The Official Alter Bridge Thread v. PAWNS & KINGS

[ariich]

Rankings:

1. Fortress
2. Blackbird
3. The Last Hero
4. ABIII
5. One Day Remains

Probably this for me, though 1 and 2 are interchangeable.

[PixelDream]

Man, this album's mix and mastering job. It's like, no matter where you put the volume on, it's always loud. Am I just getting old?

[sylvan]

The Last Hero
One Day Remains
Fortress
Blackbird
AB III

[fadetoblackdude7]

Am I the only one who doesn't have a problem with the mixing/mastering?

[Anguyen92]

Am I the only one who doesn't have a problem with the mixing/mastering?

I'm one that's on the side of wanting to defend Elvis for his production tactics from AB III onwards and not on the side of "Got to kick Elvis out as a producer.  He sucks, he's holding this band back in terms of making good sounding albums, etc."

That stated, the "lesser" songs of The Last Hero (Losing Patience and You'll Be Remembered) really suffer a good amount in the mixing/layering/etc. and make what could have been a better song, a really muddled sounding song.  Otherwise, I don't have an issue in terms of the mixing quality of the top songs of the album (with the gripe that I kinda wished they would dial back in the multiple guitars/multiple Myles vocal layering.)

That stated, I did mention this at the AB Nation Forums, and I might as well mention it here.  If AB does make a 6th album, and they do somehow managed to not have Elvis as the producer, the same album problems people may have with The Last Hero will occur in AB VI. I'm calling it.

[wolfking]

Am I the only one who doesn't have a problem with the mixing/mastering?

I don't really have a problem either.  The only thing is I wish the heavy fucking riffs were a little more clearer at times.

[kaos2900]

Am I the only one who doesn't have a problem with the mixing/mastering?

No issues here.

Ranking
Fortress
The Last Hero
Blackbird
ABIII
ODR

[mikeyd23]

Am I the only one who doesn't have a problem with the mixing/mastering?

I don't really have a problem either.  The only thing is I wish the heavy fucking riffs were a little more clearer at times.

Yeah this is pretty much me. The production doesn't bother me too much, just gets a little muddy when they have too much going on in the mix. Overall though, it usually doesn't detract from my enjoyment of the album.

Oh yeah and of course rankings:

1. Blackbird
2. Fortress
3. The Last Hero
4. One Day Remains
5. AB III

That stated, I did mention this at the AB Nation Forums, and I might as well mention it here.  If AB does make a 6th album, and they do somehow managed to not have Elvis as the producer, the same album problems people may have with The Last Hero will occur in AB VI. I'm calling it.

I agree with this. I think if AB got another producer for their next record, Mark will still layer down a wall of heavy guitars, Myles will still come in on top of that and add multiple effect layers, Myles will still layer his vocals, etc... I think fans need to realize that might be what the BAND wants in terms of sound now, and not just point the finger at Elvis. Maybe the band doesn't want to re-make ODR again, with one clean guitar, drums, bass, and one vocal line. Maybe that's not what inspires them as songwriters, and in the studio laying down tracks.

That all being said, the production has flaws, but at the root of the many layers, Elvis does some stuff really, really well. He gets a great big boomy drum sound and a great bass sound. He has a great ear for guitar tones as well. Now once all that stuff is stacked together, yeah, some nuance gets lost but that doesn't make Elvis bad or evil.

[sylvan]

I think for AB6, they need to get in the studio and record One Day Remains 2.0, or Another Day Remains, and re-record the songs with new arrangements based around the current formula of the band. Clearly, I love ODR. Myles' voice and Mark's tone were phenomenal. But, what would those songs sound like with the full power of Alter Bridge behind it, being the song writing and instrumental talent?

[Basekick]

I think for AB6, they need to get in the studio and record One Day Remains 2.0, or Another Day Remains, and re-record the songs with new arrangements based around the current formula of the band. Clearly, I love ODR. Myles' voice and Mark's tone were phenomenal. But, what would those songs sound like with the full power of Alter Bridge behind it, being the song writing and instrumental talent?

I would personally be pretty upset if they came out with ODR 2.0 for their next record. They've created an incredible and unique sound across their last two albums, where a return to those roots would be a major step back IMO.

[sylvan]

On that note, your holding out for another full on AB6 might be for naught. These guys are getting older, and I can't help but wonder how long they will continue to do what they're doing.

The idea would be to take that incredible unique sound and apply it to the one record that stands alone in their catalog due to band dynamic. I've always wondered what ODR would have sounded like with more input from Myles in the writing process, and what Mark would have done with a second guitarist. Shit, the first three times I saw them, Ernie played rhythm on the song One Day Remains. Cuz that's what Myles needs, a stand in on guitar lol.

I guess I'm just one of those outdated old 32 yr olds that are stuck on ODR  And no offense to anyone, but I literally cringe when I see AB3 ahead of ODR on these lists. I know it's an opinion, but come on... AB3 is the most disappointing thing they've done, outside of a couple DVDs, not all of which was their fault.

[Train of Naught]

Right now:

1. The Last Hero
2. Fortress
3. One Day Remains
4. Blackbird
5. AB3

I guess I'm just one of those outdated old 32 yr olds that are stuck on ODR  And no offense to anyone, but I literally cringe when I see AB3 ahead of ODR on these lists. I know it's an opinion, but come on... AB3 is the most disappointing thing they've done, outside of a couple DVDs, not all of which was their fault.

Yeah, I don't literally cringe when I see it but AB3 is the only AB record that I never really got into. Only a handful of songs I enjoy listening to, overall I find it pretty dull. Slip to the Void is fantastic though, one of their best songs.

[mikeyd23]

I think for AB6, they need to get in the studio and record One Day Remains 2.0, or Another Day Remains, and re-record the songs with new arrangements based around the current formula of the band. Clearly, I love ODR. Myles' voice and Mark's tone were phenomenal. But, what would those songs sound like with the full power of Alter Bridge behind it, being the song writing and instrumental talent?

I would personally be pretty upset if they came out with ODR 2.0 for their next record. They've created an incredible and unique sound across their last two albums, where a return to those roots would be a major step back IMO.

This. God yes. This.

Also, ABIII is their weakest effort to date, IMO.

[sylvan]

Alter Bridge is stretching out their sound so much that they're getting as many differing opinions about their catalogue as DT  . I can accept that people are gonna connect with different era's. I just come from the era of hearing 10/11 tracks from ODR for the first time LIVE before the album was even out. That music and time in AB was magic... life changing. Oddly enough, I love them as much as I ever have, but there is virtually nothing left of the original Alter Bridge.

I can't believe I'm the only one interested in hearing ODR with the true AB dynamic. No Myles in the song writing, no Myles on guitar, Mark limited to a single guitar as far as song writing, Brian and Flip are SOOO much better now. And this is coming from someone that holds that album in the HIGHEST of regards. Just pure curiosity coming from a place of immense love  .

[Adami]

It's a strange criticism of .....I guess critics....to say that it's because AB is being so radically diverse, when my main complaint is that they're being so immensely samey these days. I heard almost nothing on the new album that couldn't have either been on a previous AB album or a Tremonti album. I wish they'd BE more diverse and stretch out their sound, but they seem to just not have any desire. Which is cool, their prerogative and people seem to love it no matter what, but it's a bit less fun for me. Not that my opinion is terribly important.




....or is it?



No, it's not.

[pogoowner]

It's a strange criticism of .....I guess critics....to say that it's because AB is being so radically diverse, when my main complaint is that they're being so immensely samey these days. I heard almost nothing on the new album that couldn't have either been on a previous AB album or a Tremonti album. I wish they'd BE more diverse and stretch out their sound, but they seem to just not have any desire. Which is cool, their prerogative and people seem to love it no matter what, but it's a bit less fun for me. Not that my opinion is terribly important.




....or is it?



No, it's not.

I agree. They take small steps forward in changing their sound on each album. But they are small.

[mikeyd23]

It's a strange criticism of .....I guess critics....to say that it's because AB is being so radically diverse, when my main complaint is that they're being so immensely samey these days. I heard almost nothing on the new album that couldn't have either been on a previous AB album or a Tremonti album. I wish they'd BE more diverse and stretch out their sound, but they seem to just not have any desire. Which is cool, their prerogative and people seem to love it no matter what, but it's a bit less fun for me. Not that my opinion is terribly important.

To be fair, the jump in style from Fortress to TLH isn't huge. But the jump in style from ODR to TLH is pretty big I think. Also, I disagree with the notion that they aren't interested in being more diverse and stretching out their sound. I think that they have been progressively doing exactly that since BB. Now to what degree, I don't know. But looking at their catalog I'd say they are definitely stretching out more and more, but they are certainly keeping their core sound.

[Basekick]

It's a strange criticism of .....I guess critics....to say that it's because AB is being so radically diverse, when my main complaint is that they're being so immensely samey these days. I heard almost nothing on the new album that couldn't have either been on a previous AB album or a Tremonti album. I wish they'd BE more diverse and stretch out their sound, but they seem to just not have any desire. Which is cool, their prerogative and people seem to love it no matter what, but it's a bit less fun for me. Not that my opinion is terribly important.




....or is it?



No, it's not.

I think all you need to do is listen to a song like "This Side Of Fate" to hear how much different they sound compared to stuff from ODR and BB and even ABIII. Their choruses are less samey than they used to be, more heavy riffs, key changes, passages that flow from soft to hard quickly, call backs of previous sections inside songs...it's all there.

If you want to talk about the differentiation of songs themselves on TLH, I can understand them molding together on the first listen or two. I'd argue that's more of the production than the songwriting or change of approach from the band. Once you take in the music a bit more, you'll appreciate a tune like "Twlight" having a feel that's pretty unique to AB, or the stark differences between two super heavy tracks "The Other Side" and "Island of Fools". Or how "Cradle To The Grave" and "The Last Hero" take their ideas in different directions when the bridge hits.

Give it some time and the individually of the tracks really shine on this album. And it's freakin' GLORIOUS.

I can't see these songs being on their earlier albums. ODR and BB were excellent hard rock albums that stuck to the formula and absolutely killed it. What they have now is touching more on Progressive Metal and I think it's fantastic. ABIII was different from the earlier two as they got a bit darker with their tone while still keeping the standard rock approach. With Fortress/TLH they broke out of their formula and kept the dark mood. It pushes them from being lost in the crowd of mainstream rock acts into a league of their own.

[LCArenas]

FUCK My expectations of this album weren't that high since Show Me a Leader and my Champion, as good a pair of songs as they might be, didn't really blow my mind, and Tremonti's Dust was an okay album for me, nothing more or less.

But this album is incredible. These people are tireless man. The Writing on the Wall. The Other Side. Island of Fools. There were even some songs that didn't start too strong like This Side of Fate but later holy fucking shit. It's a strong follow up to Fortress, kind of similar to it as well. Maybe it won't top it but it's still great.

[fadetoblackdude7]

Yeah.....Cradle To The Grave is a top 5 AB song for me. Flawless song.

[wolfking]

I definitely don't want AB to go back to the older style, this style they've developed on the last two albums is unreal and I personally want it to keep going.

I revisited Fortress today and it's hard to split Fortress and TLH, both phenominal albums.

I should revisit AB3 too.

[axeman90210]

Dat riffage after the solo (so ~4:15) in the title track

[kaos2900]

Yeah.....Cradle To The Grave is a top 5 AB song for me. Flawless song.

Agreed. Also, Losing Patience has to be one of the catchiest melodies in an AB song. Been stuck in my head for days.

[Zydar]

Yeah.....Cradle To The Grave is a top 5 AB song for me. Flawless song.

Agreed. Also, Losing Patience has to be one of the catchiest melodies in an AB song. Been stuck in my head for days.

Yup, it's probably my favourite on the album.

[mikeyd23]

Losing Patience is growing on me. Upon my first couple listens I considered it one of the weaker tracks on the record along with Twilight. But the more I listen to it, the more I like Losing Patience. The hook is great and there is some outstanding guitar work.

[wolfking]

Island of Fools fast becoming my favourite. 

[mikeyd23]

Island of Fools fast becoming my favourite. 

I think if I had to pick a favorite on the album, that would be the song. Every second of the song is killer.

[Basekick]

I'm a little surprised the clear favorite isn't "This Side of Fate".

That song is the best songwriting the band has ever done. Yes, above Blackbird from a songwriting standpoint (still think Blackbird is their best song, though).

[mikeyd23]

I'm a little surprised the clear favorite isn't "This Side of Fate".

That song is the best songwriting the band has ever done. Yes, above Blackbird from a songwriting standpoint (still think Blackbird is their best song, though).

It's a top five song on the record for me. My top five haven't changed, just not sure the order they would fall into.

Island of Fools
This Side of Fate
The Last Hero
The Other Side
Cradle to the Grave

[wolfking]

I'm a little surprised the clear favorite isn't "This Side of Fate".

That song is the best songwriting the band has ever done. Yes, above Blackbird from a songwriting standpoint (still think Blackbird is their best song, though).

Wouldn't even be a top 5 for me at this stage.  Shows how fucking strong the album is.  My top 5 in no order at the moment would be;

Island of Fools
My Champion
The Last Hero
Writings on the Wall
Show Me A Leader

[Accelerando]

Writings On The Wall may have my favorite chorus on the record

[wolfking]

Writings On The Wall may have my favorite chorus on the record

It's bloody brilliant.

[mikeyd23]

Writings On The Wall may have my favorite chorus on the record

It's bloody brilliant.

Yeah I keep coming back to that song, it's really grown on me. It probably just missed being in my top 5.

Wolfs right though, this album is really strong throughout.

[wolfking]

Even though it's very long, I wouldn't cut anything from it at all.

[RuRoRul]

Still loving this album... The top 5 remains unchanged (The Last Hero, This Side Of Fate, The Other Side, Island Of Fools, Cradle To The Grave), I think my absolute favourite is between The Last Hero (best of the "epics"), Island Of Fools (best chorus on the album, fantastic song in the vein of some of my favourite Alter Bridge songs that don't seem to get enough appreciation... Pleasantly surprised this one has been received as well by other fans) or The Other Side (a really unique one for Alter Bridge).

I can't complain about the quantity of songs either. In fact one of the good things about Alter Bridge is that I pretty much always enjoy a song by them, so in a way if there are a few songs that I don't attach to right away I know I will have songs to grow on me later. For example Losing Patience was one of those sounds that sounded Ok enough, but just really didn't stand out enough to have a strong speak after a few listens. However soon enough I found the chorus constantly stuck in my head and wanted to go back and listen to that song more. Kind of fits with what Tremonti said in an interview about Losing Patience probably being a B-Side until they came up with the chorus and wanted it on the album. Incidentally, Mark also said about The Last Of Our Kind / Symphony Of Agony that despite being the bonus track it contains what he says is his favourite solo of the album, and it is definitely one of my favourite solos.