Author Topic: AVENGED SEVENFOLD: We Urged MIKE PORTNOY Against Quitting DREAM THEATER  (Read 51049 times)

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Offline ReaPsTA

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@Reap: That was the most interesting thing to me too. Apparently MP was rolling in the dough.

Which I still haven't quite wrapped my head around.  Obviously MP does well for himself.  His house is pretty nice and he just got a new Mustang.  But while AX7 isn't the biggest thing in the world, I always imagined they were just on a different financial level from DT.  While that still might be true of the band as a whole (specifically Myung and LaBrie, who don't do much outside the band), apparently MP's work on DVD's and side-projects is more than a creative outlet.
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Offline Dream Team

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@Reap: That was the most interesting thing to me too. Apparently MP was rolling in the dough.

Which I still haven't quite wrapped my head around.  Obviously MP does well for himself.  His house is pretty nice and he just got a new Mustang.  But while AX7 isn't the biggest thing in the world, I always imagined they were just on a different financial level from DT.  While that still might be true of the band as a whole (specifically Myung and LaBrie, who don't do much outside the band), apparently MP's work on DVD's and side-projects is more than a creative outlet.

MP also has a 2nd house in Arizona.

Offline ReaPsTA

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@Reap: That was the most interesting thing to me too. Apparently MP was rolling in the dough.

Which I still haven't quite wrapped my head around.  Obviously MP does well for himself.  His house is pretty nice and he just got a new Mustang.  But while AX7 isn't the biggest thing in the world, I always imagined they were just on a different financial level from DT.  While that still might be true of the band as a whole (specifically Myung and LaBrie, who don't do much outside the band), apparently MP's work on DVD's and side-projects is more than a creative outlet.

MP also has a 2nd house in Arizona.

Well then.
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Offline nikatapi

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Maybe the fact that DT and especially Mike controlled many aspects of the band themselves, led to more income?
Also A7X maybe considered the fact that an unknown drummer would be satisfied with less money than MP.

Offline KevShmev

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The irony of the situation is that MP basically pulled a Kevin Moore. It is more and more looking like MP had lost the interest on the band. It is also beginning to look like that he has also lost interest on progressive metal (as none of his new projects could be classified to that category). Of course the latter point is less certain than the first.

While it is perfectly fine for a man's opinions to change, it feels a bit weird that MP spent 15 years bad-mouthing KM for leaving the band. But in the end, he did exactly the same thing with the same reasons. I wonder what MP would say about KM now?

They all bought into your contrived sincerity
And how you wore your heart and soul right on your sleeve
Laughing sarcastically
You turned your back on the people who adored you

Self-absorbed exhaustion
Self-esteem distortion
Self-infused extortion
Self-serving abortion

I'll take the blame for these things that I say
'Cause I had the heart and the will and the courage to stay
Every day
I won't walk away

Reading through all the digests you show me
I notice the way that you think you control me
Doubting my future, you don't even know me
But I never walked out on you

Offline WildeSilas

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I mentioned this in another thread but it kind of got steam rolled. Mike wanting to take a five year break was such a huge parting of ways with the other members, and most likely for FINANCIAL REASONS. Transatlantic alone probably sells mire units than all the other member's side projects combined. Even polls on this very forum bear that out. Mike also most likely gets a bigger cut of DT DvD and CD sales because he gets the lions share of production and publishing/songwriting credits lately. He probably gets theargest cut from Ytse Jam sales, possibly gets an initial stipend for overseeing merch sales, and has released more insructional dvds than all the other membets combined. If even half of those speculations are true, his income is substantially more than the other members. He might have easily sustained himself for 5 years without a DT release as a result, but it's highly doubtful any of the others could have.
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Offline robwebster

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I mentioned this in another thread but it kind of got steam rolled. Mike wanting to take a five year break was such a huge parting of ways with the other members, and most likely for FINANCIAL REASONS. Transatlantic alone probably sells mire units than all the other member's side projects combined. Even polls on this very forum bear that out. Mike also most likely gets a bigger cut of DT DvD and CD sales because he gets the lions share of production and publishing/songwriting credits lately. He probably gets theargest cut from Ytse Jam sales, possibly gets an initial stipend for overseeing merch sales, and has released more insructional dvds than all the other membets combined. If even half of those speculations are true, his income is substantially more than the other members. He might have easily sustained himself for 5 years without a DT release as a result, but it's highly doubtful any of the others could have.
I think that's generally pretty well accepted. Portnoy essentially - not to vilify him any more than he already has been, but in the broadest of terms, he sort of went up to the band and went "hey guys! Would you mind taking five years' unpaid holiday just 'cause I'm kinda bored?"

Not that I get the impression any of the band are just in Dream Theater for the money. They're musicians, they thrive on this stuff. Not to mention that they seem to be more pumped by the music than they've been in ages, right now, but the point is that it's probably a much bigger ask than I think Portnoy really considered.

Offline ReaPsTA

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but the point is that it's probably a much bigger ask than I think Portnoy really considered.

Indeed.  Aside from DT coming back bigger and better than ever, which I think is a dubious notion in-and-of itself, why was this hiatus good for anyone else in the band?  Can you imagine any of them telling their wives they were thinking of doing this?
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Offline SystematicThought

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MP also has a 2nd house in Arizona.
That's right he does. Now that tweet makes sense to me where he says something like 'Another fine day in Casa Portnoy New York.'

Anyways, there's no shocking revelation here, but it is nice to hear A7X say this in public, now we all know.
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The irony of the situation is that MP basically pulled a Kevin Moore. It is more and more looking like MP had lost the interest on the band. It is also beginning to look like that he has also lost interest on progressive metal (as none of his new projects could be classified to that category). Of course the latter point is less certain than the first.

While it is perfectly fine for a man's opinions to change, it feels a bit weird that MP spent 15 years bad-mouthing KM for leaving the band. But in the end, he did exactly the same thing with the same reasons. I wonder what MP would say about KM now?

They all bought into your contrived sincerity
And how you wore your heart and soul right on your sleeve
Laughing sarcastically
You turned your back on the people who adored you

Self-absorbed exhaustion
Self-esteem distortion
Self-infused extortion
Self-serving abortion

I'll take the blame for these things that I say
'Cause I had the heart and the will and the courage to stay
Every day
I won't walk away

Reading through all the digests you show me
I notice the way that you think you control me
Doubting my future, you don't even know me
But I never walked out on you
lol
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Offline tristl

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not to forget, for me the fan a 5 year hiatus would have meant aleast five years no dt!!
and for them now they have for the first time support from their record company and then say ok we take a little break about  say 5 years?
dt isn't a band who comes back even bigger,
nobody knows dt besides the fans,
somewhere i read latley " the biggest band in the world that nobody knows"
thats the perfekt description, even if i hope that it will change. :metal :heart
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Offline ReaPsTA

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not to forget, for me the fan a 5 year hiatus would have meant aleast five years no dt!!
and for them now they have for the first time support from their record company and then say ok we take a little break about  say 5 years?
dt isn't a band who comes back even bigger,
nobody knows dt besides the fans,
somewhere i read latley " the biggest band in the world that nobody knows"
thats the perfekt description, even if i hope that it will change. :metal :heart

Agree with all of this.

Plus, something we don't think about as hardcore fans of the band - Once DT finally says goodbye, they don't have the immortality of Zeppelin, The Beatles, Floyd, and so on.  They will eventually fade away until they're nothing more than a footnote in music history.  Why begin that process early and then try to fight against it with a reunion?
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Offline ZirconBlue

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Also, remember that, unlike a lot of bands that have a big hit then piss all the bucks away, DT has been set up where all the bands income goes into a central account from which a salary is paid to each member.  With 10 studio albums (including one gold record), several live releases (including several platinum-selling DVDs), and tour income over the years, they've probably all got a nice, steady income.  And, I'll bet a lot of that got invested, yielding investment income on top of that.

And, they almost certainly get a much larger cut of the album sales, since they switched to RoadRunner.  

So, I'll bet all the guys are doing pretty well, with MP taking in even more from his side projects, etc.  


Offline tristl

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 :eekstill i don't think their like millionaires and they ars really working for their money and!
most importantly they are making me happy with their work! ;D ;D :heart :heart
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Offline rumborak

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MP's income must have seen a massive drop then, if he was really raking in that much money during his DT time.

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Offline nikatapi

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MP's income must have seen a massive drop then, if he was really raking in that much money during his DT time.

rumborak


Maybe that is why he tried to rejoin DT...

Offline DarkLord_Lalinc

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MP's income must have seen a massive drop then, if he was really raking in that much money during his DT time.

rumborak


Maybe that is why he tried to rejoin DT...
Maybe that's one reason, but not everything involved. The amount of pressure he was recieving from fans and media was overwhelming. I see it more like an escape, and also a bit of realization that maybe he didn't make the best choice.
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Offline Heretic

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This was pretty obvious from the way a7x said things the entire time, but yeah, glad it's finally out in the open.

Offline reneranucci

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Well, many people in this forum were saying "This record-tour-record schedule has done a lot of harm to the band's creativity. They should take a break from making music together for a while, do side projects and come back to DT with a fresh music perspective". That's what exactly what MP wanted. And he never said 5 years AFAIK.

Offline ZirconBlue

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MP's income must have seen a massive drop then, if he was really raking in that much money during his DT time.

rumborak


Depends on what the "leaving member" clause of the contract says.  Does he keep the publishing?   ;)

Offline snapple

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Dream Theater sells shit loads of albums and DVDs worldwide. Avenged Sevenfold's biggest fan base is probably in the USA. Dream Theater is HUGE in Japan. Avenged Sevenfold really isn't.

Though, I was surprised to read that A7X wouldn't have been able to keep up with MP's mortgage.

Offline ReaPsTA

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Dream Theater sells shit loads of albums and DVDs worldwide. Avenged Sevenfold's biggest fan base is probably in the USA. Dream Theater is HUGE in Japan. Avenged Sevenfold really isn't.

Though, I was surprised to read that A7X wouldn't have been able to keep up with MP's mortgage.

Good point with the world wide thing.  Especially Japan.
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Offline rumborak

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Well, many people in this forum were saying "This record-tour-record schedule has done a lot of harm to the band's creativity. They should take a break from making music together for a while, do side projects and come back to DT with a fresh music perspective". That's what exactly what MP wanted. And he never said 5 years AFAIK.

According to himself and DT, he asked for an indefinite hiatus in the end actually. I believe JR said that in successive conversations the amount of time slowly went up. First 6 months, then a year, then indefinite.

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Well, many people in this forum were saying "This record-tour-record schedule has done a lot of harm to the band's creativity. They should take a break from making music together for a while, do side projects and come back to DT with a fresh music perspective". That's what exactly what MP wanted. And he never said 5 years AFAIK.

According to himself and DT, he asked for an indefinite hiatus in the end actually. I believe JR said that in successive conversations the amount of time slowly went up. First 6 months, then a year, then indefinite.

rumborak

Pretty sure it was the other way round. He wanted an indefinite hiatus, the guys were against that so he tried to give a rough amount of time, first suggesting 5 years, and then eventually desperately suggesting one year because they were still saying no.

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Offline Mbarak

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Well, many people in this forum were saying "This record-tour-record schedule has done a lot of harm to the band's creativity. They should take a break from making music together for a while, do side projects and come back to DT with a fresh music perspective". That's what exactly what MP wanted. And he never said 5 years AFAIK.

According to himself and DT, he asked for an indefinite hiatus in the end actually. I believe JR said that in successive conversations the amount of time slowly went up. First 6 months, then a year, then indefinite.

rumborak

Pretty sure it was the other way round. He wanted an indefinite hiatus, the guys were against that so he tried to give a rough amount of time, first suggesting 5 years, and then eventually desperately suggesting one year because they were still saying no.

Yep. That's how I remember it.

Offline Kotowboy

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Incredible that he tried to rejoin DT *after* they'd had the auditions and hired Mike Mangini. . .

Offline tristl

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the strang thing for me is that on one side he wants a how long so ever break from his band and on the other side wants to join this boy group!??? :tdwn :loser:
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Offline bosk1

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It's just as soon as things start to die down... another article gets posted to keep the Portnoy subject alive. I have moved on. A lot of people have. Blabbermouth hasn't and won't until there is nothing left to squeeze from the subject
In all fairness, this is kind of new.  We hadn't really heard anything from A7X on this particular point.  They aren't regurgitating things that have already been published.

Eh, yes and no.  I think it was M Shadows (although it may have been Syn) who said most of those things quite awhile back.  The only thing completely new is "I think his intentions were pretty clear that he wanted to be a member of AVENGED SEVENFOLD."  But in fairness, these interviews do provide more detail than was previously put out there.


...so when he was asked to leave, I was more surprised at how so many people (including Mike!) were surprised.

Minor correction:  He was not exactly "asked to leave."  His original contract with the band was to tour with them through 2010 I think it was.  From what I understand, they did not boot him early and ask him to leave.  They only declined to extend the contract.  And apparently, Mike assumed it was going to be extended beyond what was originally agreed to.



I also wouldn't assume from the comments above that Mike is "rolling in dough."  From all appearances, he is comfortable.  But I think it is more of an issue of him being able to take home more net from his income in DT because of the way they handle a lot of their own merchandising and have a lot of autonomy from their label.  I'm betting A7X have a more traditional contract with the major label where everything is done on huge advances from the label and then the label and everyone else affiliated and under contract takes a huge cut of everything off the top.  So even with A7X selling more albums and playing bigger shows (at least in the U.S.), they almost certainly take home a much smaller net percentage of the sales.  Also, even if they brought Mike on full time, they may not have been prepared (metally, contractually, or whatever) to make him a full member.  That may also play into why they felt they couldn't offer him as much as he would have asked for.  Lots of variables we don't know.
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Offline TheOutlawXanadu

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Bosky, I think you're being too careful here. The A7X guy straight-up said, "He makes a lot of money". Dude's rich. :lol
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Offline ZirconBlue

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Though, I was surprised to read that A7X wouldn't have been able to keep up with MP's mortgage.

I think it's more a matter of being hired in as the "new guy" in an established band.  He wouldn't be making any of the royalties, etc. that the rest of the band is making on their back catalog. 

Mangini is likely not going to be making as much money as a member of DT as MP made, for similar reasons.  Apparently, he won't even be making as much money as he could raising exotic snakes.   ;)

Offline bosk1

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Bosky, I think you're being too careful here. The A7X guy straight-up said, "He makes a lot of money". Dude's rich. :lol

Not sure what there is to be "careful" about.  I just know a little bit about how the music industry works and am able to do the math. 
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Offline TheOutlawXanadu

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Bosky, I think you're being too careful here. The A7X guy straight-up said, "He makes a lot of money". Dude's rich. :lol

Not sure what there is to be "careful" about.  I just know a little bit about how the music industry works and am able to do the math. 

Just giving you a hard time for being the "I WOULDN'T ASSUME" guy.
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Well outside of DT, has has toured several times with other projects, has a Tama endorsement, a Sabian endorsement, custom sticks, a custom snare, custom cymbals, several instructional DVDs and a monopoly on both camels and expelling saliva.


That's gotta rake in some cash.
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Offline bosk1

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Bosky, I think you're being too careful here. The A7X guy straight-up said, "He makes a lot of money". Dude's rich. :lol

Not sure what there is to be "careful" about.  I just know a little bit about how the music industry works and am able to do the math. 

Just giving you a hard time for being the "I WOULDN'T ASSUME" guy.

Yeah, well...well...YOU'RE UNSEASONED!  SO THERE!
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