Do you think Jordan plays too many notes?

[changing_seasons]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRKcQM-iURw

Read the comments. Jordan owned a guy  

[KevShmev]

He certainly did not own the guy.  What that guy said was very true, even if it might have lacked a bit of tact by posting it in the comments section for a video Rudess himself uploaded.

Anyway, that flute sound is pretty awesome, and DT would be foolish not to utilize that somewhere on their next album.

[Quadrochosis]

that flute sound is pretty awesome, and DT would be foolish not to utilize that somewhere on their next album.

[BRGM]

Meeeh, Kev you're just boring! Jordan owned him! Jordan's right, that guy is just talking bull shit!

[KevShmev]

How exactly did he own him?  

"You have no idea who I am and what I do."  Um, since the guy was obviously watching one of his videos, I am pretty sure he knows who he is.  

And when the guy said, "Slow down sometimes, cos playing fast is only cool if you don't over do it ," that is a comment many DT fans would agree with.  And the guy did do a wink at the end of his comments to indicate that he was probably being light-hearted.  Perhaps years of working with Mike Portnoy has made Jordan Rudess overly defensive.

[BRGM]

No real DT fan would agree, only the ones at this forum cuz most of'em here are liek DT haterzz!!

[reneranucci]

Jordan was experimenting with the new sound, I think he likes having fun since he´s just playing around with it. And the big chunk at the end was very restrained and melodic.

[hefdaddy42]

No real DT fan would agree, only the ones at this forum cuz most of'em here are liek DT haterzz!!

That's quite enough of that.  If you don't like it here, feel free to not be here.

[Jamesman42]

Perhaps years of working with Mike Portnoy has made Jordan Rudess overly defensive.

Hey, this isn't a controversial statement in the slightest!

[Marvellous G]

I agree with the guy to be honest.

[BRGM]

Sorry hef! I think it's just so that so many ppl are just talking shit about Rudess

[hefdaddy42]

Sorry hef! I think it's just so that so many ppl are just talking shit about Rudess

They aren't "talking shit" about Rudess.

[Adami]

I don't it's a matter of hitting too many notes, as it is hitting too many notes in a small amount of time when it really doesn't need it.

And yes, I think he does that.

[Jamesman42]

Like many others, I sometimes feel his key solos are just bad wankery. It may be the biggest thing musically I would criticize DT for, IMO. And sometimes it's just because he plays too many notes in a measure/section of a song.

Still, when JR is on, he is ON.

[robwebster]

I don't think he plays enough notes. I can't remember ever listening to a bit of Dream Theater and thinking "this would be fantastic if it didn't have as many notes."

EVER.

[BRGM]

Agree with you Rob

[rumborak]

I think there's good fast, and there's bad fast. Good fast creates a secondary texture over the constituent notes, i.e. sort of a tapestry that you can still follow. Jordan's solos often don't have that, and they become somewhat indiscernible, especially when he uses effect-laden sounds.

rumborak

[LudwigVan]

This reminds me of that scene in the movie "Amadeus".

Emperor Joseph II: Your work is ingenious. It's quality work. And there are simply too many notes, that's all. Just cut a few and it will be perfect.

Mozart: Which few did you have in mind, Majesty?

[hefdaddy42]

I think the big thing is that Jordan isn't at his best when soloing over metal riffage.  That's when most of his recent "fast playing" has been.  He is much more creative when soloing over more melodic or progressive passages, IMHO.

[Jamesman42]

I think the big thing is that Jordan isn't at his best when soloing over metal riffage.  That's when most of his recent "fast playing" has been.  He is much more creative when soloing over more melodic or progressive passages, IMHO.

This. Like in Blind Faith (even if you hate the song), he has some killer solos over some progressive sounding riffs (which sound somewhat metal-ish).

[Quadrochosis]

I think the big thing is that Jordan isn't at his best when soloing over metal riffage.  That's when most of his recent "fast playing" has been.  He is much more creative when soloing over more melodic or progressive passages, IMHO.

This. Precisely the reason why DT needs to stop trying to get into Ozzfest with their recent albums.

[robwebster]

I think there's good fast, and there's bad fast. Good fast creates a secondary texture over the constituent notes, i.e. sort of a tapestry that you can still follow. Jordan's solos often don't have that, and they become somewhat indiscernible, especially when he uses effect-laden sounds.

rumborak

I think the only thing you can reasonably accuse Jordan's solos of being, is occasionally unmemorable. I've never thought "I could hear what he was doing if he slowed down a bit." The solos I remember are the most incredibly fast ones he does, as a general rule. Not JR, but bear with me - the first solo in Constant Motion is mindboggling. I love that bit. It locks over a tight groove and then absolutely floors you. Then Jordan does something on the continuum, and it's not as memorable. If Jordan continued from the same zone that Petrucci left off at, my eardrums would actually have fallen out. That's how incredible it'd be.

The forgettable ones are the slower ones. I want more notes and I want them now! Or I'll throw beans all over the place.

[hefdaddy42]

Prepare the beans.

[Mebert78]

My main issue with Jordan is when he plays piano sounds.  He can play soft and tender songs, but he can't resist moments where he suddenly squeezes in a million notes into a two-second span.  Here's a good example.  I was watching Jordan videos on YouTube last night and found a song called "Silent Mountain." (see link below).  I feel like this song perfectly depicts what could be consider Jordan's "faults."  It's a soft and delicate song and could be played in a simple manner, but once 2:10 hits he starts to play a million notes.  The song can't breath.  It's just way too much overplaying.  Sure, that could be the way the song is written and I understand this seems to be a recital atmosphere, but it would be much more beautiful in my opinion if he played less.

Silent Mountain link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OaKURARcIUc

[Quadrochosis]

I really like his piano flourishes, I thought you were all talking about when he does it on a synth or something, that's when it gets a little overbearing.

[hefdaddy42]

I really like his piano flourishes, I thought you were all talking about when he does it on a synth or something, that's when it gets a little overbearing.

That's probably what most of us were talking about.

[Jamesman42]

I really like his piano flourishes, I thought you were all talking about when he does it on a synth or something, that's when it gets a little overbearing.

That's probably what most of us were talking about.

Yeah, his synth solos (I can't recall any synth leads/riffs that I would call bad).

[ariich]

I can't remember ever listening to a bit of Dream Theater and thinking "this would be fantastic if it didn't have as many notes."

EVER.

This. In fact, to me the whole concept of "too many notes" or "too few notes" is nonsense. Whether something is good or bad, memorable or unmemorable, seems to have no correlation whatsoever to how fast it is or how many notes there are.

I think there's good fast, and there's bad fast. Good fast creates a secondary texture over the constituent notes, i.e. sort of a tapestry that you can still follow. Jordan's solos often don't have that, and they become somewhat indiscernible, especially when he uses effect-laden sounds.

rumborak

Much better put. I mean, personally I rarely find his solos uninteresting, but it does happen sometimes (ANTR springs to mind) but it's simply the fact that it's not an interesting solo. Some of his fast ones I adore, some of his slow ones I'm less keen on, and vice versa.

[BRGM]

Ariich is right, it doesn't matter how many notes it is, as long as it is good

[Jamesman42]

Ariich is right,

Please don't let me see you saying that, it'll only encourage him.

[ariich]

Ariich is right,

Please don't let me see you saying that, it'll only encourage him.

James is awesome.
























































Damn, it didn't last.

[Jamesman42]

Dangit, my pronouns got messed up in that reply.

You win this time, ariich.

[ariich]

[Samsara]

How exactly did he own him?  

"You have no idea who I am and what I do."  Um, since the guy was obviously watching one of his videos, I am pretty sure he knows who he is.  

And when the guy said, "Slow down sometimes, cos playing fast is only cool if you don't over do it ," that is a comment many DT fans would agree with.  And the guy did do a wink at the end of his comments to indicate that he was probably being light-hearted.  Perhaps years of working with Mike Portnoy has made Jordan Rudess overly defensive.

Agree with kev. The poster didn't express it very well, but his point is - dude overplays a lot, at least in Dream Theater. And I wholeheartedly agree.

[Dublagent66]

This reminds me of that scene in the movie "Amadeus".

Emperor Joseph II: Your work is ingenious. It's quality work. And there are simply too many notes, that's all. Just cut a few and it will be perfect.

Mozart: Which few did you have in mind, Majesty?

Yeah, I remember that.   Doesn't Mozart also say something like, "there are no more or less notes than I require."