offline TheVoxyn

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #61 on: August 18, 2012, 05:07:44 AM »
You shouldn't have, the city itself is quite nice and has more to offer than just drugs and prostitutes!
Yeah, I'm sure you're right, and I certainly considered heading up there for a bit.  The thing is, I saw tons of cities that were quite nice with tons to offer, so Amsterdam's only real distinction was the drugs and prostitutes.  When I decided that neither would be particularly interesting, it just didn't jump out at me enough to warrant the detour. 

Interestingly, I might wind up quite a bit closer early next year, but I understand they've really screwed all that up for us foreigners, so it's probably still downgraded.
Officially, yes, there are more rules for foreigners obtaining weed. Unofficially, in Amsterdam, no one cares.

Offline CrimsonSunrise

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #62 on: August 19, 2012, 08:38:59 AM »
From a safety standpoint, I'm glad my company tests.  I work in a very dangerous environment (Oil Refinery), last thing I want is someone fucked up.  Whether it's booze, pot, whatever.  We test upon hiring, randomly, and anytime someone has any type of motor vehicle accident in the yard you instantly get tested and sent home till the results come back.  That's my opinion, the companies are thinking liability for sure, plus overall safety of workers, the community, and the environment.  (I hope)
Which isn't an unreasonable position to take.  However, back to Metty's point, testing positive for THC doesn't really mean dick, unless you're opposed to people smoking on their own time.  Out of curiosity, in your high stress and dangerous environment, do you have any problem with people unwinding with a bowl and a cocktail once they go home?  Seems to me that might be a benefit, not a liability.

Off course not...I usually lead the Captain Morgan charge myself!!  If someone can do it recreationally at home, I have absolutely no problem with that, problem is, you can't test THC that tightly, to differentiate "When" it was used.  Alcohol you can.

Offline Orbert

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #63 on: August 19, 2012, 11:01:33 AM »
Exactly.  So if you can't tell whether some one is high now, or hit a joint two months ago, you shouldn't bother testing at all if your goal is to stop people from using at work.

And if you can't tell whether someone is high now or hit a joint two months ago, you're testing because you don't want people working for you who smoke at all, whether it's at work or on their own time.

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Re: What's the point of testing for THC?
« Reply #64 on: August 19, 2012, 12:04:12 PM »
Completely self-serving point:

The human brain starts seriously reaching its final stages of development somewhere around the age of 25-30, depending on who you ask.  So, being 24, I've started to notice that a lot of people around my age are in the final stages of their personalities becoming fully adult.  I know one guy who's engaged to his fiance, and they basically live an "adult" life of trying to buy a house and working 8 hour per day jobs.  They still do "childish" things, I guess, but it's the wrong way to think about it.  You're basically seeing where they will end up.

You can always tell at this point who is seriously into pot, alcohol, or some other kind of drug because you can tell their brain is just not at the same stage as those who are becoming adults.  The drug is stunting their mental development.  The pot headz uzually talk like thisssss mannnnnn......  They look burnt out.  The people who drink too much are impulsive and lack a meaningful emotional center.

You wish you could tell hard drinkers and pot heads in high school "Dude, if you don't stop this, you literally won't be able to become an adult."  But then you would just be the man, trying to stomp out their good times.

An employer screening for THC use is basically saying "who among these job applicants is a child masquerading as a man?"

This reasoning uses far too much of the post facto fallacy, and ignores why people start smoking or drinking heavily in the first place.

---

So, sorta funny story... up here in Missoula, Montana, at least, barely anyone drugs tests, and especially not some of the people you might think would drug test. And the reason is pretty clear: there basically wouldn't be fucking anyone they could hire. Hell, I know people using heavy construction equipment who never got tested, never will get tested, and knows that just about everyone they work with smokes.

Which is completely different than New Mexico, where  quite a few jobs test, even though most people down there smoke... they just cheat or get it out of their system quickly.

Which is all the more screwed up since they'll then use the stoner aspect as a scapegoat.  Yeah, our procedures are pretty suspect, and we haven't kept up our equipment for the last 12 years, and the DVD we provide for training was produced in Yugoslavia, but he tested positive for cannabis, so it's entirely his fault the lab exploded!

Isn't there some rather bullshit studies that say you're impaired from operating a vehicle for up to 72 hours after smoking?

Pretty much every job drug tests. But yup, most just get clean and continue.
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