Author Topic: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help  (Read 3068 times)

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Offline setrataeso

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Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« on: August 02, 2011, 01:00:15 PM »
Alright guys, I'm in shit city right now, and I'm looking for advice or anything.

So, for the past 10 months, I've been working at a science centre in Halifax called Discovery Centre. It was an awesome job that I really enjoyed going to. But, I'm pretty much cooked at this point.

This past Saturday, while working in the gift shop, a mother came in with her two little boys and asked for directions to the nearby candy store. I told her where to go. I told her it was 3 blocks down the street and it's big and colourful and has a big Mr. T in the front window. I also mentioned that there are a bunch of gay fellows working there. That was that.

On Monday, my boss got an email from her saying that she heard me make a derogatory comment about gays. According to her, she heard me say "there are a bunch of stupid gays working there".

I would never say this. I never have, and I never will. But I am in all kinds of shit about this. The entire centre knows. The CEO, the HR people, all my fellow staff members are all aware of this. The lady came in today to back up her word, so she seems to think it's a big deal. I got called in, and I'm on indefinite suspension.

Now, there were a few coworkers around that my boss has yet to gain a testimony of what happened from, so I won't get contacted about this until later in the week, but I can't see this ending well. The way I see this going is one of a few ways. It either plays out that:

A) I prove myself innocent, and they let me stay.
B) I prove myself innocent, but they see me now as a liability to the centre, and let me go
C) I am unable to prove myself innocent, and they let me go

I'm not too thrilled about any of these options. If A occurs, then I'll be left with a permanent blemish, and have to go around to every single staff member, and gradually win myself back into good graces. However, now if I say anything ever, I'm in hot shit. If I joke around with a kid, or make the smallest mistake, I'm done.

Right now, I'm looking for a new job, but I really need the Discovery Centre as a reference. I worked there for almost a year, and it's reference gold if I want to get into any sort of customer service job. If they give me a reference, let me go, and choose to forget about the whole homophobia scandal, then I'll be content and I'll go amicably. However, I'm concerned that they won't give me anything, considering how big of a deal this is on the centre, and the repercussions of pandering to someone in the middle of this ordeal by giving them something they need. The centre is fearing legal troubles on both sides. If they let me stay, or let me go, but give me a severance package or a reference, the woman who is accusing me is liking going to light a fire. She could bring this to the newspapers, or sue the centre. However, if they don't give me what I'm legally entitled to after letting me go, then they are worried about me suing them for wrongful dismissal and violation of workers rights.


This whole thing is very overwhelming. I sure as hell am not staying there after this is done, but I have to worry about both how I need to handle these slanderous accusations, and also how I legally want to handle my inevitable dismissal. Any suggestions on either front?
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Offline Chino

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2011, 01:04:38 PM »
Why did you mention the gays in the first place? Especially to a mother with her children... I'm sorry to hear you are in this situation, but in today's society you can't expect to say the word "gay" and have it not turn into a shit storm.

Offline setrataeso

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2011, 01:09:12 PM »
Why did you mention the gays in the first place? Especially to a mother with her children... I'm sorry to hear you are in this situation, but in today's society you can't expect to say the word "gay" and have it not turn into a shit storm.

I don't really remember to be honest. I must have been trying to be cute or something. I'm friends with the guys that work there, so it didn't seem like a big deal to say.
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https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=25343.0

Setra, I think that is the best statement I have read on this forum.  Very well said.

Offline Gadough

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2011, 01:12:57 PM »
Everyone in this country needs to get rid of the giant rod stuck up their ass. Jesus Christ, this is so ridiculous. I'm sorry you have to go through this Set. Even if it wasn't necessary for you to mention that, you shouldn't have to deal with this. A fine example of when political correctness goes way too far.
Gadough isn't Hitler. He's much, much worse.

Offline setrataeso

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #4 on: August 02, 2011, 01:16:30 PM »
Thanks man. I'm hardly the first person at my work to mention a gay guy to a customer. There's a gay guy who worked across the street at a starbucks, and our staff members thought he was hilarious, and would send customers over to pass on a message or something. I dont see how mentioning a couple of gay candy store guys turns into "Lee hates stupid gays".
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https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=25343.0

Setra, I think that is the best statement I have read on this forum.  Very well said.

Offline ricky

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #5 on: August 02, 2011, 01:19:09 PM »
i say you find that lady and tackle her.
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Online lordxizor

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #6 on: August 02, 2011, 01:20:20 PM »
Really, there's not much you can do but tell the truth and hope people believe you. Perhaps it would be best to discuss with someone whether it would make sense for you to simply resign to appease the woman and maintain a decent reference from your current workplace.

I wouldn't worry too much about the woman suing or going to the newspapers. I don't think newspapers are interested in stories about relatively unimportant people making disparaging comments about homosexuals. Unless you're in upper management I doubt there's much of a story there. And what would she sue for?

Offline El Barto

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2011, 01:23:32 PM »
If the company is worried about you suing them, then they're not going to be a problem when it comes to a reference.  "Yes, he worked here from August to July.  Company policy prohibits us from saying anymore.  Have a nice day." 

Personally,  I'd get the hell out of there.  "The customer's always right" is a shitty way to do business, and I don't care for being automatically in the wrong because of it.  I'm just funny that way. 
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Offline Dark Castle

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2011, 01:24:39 PM »
God this reminds me of a femanazi I know, people need to quit making crisis's out of simple words, its getting ridiculous in our society how politically correct we have to be ALL the time.
Good luck to you though, hopefully this all works out for you.

Offline 73109

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2011, 01:27:14 PM »
Set, that really sucks dude. I can't offer advice, being 16 and all, but what I can say is that you were delt a real shit hand, and I hope everything works out for the best. Have you faced any shit from people other than HR over this? Like coworkers?

Offline 7StringedBeast

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2011, 01:27:51 PM »
I think you should sue that woman who slandered you.  You can't just walk around making accusations and costing people's jobs.  Sue her.
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Offline 73109

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2011, 01:30:00 PM »
That is a great idea. If you have people on your side, it becomes an "insert number larger than 1" on 1 fight, and you'll win.

Offline setrataeso

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2011, 01:32:51 PM »
Really, there's not much you can do but tell the truth and hope people believe you. Perhaps it would be best to discuss with someone whether it would make sense for you to simply resign to appease the woman and maintain a decent reference from your current workplace.

I wouldn't worry too much about the woman suing or going to the newspapers. I don't think newspapers are interested in stories about relatively unimportant people making disparaging comments about homosexuals. Unless you're in upper management I doubt there's much of a story there. And what would she sue for?

I dont know, theres probably something. I find her argument would hold little ground, but I can see this from the centre's point of view; there could be a big ruckus if someone gets away with a shit deal. I guess the lady felt like she was offended, or she was offended on behalf of her children. It could be bad press for the centre if they make the wrong move.
Even if they keep me past this, I'm going to resign. It's an uphill battle after this for me anyways. Still, the centre won't be my reference if I leave before this is all sorted out. If I leave, then the centre has to bear this burden, and I can't imagine them doing something for me after that. If I at least take this like a man, and stand my ground, then i can at least take the blame for the misunderstanding, and ask that it be stricken from mine and the centre's record in the future.


Set, that really sucks dude. I can't offer advice, being 16 and all, but what I can say is that you were delt a real shit hand, and I hope everything works out for the best. Have you faced any shit from people other than HR over this? Like coworkers?

No, I'm prohibited from being in or around the centre until I'm contacted next.
I would consider the suing idea, but then I become no better than the woman who accused me. Maybe she heard me wrong because her shitty kids were yelling or something. It's already a misunderstanding on her part and she's shitting on me because of it. I don't want to make this into something big between her and I. I'm more concerned about what my employer will do with me, post-incident.
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Setra, I think that is the best statement I have read on this forum.  Very well said.

Offline Gadough

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #13 on: August 02, 2011, 01:33:00 PM »
I think you should sue that woman who slandered you.  You can't just walk around making accusations and costing people's jobs.  Sue her.

Would there actually be a case for doing this? It's definitely fair; this bitch is lying about you and it may cost you your job. But legally, would a case like this, you know...not get immediately thrown out?
Gadough isn't Hitler. He's much, much worse.

Offline Dark Castle

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #14 on: August 02, 2011, 01:35:08 PM »
That and what would you even get out of it?  Not to mention she'd probably get support too.

Offline 73109

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #15 on: August 02, 2011, 01:36:02 PM »
Defamation of character. Hell yeah he can sue.

Offline Gadough

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #16 on: August 02, 2011, 01:38:40 PM »
Normally I hate when Americans get "sue-happy". But in your case,

1. She deserves to get sued.

2. I'm pretty sure you're Canadian.

So if you have the capabilities to sue someone, I say go for it.
Gadough isn't Hitler. He's much, much worse.

Offline setrataeso

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #17 on: August 02, 2011, 01:40:31 PM »
If i have the capibilities of suing anyone, it'll be the centre.
It'll almost cost me more in the long run to sue the lady. Suing for defamation of character is not worth anything in the long run.
I'm not one to sue anyways, but if I was to do it, it would be the centre if they refuse to make my exit less onerous. If they let me go, it'll already be wrongful dismissal. If they don't give me anything either, then I gain some ground on worker's rights violations.
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https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=25343.0

Setra, I think that is the best statement I have read on this forum.  Very well said.

Online lordxizor

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #18 on: August 02, 2011, 01:40:52 PM »
I wouldn't sue her unless he's got people to back up what he said. If it's him versus her, I doubt he's got much to stand on. Plus, just the fact that he unnecessarily pointed out that there were gay guys working at the store doesn't really look very good.

Offline Sir GuitarCozmo

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #19 on: August 02, 2011, 01:42:36 PM »
While it sucks extremely badly that you are in this situation and the lady needs to STFU and GTFO, she's probably going on the fact that you seemingly felt it imperative to, while giving her and her kids directions to a candy store, point out that it's staffed by gay people.  She doesn't know that you know those guys there.  The mere fact that you said it at all, even if it wasn't in a malicious manner in any way, would likely make most people suspicious of your motives for having mentioned it.

"I just asked for directions to a candy store.  Why in the world did he feel the need to tell me that gay people work there?"  

Like I said, she's being completely ridiculous and should NOT have embellished your words.  I hope you beat this.  Just pointing out that I can see why she may have questioned why you offered her information that was somewhat unnecessary.

EDIT:  Semi-ninja'd by lordxizor

Offline Dublagent66

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #20 on: August 02, 2011, 01:44:05 PM »
That sucks and people do misinterpret or misunderstand things from time to time.  My advise in the future would be not to give out too much information.  Just answer the question and send them on their way.  Saying that gays work there is irrelevant.  Anyway, I hope it blows over cause that lady is getting carried away.
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Offline setrataeso

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #21 on: August 02, 2011, 01:48:11 PM »
Yeah, I definitely realize my mistake of mentioning the guys that worked there. Still, if she had not embellished my words and just pointed out to me or my boss that it was unnecessary for me to mention the guys that work there, I could have just explained that I know them, and I'm just joking around anyways. I would have gotten a slap on the wrist at worst, I would have explained myself, and this whole thing would have blown over. Instead, she has chosen to take it upon herself to get me fired, so I don't stand much of a chance.
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Setra, I think that is the best statement I have read on this forum.  Very well said.

Offline Ryzee

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #22 on: August 02, 2011, 01:49:12 PM »
So, first off I want to say that I do hope this works out for Set as I don't ever want somebody to have to lose their job or be in any kind of financial trouble.  But I have to point out a few things.

One is that I see a lot of people in the thread making reference to "this country"  "our society" and "political correctness."  I'm gathering from Set's post (use of the word "centre" for one) that he is not American- maybe Canadian?  So in this case this isn't about "damn American political correctness."  Not sure how that matters but thought I'd point it out.  Anyway, society issues and political correctness aside, the fact of the matter is people are people and they take offense to various things.  Without knowing their personality, sense of humor, beliefs, etc. already you never know what a stranger may take offense to.  That's why when you're dealing with the public you have to be careful about what you say.  This is probably why his work is reacting the way they are, they realize this and they'd rather lose an employee than a customer.  That's just how businesses work.

The second thing, and I think Chino already mentioned this, is why say anything about the sexual preference of the candy store employees in the first place?  What does that have to do with anything?  And Set mentioned that he's not the first employee at his work to comment about someone being gay to a customer.  I just don't understand why they would do that.  That's like telling a customer "yes there's a bank down the street.  The teller there likes to wear a cowboy hat when he bangs his wife."  I just don't get how something like that finds it's way in to a conversation like that.  Oh well, that's all.  Hope everything works out ok for Set, just had to get that stuff off my chest.

Edit:  Also everybody pretty much said everything I did already while I was typing my long-winded post.  I suck.

Offline OskarSluring

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #23 on: August 02, 2011, 01:53:33 PM »
This might be a silly idea, but i will go with it anyway:

You said you knew the people working at the candy-store. Why not try to get some of them to testify for you, and tell the ones that are accusing you that you have nothing against them.
Would something like that be able to arrange?

Maybe i'm just being very naive, but that's probably what i would try to do.

Offline Dark Castle

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #24 on: August 02, 2011, 01:54:30 PM »
In society I meant worldwide, its not just Americans, the 'femanazi' I mentioned is actually british and actually had a big spat with her and a group of her friends about how I and a small group of friends were sexist pigs essentially for having differing opinions than hers.  
But that has hardly anything to do with the topic on hand.
That lady really should have just had you explain what you meant instead of taking it upon herself to ruin your job and put a mark on the Centre for something you didn't even say.

Offline setrataeso

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #25 on: August 02, 2011, 01:55:18 PM »
If I cared about keeping my job after this, I would get the guys at the candy store to testify on my behalf that I was just being light-hearted and cute, rather than being homophobic. I have faith that my coworkers will at least say that it would be out of character for me to say "stupid gays". I am unfiltered, so I probably just mentioned the gays guys without even thinking about it. If I was able to contact the woman, I would explain the scenario and context, but i can't do that, so I'm left to argue in a bubble.
However, the more I think about it, the more discouraged I am about staying at this job after this is done, anyways.
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https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=25343.0

Setra, I think that is the best statement I have read on this forum.  Very well said.

Offline OskarSluring

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #26 on: August 02, 2011, 01:59:03 PM »
I hope your co-workers do stand up for you, and that this will have a poitive outcome  :smiley:

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #27 on: August 02, 2011, 02:00:03 PM »
It doesn't sound like a company that seems pretty willing to throw you under the bus is worth working for. I'd start polishing your resume today and sending it out to other companies. References are pretty worthless these days so I wouldn't sweat it.

Offline setrataeso

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #28 on: August 02, 2011, 02:00:35 PM »
Thanks for all the kind words guys. I just need the reference. If I can get that and move on peacefully, I'll be fine. I don't want to have to sue anyone or piss anyone off.
NEW REVIEW: Lady Gaga - Born This Way
https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=25343.0

Setra, I think that is the best statement I have read on this forum.  Very well said.

Offline El Barto

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #29 on: August 02, 2011, 02:02:54 PM »
Honestly dude,  you're nineteen.  None of this matters.  It seems like a big deal, but it really isn't.  All you need to know is that sometimes life in the business world will really suck balls, and the Centre will give you a neutral reference.  That's it.  Nobody's going to sue anybody, and getting fired is just one of those things that happens in the real world.  You'll get a better job and laugh about how silly they were at your last gig.
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Offline 73109

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #30 on: August 02, 2011, 02:04:10 PM »
Dude, to be honest, everyone fucks up. Everyone has at least one thing over their head that they are not proud of. This is yours. If it were me in your shoes, if this turns out well, I'd stay with the centre. You'be been there for over a year. You dig your job well, and it seemed as though you dug the people around you, and the people dug you. I'd stick it out, and if you sense any animosity, just explain to whoever what happened. There is no sense in letting this get to you this badly. If this turns out well, continue to live your life.


Offline black_biff_stadler

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #31 on: August 02, 2011, 02:07:56 PM »
Setra, aren't you living with a few other housemates and early on in your college years? I ask this because it'll help me gauge your level of financial urgency since if you're still living at home your parents will still obviously support you until you find new work even if they're a little let down about this mishap.

That aside, if you are out of the parental comfort zone you'll obviously need money and probably very soon unless you have a decent nest egg. If you and your parents have a good rapport with each other then let them know about this immediately since you will likely need a little assistance to tide you through unless you're fortunate enough to quickly get a new job. Even if you and them don't have a great rapport I'd still figure out whether mom or dad will take it better and tell the cooler one about it first so the other one can then hear it from them and blow their top if they need to so when that parent(the less cool one) begins to talk to you about it they'll be doing so with much less hostility which is critical since if they come out swinging you may lose your cool and come back with equally harsh words potentially screwing yourself out of much needed help.

I understand if you may need to tell them what happened in a way that makes you sound less irresponsible in order to cushion the initial "oh shit!" factor but when doing so be careful not to omit any details that they're likely to find out any way since the last thing they wanna encounter while helping you in this darkest hour is EVEN MORE unpleasant surprises.

From the legal standpoint I've always found it best to trust your parents' advice before making your own decisions. Discuss this matter thoroughly with them in order to find out if they think you'll actually need to hire legal representation. If they think you will then ask them to help you find a lawyer who will give a free consultation since it'd be tragically naive to fork over several hundred/couple thousand dollars to someone without having absolute faith in their ability and willingness to give you your best shot in this thing possible.

Also, since you mentioned a suspension I'm guessing you have a few days before you have to talk to anyone at work again. USE THIS TIME AS WISELY AS YOU CAN TO PREPARE! If they plan on being dicks and running you through the mill as some kind of sacrificial lamb in order to set an example for future employees then you need to be 110% sure that you give them not even an atom of material to use against you. If you've decided by then that you definitely don't want the job anymore and feel certain that they are gonna pursue legal action against you then cease absolutely all communication with them and let your lawyer handle ANY AND ALL COMMUNICATION.

As for work, I'd just not use them as a reference unless you are convinced you can get a decent reference. Since you're in school it's very plausible that you'd have a long lapse in employment since a fair amouint of folks don't work during college. Also, it'll serve you extremely well to get your next job before any of this crap can turn up on a background check(and that should only be a problem if it does go to the courts in which case you still may be fine if you emerge victorious...your lawyer will/should be able to let you know all that this entails.) Beyond this, if you do begin receiving financial assistance from your parents then do everything in your power to remain in their good graces. Let them know(with not only your words but definitely with your actions as well) that you're agressively pursuing new employment. They may tell you to not overload your plate with the balancing of school, work, and legal matters. If they are providing you with financial help then do as they say.

Until this blows over keep your nose as clean as possible. Don't post anything on social media things like Facebook, Twitter, etc. that can be used to make you look bad in court or that could piss off your parents such as pics of you going out and drinking or doing anything you wouldn't do at a family gathering. As for DTF stuff, avoid any gay humor(I know we're quite liberal with it but you have to look out for yourself since it'd be ultimate facepalm time if this went to court and you one day saw it used against you.)

That's all I can think about for now but I'll try to keep an eye on this thread and contribute anything else that may help and above all I surely wish you the best since I've definitely done stupider things and not had shitstorms of this caliber beset me.

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Offline MetalManiac666

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #32 on: August 02, 2011, 02:14:26 PM »
Horrible situation, and I have to agree that the company sounds like they don't give a shit about their employees.  In conclusion, people suck.

Offline setrataeso

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #33 on: August 02, 2011, 02:34:22 PM »
@black_floyd:

I'm not living at home, but I'm not in school either. I'm just working until I can get on with my actual career.
I've already talked to my dad, who is the more logical and the one I'm most like out of my parents. He's given me a bunch of advice, including what I'm entitled to legally, and also encouraging me that because it's the end of summer, this is actually the most convenient time of the year to lose your job, because of all the soon-to-be-available student employee slots.
Yeah, I'm keeping my head down, and only mentioning this to friends of mine who I think can help me get work, or who have gone through something similar.
I don't think anyone will pursue legal action against me. The lady probably just wants me fired, and the best thing for the centre to do for their image is to appease her and do just that.
My parents are definitely on my side. I've been living on my own for a year now, and have done it almost all on my own with very little financial assistance from them. They'll be more than willing to help me out if I was in a tight spot (hell, they'd help me even if I was not in a tight spot). I'm not one to abuse their generosity though. I just need them for advice, and in dire circumstances I'll ask for money.

This was good advice though, thanks dude.
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Offline black_biff_stadler

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Re: Work woes/legal trouble = Need some help
« Reply #34 on: August 02, 2011, 02:42:20 PM »
@black_floyd:

This was good advice though, thanks dude.

No prob. Although this forum can be overrun with unsympathetic silliness(especially in help needed threads) we do have a strange tendency to shut off our unnecessary goofiness when the help needed is of an urgent nature. I actually spent nearly an hour composing that which may be a record for my five years I've been a part of this community :lol But at any rate, I'm glad to hear that the old crow likely won't be cawing any more on this matter.
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