Author Topic: The Yes Discography: Mirror to the Sky (2023)  (Read 89197 times)

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Offline Orbert

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #525 on: July 14, 2015, 06:43:13 AM »
At its best (and especially with Jon Davison singing), it sounds like a recent Glass Hammer album, who themselves always seem to be trying to be Yes but come off as a much weaker version. Basically, on Heaven And Earth, Yes sound like a lite imitation of themselves. The comparison is so strong to me that I wonder how much of an influence Davison had in writing this. He's not the leader of Glass Hammer by any stretch, but still.

Davison's mark is all over this album.  He has sole writing credit on one song and co-credit on six of the other seven.  Steve and Chris, along with Alan, have been the core of Yes for a while now, but none of them are strong or prolific songwriters.  They all have been parts of great collaborations, with each other and with Jon Anderson, but each of them seems to need to the others to really come up with something great.  Chris was quoted many times saying that one of the reasons why they were so excited to be working on a new album was because Jon Davison is a songwriter.  Benoit David is not, and that's the main reason why they brought in Trevor Horn and eventually Geoff Downes on Fly From Here.

There is definitely something exciting about a new musical collaboration, and I'm sure the guys weren't kidding or embellishing when they talked about how great it was to be working on new songs.  But I wonder how much of that was simply because they knew that they themselves needed that spark to get things going, and they never realized how bland and homogeneous the results were.  "Exciting" is not a word I would use to describe this album, ever.

Offline ytserush

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #526 on: July 31, 2015, 03:57:00 PM »
Have I missed the Progeny discussion?  Only had time to listen to the first three shows but I'm so glad I finally got around to picking this up.

Offline Orbert

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #527 on: August 02, 2015, 09:14:24 PM »
It's coming.  I'm still trying to figure out how it'll work, and listening more.  I've completed three listens to the whole thing, and have done some jumping around as well.  Obviously, there's a lot to digest.

Offline Mladen

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Re: The Yes Discography
« Reply #528 on: August 06, 2015, 08:29:29 AM »
I actually haven't listened to all of them, I skipped the 80s Yes as well as some 90s material. From what I've heard, the top 10 would probably look something like this:

1. Close to the edge
2. Fragile
3. Relayer
4. Drama
5. Tales from topographic oceans
6. The Ladder
7. The Yes album
8. Magnification
9. Going for the one
10. Fly from here
Time for an update. I revisited several albums I wasn't that sure about, and I also went for it and decided to finally check out the streak of albums I hadn't heard before - 90125 up to and including Open your eyes. That however excludes the Keys albums as well as AWBH. My updated ranking would look like this:

1. Close to the edge
2. Fragile
3. Relayer
4. Drama
5. Tales from topographic oceans
6. The Ladder
7. The Yes album
8. Fly from here
9. Talk
10. 90125
11. Big generator
12. Magnification
13. Going for the one
14. Heaven and earth
15. Tormato
16. Time And A Word
17. Open your eyes
18. Union
19. Yes

I was pleasantly surprised by the Rabin era stuff. Talk was particularly interesting, especially the first three songs which are all tremendous. 90125 has its share of catchy tunes, and so does Big generator - I found the two albums almost just as good. Open your eyes was filled with average songs, although the first two tracks are pretty rocking. Union is a mess and not a single song REALLY stood out.

Offline ytserush

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #529 on: September 14, 2015, 07:12:37 PM »
It's coming.  I'm still trying to figure out how it'll work, and listening more.  I've completed three listens to the whole thing, and have done some jumping around as well.  Obviously, there's a lot to digest.

Could do each of the seven shows and how they compare with each other or pick the best performance of each track in the set.  i still have the last three shows to go myself. I've been savoring them.

I love this release so much more than Yessongs.  Yessongs turned me off to live Yes for the longest time.

Offline Orbert

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #530 on: September 14, 2015, 10:50:53 PM »
I can't do the shows individually.  There just isn't enough time for me to listen to all seven shows enough times to know the individual differences and subtleties between them.  Every time I go through them, there are different things that catch my attention, as the shows are actually more different from each other than one might think, but I still haven't gotten to the point where I can pick a favorite show, or a favorite version of "Close to the Edge", or anything like that.  Not even close.  If I had 30 more hours, I could get to that point, but I just don't have that kind of time to devote to a single album.

I thought about this again just the other day.  I think I'm just gonna go with some overall impressions and comments, and let others comment as well.

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #531 on: September 15, 2015, 06:48:53 AM »
 Slightly off-topic… Are you planning on going to see Jean Luc Ponty and Jon Anderson when they come to the Chicago area?
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Offline Orbert

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #532 on: September 15, 2015, 06:59:07 AM »
No.  I don't really go to concerts any more.

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #533 on: September 15, 2015, 07:08:36 AM »
No.  I don't really go to concerts any more.

I usually don't either.... No time or money. Tickets plus fees plus babysitter = dent in paycheck
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Offline Stadler

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #534 on: September 15, 2015, 08:06:42 AM »
1. Going For The One
2. The Yes Album
3. Drama
4. Fragile
5. Tales from Topographic Oceans
6. Big Penetrator
7. Fly From Here
8. Talk
9. 90210
10. Close To The Edge
11. Tormato
12. Magnification
13. Relayer
14. Time And A Word
15. Union
16. Yes
17. Heaven And Earth
18. The Ladder
19. Open Your Eyes


GFTO is my favorite album of all time by any band, so...

Offline Architeuthis

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #535 on: September 15, 2015, 08:57:10 AM »
Yes lost me after the departure of Jon Anderson.  The replacement singers are uninspired and mediocre at best. I miss the Trevor Rabin era a lot, TALK being a brilliant album along with Big Generator and 90215. Union is a great album with all the members!  I still followed Yes closely after the departure of Trevor Rabin, but after Jon Anderson was gone I had to draw the line. Yes is not Yes without Jon Anderson and Chris Squire..
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Offline Mladen

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #536 on: September 15, 2015, 09:19:33 AM »
10. Close To The Edge
I don't think I've ever seen this before.

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #537 on: September 15, 2015, 10:05:15 AM »
10. Close To The Edge
I don't think I've ever seen this before.
Me neither.

But hey, opinions.
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Offline jammindude

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #538 on: September 15, 2015, 10:27:03 AM »
Yes lost me after the departure of Jon Anderson.  The replacement singers are uninspired and mediocre at best. I miss the Trevor Rabin era a lot, TALK being a brilliant album along with Big Generator and 90215. Union is a great album with all the members!  I still followed Yes closely after the departure of Trevor Rabin, but after Jon Anderson was gone I had to draw the line. Yes is not Yes without Jon Anderson and Chris Squire..

Honestly...Fly From Here is actually not bad.   The title track epic and the album closer are both amazing.  The middle songs are up and down, but still...  I always say that if you like more than half the music from an album, then it's worth the price of purchase. 
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Offline Stadler

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #539 on: September 15, 2015, 12:33:54 PM »
10. Close To The Edge
I don't think I've ever seen this before.
Me neither.

But hey, opinions.

Well, I understand that, and don't get me wrong, it is a classic album ("And You And I" is a top five Yes song for me) but I just don't find myself going for it very often.   I've already said GFTO is No. 1, but I listen to everything in the Top Five often.   To be fair, you could probably put 6 though 10 in a hat, and pull them out at random and I'd live with the order, but still.   It's a great album that doesn't move me as much as the rest.

Now, if I was doing an "objective", Five Best Yes Albums list:
1. Close To The Edge
2. The Yes Album
3. 90210
4. Fragile
5. Going For The One

Offline ytserush

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Re: The Yes Discography: Heaven & Earth (2014)
« Reply #540 on: September 27, 2015, 07:41:29 PM »
Yes lost me after the departure of Jon Anderson.  The replacement singers are uninspired and mediocre at best. I miss the Trevor Rabin era a lot, TALK being a brilliant album along with Big Generator and 90215. Union is a great album with all the members!  I still followed Yes closely after the departure of Trevor Rabin, but after Jon Anderson was gone I had to draw the line. Yes is not Yes without Jon Anderson and Chris Squire..

They lost me live just before he left. What was that 2004? 2005?  The last tour I can say I enjoyed was the Masterworks Tour.

Have to say that Jon Davidson does a really good job based on what I've seen on you tube. It's the rest of them I don't care for live at this point.

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The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #541 on: October 05, 2015, 04:33:26 PM »
Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)



Jon Anderson - Lead Vocals
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums


Opening (Excerpt from "Firebird Suite") / Siberian Khatru
I've Seen All Good People
  Your Move
  All Good People
Mood for a Day / Clap
Heart of the Sunrise
And You And I
  Cord of Life
  Eclipse
  The Preacher The Teacher
  Apocalypse
Close to the Edge
  The Solid Time of Change
  Total Mass Retain
  I Get Up, I Get Down
  Seasons of Man
Excerpts from "The Six Wives of Henry VIII"
Roundabout
Yours is No Disgrace


October 31, Maple Leaf Gardens  Toronto, Ontario
November 1, Ottawa Civic Centre  Ottawa, Ontario
November 11, Duke University, Durham  North Carolina   
November 12, Greensboro Coliseum  Greensboro, North Carolina
November 14, University Of Georgia  Athens, Georgia
November 15, Knoxville Civic Coliseum  Knoxville, Tennessee
November 20, Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum  Uniondale, New York

----------

While searching the vaults for potential bonus material to include on the reissues of Yes' back catalogue, a discovery was made:  Eight complete shows from the 1972 Close to the Edge tour.  Soundboard recordings, apparently untouched for decades.  It turned out that one of the shows had been damaged, but the seven remaining shows were meticulously restored and remastered from the original two-inch, 16-track recordings.  The result is a massive 14-CD collection known as Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two.

This was an important discovery for multiple reasons.  For one, the long-time standard by which all other Yes live recordings are measured, Yessongs, is known for both its incredible performances and its subpar sound quality.  As these tapes would soon reveal themselves to be the original sources for much of Yessongs, the thought of correcting the sound quality after all these years was intriguing at the very least.

Another reason was that these recordings were all from early in the tour.  Bill Bruford had left the band shortly after production of Close of the Edge was complete, before the tour began.  This gives listeners the opportunity to observe the evolution of the live versions of these classic tracks, and how quickly Alan White filled Bruford's position and has made it his own for the next 40+ years.

And finally, while many fans agree that Yes studio albums are often perfect or near-perfect, most do not realize how much improvisation was part of the early Yes experience.  The differences between the live versions on Yessongs and the original studio recordings are well-known; what is not so well-known is that many of them are different because they were improvised every night.

We have here seven shows, each with the same set list.  Steve Howe's medley/mashup of "Clap" and "Mood for a Day" is different every time.  Similarly, Rick Wakeman's "Excerpts from 'The Six Wives of Henry VIII'" is different every time.  The intro jam to "Yours is No Disgrace" is very different every time, and so are Steve Howe's solos.  The same with Rick Wakeman's phenomenal B-3 solo in "Close to the Edge".  Every one is different.

I was skeptical at first.  I had always assumed that with songs so complex and intricate, everything had to be carefully worked out.  You can't play music like this and leave solo sections open-ended; the band has to know when to go into the next part of the song.  And with that (incorrect) assumption in mind, I had my doubts as to how different these shows would be.

My eyes and ears were opened.  These shows are a revelation.  Every one is different.  Not every bit of every song, no, nothing like that.  But for those who are familiar with the songs, there is something different in every performance here.  All those little licks and fills that Howe does during songs are different every time.  Jon's vocal deliveries vary more than one might think.  And so on.

I'm not going to evaluate each show individually.  I've listened through the entire collection four times now, and I don't think I'll be doing any more full listens.  Obviously it's very time-consuming, but mostly it's just exhausting.  I can identify specific things from specific shows which make it stand out, but it would take at least a few more listens before I could rank the shows or judge them individually, and I'm not sure that there would be any point.  You are either a big enough Yesfan and/or have the means to purchase this set, or not.  And if you do, you're going to listen to it all anyway, and come to your own conclusions.


The first thing that strikes you is how incredibly clear everything sounds.  For most of us, this might be partly because we've been listening to Yessongs for 40 years and have become accustomed to the "muddy" sound of it.  The Dolby was miscalibrated at an early stage, and correcting this by going back to the original multitracks was impossible until now.  We listened "through" the mud to hear the sound of a young band on fire.

The idea here was to clean up the tapes and present the shows "warts and all" as much as possible.  You are there, at that venue, that evening.  So when a local radio station starts coming through Wakeman's keyboard rig during one of his "Six Wives" solos, you hear it.  Jon rambles on in his unique way while guitars are being tuned.  There are occassional flub-ups.  The band does get out of sync a few times.  This is very complex music and the drummer just joined the band a few weeks ago.  But that's part of the attraction.  You know that this is how it sounded that night.

The one exception is that some of Chris Squire's bass work has been doctored a bit.  They ran it through some extra processing to get Squire's characteristic sound, as the original soundboard tapes had not captured enough to work with.

As a keyboard player, I found it particularly satisfying how well you can finally hear Wakeman.  He, like the rest of the band, is on fire, and you can finally hear him.

Another thing worth noting is that some of Yessongs came from the Fragile tour and those tapes are not included here.  It is therefore not possible create a "new, clean-sounding" version of Yessongs, as many fans would almost certainly do.  It turns out that all the original Yessongs tracks from the Close to the Edge tour are here, but the Fragile tour tapes have yet to be found, if they still exist.


The Packaging is, of course, completely ridiculous.



Seven shows, each in its own double-CD slipcase, plus the booklet, all in a box.  Each show has its own unique cover and disc art, new and/or unreleased Roger Dean art from the Yessongs period.



(Click each to biggify)

Obviously, this is a set for hardcore completists only.  For those who aren't up to purchasing the entire box, Rhino has also prepared

Progeny: Highlights from Seventy-Two



Here we have a two-disc set with "the best" version of each song from the original seven shows, a representative ideal show.  Who decided this and how is available somewhere on the Internet, I'm sure.  I've heard only positive comments about the "Highlights" set, just as I've heard only positive about the full set (other than the price).
« Last Edit: October 06, 2015, 07:08:17 AM by Orbert »

Offline Mosh

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #542 on: October 06, 2015, 01:02:54 AM »
Interesting. When I heard about this I was pretty skeptical. 7 shows from the same tour with the same setlist? That sounds way too exhaustive for a casual Yes fan like me. But I wasn't aware of the improv, that sounds cool. Might check out at least one of these shows.  :tup
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Offline Orbert

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #543 on: October 06, 2015, 07:25:00 AM »
I have friends who are serious Deadheads.  They collect bootlegs of The Grateful Dead, make copies for each other, etc.  I know the Dead have a huge improvisational component to their music, and I guess that makes sense, but I could never understand how they could listen to countless shows, hundreds or even thousands of them, over and over.  And then discuss them with each other, argue about which take of a particular song was better, this venue this night in '73, or this other venue this one night in '75, or whatever.

I picked up the remastered version of Chicago at Carnegie Hall when it came out.  Having grown up with the original 4-LP version (it was actually my very first album), I knew every note of every song.  The remastered version fit the original four LPs onto three CDs, and included a fourth CD of "alternate takes".  Performances of "Sing a Mean Tune, Kid" and "South California Purples" and others from different nights, as Chicago had played Carnegie Hall the entire week.  The two songs I mentioned have extended, eight to 10 minute jazz improvs, and they were different every night.  I had no idea how different until I heard the alternate takes.  Suddenly, I wanted to hear all of them.  If they were this different from each other, then it stands to reason that the others were all just as different (which isn't necessarily true, I realized later; it could also be that these alternates were chosen specifically because of how different they were from the ones originally included, and the others were all somewhere in between).  But then I understood the deal with the Deadheads.  Every night was a unique show.  Every one had something different to offer.  And if you love the music, as I do, you want to experience every one of them.

That's how I feel about this collection of Yes concerts.  There aren't huge 10-minute jams which were different every time, but there is a surprising amount of difference between performances even from one night to the next.  The crowd is always different.  The technical challenges are always different.  But most importantly, the solos are always different, and that's what I love to hear.  Sure, there are similarities, certain riffs show up in various forms in different spots.  But overall, for diehard Yesfans, this is a treasure trove.  All we need now is a similar set of unearthed Fragile concerts.  And a complete Tales from Topographic Oceans.  And Relayer.  And Going for the One...

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #544 on: October 06, 2015, 10:08:46 AM »
Wow, that sounds crazy.

I would love to have this.  However, I doubt that I have the money or time required.
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Offline Nihil-Morari

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #545 on: October 06, 2015, 01:21:23 PM »
I was skeptical too. Favorited it on spotify, and it's been one of the things by Yes that I listen most to. I really love the honest sound, the way things can go wrong, and the fact that they sometimes do. Great set, would love to buy it once. When it get's a tad cheaper :biggrin:
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Offline ytserush

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #546 on: December 06, 2015, 11:27:11 AM »
Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)



Jon Anderson - Lead Vocals
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums


Opening (Excerpt from "Firebird Suite") / Siberian Khatru
I've Seen All Good People
  Your Move
  All Good People
Mood for a Day / Clap
Heart of the Sunrise
And You And I
  Cord of Life
  Eclipse
  The Preacher The Teacher
  Apocalypse
Close to the Edge
  The Solid Time of Change
  Total Mass Retain
  I Get Up, I Get Down
  Seasons of Man
Excerpts from "The Six Wives of Henry VIII"
Roundabout
Yours is No Disgrace


October 31, Maple Leaf Gardens  Toronto, Ontario
November 1, Ottawa Civic Centre  Ottawa, Ontario
November 11, Duke University, Durham  North Carolina   
November 12, Greensboro Coliseum  Greensboro, North Carolina
November 14, University Of Georgia  Athens, Georgia
November 15, Knoxville Civic Coliseum  Knoxville, Tennessee
November 20, Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum  Uniondale, New York

----------

While searching the vaults for potential bonus material to include on the reissues of Yes' back catalogue, a discovery was made:  Eight complete shows from the 1972 Close to the Edge tour.  Soundboard recordings, apparently untouched for decades.  It turned out that one of the shows had been damaged, but the seven remaining shows were meticulously restored and remastered from the original two-inch, 16-track recordings.  The result is a massive 14-CD collection known as Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two.

This was an important discovery for multiple reasons.  For one, the long-time standard by which all other Yes live recordings are measured, Yessongs, is known for both its incredible performances and its subpar sound quality.  As these tapes would soon reveal themselves to be the original sources for much of Yessongs, the thought of correcting the sound quality after all these years was intriguing at the very least.

Another reason was that these recordings were all from early in the tour.  Bill Bruford had left the band shortly after production of Close of the Edge was complete, before the tour began.  This gives listeners the opportunity to observe the evolution of the live versions of these classic tracks, and how quickly Alan White filled Bruford's position and has made it his own for the next 40+ years.

And finally, while many fans agree that Yes studio albums are often perfect or near-perfect, most do not realize how much improvisation was part of the early Yes experience.  The differences between the live versions on Yessongs and the original studio recordings are well-known; what is not so well-known is that many of them are different because they were improvised every night.

We have here seven shows, each with the same set list.  Steve Howe's medley/mashup of "Clap" and "Mood for a Day" is different every time.  Similarly, Rick Wakeman's "Excerpts from 'The Six Wives of Henry VIII'" is different every time.  The intro jam to "Yours is No Disgrace" is very different every time, and so are Steve Howe's solos.  The same with Rick Wakeman's phenomenal B-3 solo in "Close to the Edge".  Every one is different.

I was skeptical at first.  I had always assumed that with songs so complex and intricate, everything had to be carefully worked out.  You can't play music like this and leave solo sections open-ended; the band has to know when to go into the next part of the song.  And with that (incorrect) assumption in mind, I had my doubts as to how different these shows would be.

My eyes and ears were opened.  These shows are a revelation.  Every one is different.  Not every bit of every song, no, nothing like that.  But for those who are familiar with the songs, there is something different in every performance here.  All those little licks and fills that Howe does during songs are different every time.  Jon's vocal deliveries vary more than one might think.  And so on.

I'm not going to evaluate each show individually.  I've listened through the entire collection four times now, and I don't think I'll be doing any more full listens.  Obviously it's very time-consuming, but mostly it's just exhausting.  I can identify specific things from specific shows which make it stand out, but it would take at least a few more listens before I could rank the shows or judge them individually, and I'm not sure that there would be any point.  You are either a big enough Yesfan and/or have the means to purchase this set, or not.  And if you do, you're going to listen to it all anyway, and come to your own conclusions.


The first thing that strikes you is how incredibly clear everything sounds.  For most of us, this might be partly because we've been listening to Yessongs for 40 years and have become accustomed to the "muddy" sound of it.  The Dolby was miscalibrated at an early stage, and correcting this by going back to the original multitracks was impossible until now.  We listened "through" the mud to hear the sound of a young band on fire.

The idea here was to clean up the tapes and present the shows "warts and all" as much as possible.  You are there, at that venue, that evening.  So when a local radio station starts coming through Wakeman's keyboard rig during one of his "Six Wives" solos, you hear it.  Jon rambles on in his unique way while guitars are being tuned.  There are occassional flub-ups.  The band does get out of sync a few times.  This is very complex music and the drummer just joined the band a few weeks ago.  But that's part of the attraction.  You know that this is how it sounded that night.

The one exception is that some of Chris Squire's bass work has been doctored a bit.  They ran it through some extra processing to get Squire's characteristic sound, as the original soundboard tapes had not captured enough to work with.

As a keyboard player, I found it particularly satisfying how well you can finally hear Wakeman.  He, like the rest of the band, is on fire, and you can finally hear him.

Another thing worth noting is that some of Yessongs came from the Fragile tour and those tapes are not included here.  It is therefore not possible create a "new, clean-sounding" version of Yessongs, as many fans would almost certainly do.  It turns out that all the original Yessongs tracks from the Close to the Edge tour are here, but the Fragile tour tapes have yet to be found, if they still exist.


The Packaging is, of course, completely ridiculous.



Seven shows, each in its own double-CD slipcase, plus the booklet, all in a box.  Each show has its own unique cover and disc art, new and/or unreleased Roger Dean art from the Yessongs period.



(Click each to biggify)

Obviously, this is a set for hardcore completists only.  For those who aren't up to purchasing the entire box, Rhino has also prepared

Progeny: Highlights from Seventy-Two



Here we have a two-disc set with "the best" version of each song from the original seven shows, a representative ideal show.  Who decided this and how is available somewhere on the Internet, I'm sure.  I've heard only positive comments about the "Highlights" set, just as I've heard only positive about the full set (other than the price).

Glad you finally got to this. It's easily the best live Yes collection I own.

Totally changed my mind about '70's live Yes.   Yessongs never did it for me because of the way it sounded to me.

Offline Orbert

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #547 on: December 06, 2015, 11:38:47 AM »
I was fortunate to get into Yessongs back when all I had was a cheesy portable stereo.  I say that this was fortunate because it was a given that the sound wouldn't be great, and this was also in the early years of my record collection, so I had very little basis for comparison.  Instead, I enjoyed the performances, and the sound quality didn't bother me.  It was only after years of listening to many other live albums that I realized that the sound of Yessongs was really pretty bad.

Offline Mladen

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #548 on: December 06, 2015, 12:58:21 PM »
I saw the Progeny box set a while ago in a local music store and I was really surprised to see it. Anyone who buys it must truly be a hardcore fan.

Offline Nihil-Morari

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #549 on: December 06, 2015, 01:09:46 PM »
I saw the Progeny box set a while ago in a local music store and I was really surprised to see it. Anyone who buys it must truly be a hardcore fan.

I'm far from the greatest Yes fan there is, but I really like the idea of the boxset. Hearing the subtle differences in shows and improvisations is like a treasure hunt. Too bad the boxset is 100 euros, if I one day see it a tad cheaper I'll buy it. Maybe second hand one day.
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Offline JediKnight1969

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #550 on: December 10, 2015, 01:56:37 PM »
Top 5 Yes albums IMHO:

1- Close to the edge
2. Fragile
3- The Yes album
4- Going for the one
5- Keystudio

Honorable mention:

6- The ladder
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Offline The Letter M

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #551 on: December 10, 2015, 03:13:01 PM »
Top 5 Yes albums IMHO:

1- Close to the edge
2. Fragile
3- The Yes album
4- Going for the one
5- Keystudio

Honorable mention:

6- The ladder

Nice to see someone give the Keys material a mention! It's highly underrated, IMO, though some might say the classic line-up kind of over-hyped the material. I think those folks were expecting too much from the line-up that made TFTO and GFTO (because you have to recall, they also gave us Tormato).

The Ladder is a great album, too, with some nice songs and moments in there. Definitely better than the albums that surround it.

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Offline KevShmev

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #552 on: December 10, 2015, 06:37:27 PM »
Talk is better than both, IMO, but The Ladder is good (not as great as I once thought, but I still like it), and the Keys songs are mostly good (Be the One and That, That Is have some weird, awkward melodies, but all of the songs from Keys 2 are quite good).

Offline Stadler

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #553 on: December 11, 2015, 06:36:45 AM »
Talk is better than both, IMO, but The Ladder is good (not as great as I once thought, but I still like it), and the Keys songs are mostly good (Be the One and That, That Is have some weird, awkward melodies, but all of the songs from Keys 2 are quite good).

Talk is, in my view, the most underrated of all Yes albums.  If you isolate the Rabin albums (and by that I include the "YesWest" songs from Union) the level of accomplishment of that material is rather consistent.   I guess if you don't like it, it is consistently "crap", but I happen to really dig Rabin (especially his voice), so for me, that is three and a half albums of just top notch material.  The Anderson material that doesn't have Rabin is (for me) rather patchwork starting with ABWH.  "Open Your Eyes" is easily my least favorite Yes album, and the Ladder isn't far off that.  Even the Keys material is musically good, but gets ruined by Anderson's hipster "Janie's on crack time!" lyrics, and usually lyrics don't bug me at all (I like Kiss, after all). 

Offline Orbert

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #554 on: December 11, 2015, 08:54:27 AM »
I agree with pretty much all of this, with one important difference.  As much as I can admire Trevor Rabin's talent, in writing, arranging, playing, producing, basically everything, a lot of that admiration came later, and there is still something deep down about him that bugs me.  I can't pin down what it is.  I like 90125, and I like Big Generator.  I didn't pick up Big Generator until later, though, because of various circumstances, and it took a while to get into it.  This was a very different Yes.  I didn't simply write them off because of the lack of both Steve Howe or Rick Wakeman or both, as many did, but there's no denying that there are some elements of "the Yes sound" which aren't here.  Steve Howe called it Yessishness, which is a silly word, but somehow I know exactly what it means, just as I can never know what it is about Trevor Rabin that bugs me.

Talk is by Trevor's band, and in my head in parentheses the name of Trevor's band is Cinema.  A very good band, really.  I picked up Talk much later, again because of circumstances, and it's great, probably the best of the three.  But then Trevor sings, and it's not Yes, it's Cinema.  It doesn't have to be Jon Anderson.  Trevor Horn, Benoit David, and Jon Davison all have Yessish voices.  Somehow Trevor Rabin does not.  His is simultaneously a voice I like, and one which bugs me.  Hey, I think I just figured out what bugs me about Trevor Rabin.

Anyway, I also agree about "crack time".  I cringe (or at least mini-cringe inwardly) every time I hear that line.  I like the Keys to Ascension material mostly (both releases, since I see them as all one body of work), but some of it's a little shaky.  This is the same band that made Tormato, another album I like better than a lot of people do, but which I admit has some questionable moments, so it all makes sense.  Not every album is going to be Going for the One, which I think is flawless from start to finish; in fact, very few are, even if they are by the same band.

Overall, I like the Keys to Ascension material best from the 90's and later Yes.  I like Wakeman over Kaye or Downes, I like Howe over Rabin or Banks, and I like Anderson over anyone else.

Offline KevShmev

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #555 on: December 11, 2015, 06:41:43 PM »
That's interesting, because as someone who only knew Yes for years as the one where Rabin and Anderson both sang, when I first heard the Drama album, I thought Horn's voice was a unique, albeit vastly inferior, blend of Anderson's and Rabin's voices.  But I can certainly understand how someone who grew up on 70s Yes would be a bit turned off by anyone else singing lead vocals on a Yes album.  Heck, I had a hard time with Drama at first for that very reason (no Anderson or Rabin).

Offline Orbert

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #556 on: December 11, 2015, 08:56:28 PM »
I loved Drama from the very beginning, even though it was not Jon Anderson on lead vocals.  It helps that I always liked Trevor Horn's voice.

Offline Stadler

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #557 on: December 14, 2015, 08:15:27 AM »
I agree with pretty much all of this, with one important difference.  As much as I can admire Trevor Rabin's talent, in writing, arranging, playing, producing, basically everything, a lot of that admiration came later, and there is still something deep down about him that bugs me.  I can't pin down what it is.  I like 90125, and I like Big Generator.  I didn't pick up Big Generator until later, though, because of various circumstances, and it took a while to get into it.  This was a very different Yes.  I didn't simply write them off because of the lack of both Steve Howe or Rick Wakeman or both, as many did, but there's no denying that there are some elements of "the Yes sound" which aren't here.  Steve Howe called it Yessishness, which is a silly word, but somehow I know exactly what it means, just as I can never know what it is about Trevor Rabin that bugs me.

Talk is by Trevor's band, and in my head in parentheses the name of Trevor's band is Cinema.  A very good band, really.  I picked up Talk much later, again because of circumstances, and it's great, probably the best of the three.  But then Trevor sings, and it's not Yes, it's Cinema.  It doesn't have to be Jon Anderson.  Trevor Horn, Benoit David, and Jon Davison all have Yessish voices.  Somehow Trevor Rabin does not.  His is simultaneously a voice I like, and one which bugs me.  Hey, I think I just figured out what bugs me about Trevor Rabin.

Anyway, I also agree about "crack time".  I cringe (or at least mini-cringe inwardly) every time I hear that line.  I like the Keys to Ascension material mostly (both releases, since I see them as all one body of work), but some of it's a little shaky.  This is the same band that made Tormato, another album I like better than a lot of people do, but which I admit has some questionable moments, so it all makes sense.  Not every album is going to be Going for the One, which I think is flawless from start to finish; in fact, very few are, even if they are by the same band.

Overall, I like the Keys to Ascension material best from the 90's and later Yes.  I like Wakeman over Kaye or Downes, I like Howe over Rabin or Banks, and I like Anderson over anyone else.

Orbert, I could have written this.  I know EXACTLY what you are saying, and while I don't have a ton to add to it, I would offer that one of the things is, Yes is more than Anderson singing.  Chris Squire sang a LOT in Yes, and his voice is ALL OVER Drama, which lent it credibility, and didn't make it 1,000,000 miles from what came before.  Except for obvious things like the Leave It a cappella number, Rabin and Anderson did a lot of what Squire and Anderson did.  Chris got relegated to the "Steve Howe role, if that makes sense.  I think people who aren't Yes freaks would be greatly surprised how distinctive and integral Squire's vocals are to the Yes bouillabaisse (anyone see what I did there?  Fish stew?  Fish?  Crickets...).

Add to that that Anderson, Squire, Howe, and Horn all have that warm, English tenor sound quality to their voices (Lake and Wetton have it too) and Rabin has a more clear, piercing tone to his voice and it really becomes distinctive.


I will add too, that Going For The One is my favorite album of alltime, and Side One of Tormato is REALLY good.   Side Two suffers from "Circus of Heaven" and "Arriving UFO", which makes Madrigal sound that much more unimpressive, but it ends well with OTSWOF.   If someone could have locked Anderson in the closet when they were recording side two, the world would be a better place.  :) 

Offline Orbert

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #558 on: December 14, 2015, 11:36:46 AM »
We're again on the same page.  It's not just Jon Anderson, but the harmonies and the blending which matters more to me.  The vocals on Drama, Fly From Here, and Heaven & Earth all sound very similar to me because of the ways the voices blend.  And most of the vocals on the Rabin-Yes albums have a similar sound, so it's really Rabin's lead vocals which stand out.

Offline chaossystem

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Re: The Yes Discography: Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
« Reply #559 on: December 14, 2015, 07:07:34 PM »
Just to give you something to think about-

In my opinion, the TEN best Yes albums...

Chronologically:

1) Time and a Word
2) The Yes Album
3) Fragile
4) Close to the Edge
5) Going for the One
6) Drama
7) 90125
8) Talk
9) Keys to Ascension
10) Keys to Ascension 2
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