Poll

How much do you like BC&SL?

It's my new favorite
33 (5.4%)
It's up there with the best of 'em
247 (40.4%)
It's good
198 (32.4%)
It's O.K.
107 (17.5%)
Never Enough
27 (4.4%)

Total Members Voted: 593

Author Topic: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions  (Read 132410 times)

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Offline RandalGraves

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #70 on: June 22, 2009, 11:28:55 AM »
Wow, I'm pretty shocked by the reception for this.  Most notably, Best of Times and Count of Tuscany, as I rate the former one of their best and the latter one of their worst.

Still, solid albums.  Wither makes me wish they did more songs under 10 minutes.

Offline tri.ad

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #71 on: June 22, 2009, 11:29:32 AM »
Check out The Count Of Tuscany @ 2:36: One of my favourite JR moments ever. Amazing lead. :tup
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Offline cygnusx1jg

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #72 on: June 22, 2009, 11:34:43 AM »
Since there seems to be a good number of people less than enthusiastic about some of the lyrics on this record, I wonder if some people will end up liking the instrumental CD more than the "regular" one?
Hope is what remains to be seen. Now we must tend our garden.

Offline antigoon

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #73 on: June 22, 2009, 11:36:23 AM »
I don't think so. While some of the lyrics are bad, the vocal melodies are mostly strong throughout. These songs weren't written to be instrumentals; I don't see how anyone could prefer them as such.

Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #74 on: June 22, 2009, 11:39:24 AM »
Since there seems to be a good number of people less than enthusiastic about some of the lyrics on this record, I wonder if some people will end up liking the instrumental CD more than the "regular" one?

And miss out on those harmonies?!
The lyrics aren't too bad overall. The main one I am hearing complaints about is TCOT. The rest is no different than I hear about any other recent DT album overall. If people can manage the last few DT album's lyrics, then they won't have a problem with these.
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Offline tri.ad

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #75 on: June 22, 2009, 11:42:40 AM »
I think some of the TCOT lyrics are rather totally hilarious than awful. Yes, they are simplistic, but they're also fun and better than some whiny, pretentious lyrics à la Feel So Low.

Btw, Wither contains very good lyrics imo.
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Offline DarkLord_Lalinc

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #76 on: June 22, 2009, 11:43:22 AM »
I think some of the TCOT lyrics are rather totally hilarious than awful. Yes, they are simplistic, but they're also fun and better than some whiny, pretentious lyrics à la Feel So Low.

Btw, Wither contains very good lyrics imo.
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Offline cygnusx1jg

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #77 on: June 22, 2009, 11:45:05 AM »
That leads into an interesting (maybe) question or two:  Does an instumental actually have to be written as one to "work"?  Also, assuming that the average DT fan will probably listen to the main CD for a little while, where does the intrumental and cover CD fit in?  How long do you think it will be before those get multiple listens?
Hope is what remains to be seen. Now we must tend our garden.

Offline antigoon

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #78 on: June 22, 2009, 11:45:49 AM »
I think some of the TCOT lyrics are rather totally hilarious than awful. Yes, they are simplistic, but they're also fun and better than some whiny, pretentious lyrics à la Feel So Low.

Btw, Wither contains very good lyrics imo.
Like reflections on the page, the worlds that you create... *Awesome keyboard pad*

THAT PART IS SO FUCKING GOOD.

Offline ReaPsTA

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #79 on: June 22, 2009, 11:52:55 AM »
Awake
I&W
FII
SFaM/BCSL
SDOIT/SC
8vm
WDADU
ToT

DT did good with this one.
Take a chance you may die
Over and over again

Offline antigoon

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #80 on: June 22, 2009, 11:54:42 AM »
My Turn

Falling Into Infinity
Awake
Images & Words
Scenes From A Memory
Black Clouds & Silver Linings
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Octavarium
Train of Thought
When Dream And Day Unite
Systematic Chaos

Online Zydar

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #81 on: June 22, 2009, 11:57:12 AM »
Images & Words
Scenes From A Memory
Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence
Black Clouds & Silver Linings
Octavarium
Train Of Thought
Awake
Falling Into Infinity
Systematic Chaos
When Dream And Day Unite

So right now it's in my Top 5.
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Offline ariich

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #82 on: June 22, 2009, 11:58:24 AM »
I think some of the TCOT lyrics are rather totally hilarious than awful. Yes, they are simplistic, but they're also fun and better than some whiny, pretentious lyrics à la Feel So Low.

Btw, Wither contains very good lyrics imo.
Completely agreed on all counts (pun not intended!). The lyrics to TCOT are a bit of silly fun, just like a lot of the old prog bands used to do, and it works surprisingly well. And I think the lyrics to Wither are really good and open, plus the way James sings them is just beautiful.

I voted that this album is up there with the best of them. I was pleased that it arrived in the post today :D I'll admit I heard the leak twice through a few weeks ago, but then I deleted it and haven't listened since. I liked the album a LOT on those listens, but listening through again now it's actually even better, and I'd go so far as to say I love it. It just edges out FII into my number 4 spot.

1: Six Degrees
2: Images & Words
3: Awake
4: BC&SL
5: Falling Into Infinity
6: Train of Thought
7: Systematic Chaos/Octavarium (tied)
9: SFAM
10: WDADU

I'll post a track by track review once I've finished listening through.

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Offline AcidLameLTE

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #83 on: June 22, 2009, 12:00:11 PM »
TELL THEM ABOUT NICK, TELL THEM ABOUT BRIANG, THE COUNT OF TUSCANIAIIIIIINNNNNN!!!!!

Offline antigoon

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #84 on: June 22, 2009, 12:01:05 PM »
:lol

Offline TL

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #85 on: June 22, 2009, 12:03:31 PM »
I'll do a short overview for now, and maybe a more in depth review later.

A Nightmare To Remember - A solid album opener. The start is awesome, and the middle section is amazing. The end goes on a bit long, and of course there's the Portnoy growl, but it's still quite good.

A Rite of Passage - I liked it when I first heard it, then I liked it a bit less, and then it grew on me, and I like it quite a bit now. It's going to be a fantastic live song. Good overall song, great chorus, and the instrumental break is mostly well done.

Wither - An absolutely beautiful song, packed with emotion and power. Simply fantastic.

The Shattered Fortress - Someone who hadn't heard the other 12 Step songs will probably find the structure very strange, but I find that for those of us who've been following the saga, it's a treat to listen to. The callback to older riffs and lyrics with a new spin added to them was so cool to listen to. A great song overall.

The Best of Times - A good song, and very moving at times. Not my favorite song on the album, but I like it.

The Count of Tuscany - I love this song. Even though some of the lyrics are a bit silly, it works. Great melodies, and the final section or two are epic and amazing. It works perfectly as an album closer.

Overall - At least their best album since Six Degrees. Time will tell if it will end up passing Six Degrees on my list. For the most part, they're able to do amazing, technical playing while keeping it reserved and tasteful. The awesome instrumental parts serve the songs. The guys all do some cool instrumental stuff, and JLB sounds absolutely fantastic.

9/10

Offline ariich

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #86 on: June 22, 2009, 12:14:46 PM »
Wow, the album does end rather incredibly.

By the way, what does everyone think of the booklet artwork? I really love the stuff they have come up with. The front cover is decent, but the stuff inside is just great, especially for The Shattered Fortress, and also the goldfish pic on the inside of the first page.

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Offline Spolt

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #87 on: June 22, 2009, 12:21:51 PM »
Awesome album !

- I was blowned away by ANTR intro, totally new for DT and it sounded so bad-ass.
- I can say that it's the first album since I&W and SFAM that has no weak track.
- Once again the album theme is well integrated inside the opening and closing tracks (Thunder at beggining and small birds at the end, really cool choice for Black Clouds & Silver Linings)
- The intro to TCOT is one of the best things they've done since ITPOE Part. 1
- TBOT really sound like Rush's "The Spirit of Radio"
- TSF had me head-banging, really closes the Suite well !  :metal

On the other hand, i don't like the fact that Petrucci introduced "The Count of Tuscany" right at the beggining of the song, it kinda spoiled the lyrical experience.  :\

8,5/10

Offline j

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #88 on: June 22, 2009, 12:26:35 PM »
DT's best album since Six Degrees.  Time will tell if it ousts FII and SFAM for the number four spot, behind I&W, Awake, and 6DOIT.  Every song has grown on me thus far.

It seems pretty clear to me that the lyrics to The Count of Tuscany are at least a bit tongue-in-cheek.  It's interesting in the way it contrasts DT's other giant epic songs in that respect.  Not only that, but maybe the sometimes ridiculous lyrics are supposed to reflect the absurdity of the whole experience in hindsight.  At any rate, LaBrie somehow successfully injects so much emotion into the last few minutes, almost making me forget about the weird lyrics from the first half of the song.  Crazy lyrics or no, I am genuinely impressed; this song is one of the best of DT's career.  It will be hard to top on their next album.

The Best of Times's lyrics are obviously sincere, but definitely could use some work in places.  I think they would have benefitted from a bit more time "in the oven", but they're not unbearable.

With the possible exception of The Best of Times, where he sounds a little weak, LaBrie dominates this album.  The other guys deliver standout performances too, but LaBrie was lacking on Systematic Chaos for whatever reason, and he is definitely back on his game.

-J
« Last Edit: June 22, 2009, 12:33:41 PM by j »

Offline TheVoxyn

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #89 on: June 22, 2009, 12:27:30 PM »
In peacefull sedation I lay half awake  :heart.

Offline InTheNameOfGod

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #90 on: June 22, 2009, 12:29:21 PM »
It's funny how pretty much everyone has slotted BC&SL in at number 4.

 :metal
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Porcupine Tree - Deadwing *****
Symphony X - The Odyssey ****1/2





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Offline ariich

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #91 on: June 22, 2009, 12:31:06 PM »
With the possible exception of The Best of Times, where he sounds a little weak, LaBrie dominates this album.  The other guys deliver standout performances too, but LaBrie was lacking on Systematic Chaos for whatever reason, and he is definitely back on his game.
I disagree that he sounds weak on TBOT, I think his singing was intentionally subtle and heartfelt, which, to me gives the song more genuine emotion that if it was sung with over the top emotion like the end of TCOT.

I think it's a wonderfully heartfelt song, and while the lyrics are simple, they are a perfect expression of MP's feelings about his father.

EDIT: Oh, but I DO agree that James is absolutely awesome on this album. FLY NOW BE FREEEEE!

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Offline KevShmev

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #92 on: June 22, 2009, 12:31:44 PM »
- TBOT really sound like Rush's "The Spirit of Radio"

I've heard a lot of people say that, and I can sorta hear it, but only briefly.  And thankfully, I have not detected any other parts which sounded lifted or borrowed from other bands, which is great, as I think they had gotten really bad about letting parts from songs by bands they like creep into their songs.

The Best of Times's lyrics are obviously sincere, but definitely could use some work in places.  I think they would have benefitted from a bit more time "in the oven", but they're not unbearable.

I would agree with that.  Some of them are really good, and some sound like something a 5th grader would have written. :lol

With the possible exception of The Best of Times, where he sounds a little weak, LaBrie dominates this album.  The other guys deliver standout performances too, but LaBrie was lacking on Systematic Chaos for whatever reason, and he is definitely back on his game.

In all fairness to JLB, the vocal melodies he was handed to sing for the new album are a massive upgrade over the ones he was handed to sing for SC.

Offline changing_seasons

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #93 on: June 22, 2009, 12:37:48 PM »
This album is totally amazing, and I really love it! The Count of Tuscany is my new favorite song, and there really are no bad moments on this CD at all. I wasn't going to go see Dream Theater live this year, but this album has nearly convinced me to go.


A ranking at this moment for me would be something like:

Scenes From a Memory
Black Clouds & Silver Linings
Images and Words
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Octavarium
Falling Into Infinity
Systematic Chaos
Train of Thought
When Dream and Day Unite
Awake

Tell about my brother
Tell them about me
The Count of Tuscany

Offline axeman90210

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #94 on: June 22, 2009, 12:44:17 PM »
I'm not gonna do a song by song review because in time I'm sure we'll dicuss each of these songs to death in their own threads. I'll just say that this album slays, easily the best they've done in a while. Props go out in particular to JLB for absolutely killing it on this album and also JP. Petrucci's playing is usually what I love the most about DT songs, but he brings it up to a whole new level on this album. The riffs are :metal as hell and the solos are top notch (the last 3 minutes of TBOT... does it get much better than that? Didn't think so). The band as a whole is a bit more.... restrained than on SC and it definitely pays dividends. Specifically, Wither as a whole (although I do feel like the guitar solo could have gone on a little bit longer) and the final section of TCOT. The little melody that Rudess comes in with over the acoustic guitar is so simple yet so perfect for the song :tup

I can never rank the albums in a specific order, but I do like to break them out into tiers:

Tier 1 (The Trinity)
Images and Words
Awake
Scenes From A Memory

Tier 2 (Still stunningly brilliant, but just a notch below the best)
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Black Clouds and Silver Linings

Falling Into Infinity is kind of out here on it's own because some of the album is incredible, while I never ever want to listen to the rest

Tier 3 (Occasionally I spin a song or two, but that's about it)
Train of Thought
Octavarium

Tier 4 (I never bother with these)
When Dream and Day Unite
Systematic Chaos
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Offline Sigz

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #95 on: June 22, 2009, 01:00:46 PM »
It's up there - it's certainly a strong album. My initial reaction wasn't as strong as it was with SC, but I think it will age much better than SC did.
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Offline Neccy60

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #96 on: June 22, 2009, 01:15:31 PM »
8/10.

Songs in order of greatness:
A Nightmare To Remember
The Count Of Tuscany
The Best Of Times
A Rite Of Passage
The Shattered Fortress
Wither

I can't say that this is better than say I&W or 6DOIT, but an arguement can be made for the others.  It's a huge upgrade over SC.
The one big problem I see with this album is that it really doesn't add anything new.  The other albums seem to have always had something new, while this is, for all intents and purposes, a trip back to ther 90s/early 00s.  At least that's my opinion.

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Offline rumborak

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #97 on: June 22, 2009, 01:21:30 PM »
I've been listening to the album for a while now, but I must say it didn't age well. The lyrics still stick out terribly at times ("thank you for ... MY LIFE!", or "DID THEY EVER SEE THE RED LIGHT?! HWAAAAA!!"), and the music (which overall is better than on SC) can't make uo for it. A good effort, but a bit "DT paint by numbers".

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Offline TioJorge

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #98 on: June 22, 2009, 01:35:06 PM »
I was taken by surprise, to say the least; it blew my expectations out of the water. However, I still chose "It's good" on a count of I haven't had much time with the album as a whole. But right now it's nearing somewhere between "it's good" and "it's up with the best of them", and there it will likely stay. I will say that there isn't a single song that I even think about skipping, and that is very rare for me, especially with recent DT albums, so that is a definitely plus. Cohesion is a huge factor for me when listening to albums, so that might bump this one up to the 3 spot. I'm sure I'll have thoughts on single songs as we discuss them. Overall I'm very happy with this album, the best that DT has released in years.

The ranks:
Images and Words
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Awake
Black Clouds & Silver Linings
Scenes From a Memory
Octavarium
When Dream and Day Unite
Falling Into Infinity
Systematic Chaos
Train of Thought

I was really blown away with how much I like Wither, by the bye. It might be my second favorite. JL sings it with such conviction, it makes the song soar.

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Offline Jamariquay

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #99 on: June 22, 2009, 01:42:21 PM »
The Rush-y part in TBOT starts out like Spirit Of Radio but morphs into something similar to Red Barchetta.

Which is awesome because Rush is awesome.

Offline RobD

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #100 on: June 22, 2009, 01:47:19 PM »
This album is kicking my arse rather professionally. :tup

"IT'S A BLESSING NO-ONE DIED!
BY THE GRACE OF GOD ABOVE!
EVERYONE SURVIVED!
ROOOOOOOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAARRRRRR!!!"

:metalol:
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Offline aurorablind

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #101 on: June 22, 2009, 01:52:45 PM »
On my second listen now, and i'm feeling all tingly inside.
I know i was really hyped when i got 8vm and SC as well (TOT was the first new album i bought as a fan, and really didn't do anything for me at the time), but some of this songs gave me chills on my first listen, and the only new song that gave me chills before this was 8vm (title track)..
I'm so happy, relieved and in love with this album at the moment! I really didn't think i would like it, as SC was kind of a let down for me (i liked most of it when it came out, but i haven't really listened much to it since it came out..) , and the way MP has been talking about BC&SL never really seemed that exciting. So im really glad i listened to this album with no real expectations.

Short notices about each track:
1. A nightmare to remember: Love it! As some people have said before, it kind of drags on a bit, but it's still a perfect opener! The MP vocals and the "blastbeats" are kind of silly, but works. Top notch song! 9/10
2. A rite of passage: I've listened it to death, but when i listened to it again today it really works within the flow of the album. A really good single with a really strong single and a really good guitar-solo! 8/10 song for me
3. Wither: I heard it a couple of days ago on the Bruce Dickinson show, and it gave me chills! I love how it stays simple, calm and emotional all the way through. It will be a great single. James sounds terrific! 10/10
4. The shattered fortress: Not really sure if i like it or not yet. It was cool to hear some of those riffs and melodies again, and i loved how they ended with the glass prison-riff (with some dying soul/root of all evil-rythmstuff in the end). But it kind of felt a bit thrown together at my first listen. I must listen to it a couple of times before i say for sure if its super-cool or average.. For now it's 7/10. I liked it, but it left me a bit   :-\
5. The best of times: Really enjoyed it. I went into this song knowing that the lyrics probably would be a bit awkward, but i knew it was a really personal song, so i tried to just listen to it and read the lyrics for what they are. I actually shed a tear in the end. I found the song really touching, emotional and beautiful. I imagined MP sitting at his fathers bed listening to this with him. It must have been a really powerful and emotional moment. Some things about the song could probably have been worked out better, but its a great song. Loved the intro and the JP-solo in the end! 9/10
6. The count of tuscany: This was the really big surprise. I really didn't think i would like it (just based on the title, and a review -  i know, that's just silly of me), but this song kicked my ass! One of the best things they have done for years.. Better than Itpoe, up with 8vm and Acos. Can't wait to see this song live! (If they don't play it live i will personally hunt the band down, kidnap them and make them play it for me personally..). I don't care if the lyrics are cheesy. I knew they would be. But musically this really challenges some of the best things they have done! 10/10 - no doubt about it.

For now, it's a 9/10 album for me. I loved it. The best thing they've done since SFAM. Outstanding!  :metal

Offline perfey

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #102 on: June 22, 2009, 01:53:43 PM »
On Wednesday I will hear it! Cant wait for it! : D

Offline orcus116

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #103 on: June 22, 2009, 02:07:29 PM »
I know Mike didn't mean it but words like 'kindness' and 'courtesy' should never, ever be growled/toughened up vocally.

Offline ariich

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Re: Black Clouds & Silver Linings: Reactions
« Reply #104 on: June 22, 2009, 02:22:21 PM »
An interesting thing I've noted: While the album was obviously produced by MP and JP, Paul Northfield has been credited, in addition to recording and mixing, as co-producing the vocal tracks. After all the discussion about getting an outside producer to help utilise JLB well, I found this pretty interesting.

I don't have my copy of SC on me, but is Northfield credited the same way on SC?

Ariich is a freak, or somehow has more hours in the day than everyone else.
I be am boner inducing.